Sir Myshkin

Slightly level of irony in calling out that character in this thread given previous comments about top-hat and monocle crowd: His build is the poster-child for "expensive" 🤣🤣🤣

I tried to do a couple of scarf-like things on one or two characters, but other than one very specific case, I heavily dislike capes and find them to be massively impractical. Also have never favored the spandex look, ever. I feel a character should have mass, texture, detail. Designers even acknolwedge this both in movie/series adaptation of comic-based characters, as well as the artists developing the books. Having layers in the costume gives more presence to the character, more depth, and makes them more dynamic than something running around in spandex. This impact has occurred on every comic line in the last 20 years from Superman to Spider-Man. It also helps acknowledge that a simple fabric isn't really going to hold up on the regular, and doesn't protect the wearer for anything, nor does it truly allow them to hide gadgets and tools of any sort. Just going from the 70's to early 00's the 'S' symbol and the belt and even the cape of Superman were theatrically detailed, and by the time Cavil wears the suit its been given layered/armor definition and a material that's definitively not spandex (although hilariously it's the one costume that probably would've been better favored to rely his physique instead of fake it). This is the reality of a spandex suit: 🤣 And this is what we know, deep down, it really should be: Edna Mode didn't have anything to do with that.

If anyone learns anything about Influence, it's better to have stock in property than cash. Oh wait, that's a real-world economists perspective. Enh, it still holds true here too. If you measured raw Influence across an account, I would easily appear to have "little" in fluid funds, but I sit on physical items worth a considerable amount beyond. It would be rather difficult to say "who's the richest one of all" if we only looked at where the fluid Influence flows and pools. Most current project I early bank rolled with floating funds 200m Inf, completed every item in his build to level 35, but started slotting at 23. Given the last few items the build needs are Purples I cannot slot, and a couple more WO's I'll likely have to shell out an additional 200m. But, you're right, a "billion inf build" is incredibly over stretched. At most I've only ever spent a hard-cash value of ~650-700M (roughly) for any one character. Not sure what I'd class as sizable, but I suspect I'm in the same boat as you. I roll a character and level to 50, fully slot the build and earn at least the Alpha slot and a T3 to sit in it, and that's irregardless of whether I ever intend to log into the character again (I have a couple that I never play).

Doesn't count, you used Rage. Nerf Rage!

The only one that really has collective value is Ageless, which if you break down the steps and average it out over the course of two minutes you end up with a "long-term" value of 20% Global Recharge for anything that sits within its 2+ minute effect. Anything that cycles within 60/s or less it depends on which side of the tier it falls for that to matter, but often in those cases Ageless is likely less impactful by contrast. Barrier, anyone who uses that for calculations is just seeing it as 5% net since that's the portion and value that exists the longest (at the end). The burst portion of the ability is effective as an anti-debuff, which is essentially the only alternative reason someone may take this power. Clarion is purely either a perma-mez, or a "Power Boost" for Farsight (about the only power that actually matters under its effect).

Heh, now lets see how long it takes folks to recognize these faces.

I try everything in my power to develop builds that don't need to fulfill their purpose with a Destiny, and then I get to the point of finally being able to select one and I look at the list and go "... I don't need any of these, so I guess Rebirth it is!" Because it's the only one that ends up having universal value no matter what. There are only a few one-off cases where I know that the Destiny needs to support a certain purpose: Ageless on my Blaster because it vacuums endurance like a Dyson, and Clarion on my Storm for Mez Protection. Personally I feel like we need one more Destiny in there that does a little Acc/Dam/End/Regen blending. Doesn't need to have a huge spike, just something that gives a nice little collective static bonus of +ToHit/+Dam/+Recovery/+Regen alongside Debuff Resistance to each of those categories for two minutes. Just a nice little "top off" power that can more dynamically blend on teams than compared to what we have now: Super Def/Res, Super Heal, Super Mez, Super Weird (what is really the point of Incandescent, come on).

Yes there is inherently some mild synergy in this factor since Energy Aura does provide that kick-up to +Recharge, but there is a max limit that Power Siphon can ultimately be drawn down to (30/s, but realistically 35/s) for minimum recharge. Incidentally this plays right into the life-cycle of Power Siphon's ramp up and ramp down effect (10/s to ramp up to full, sit at full for 10/s, then slowly taper down when the ability "ends" after 20/s and the stacks wear off their 10/s duration and effectively hold a 30/s total window of time. Technically (for Scrappers specifically) the critical function of Concentrated Strike refreshes Power Siphon, but it tends not to be that often, and historically often at the point where you're left going "...did that even matter?" Plus Concentrated Strike is... kind of "eh" power compared to everything else in Kinetic Melee's arsenal.

True story: I took Medicine on my "MAN" build Traps/AR(Fighting) Defender because I thought it would be an amusing shtick to play up during lulls in attacks or something. I hardly ever used it, I just couldn't be bothered to make the effort when it was simpler to just run over and Kick whatever was causing the offense than to try and save the player indirectly. In truth, Provoke would've been more useful than Aid Other ever proved to be. But then again I'm considerably Mad as who would Tank with a Traps Defender?! <-- This guy.

Edit: nevermind, it just really isn't worth it.

The Story of March A Carpenter needs nails to frame a house, so he goes to a Blacksmith and says "I need nails and a new hammer." The Blacksmith agrees, but what can the Carpenter offer in exchange? The Carpenter says, "I'll bring you crafted handles for your tools." The Blacksmith agrees, and the Carpenter sets off. Now the Blacksmith needs ore for these nails and hammer, so the Blacksmith goes to the Miner and says "I need ore for nails, I will give you a new pick-axe and shovel for the work and product." The Miner agrees, and sets off. The Miner knows that the work ahead will be arduous and time consuming, and the mine will be dark, he will need light. The miner goes to the Candle Maker and says, "I need candles to work in the mine for light." The Candle Maker agrees, but they will need tallow and wicks for the Miner's needs, how will the Miner repay this need? The Miner says "I will give you the coal from my mine to use in melting your tallow and to warm your home." The Candle Maker agrees, and the Miner sets off. Now the Candle Maker needs tallow, so she goes to the Butcher and asks for the fat off hides and cuts of unwanted meat. The Butcher is willing, but what does the Candle Maker offer in exchange for these goods that the Baker also needs for their breads and sweets? The lard of the animals can be used in their lamps and produce light, there is nothing that the Candle Maker makes that the Butcher would need. "I also make wicks for my candles," she says, "I can make the twine you use to wrap your sales." The butcher agrees, and the Candle Maker sets off. Later that day the Weaver gets a request of cheese cloth for the Butcher's cuts, and cotton for the Candle Maker to make twine. She sets out to the Farmer who has fields of cotton, and pastures of sheep and asks for the things she needs. The Farmer agrees, in exchange for new Coveralls to work the fields. The Weaver agrees, and sets off. The Farmer goes out to begin collecting his cotton and notices his cotton gin is broken, so he heads to the Carpenter and asks for a repair. In exchange for the service, the Farmer tells the Carpenter that a large oak tree has been felled on his farm and is welcome to its wood. The Carpenter sees that the oak would be strong and best served for the Blacksmith's tools, and agrees to this arrangement upon which the Farmer sets off. In a day many services are exchanged, and fair value is assessed for all the items being crafted in trade for the service of making each for the other. Everything is circular on itself, and no one party feels a disservice for the arrangements they've made. Experience in craft is continued, goods are developed and traded for others' experience, craft, and goods. Then the next day comes and a Stranger whom enters the town with bags of coins in amounts considered to be rare to have, yet somehow the Stranger has much of it. They go to each stall in the Market and they offer handfuls of coins to each artisan at each stall, and they ask for little, but pay with a lot. Each artisan begins to think they are not asking enough for their wares if this one person is so willing to spend so much for so little. The Stranger has spread worth into every pocket, but it has caused an illusion of exceeded worth in each pocket it lands, and this goes on for weeks. Now every good in every stall is being asked for at double the previous cost. Some like the Blacksmith have goods that cannot be gone without, but others like the Candle Maker struggle to match the worth. The town crier sees this, and reports it to the head of the town council who comes out and meets the Stranger one day, and asks "Where did you earn these riches?" The Stranger shrugs at the question and waves his hand around as if swatting away a fly, "I am too lazy to farm, to weave, to cook, to carve, or forge, but there is a well on my land that if I stand at its side for an hour a day, it fills my pockets with coins. I discovered one day that enough of these would buy me anything I could desire. When I discovered this town, I came here and bought the things I cannot do on my own, and offered an amount that would not be turned down because the coins mean nothing to me, as I can get more whenever I please." This upset the head of the council to no end, knowing what chaos such an extravagant expenditure of wealth has caused on his town. "I will tax you then, half of your earnings. You will pay fair value for the purchases you make, no more, no less than their worth." The Stranger is baffled by this idea, angered at the thought, "And what would you do with the tax you collect?" "I will throw it in the river and watch it be washed away. For now we will let you keep your well, but you offer no service or good that balances the coin you bring. that dilutes the worth of the goods we sell, and disrupts the balance of the townsfolk's goods which I cannot have, as it will make it impossible for them to afford and trade goods fairly. You will spend and buy at the rate everyone else does." The Stranger conceded, but by force for this change, and after a short while the town's market stalls returned their prices and their services back to normal and the town seemed restored. The head of the council still knew though of that well on the Stranger's land, spitting out coins freely for standing still for hours on end and that would have to be stopped. One did not just leave a leaky faucet to drip, drip, drip, without purpose.

Worth mentioning that if you're doing a lot of stuff solo, or otherwise need to build up a supply of Incarnate stuff, Heather's preliminary arc is repeatable through Oroborous and has some good payouts at the ends. It can feel a bit tedious to keep restarting it, but it definitely has better returns than just redoing DA repeatable.

That first spoiler'd build was a direct response to Lady War's build, which did not include a travel power. In the event of offering suggestive feedback I will try not to remove/alter power selection choices of a player's build. The second suggested (spoiler'd) build does have Mystic Flight included, however (and would be the more likely suggested between those two specifically). As for the build, if you're running with nothing slotted, than that is your problem right there. That build empty and void of enhancement is really lacking. Even at a bare minimum getting some basic IO's (or even SO's if you must) to get some enhancement is going to open up a world of survivability. That defense needs to hit 40-45% to really start making a difference in your life, and even with just basic slotting you can hit that range. Also remember that Shield Charge and Foot Stomp are just as much AoE damage as they are Control (KD effects) to limit incoming attacks.

It doesn't take much to negate the -Dam from Granite Armor, and in honesty to even negate all of its side effects if someone wanted. The idea of a Granite built Proc Monster has come up several places, and the user Bopper even dedicated an entire thread to the exploration of it and having multiple builds for exmp play, and specifically targeting Psionic resistance. This is one I put together at the time that was being talked about, its soft cap to all (but Psi), and hard cap resists to all (but Psi) with the Tanker +Res ATO proc.

In those situations I send it to the player's email with a note along the lines of: "In honor of your quest to earn your keep, lets make a deal with this influence. Carry it with you and use it to help others along your path, whenever that time comes, you can simply forward this to them." Unless they "claim" it, it just sits there indefinitely which makes it a convenient way for them to keep it separate and "pay it forward" for someone else. If they truly don't want to mess with it they can technically "send it back," but... that never happens 😄 edit: I also generally don't "trade request" anyone, I much rather like leaving random emails behind. If it's important enough I'll shoot them a tell, but some times its fun just to send it and let it sit for a while. I've gotten responses weeks after the fact "I didn't even know!" (or whatever along those lines).

I had started typing out the thought of this before, and ended up not because I felt I was going overboard on my reasoning, but since you brought it up: If 10 Merits becomes 30 Converters, and I sell those for enough of a price to take home 75,000 a piece, I have an effective per-merit value of 225,000. Lets take that consideration the other direction and not sell the converter, but use them instead on a random drop set IO I just crafted (from salvage I already had on-hand, minimize investment ratio). The starter IO is... lets say an UC, we want to move out of that option so we convert out for 2 in the category to get a rare (typically). Hypothetically lets say that I just jackpot struck on a solid 2 mill minimum piece and sell it with that profit margin, that makes my converter value 1,000,000 per Converter, which makes my Merit value 1 to 3mill, making my stack of 10 worth 30mill. Of course that doesn't always play out so brilliantly, which means I'm more likely looking at something like 2 to convert out, and 1-3 attempts are Rare bouncing into a minimum 2mill payout. That translates my per-Converter cost ratio to 400,000, and turns my per-Merit to 1.2 million. I'm still way ahead of the curve. The question from here is "how many converters can I burn before my potential payout of 2,000,000 becomes cost deficient to having just sold the converts?" At the current market value of 75,000* I'd have to burn 27 converters to fall below the value of having just sold them out-right. As it stands currently Converters and Boosters are seen as the two prominent "best" methods of burning Merits into raw Influence, but that only applies in a "don't want to do any work for it" path. Even the simplest case of light converting can get into a useful and meaningful profit that exceeds even a 1 to 333,333 value. This doesn't even account for the potential of landing into an IO worth 4mill+ and what that becomes (at a minimum if I used all 30 to get it, my Merit value is 400,000). Like I said, using Merits saved me BILLIONS of Influence. *Not accounting for any fees or adjustments to compensate fees, looking for the simplistic math here. Also, lets hope I didn't smudge a decimal somewhere!

I did the math at one point on what it took to buy converters directly and flip accordingly. I should say less that I "did the math" and more of a "I was doing this without consideration for a long time and finally sat down at some point and asked myself how much Influence I was flushing." Short end of it was that for every 10 5mill+ valued IO I sold, I was loosing one or two of those straight up to conversions. Looking at a small set of 1 in 10 (5 out of 45 Mill potential), doesn't seem terrible, until that is exponentially compounded by stacks of 10 at a time, 60+ stacks, daily (for a while, this was a bit back now). Within a month I had "given away" over a billion influence to converters. The true number is honestly probably even greater than that knowing I was buying them in sets of 1,000 (76-100m) every few days. Was around that same time I came to the determination that having a "Marketer" wasn't really worth individualizing one character's role towards and started making sure I targeted each Phalanx Task Force as I leveled a character (especially on double-up weeks), and cash in the merits for converters and use that supply to start looping drops and key market items to generate influence within the contained character.

This is the most important take away @Ankhammon. There are only a handful of sets that are prime for pairing and truly bending procs in the most significant way on Defenders (about four or five primaries and secondaries equally). There are only so many sets that have a high threshold for proc utilization before things simmer into a pretty equal territory. Some sets (like Fire Blast) are fairly limited in their options, so there's no major difference if one goes Defender of Corruptor in the attempt of trying to build a surplus function (ie: more freedom with set bonuses). The full break down is linked in my signature (Defender Proc Monster) on what lays out to be optimal choices, and still several of them can be done (to an extent easily) on a Corr. As someone also already mentioned on the Scourge topic too (to reinforce), this is another big aspect of how a Corr can potentially deal with higher-difficulty targets more uniquely/quickly in some build comparisons. It all just depends on the nature of the design, the proc utility, and what the debuff/buff set does to support the blast set.

(couldn't resist, cause what better use has this thread become than a meme war!)

Ooh, are we storytelling? Back on Retail, my very first character way back in the old days before Villains and Inventions and all those shenanigans, I loaded up the worst costume on a wolverine-clone one could imagine and dropped into Galaxy City. The place was practically deserted save one speck among the white tiles and benches, a blurry obtuse black smoky fog oozing from a human-shaped form out all over the pavement. "That's so cool!" I thought to myself, and approached it, going around in circles trying to figure out what power sets it belonged to. Then the mist spoke to me, "First character?" We talked for a few minutes about Dark Armor, and how empty Galaxy City was for a starter-zone, and that everyone typically (even randomly in the greater proportion) head to Atlas Park. Then, at the end, they sent me a trade request (the only way to move INF at all). They dropped 50,000* Influence my way, and I was flabbergasted at the amount expecting it to be so much. They said "No problem," and went about their way. I decide to figure out missions and start looking for my contact, I bump into another player, small conversation later we're now teamed and they're taking me through some info about the first contacts of the game and how to get story arcs going, then invite me to their SG. I was like "This is crazy. These people can't all be this nice, can they?" Every experience since was all up hill positives, and I understood paying it forward was the biggest part that mattered and I try and continually drop random gifts of influence and enhancements on folks. Now here on Homecoming, whenever I'm on a character that can support it, when I see the random musings over "I wish I could afford X..." or "I really need Y", I'll drop random parts on players, or send them e-mails with the items in question, or Influence enough to buy it.s

😄😄😄😄😄😄😄😄😄

A thought for you: You're spending too much time on your primary. If you're interested in my perspective: tl;dr Not every set sings for every player. It sounds like this one just isn't a tune you enjoy. Don't feel bad about leaving the character behind and moving on to a new project.

puts on professor cap Core concepts on creating an attack chain (AoE or ST, or a combo of both) is looking at what provides the most "Bang for Buck" (Damage for Cost/Cast), and repeating the best options as often as possible. Every attack has what is called a "DPA" or Damage Per Activation. This is the Dam / Cast = DPA. Shockwave has an "Arcana Time" (Cast+ServerTickDelay) of 1.188 and does a base 72.26 Damage, its DPA is 60.82. Eviscerate has an Arcana of 2.508, base of 143.2, DPA of 57.09. Technically Eviscerate has a higher critical opportunity which makes is better exclusively on Scrappers over say Brutes or Tankers who don't get that function. Shockwave has an opportunity to Critical as well, but not as high as Eviscerate. From a Single-Target perspective it is reasonable to want to take Eviscerate, and it too can slot similarly between sets and procs (including a -Res proc which also happens to be -20% compared to the one Shockwave can slot at -12.5%). Now at this point Eviscerate is sounding pretty tasty, so why would I not take it, right? Well the answer to that comes down to a handful of reasons that all pretty-much come down to the cast and function of the two powers: Shockwave is a long-reach cone that does KB (can convert to KD) and is surprisingly very strong for such an ability. Typically a cone/aoe would not have a DPA that makes it comparable (or potentially better) than a normal ST attack. It also has a very fast cast time (1.188 is very quick compared to many other attacks in the same set which are slightly, to significantly longer). Eviscerate may be able to tag in its short cone an extra 2-3 bodies if they're clumped well enough, but Shockwave can grab an entire spawn, and having that as an option in your main attack chain is very handy. Follow Up is the binding agent that makes Claws shine by giving it a significant damage and to-hit boost, plus the ability can stack ontop of itself. Typically a reasonable amount of recharge in a build can manage to effectively get this down to "2x", which means an effective attack cycle that happens within 5/s each go-around to keep up FU's 10/s duration stacked on itself after it gets rolling. In many cases of casual recharge another attack needs to fill the small remainder gap which is where something like Strike sometimes comes into play early on, or conveniently Shockwave after 32 that is a bit better. Eviscerate could be exchanged (potentially) for a couple of options, or just added in, but its cast time tends to force the "5/s" cycle off kilter, which isn't the best. Typical go-to chain for Claws is FU > Focus > Slash (with slash having a -Res proc), but it requires an insane amount of recharge to get FU down to that <3/s recharge. A reason why this is so sought-after is the fact that FU > Focus > Slash ends up with a very tiny window where it triple stacks FU and allows just enough time to tag Focus with that 3x buff, making Focus hit incredibly hard. An "easy" chain that works similarly is FU > Focus > Eviscerate (with -Res) which is a bit more forgiving on recharge and still fits (squeezes in at .1/s under 5/s). But a lot of practical testing tends to lean that an attack that starts growing beyond 2/s, especially 2.5+ is dramatically more damaging to consistency when it misses because of the amount of window it consumes to do its job. Focus has a DPA of 72.47 and an Arcana cast of 1.32, doubled up that is 144.94 and 2.64/s, Eviscerate is (as noted) 57.09 at 2.508. Even if Eviscerate critical for double value, it still isn't anywhere near just using Focus twice, so we really, really want to make Focus happen as much as possible, thus we stick with Slash (shorter cast, 'same' base DPA, net overall gain to DPS). Keep this note strongly in mind on one reason why Eviscerate so commonly gets skipped. If Claws can do 144.94 base DPA with Focus in 2.6/s, if Eviscerate is being used, and it misses, not only are you missing out on the 57.09 DPA in that window, but the overall net loss of what could have been much much more. If one Focus were to miss, it's only 1.32/s of lost time, and can quickly be earned another chance after just a couple of seconds cool down. Fast, strong attacks are very forgiving to DPS when it comes to misses. Slow and heavy attacks are very damaging to DPS when they miss because they prevent better, optimal recovery. A couple others mentioned the Endurance cost as a concerning factor, and to touch on that one reason Eviscerate isn't seen as a hungry ability is because, again, its cast time is so long. Our endurance is recovered at a base #.## "End Per Second" (server ticks apply to us and all too, but lets just go with it cause the math washes the same). Lets say you have a typical 3.00 EPS (nice round number). Shockwave with decent enhancement comes down to about 7.24 end, and casts in 1.188, that's kind of an expensive trade. Eviscerate (slotted the same exact way) comes down to 5.56, and casts 2.5, its cheaper, right? Well, technically not only is it cheaper, it's kind of "free" by consequence. If you recover 3.00 EPS, and it casts in 2.5/s, you're actually earning 7.5 total end during that cast cycle, meaning you actually gain almost 2 points of Endurance! Because of this, Eviscerate inclusive chains can feel a lot less stressful on the end bar. Back to the original question. I did briefly mentioned that Strike was another common filler which can just as easily serve a purpose, fill the chain in the appropriate gap, and doesn't cost as much endurance to use, so why (other than its cone, we're only thinking ST after all, right?) would I take Shockwave if its going to burn me out? That answer comes down to that -Res proc I hinted at. Even at -12.5% (nearly half what we see in many others that do the same function), that proc is force-multiplying your entire attack chain's damage when it goes off, and it lasts for 10/s. Even if has a sporadic trigger and you only see it a couple times a minute, it is boosting your overall performance above what was possible supplementing with Strike. The rest of that comes down to finding some good end-management techniques (or Ageless Incarnate Destiny). In the end I guess you could simplify all of that down to "It's Math" if you wanted, but the math has purpose and reason behind it to justify the values and numbers.

I looked into this specific concern and the issue you're seeing is Bug and should be reported as such. The normalized data at the top is including the DoT "fire" damage when the power is used while [Fiery Embrace] is active. It can be easily accounted for by just adding up the totals of the power itself, plus the Fire DoT, and that's exactly what's posted at the top for both Shadow Maul and Midnight Grasp. Those are the only two DoT inclusive abilities though, and the only two (from what I just looked at) that are impacted in Dark Melee. The individual data is still accurate, but the addition at the top is incorrectly adding a conditional value. Again, if you're seeing something like that a quick math-check is all it takes, and you can report those Bugs as you find them.

The values you see posted in the actual game are accurate to level 50 base line performance. Level differences, resistances, etc, will all alter that value up or down accordingly. You should see two things, an enhanced value and a base value ["$enhancedvalue ($basevalue)"] in the power management "Show Detail" screens. Where it says "Damage per Activation" is how much the attack does out-right at level 50. There are a multitude of things that can change your values on the fly like Fury, Defiance, some mechanics stack damage, things like Follow Up which buff in the attack cycle, etc. If you want a flat experiment to verify, go punch a Pylon in the RWZ. It has base 20% resistances (which you can calculate out from the game's values). Edit to add: While Mid's isn't perfect and correct 100% of the time, most of its base values should be correct (like 95%, I'm being generous on possible error). Things that may not seem to line up correctly would be cases like having a damage proc in a power, Mid's will try and use the algorithm (somewhat brokenly) to give an estimated damage, and that number will never correctly match in game because of the proc in the power that the game doesn't count as actual damage in the attack's status windows.