How About an Option option for Group Fly?

[Attache]

After a break, I've been on no less that 5-6 teams or leagues recently where tension about Group Fly has gotten heated while I just listened to the back and forth. I do, honestly, see both sides of things - I have it on a few Masterminds myself. What seems to be different in Homecoming's reemergence compared to Live is that I can't imagine not turning it off if someone asked me to do so but since the return of the game, I've seen people refuse or leave teams rather than do so. I've seen it several times just this past week.

I get it. We have an option to turn it off and we should all visit Null the Gull with each and every alt to make sure we're not affected if we don't want to be. I have to admit, though, it frequently slips my mind (I don't seem to be alone) and by the time I encounter it in the higher level content, it usually isn't convenient to pop over for the fix. I don't haunt the D with most characters so I generally don't even have it as an option on the teleporter and when you have to explain to the team or league why you are leaving the zone (or risk being kicked), it usually just starts up the discussion. I have just vaguely said I have something to do real quick - but even then folks see where you went and guess and it starts the debate up anyway.

Could this be something added to our Options at this point? It'd be a lot easier to recall if you've taken care of it on a given alt and while I've not run into it personally, I can imagine scenarios where you might want it off 95% of the time but having a way to turn it back on on the spot for a given mission or situation may be of value. Given that people want to use it, that there is no flag to remind you if you've taken care of it on a given character until you are in the thick of it, and that it does affect movement and some powers, being able to pull it up on a tab in Options seems the better, well, option if it is at all possible.

Edited November 8, 2022 by Attache

[Astralock]

Developers have said before that adding the option to the Options window is not possible without a ton of work, so it's Null the Gull or bust.  Also, making Group Fly disabled by default is also a no-go as it would automatically disable Group Fly on pets and henchmen making taking the power pointless.

 

Just have to make it a habit to go to Pocket D and visit Null the Gull on new characters.  I do it at level six on every new character I make.

[biostem]

Maybe add a contact to starter zones that directs people to visit Null or something...

[PoptartsNinja]

A lot of the tension could be resolved if Group Fly started out disabled by default, with players voluntarily opting in at Null rather than having to remember to opt out.

 

It's still a highly useful power for Masterminds, and letting people opt in to have it affect them would let the people who enjoy having that option continue to use it with a minimum of frustration for everyone else who may discover mid-raid that they forgot to disable the option on their elec tank or earth controller or other character that requires ground contact for some of their powers to function.

[Astralock]

14 minutes ago, PoptartsNinja said:

A lot of the tension could be resolved if Group Fly started out disabled by default, with players voluntarily opting in at Null rather than having to remember to opt out.

 

It's still a highly useful power for Masterminds, and letting people opt in to have it affect them would let the people who enjoy having that option continue to use it with a minimum of frustration for everyone else who may discover mid-raid that they forgot to disable the option on their elec tank or earth controller or other character that requires ground contact for some of their powers to function.

Again, it’s been said that making Group Fly disabled by default would mean that it would not work on your henchmen and pets, even if you went and enabled it later.

[Rudra]

Personally, I think henchmen and pets should be able to inherit the character's travel powers. That would probably take away Group Fly's last use though.

[Lazarillo]

42 minutes ago, biostem said:

Maybe add a contact to starter zones that directs people to visit Null or something...

Or simply add a Null-esque NPC to more zones (it really needs to be in low-cap raid zones like The Hive/Abyss RWZ).  Or heck, as I understand it, Null functions by adding invisible Temp. powers to the player, so maybe it could just be added to the P2Ws?

[biostem]

Just now, Lazarillo said:

Or simply add a Null-esque NPC to more zones (it really needs to be in low-cap raid zones like The Hive/Abyss RWZ).  Or heck, as I understand it, Null functions by adding invisible Temp. powers to the player, so maybe it could just be added to the P2Ws?

I don't have the post or comment on-hand, but I vaguely recall there being developer resistance to proliferating Null to more areas...

[Akalabeth]

How about an option not to let masterminds join? 🙂  While group fly is in the MM's best interest, no MMs in a group is in everyone's. 🙂

[Rudra]

5 minutes ago, Akalabeth said:

How about an option not to let masterminds join? 🙂  While group fly is in the MM's best interest, no MMs in a group is in everyone's. 🙂

Even as a joke, that sucked.

[Lazarillo]

6 minutes ago, Akalabeth said:

How about an option not to let masterminds join?

As a MM player, I'm probably having more fun on my own "team" anyway. 😝

[Akalabeth]

1 minute ago, Rudra said:

Even as a joke, that sucked.

 

Why?  They make their own groups. "ALL MM ____"

[Rudra]

5 minutes ago, Akalabeth said:

 

Why?  They make their own groups. "ALL MM ____"

So does everyone else. "All Blaster <insert task>!" "All Controller <insert task>!"

 

So by that logic, all ATs should have an option to be excluded from doing things.

[Akalabeth]

5 minutes ago, Rudra said:

So does everyone else. "All Blaster <insert task>!" "All Controller <insert task>!"

 

So by that logic, all ATs should have an option to be excluded from doing things.

 

Ok. 🙂

[PoptartsNinja]

47 minutes ago, Astralock said:

Again, it’s been said that making Group Fly disabled by default would mean that it would not work on your henchmen and pets, even if you went and enabled it later.

I wasn't aware of that.

 

As a back-up, they could add the option to the P2W vendor or the trainer in the tutorial. "Would you like to be affected by Group Fly? You can change this later at Null the Gull in Pocket D"

[Greycat]

4 hours ago, Lazarillo said:

Or simply add a Null-esque NPC to more zones (it really needs to be in low-cap raid zones like The Hive/Abyss RWZ).  Or heck, as I understand it, Null functions by adding invisible Temp. powers to the player, so maybe it could just be added to the P2Ws?

 

Apparently adding Null to zones where it makes sense to have quick access (without leaving and getting locked out) is just short of kicking puppies while stealing candy from babies the way some react to the suggestion. Yes, Null in raid zones would be very convenient, and I'd be happy to see it.

[weewoozesty]

Personally speaking, I think Null The Gull's settings regarding travel powers etc could just be moved to the zone trainers.

Biggest reason being that while for some archetypes being in a group fly isn't that big of a deal.  For others with specific power sets it really screws them over.

Seismic Blast for example is completely destroyed by any type of flight powers.  

 

So my solution is simple.  Put the travel power related Null The Gull options on zone trainers.  I like speedboosts buff effects but absolutely hate the speed portion of it as i find it makes navigating certain mission lay outs painful.

[Grouchybeast]

8 hours ago, weewoozesty said:

So my solution is simple.  Put the travel power related Null The Gull options on zone trainers.  I like speedboosts buff effects but absolutely hate the speed portion of it as i find it makes navigating certain mission lay outs painful.

 

I think this would be a nice way to do it.  I assume that Null couldn't be ported as-is to non-coop zones anyway, and would need to have his menus edited appropriately (I'm not sure what happens if you change alignment to full hero in a villain zone, but probably nothing good).  Since there would need to be editing done anyway, adding it to the trainers would presumably be the same work, with the bonus of not needing to place a new NPC in every zone.

Edited November 9, 2022 by Grouchybeast

[Akalabeth]

That's a good suggestion.  If it won't work for programming reasons on a trainer, how about the p2w vendors? 🙂

[weewoozesty]

1 hour ago, Grouchybeast said:

 

I think this would be a nice way to do it.  I assume that Null couldn't be ported as-is to non-coop zones anyway, and would need to have his menus edited appropriately (I'm not sure what happens if you change alignment to full hero in a villain zone, but probably nothing good).  Since there would need to be editing done anyway, adding it to the trainers would presumably be the same work, with the bonus of not needing to place a new NPC in every zone.

Thats why I was thinking that only some of null's options would be set to the trainers.

 

I dont think allignments in an enemy zone would work.  But travel power settings and stuff of that nature should be fine.

[TheZag]

My understanding is that null is a psuedo-GM and uses higher level slash commands than players have access to in order to grant and revoke those hidden temp powers.  Continually adding to nulls capabilities could introduce bugs.  You might be suprised at how much you can do with a single vulnerability. 

 

My nintendo wii,  that doesnt play DvDs because nintendo said it would drive the cost of the console up too much,  plays DvDs.  There were no hardware modifications,  just a software modification made through a small vulnerability in the console's email system.

 

Basically im trying to say we should consider carefully when we want changes to null.  If an exploit were found to have null run a command from a player and they boot everyone from the server or grant themselves all the purples or hero 1's powers or something.

 

Well,  maybe not boot all,  i think that one is a really high level command,  possibly dev only.

 

[biostem]

Here's another thought - y'know how they added an option to change the range of local chat - what if group fly could be given a variable range option, with one being self-only.  If they can't readily place Nulls all over the place, how about allowing those with group fly to simply shrink its range a bit?

[Attache]

Wow. I did not get a single notification this was responded to at all. Thanks for taking the time, everyone. Notifications are on so I don’t know what happened…

 

I am definitely trying to remember and get into the habit of doing it on my alts. I was so thankful that someone leading an MSR shouted a reminder the other day. 
 

If the GMs said adding it to Options wasn’t possible, that’s that. If not an Option screen option, how about a slash command to check the status? In a game that actively encourages altitis, being able to check the status without making a trip would be nice. I made the run on an old 50 the other day only to find it was already off.

[UltraAlt]

On 11/8/2022 at 3:16 PM, Attache said:

I get it. We have an option to turn it off and we should all visit Null the Gull with each and every alt to make sure we're not affected if we don't want to be.

 

On 11/8/2022 at 3:16 PM, Attache said:

It'd be a lot easier to recall if you've taken care of it on a given alt and while I've not run into it personally, I can imagine scenarios where you might want it off 95% of the time but having a way to turn it back on on the spot for a given mission or situation may be of value.

 

Honestly, this is one of the reasons that I suggested putting a Null the Gull in Atlas Park (and the other starting zones) next to Ms Victory.

When I first make a character, I do several things. I get the Atlas Tour Guide, vist the P2W vendor, go to the Pocket D to talk to Null the Gull (and pick an explore badge), and grab an exploration badge from Talos and Peregrine Island.

I didn't do this when I first came back, but I've been doing now since around the start of the Fast Teleport system.

When I go to the Gull, I turn off accepting Group Fly, Team Teleport, and Speed buffs.

 

I would think it would be easier to make Group Fly non-accepted by default then adding it to the options menu (which is why it was added in through Null the Gull in the first place).

 

I would like to see it done, but I don't expect any of these changes. I'll just have to keep going to the Pocket D everytime I make a character.

Fortunately, a Pocket D van was added to Altas so you don't even need a SG base or hop zones to get there any more.