golstat2003

Even with the new options, you'd still need to advertise what type of team you're forming. aka, "Master LRSF options team forming, looking for 7". In the short term after the release of the new features the team leader would have to explain what that means, including if it's a tf/sf that incarnate powers won't be allowed. Or if other more difficulty options are included. In the long term folks would know to ask when they see that Master label included in the request for team mates, as to what settings the team/tf leader is setting. With all that said, dev time on new difficulty options is something we probably won't see until 2025. The theory crafting in this thread is fun though.

So as I read, an additional difficulty option. Thanks for clarifying.

I'm not putting words in people's mouths. The main point has always been that changes being discussed in this thread would be in optional difficulty options. It seemed like you were saying the incarnate change shouldn't be optional. If I"m misreading what you said, apologies. But to be clear removing incarnate power use (besides Alpha) from levels below 50 should only be in new difficulty options. Shouldn't be made to the overall base game. EDIT: The OP can come in and correct if I'm wrong in reading what folks have been saying that these suggestions should be in optional difficulty options.

Then I would advocate against this change. I prefer to be able to use all incarnate powers from 45 to 50 period. I'd advocate against such a change. Any change to how incarnate powers works now of this level should be in OPTIONAL difficulty options like we've been saying all thread.

I think you meant "should have been". It's waaaay too late at this point to make such a change.

Honestly if I joined a lvl 45-50 tf/sf that had not advertised ahead of time that it was a "no incarnate powers" tf and suddenly found my incarnate powers turned off when the sf/tf started, I would tell the leader "you better reform, I'm out". Then drop. I don't like things sprung on me in teaming at the last second. If I see it forming in LFG, I better have all the info BEFORE we start. Especially since tfs are a time commitment (especially some of the longer shadow shard ones). I don't think I'm the only one.

Knockback powers can't be easily unslotted. Incarnate powers can. And it's really not that much of a burden if you're serious about it. What I think you'll find (I think you know based on what you just typed) is that most folks would not want to join a team of "no incarnate powers" because the majority of players like them. Even if you had the difficulty options to remove them automatically, you'd still had to advertise to anyone who joins a level 45-50 tf that they were joining one where those powers were auto removed. That's not something you can just spring on folks. So you would STILL have to advertise this whether you had those difficulty options or not. Just saying.

Also we have a bajillion (slight exaggeration lmao) chat channels. The main socialization in COH doesn't come from teaming. Since quite a few pickup groups I team with sometimes don't even talk in team chat. Yet I see folks chatting away in LFG, Help, General, and the respective server channels.

Also folks act like Incarnates are some beast that is inevitable for every level 50 or that they are something that you can't work around. Team leaders can do as you mention and also ask incarnates to unslot those powers. (They can actually be unslotted easier than enhancements, and changed to different powers easier than primary/secondary/pool powers). And if you (in general) don't even like the system, newsflash: don't craft the powers! I bet you money though, as you alude to, many more folks prefer incarnates as is (including using them as they see fit in ALL content, at ALL levels), than those that would be willing to unslot them. I don't consider this a problem that needs fixing at all.

I find it a bit funny and somewhat shortsighted. Because without it, I know quite a few vets that would have left years before the shutdown on live. Myself included. It (Incarnates) extended the life of the game the same way the Invention system did on live at the time it came out, and the same way purples, pvp IOs and Attunded IOs did. And HC making it easier to get into those systems (including their seeding of the market to keep prices low) is one of the reasons I stuck with HC when the dam on rogues servers broke a year+ back. Each major system change extends the life of an mmo. It's either that or constant content updates. Costume changes alone would not have allowed COH to run as long as it did on live.

The problems this would bring up outweigh any benefit by a mile or more. Sorry but its a no from me.

Hmmm, one could argue IOs started us long down that path before Judgement and family came into existence. Especially with purples, attuned IOs, and the constant inclusion of Set IOs that gave new ways to get +recharge.

That's kind of a naive view if that's what they said. At the time incarnate content needed large leagues to even start. (And to an extent still does). If I was expected to only play my incarnated characters in incarnate content, I wouldn't have ever bothered. And if Alpha were the only ability available in lvls 45-50 I would never have bothered starting the system on any character. I'm sorry but for most of my toons none of the alphas really provide anything impressive, especially with the inventions system. Alpha is a nice to have but is boring as hell for a system that is supposed to be the next level of power for our characters.

Agreed. All incarnate powers should stay as is.

Yeahhhh no. Let them continue to negotiate. Nothing wrong with that.

Well no, at that point what HC has stays as is. Or you get a C&D.

There is no hard deadline. They own the IP. They can take as long as they want.

Yeah I distinctly remember Positron and a few others outright explaining this on the live forums. In fact I recall that for some time (and probably even near the end of the life of the live product) plugging values into excel was part of the work. (Though that might have only been for powers). EDIT: Bottom line if folks just gotta be patient and wait. I'm just glad HC is still up and running and hasn't been hit with any Cease and Decist. Grateful for "small" things like that.

Actually it would help with the other thing that controllers can do -- debuffing. Which is extremely powerful. When I form teams and invite controllers, I'm not just seeking their control abilities. Especially since buffs and debuffs can be a force multiplier.

Hmmmm, the majority don’t care if the game is too easy as long as they can hop on a team and play or can easily solo on their own. But this is a side discussion, and not really relevant to those who are looking for more challenge options.

Assuming one thinks AOEs are a problem. I don’t think the majority of players think so.

Well no. These new options we are discussing are supposed to be OPTIONAL difficulty settings. If you can do it as part of the difficulty settings for those who want to play the new “OMGBBQHaaardMode” sure. As an overall change to the base game, no. i think both of you are discussing such changes in regards to the first option-aka optional difficulty. Just want to make it clear yet again that the base game should stay as is. Most players don’t care for making the game harder just to make it harder.

Hmmm. At 50 though thanks to incarnate abilities teams have stacking debuffs, so burning down hp/health and regen hasn’t been an issue there. At lower levels you have a point. But then I would not expect low level teams to use any such OPTIONAL difficulty settings. The plan ol +4/x8 and below will still exist. 😝

I was just thinking about Propel when I read the thread title. Good point. I would be down with this as an actual suggestion using the Propel tech!

As long as there is a screening process where HC themselves could block the submission, I have no issue. I don't trust anything having to do with user generated content. Not after the debacle that is AE. And if there are some existing offensive symbols, petition the GMs to have them removed. (I mean in general not specific to this poster).