All of CoH Is End-Game Content

[Shinobu]

 

Every time someone says, "You shouldn't rush to level 50, there's not that much end-game content," I want to scream.

 

The entire game is end-game content.

 

Once you hit level 50 and have your alpha slot, you can run any task force you like.  That means an ITF or STF or an Apex or Tin Mage, and it also means you can run Synapse and Positron and Admiral Sutter.  You can run virtually any story arc from Ouroboros.  You are not limited in what you can do because you rushed to 50 -- quite the contrary, your horizons are expanded to include the entire game.  Anything you want to do, you can do.

 

And the best part?  You have a completed build to do it with.  Certainly if you exempt down you will not have access to all of your powers, but there is no arguing that I'm still in better shape as a completed level 50 exempted down to run a Moonfire Task Force, than a level 25 character running the same TF.  I have more slots, I have a more complete build, and if I've used any attuned IOs of any sort at all in my build (including purples or PvP IOs) then there's really no contest, the level 25 can't match me.

 

Best of all, if I want to do actual level 50 content, I can.  I can join hami raids, Apex/Tin Mage, incarnate TFs -- whatever.  But in fact I do run a lot of lower and mid-level TFs with my friends, and it doesn't matter that I'm level 50.

 

I don't know, maybe some people refuse to ever exempt down and don't see the point of doing a Hess TF once they've already done it.  But the idea that there's little to do at 50 always strikes me as a very stupid statement -- there's EVERYTHING to do at 50.  That's what makes this game so great.  ^_^

 

 

Now, I do agree that a new player should enjoy the journey the first time through because you learn a lot along the way.  But an awful lot of the player base has experienced this game before, so if you want to take shortcuts to 50, by all means.  It's not as if you're skipping over anything that you can't go back and do later.

 

 

[jack_nomind]

maybe a little reductive

 

but agreed

 

the true end-game build can shepard 7 noobs through the entire TF commander badge in 5hrs

 

i have yet to find it.  i think it might be a warshade.

[Xaeon]

The true endgame is developing enough patience to go through all four shadowshard TFs in one sitting.

[AkuTenshiiZero]

An acquaintance of mine rushed through the game to max level and Incarnate.  He hasn't played in over a month.

 

The landscape of gaming has changed so much, back when CoX was live we still lived in a time when the leveling process mattered.  These days all that matters is the endgame.  So people unfamiliar with the "old ways" are blasting through only to realize that there isn't much to see at the end.

 

CoX was designed to be enjoyed over a long period of leveling.  Slow down, enjoy the journey.  It's a nice reprieve from the instant gratification shit that is plaguing other games.

[MyriVerse]

Meh. None of my characters has ever reached end-game. The content has always started boring me in the late-30s/early-40s.

 

But I've loved the game for 15 years now.

[Shazzie]

Some people rush. It's just how they are, that's their mentality, and they will play that way in any and every game. I will personally never understand it beyond just that: it's how they are. It does no harm, let them be themselves. Some people just want to hurry up and unlock a particular power or powers, but stop the rush when that's achieved. Some people just have a strong drive to complete their build. Some people want to get into incarnate stuff. Some people want to have their characters back, and if their characters were all maxed out, well they have to get there to be completely 'back'. Some  people have just done all this so much that their interest in the leveling process is gone. We're different people so of course we all have different interests in gaming and how we game, but we still have one interest in common- this game itself.

 

I only give a "No need to rush!" comment when it's someone who, because of 'the game starts at max level' mentality that other games foster, thinks they have to do that here. There's just so much you can do before you're max level, that unless you have specific reasons, there's no need to rush. But if they have a reason besides that mistaken concept? Have at it, and have fun.

[Legree]

And the best part?  You have a completed build to do it with.  Certainly if you exempt down you will not have access to all of your powers, but there is no arguing that I'm still in better shape as a completed level 50 exempted down to run a Moonfire Task Force, than a level 25 character running the same TF.  I have more slots, I have a more complete build, and if I've used any attuned IOs of any sort at all in my build (including purples or PvP IOs) then there's really no contest, the level 25 can't match me.

 

I did this a few times with my 50s, and honestly I found it extremely dull.  I'd much rather see how a new character handles enemies on level as they progress than go back and god-mode it through content that I know I now outclass.

 

YMMV, of course, but I honestly wonder how many of the people who are PL'ing to 50+3 right now are still going to be playing a few months from now.

[srmalloy]

Once you hit level 50 and have your alpha slot, you can run any task force you like.  That means an ITF or STF or an Apex or Tin Mage, and it also means you can run Synapse and Positron and Admiral Sutter.  You can run virtually any story arc from Ouroboros.  You are not limited in what you can do because you rushed to 50 -- quite the contrary, your horizons are expanded to include the entire game.  Anything you want to do, you can do.

 

And it's this that makes me sad every time I see something like "lvl 50 Brute looking for AE or farm" in the LFG channel -- you can get your enjoyment from the game how you want, but seeing someone who's powerleveled to 50, and all they're interested in is more farms, is depressing. Thinking about all the content they don't care about because it's not a farm (or don't know about, because all they've ever done in game is farm) reminds me of a line from a novel referring to mining the asteroids for resources: "Out there it's raining soup, and we don't even know about soup bowls." But if endless farming is the only way they know how to play, or what they think is the 'best' way to play, I'll just be disappointed in them and let them go off and do their own thing.

[MunkiLord]

Once you hit level 50 and have your alpha slot, you can run any task force you like.  That means an ITF or STF or an Apex or Tin Mage, and it also means you can run Synapse and Positron and Admiral Sutter.  You can run virtually any story arc from Ouroboros.  You are not limited in what you can do because you rushed to 50 -- quite the contrary, your horizons are expanded to include the entire game.  Anything you want to do, you can do.

 

And it's this that makes me sad every time I see something like "lvl 50 Brute looking for AE or farm" in the LFG channel -- you can get your enjoyment from the game how you want, but seeing someone who's powerleveled to 50, and all they're interested in is more farms, is depressing. Thinking about all the content they don't care about because it's not a farm (or don't know about, because all they've ever done in game is farm) reminds me of a line from a novel referring to mining the asteroids for resources: "Out there it's raining soup, and we don't even know about soup bowls." But if endless farming is the only way they know how to play, or what they think is the 'best' way to play, I'll just be disappointed in them and let them go off and do their own thing.

 

But if they are having fun and enjoying themselves, why would that make you sad? If that's all someone does and they are having a good time, then I think being happy for them makes more sense.

[pattycake]

I just leveled my 3rd contact reeling to level 12 (completing contacts to confident before progressing, without flask-backing) I haven't lost interest making in a fourth one. I left CoH right around issue 15 due to lost of immediate motivation, but due to the burning love I have for the game been yanked from my soul, I am just thankful its back.

 

My opinion:

I may have a quarrel with the many features added into CoH which made slow-progression disincentive, thus my part of the community was disabled, I've voiced this many times. But that doesn't stop me from understanding the OPs point of view (scratch - the entire game is end-game; I strongly disagree)

 

The endgame is fun. I've played many, many MMos enough to understand the only ones that survive are the ones which treat endgame as a 'bonus'. It is what you do after there is nothing left to do.

 

I have no beef for PL / Farmers. But there was a time, where slow-progression was the main attraction.. The only difference now is 'endgame' is the main-attraction and unfortunately this dynamic particularly takes away from slow-progression. And when we voice our concerns we're met with... 'just ignore the content'

[SwitchFade]

You're ALL wrong.

 

True end-game meta-content is...

 

 

 

Forums.

 

Oh, and costuming.

[Saikochoro]

Once you hit level 50 and have your alpha slot, you can run any task force you like.  That means an ITF or STF or an Apex or Tin Mage, and it also means you can run Synapse and Positron and Admiral Sutter.  You can run virtually any story arc from Ouroboros.  You are not limited in what you can do because you rushed to 50 -- quite the contrary, your horizons are expanded to include the entire game.  Anything you want to do, you can do.

 

And it's this that makes me sad every time I see something like "lvl 50 Brute looking for AE or farm" in the LFG channel -- you can get your enjoyment from the game how you want, but seeing someone who's powerleveled to 50, and all they're interested in is more farms, is depressing. Thinking about all the content they don't care about because it's not a farm (or don't know about, because all they've ever done in game is farm) reminds me of a line from a novel referring to mining the asteroids for resources: "Out there it's raining soup, and we don't even know about soup bowls." But if endless farming is the only way they know how to play, or what they think is the 'best' way to play, I'll just be disappointed in them and let them go off and do their own thing.

 

Why is this depressing though? If that is what they enjoy doing, then that is how they should play. I have a friend who started up HC for one day. He went through story contacts for several hours. Got bored of the slowness of it and quit. I managed to get him to try DFB and a few AE farms a couple weeks later and he has since been playing several hours a day.

 

Some people just love farming. It’s what they do. I love the low level farms so I can get to the 30s quickly and then do whatever I want after. But for others the farming is the game. For many it also isn’t about not knowing any better. Many have tried stories, TFs, etc and just don’t enjoy them. It isn’t a lesser way of playing. They aren’t skipping content. They are choosing the content that is right for them.

[Blackbird71]

Endgame is when I've filled all the character slots.

 

On every server.

 

I think I'll be playing for a while...

[Widower]

Forums.

 

Does that make me the "final boss" of CoH? Groovy.

[Saikochoro]

You're ALL wrong.

 

True end-game meta-content is...

 

 

 

Forums.

 

Oh, and costuming.

 

This is true honestly. When I played swtor I found that I spent way more time on the forums than in the game itself. So far on HC, I’ve spent more time in game, but I do prowl the forums a lot.

[justicebeliever]

I have no beef for PL / Farmers. But there was a time, where slow-progression was the main attraction.. The only difference now is 'endgame' is the main-attraction and unfortunately this dynamic particularly takes away from slow-progression. And when we voice our concerns we're met with... 'just ignore the content'

 

I disagree...(full transparency, I am one of those 'disaffected' slow progression people)...but this game has always had a significant population that just wants to lvl up as fast as possible.  Even when there was no end game...

 

And I think what you are saying is that before Incarnates, there was no end-game, and grinding content was all there was...but that would have been really long ago...Before Incarnates, there was AE Farming, before that Reward Merits, Very Rare Purple IO's , then Flashback, then Inventions/Marketplace, before that Prestige/Supergroup/Base Raids, before that Epic AT's, and before that Hami-O's.  There has always been a big shiny that has made people want to lvl up as quick as they can.  There has always been a sizable contingent looking to get to that brass ring as fast as possible.

 

I also don't have a beef with any of this...but just pointing out that it has always been an issue...

[Xaeon]

You're ALL wrong.

 

True end-game meta-content is...

 

 

 

Forums.

 

Oh, and costuming.

 

"Fashion is the true end game" - Warframe mantra.

[justicebeliever]

You're ALL wrong.

 

True end-game meta-content is...

 

 

 

Forums.

 

 

I hate to disagree SwitchFade but you are way off on this....

 

 

 

 

 

The actual game is the end-game of the Forums...Forums First!  Forums Last!  Forums Forever!!!  Long live GM Widower!!

[_NOPE_]

You're ALL wrong.

 

True end-game meta-content is...

 

 

 

Forums.

 

OOOO! I think I dinged... level.... two hundred?

[Shinobu]

I have no beef for PL / Farmers. But there was a time, where slow-progression was the main attraction.. The only difference now is 'endgame' is the main-attraction and unfortunately this dynamic particularly takes away from slow-progression. And when we voice our concerns we're met with... 'just ignore the content'

 

I disagree...(full transparency, I am one of those 'disaffected' slow progression people)...but this game has always had a significant population that just wants to lvl up as fast as possible.  Even when there was no end game...

 

And I think what you are saying is that before Incarnates, there was no end-game, and grinding content was all there was...but that would have been really long ago...Before Incarnates, there was AE Farming, before that Reward Merits, Very Rare Purple IO's , then Flashback, then Inventions/Marketplace, before that Prestige/Supergroup/Base Raids, before that Epic AT's, and before that Hami-O's.  There has always been a big shiny that has made people want to lvl up as quick as they can.  There has always been a sizable contingent looking to get to that brass ring as fast as possible.

 

I also don't have a beef with any of this...but just pointing out that it has always been an issue...

 

Heck, I remember that brief time when level 40 was the max level and people ran Abandoned Sewer Network over and over (without actually completing it I think) because it was the best XP anyone could find.  And yes, I remember around the time that the Winter Lords showed up (WL babies came before there was ever an AE baby) was when they released Peacebringers and Warshades.  I remember this because a couple of SG mates had Peacbringers, and they looked so cool and I wasn't 50 yet and I couldn't make one.  I was kind of afraid to PL to 50 on Winter Lords, it seemed like that might get you nerfed somehow, but I wasn't too afraid to make a fire tank and herd and burn my way to 50 in as short a time as possible.

 

 

[pattycake]

 

I also don't have a beef with any of this...but just pointing out that it has always been an issue...

 

Absolutely, you always point out the right things. ;)

 

 

 

 

 

 

[justicebeliever]

You're ALL wrong.

 

True end-game meta-content is...

 

 

 

Forums.

 

OOOO! I think I dinged... level.... two hundred?

 

Ooh!  Can we get vet levels for the forums?

[hoodedKitsune]

An acquaintance of mine rushed through the game to max level and Incarnate.  He hasn't played in over a month.

 

The landscape of gaming has changed so much, back when CoX was live we still lived in a time when the leveling process mattered.  These days all that matters is the endgame.  So people unfamiliar with the "old ways" are blasting through only to realize that there isn't much to see at the end.

 

CoX was designed to be enjoyed over a long period of leveling.  Slow down, enjoy the journey.  It's a nice reprieve from the instant gratification shit that is plaguing other games.

 

I am not big on posting but THIS x1,000! City really was one of the last games I knew that for the longest it was the "journey", then we got time travel, content in all level ranges new, and finally endgame.  So many of the MMOs now days only do endgame to the point that if you are not rushing to be max level, it's kinda a lonely game unless you have like minded friends!

 

I am all for "to each their own" but the whole "the game doesn't start till max level" is what is killing a lot of new games, heck half the games are trying to now go back to "classic"....that should tell you something! 95% of the games now have it to where whatever powers you have be the time you get to level 10 or 20 is all you will ever have in games that reach up to level 50 and higher!  You no longer out level anything which adds to the feeling of never getting stronger when you have the same 8 powers with 3 of them being passives.  No Dev team can ever make enough content any more when people burn through an "Endgame" dungeon that took half a year to make in less than a month and are hungry for more! 

 

If this is your favorite way to play, I ain't mad at ya, I tip my hat to you....but it makes me sad when someone jumps into an MMO, be it old or new, gets to max level in less than a week, does whatever the new Endgame place is in a week and a half time, then sets up camp in a forum or Twitter/Facebook/Reddit and is telling everyone how bad said game sucks cause they blew threw it in 2 to 3 weeks and the game has NOTHING to do! 

[PaxArcana]

The endgame begins immediately after you finish (or skip) the Tutorial.  :)

[Yomo Kimyata]

 

And the best part?  You have a completed build to do it with.  Certainly if you exempt down you will not have access to all of your powers, but there is no arguing that I'm still in better shape as a completed level 50 exempted down to run a Moonfire Task Force, than a level 25 character running the same TF.  I have more slots, I have a more complete build, and if I've used any attuned IOs of any sort at all in my build (including purples or PvP IOs) then there's really no contest, the level 25 can't match me.

 

Best of all, if I want to do actual level 50 content, I can.  I can join hami raids, Apex/Tin Mage, incarnate TFs -- whatever.  But in fact I do run a lot of lower and mid-level TFs with my friends, and it doesn't matter that I'm level 50.

 

I don't know, maybe some people refuse to ever exempt down and don't see the point of doing a Hess TF once they've already done it.  But the idea that there's little to do at 50 always strikes me as a very stupid statement -- there's EVERYTHING to do at 50.  That's what makes this game so great.  ^_^

 

 

Firstly and most importantly, I think that it is great that we have different opinions on this, and yet, we both get so much out of this game.  I had really mixed feelings when CoX re-emerged, but so far it really appeals to a wide variety of people for a wide variety of reasons.  And that is really wonderful and inspiring.

 

I have a very different play style than you.  I'm limited for a number of reasons to the amount of continuous time I am able to log on, so I rarely am able to team for extended periods of time.  I've been on one TF so far on Homecoming.  I've got about 40 alts from lvls 5-45, and the only reason I don't currently have a 50 is that I turned off xp so that I could see what AVs I can solo when I come to them.

 

I left Live around the time they were instituting the incarnate system, so I will be the first to admit that I don't really know what I'm talking about.  But it seems to me that this game is easy.  Really easy.  Part of that is figuring out what tips and tricks you need to do in order to become better, but part of it just feels too simple.  Sometimes you'll be on a steamroll mission and it's so easy it's like playing chess with a 5 y/o and every piece is a queen.  I don't recall in Live ever failing on a TF, regardless of whatever team make-up was (although I admit I don't think I ever ran any Master of ... TFs).

 

I get it that some people really like it that way.  And that's cool.  Personally, I like to test myself.  To play sub-optimal or even foolish build combinations because it meets my character concept.  And does that handicap me?  Not really, because even if I face-plant a hundred times, that hundred-and-first time I'm probably going to pull it off.

 

For me, part of that is building my character going forward organically.  I wrestle with power selection and slot placement, and every single time that I ding, it's a mental challenge to do the best I can.

 

So, not having any recent personal experience with having a fully incarnated toon put together, I can only imagine that it makes the game even easier.  I seem to recall the iTrials are really hard and require those extra powers, but I can't imagine taking that 50+++ into Oro and going back and ganking Atta.  To me, that seems like it would just be too easy.

 

I also really, really like a lot of the content.  Don't get me wrong, CoT and Oreganobana can suck a bag of #!@#, but every single time I bust the Freakshow arms deal and meet a Mysterious Soldier, I get goose bumps.  Who can it be?

Maybe I'll care less and less about that as I level 50 or 100 alts, but for the time being, this really works for me.

 

Anyhoo, I'm really happy that we each enjoy this game in our own way!