When escorting an NPC, let the NPC follow you while Stealthed

[DrRocket]

For many of my non-melee, Stealth is a major component of their defense strategy, and when you get into an escort mission, being forced to essentially give u your stealth defense in an environment where status effects are essentially spammed, becomes extremely hazardous to non-melee.

 

Ironically, there are a few missions, where being under stealth does not impact the NPC following, while many others it does.

 

Perhaps the request, is to make all missions where NPCs can follow you while you are stealth

 

Regards

[srmalloy]

16 minutes ago, DrRocket said:

Ironically, there are a few missions, where being under stealth does not impact the NPC following, while many others it does.

The rule of thumb seems to be that if the escorted NPC participates in combat while they're being led out, they can see you through stealth; if not, then they're too stupid to take the canvas sack off their head, and will lose track of you at any hint of your getting outside their perception range.

[Ghost]

If enemies can’t see you in stealth, why would anyone else?

[Ukase]

Mark and Recall for the win. (not much help when you're under level 20, though, admittedly)

[lemming]

I still want a sack to stuff them into so we just carry them out.

 

Mark & Recall is definitely the winner.

 

And for a slow solution, if you hit walk, they'll even follow a stalker.  (Though some obstacles do confuse the hostage)

[OverkillEngine]

In lieu of an actual systemic fix to perception and pathfinding, just have entering an escort mission grant a temp version of Assemble the Team and make sure all escort NPC's are valid targets for it once they've been flagged as "rescued" from their initial spawn location.

[Glacier Peak]

Mark and Recall for the win! You can use it to teleport multiple escorts at the same time. 

[Psi-bolt]

1 hour ago, Ukase said:

Mark and Recall for the win. (not much help when you're under level 20, though, admittedly)

 

I wish we could buy temporary charges of this power.

[golstat2003]

Let's just change all escort missions so that if you get to the exit, the escort/hostage teleports to your location and the mission ends. This game's stupid escort AI is why I mainly avoid such missions, or use my auto complete on such missions where possible.

 

For newspaper/radios, I would rather zone out and back into the zone, then do an escort mission. UGH.

Edited Wednesday at 04:31 PM by golstat2003

[El D]

Escort NPCs should just be temporary pets. It maintains the set up of the escort missions while allowing the NPCs to be a lot more functional rather than frustrating. Direct control and immediate ability to monitor them eliminates a lot of the issues with losing track of them or aggro-ing on everything in sight. It also makes it very easy to tell who they're following and it's a lot harder for folks to miss a brand new pet window popping up on their screen and randomly drag escorts into another mob. Can still teleport them as needed, and do so more easily.

[Renatos1023]

I was just complaining about this during a Moonfire the other day. I wholly support having rescue mission NPCs changed somehow so people don't need to turn stealth off. Not sure if a huge boost to NPC perception would solve the issue or not, but that would seem to be an easy fix if so. 

[Rudra]

As much as I hate dropping my stealth powers when I have a non-combat escort, I do have a question. If the player's character is using a stealth power, that is, the character is actively trying to avoid being detected, then how is John or Jane Doe, the average civilian with no experience at tracking things, supposed to follow the player character when the character is actively trying to not be seen? It's like expecting random Gothamite to follow Batman when he saves them, then pops a smoke grenade and disappears. "Uh, Batman? Where'd you go, big guy? Oh god, PLEASE don't leave me here alone! There are things here that will EAT me!!!!". (Yes, Batman will still sneak if guiding someone, but only just using corners to look around and make sure it is still safe for the Gothamite. Look at the times Batman had to escort someone. He had to escort an injured Superman, and aside from using the sewers to get around to avoid detection, was not making any effort to be sneaky because he had to lug Superman around.)

 

So yeah, I hate dropping my stealth powers when I have to escort a non-combat NPC, but it makes sense for me to have to, so I accept it.

[biostem]

I wonder how difficult/feasible it would be to have it where, upon freeing the hostage, all players on a team are granted a temp power that, then toggled on, suppresses all stealth for that person...

[lemming]

1 hour ago, Renatos1023 said:

Not sure if a huge boost to NPC perception would solve the issue or not

For non-combat ones sure.    Combat ones, I'd love to have their perception reduced since some of them will see a mob across the map and attack.  I'm still voting for a sack.

[Psi-bolt]

6 hours ago, lemming said:

I still want a sack to stuff them into so we just carry them out.

 

It would be nice if we could pick up the hostage.  Even if that came with a debuff.  

[Rudra]

1 minute ago, Psi-bolt said:

 

It would be nice if we could pick up the hostage.  Even if that came with a debuff.  

Sure, make the debuff you are limited to that one Family guy carrying the body you have to rescue for both animation and movement speed, and you automatically lose any and all stealth effects while also gaining the Only Affect Self status. At least then we wouldn't have to stand there and wait for the NPC to figure out how to use stairs or a ramp of all things.

[MTeague]

1 hour ago, Psi-bolt said:

 

It would be nice if we could pick up the hostage.  Even if that came with a debuff.  

I have repeatedly asked for either an NPC leash, so they don't need to see me, just follow the tug of the leash, OR, a temporary power to pick up the NPC in a fireman's carry. Even if my ability to attack is 100% grayed out while I'm carrying the NPC, with even Fire Aura's and the like forcibly turned off. 

[MTeague]

1 hour ago, lemming said:

For non-combat ones sure.    Combat ones, I'd love to have their perception reduced since some of them will see a mob across the map and attack.  I'm still voting for a sack.

I sometimes teleport past Lady Grey and proceed to clear the path as best as I can before I "rescue" her. 

It won't stop spawned ambushes after you retrieve her of course, but I can at least clear the static spawns.

[Rudra]

2 minutes ago, MTeague said:

I sometimes teleport past Lady Grey and proceed to clear the path as best as I can before I "rescue" her. 

It won't stop spawned ambushes after you retrieve her of course, but I can at least clear the static spawns.

Heh. I always ignore and avoid Lady Grey on that mission until the map is cleared. And after the initial ambush is dealt with and panic subsides, I race ahead of her as best I can to clear the remaining ambushes so she doesn't die.

[golstat2003]

3 hours ago, Rudra said:

As much as I hate dropping my stealth powers when I have a non-combat escort, I do have a question. If the player's character is using a stealth power, that is, the character is actively trying to avoid being detected, then how is John or Jane Doe, the average civilian with no experience at tracking things, supposed to follow the player character when the character is actively trying to not be seen? It's like expecting random Gothamite to follow Batman when he saves them, then pops a smoke grenade and disappears. "Uh, Batman? Where'd you go, big guy? Oh god, PLEASE don't leave me here alone! There are things here that will EAT me!!!!". (Yes, Batman will still sneak if guiding someone, but only just using corners to look around and make sure it is still safe for the Gothamite. Look at the times Batman had to escort someone. He had to escort an injured Superman, and aside from using the sewers to get around to avoid detection, was not making any effort to be sneaky because he had to lug Superman around.)

 

So yeah, I hate dropping my stealth powers when I have to escort a non-combat NPC, but it makes sense for me to have to, so I accept it.

 

Yeah I get the logic. My problem with those missions isn't even with stealth off the AI on the NPC is still stupid as f*&^!

[srmalloy]

1 hour ago, golstat2003 said:

 

My problem with those missions isn't even with stealth off the AI on the NPC is still stupid as f*&^!

The NPCs are brain dead already; you can see this in office maps, where rescued NPCs appear to be hardcoded to run to the nearest point where they can leave the floor — even when this means that they're running deeper into the mission, to a floor still populated with hostile mobs. Or when there's an invasion event going on, where the NPCs will panic and run around madly — including into fights — rather than running to the nearest door to hide. 

[lemming]

2 hours ago, MTeague said:

I sometimes teleport past Lady Grey and proceed to clear the path as best as I can before I "rescue" her. 

It won't stop spawned ambushes after you retrieve her of course, but I can at least clear the static spawns.

Oh yea, I generally treat missions like that as kill all before I rescue them.   I tend to draw their groups away, etc...  Unless I have Mark & Recall.

[DrRocket]

12 hours ago, Ghost said:

If enemies can’t see you in stealth, why would anyone else?

Cause I am holding my escort's hand?

[Rudra]

11 minutes ago, DrRocket said:

12 hours ago, Ghost said:

If enemies can’t see you in stealth, why would anyone else?

Cause I am holding my escort's hand?

Then you aren't sneaking around? (Edit: Especially red side or in the Dirge of Chaos mission and similar where the escort is supposed to be actively resisting or trying to escape you?)

 

Edited Thursday at 01:51 AM by Rudra

[DrRocket]

2 minutes ago, Rudra said:

Then you aren't sneaking around?

How could I? I am stuck escorting, but I coudld help bozo move stealtfully too