Re-enable lvl 35 level req in the Rikti War Zone

[Sister Corruption]

I thought that this was done back when the server population was tiny (but apparently it was done during Issue 16). But, at present, is there any reason for a sub-level 35 to be in the zone other than using the MSR for PLing?

Edited October 6, 2019 by Sister Corruption

[Rathulfr]

The minimum level was removed in Issue 16, back in Retail.

https://paragonwiki.com/wiki/Rikti_War_Zone

 

/jranger

[Coyotedancer]

The vendor in the Vanguard base is easy to get to buy SO enhancements. Sure, you can always run to Talos or another higher level zone without much trouble, either, but it's a nice option to have if you happen to hit 22 in Atlas.

[Apparition]

  On 10/6/2019 at 4:43 PM, Sister Corruption said:

I thought that this was done back when the server population was tiny (but apparently it was done during Issue 16). But, at present, is there any reason for a sub-level 35 to be in the zone other than using the MSR for PLing?

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I fully 110% agree with you on this and have been arguing exactly this since the launch of Issue 16, but you're just stirring up a hornet's nest.  The Rikti mothership raid can now be locked to level 35+ via the trial.  Good enough.

[Cobalt Azurean]

  On 10/6/2019 at 4:54 PM, Rathulfr said:

/jranger

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Whoa, now there's a classic blueboards reference! Nice!

[Rathulfr]

  On 10/6/2019 at 4:43 PM, Sister Corruption said:

I thought that this was done back when the server population was tiny (but apparently it was done during Issue 16). But, at present, is there any reason for a sub-level 35 to be in the zone other than using the MSR for PLing?

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Is there any reason for a sub-level 35 to not be allowed in the zone?  Should we level lock any other high-level zones while we're at it?  Peregrine Island or Grandville, perhaps?  Aside from your distaste of "using the MSR for PLing", how would enforcing a minimum level on RWZ improve game play for anyone?

 

Edited October 7, 2019 by Rathulfr

[Sister Corruption]

  On 10/7/2019 at 1:39 AM, Rathulfr said:

 

Is there any reason for a sub-level 35 to not be allowed in the zone?  

 

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Sure. Lowbies can't contribute to the MSR very well, but they can contribute to hitting the zone cap. That's a reason they shouldn't be in the zone. The whole adding the MSR to the LFG tab is because of that problem. It's a stopgap fix for what would be a much easier solution--restoring the level requirement.

[Megajoule]

or for raising the zone cap a bit, so that we don't have to chase every single person who isn't on the raid out of the zone.

(which is impossible when some of them are AFK, a problem which making them be level 35 or above does nothing to solve.)

[CU_Krow]

I agree with this suggestion. If Cimerora requires a certain lvl (tho honestly its more badge-related), then it would make sense to have RWZ be similar. In terms of the SO enhancements, others can easily agree that lowbies can go elsewhere to get them. 

[golstat2003]

I DISAGREE with the suggestion. Even more so now that you can start a raid via LFG.

[justicebeliever]

  On 10/7/2019 at 9:42 AM, Megajoule said:

or for raising the zone cap a bit, so that we don't have to chase every single person who isn't on the raid out of the zone.

(which is impossible when some of them are AFK, a problem which making them be level 35 or above does nothing to solve.)

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You shouldn't have to chase anyone.  Just use the LFG queue.  And there are other reasons to be in the zone besides a raid, i.e. contacts there who give missions, badges, etc...

[Apparition]

  On 10/7/2019 at 4:26 AM, Sister Corruption said:

Sure. Lowbies can't contribute to the MSR very well, but they can contribute to hitting the zone cap. That's a reason they shouldn't be in the zone. The whole adding the MSR to the LFG tab is because of that problem. It's a stopgap fix for what would be a much easier solution--restoring the level requirement.

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It is a stopgap solution, but it is one that works very well.  Because it only loads a portion of the RWZ, performance during the raid is much better.  I have yet to experience any lag or raiders disconnect.  In addition, it makes running multiple MSRs much more stable by freeing up your computer's RAM by loading into a zone when the raid ends.  The trial raid also boosts everyone to combat level 50 so you don't have to worry about every team having a level 50 leader. 

 

I honestly can not understand why more people haven't used the LFG trial yet, other than inertia. 

Edited October 7, 2019 by Apparition

[Hyperstrike]

  On 10/7/2019 at 4:26 AM, Sister Corruption said:

Sure. Lowbies can't contribute to the MSR very well, but they can contribute to hitting the zone cap. That's a reason they shouldn't be in the zone. The whole adding the MSR to the LFG tab is because of that problem. It's a stopgap fix for what would be a much easier solution--restoring the level requirement.

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Incorrect.

While zone cap IS involved, it has nothing to do with lowbies.
LFG raids basically remove the necessity to have GM cooperation to spin up a new zone for the raid.
Mainly because there's no good way to control zone population in the prime instance.

Also, as someone who regularly runs ship raids (and doesn't mind a few lowbies here or there) and who's original Raid leader toon ruthlessly bypassed the zone lock once Mission Transporter came out to run her first raid at L20, I can't say I support reinstituting the zone lock.

[Megajoule]

  On 10/7/2019 at 3:38 PM, Apparition said:

I honestly can not understand why more people haven't used the LFG trial yet, other than inertia. 

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Because the LFG trial, at least in its current form, has issues that have been documented in other feedback threads.

[Apparition]

  On 10/7/2019 at 8:23 PM, Megajoule said:

Because the LFG trial, at least in its current form, has issues that have been documented in other feedback threads.

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Yes, I am aware.  However, the zone MSR has issues as well, and IMO those issues outweigh the trial's issues by a hefty amount. 

[Megajoule]

  On 10/7/2019 at 8:35 PM, Apparition said:

 

Yes, I am aware.  However, the zone MSR has issues as well, and IMO those issues outweigh the trial's issues by a hefty amount. 

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  On 10/8/2019 at 7:44 AM, Gulbasaur said:

 

I think I was part of the same attempt as you. We ran a zone-based raid, then all gathered in KW for comparison. 

 

I was 50+1 or +2, I had the Member of the Vanguard badge. I was a rogue (if that matters - you never know - could be a blue-red split or something in the LFG process). 

 

I was one of the 50% or so who didn't make it into the raid - I got the loadscreen (off-centre, I noticed), then the KW loadscreen and I and about 20 other people were dropped out of the league. 

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Yup, half the league crashing out is much better than the alternative... 🙄

[Apparition]

  On 10/8/2019 at 8:56 PM, Megajoule said:

Yup, half the league crashing out is much better than the alternative... 🙄

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That is bad, yes.  However, considering that's the one and only instance I've heard of that happening with my leading four with no disconnections, it sounds like it was a fluke.  Something happening once doesn't make a trend.  Granted, it should definitely be looked into.

[Sura]

I'm sure I don't do the the MSR nearly as much as most here, but the last three I did that were non-LFG had people getting disconnected left and right.  It was a near constant stream of "reinvite please" and whatever leaders were left frantically trying to get level 50's into the leader slots of the team.  On one we had to, while in the bowl, dissolve the entire League and then reform it under a different leader because the original leader had crashed and the person the star fell to was completely unresponsive.  If I remember correctly there was even a thread on disconnect issues in the MSR in the bug forum.  

 

Probably both methods need some looking at.

Edited October 9, 2019 by Sura
spelling be hard

[Hyperstrike]

  On 10/9/2019 at 4:38 PM, Sura said:

I'm sure I don't do the the MSR nearly as much as most here, but the last three I did that were non-LFG had people getting disconnected left and right.  It was a near constant stream of "reinvite please" and whatever leaders were left frantically trying to get level 50's into the leader slots of the team.  On one we had to, while in the bowl, dissolve the entire League and then reform it under a different leader because the original leader had crashed and the person the star fell to was completely unresponsive.  If I remember correctly there was even a thread on disconnect issues in the MSR in the bug forum.  

 

Probably both methods need some looking at.

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With the standard, non LFG raid, dropping is GENERALLY an issue with an aged zone instance.  The mapservers aren't good little citizens on the server.  And over time they leak memory, consume other resources, and generally get decrepit.

A fresh zone on a stable host server is usually the best chance one gets for a stable, problem free raid.
Unfortunately, this requires GM participation.