MrCaptainMan Posted October 9, 2019 Share Posted October 9, 2019 I’ve not had much experience at all with Masterminds. Can we choose the gender of the human pets such as ninjas, thugs etc, or are they fixed, or random? MCM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MetaVileTerror Posted October 9, 2019 Share Posted October 9, 2019 This has been a long-standing requested feature, but alas, the Henchpets are all hard-coded at the moment with their preset models. The most variation you get are with the Mercenaries and the Thugs randomizing between an assortment of pre-established appearances, all quite masculine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaintD Posted October 9, 2019 Share Posted October 9, 2019 By 'all quite masculine' he means 'women simply don't exist in MM primaries'. Masterminds are a hardcoded sausagefest unless you have a death wish and wanna try it on with a lioness. The idiot formerly known as Lord Khorak Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redlynne Posted October 9, 2019 Share Posted October 9, 2019 Wait ... the demons aren't all high school girls? 3 Verbogeny is one of many pleasurettes afforded a creatific thinkerizer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shazbotacus Posted October 9, 2019 Share Posted October 9, 2019 (edited) I understand the original devs' worry that players would make Masterminds of all female henchmen with... certain outfit themes and name themselves stupid, degrading middle school/4chan crap whenever the topic of customizable henchmen came up, but I wouldn't be opposed to certain henchmen summons having just one female model to be picked out by random as the game assigns an appearance to summoned pets. Like how the Skulls started taking on female members. Edited October 9, 2019 by Shazbotacus 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IscreamMan Posted October 9, 2019 Share Posted October 9, 2019 (edited) 2 hours ago, Shazbotacus said: I understand the original devs' worry that players would make Masterminds of all female henchmen with... certain outfit themes and name themselves stupid, degrading middle school/4chan crap whenever the topic of customizable henchmen came up This makes no sense and sounds like the dev just wanted an excuse as to why they didnt do what in hindsight was obvious. I mean by the same logic, City of Heroes shouldn't have even been developed bc someone might make an offensive character or a marvel clone. IMO, the lack of customization in the MM pets, in a game where the biggest and best feature is its character creator, is just lunatic design choice. I'm a game programmer myself, so I'd be interested in checking out adding the feature if homecoming devs would promise to add it. Edited October 9, 2019 by IscreamMan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shazbotacus Posted October 9, 2019 Share Posted October 9, 2019 That's a fair point. Sometimes I do wonder if the devs were just lazy about some things. I know I am. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaintD Posted October 10, 2019 Share Posted October 10, 2019 Actually it would almost certainly have been because of PvP, which they were still desperately pretending was still A Thing at that point. In a PvP environment all powers have to have the same consistent effects and appearances so you can identify things at a glance. It's why the 'minimal' costume customization options are ACTUALLY 'PvP Only'. Power customization was also not at all on anyone's mind for anything at all at that point either, so the henchmen were implemented with as little concern for customization as anything else. Given how much work it took to do power customization, it's probably just as much to implement it for MM henchmen, but it would all be for just a handful of primaries on a single AT. The idiot formerly known as Lord Khorak Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IscreamMan Posted October 10, 2019 Share Posted October 10, 2019 4 hours ago, SaintD said: Actually it would almost certainly have been because of PvP, which they were still desperately pretending was still A Thing at that point. In a PvP environment all powers have to have the same consistent effects and appearances so you can identify things at a glance. It's why the 'minimal' costume customization options are ACTUALLY 'PvP Only'. Power customization was also not at all on anyone's mind for anything at all at that point either, so the henchmen were implemented with as little concern for customization as anything else. Given how much work it took to do power customization, it's probably just as much to implement it for MM henchmen, but it would all be for just a handful of primaries on a single AT. I'm gonna download the source code and take a look. Might even be less insane to just make an entirely new archetype / powerset than to try to edit the MM henchmen, if things are as bad as people say. I heard the source is worse than you can imagine, if you imagined it being awful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redlynne Posted October 10, 2019 Share Posted October 10, 2019 8 hours ago, IscreamMan said: I heard the source is worse than you can imagine, if you imagined it being awful. At least spaghetti is straight before it gets boiled ... Verbogeny is one of many pleasurettes afforded a creatific thinkerizer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SmalltalkJava Posted October 10, 2019 Share Posted October 10, 2019 I love the psychology of pvp. Real pvp’rs should be able to pvp with minimal effects options enabled. In a real super hero world you might not always be able to tell if a person is using dark armor vs fire amor. Or what ever power has minimal effects options vs another power that has it also. If your gonna pvp, then do it all the way. I don’t care if you have effects or not. I’ll run up to you with my petless MM and cross punch your face! Kick, cross punch , brawl. - I’m just poking fun. 😉 1 Baseline MM Henchmen Defenses and Resist Values MM - Beast Pets - Pet Attack usage and some quick proc testing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gulbasaur Posted October 13, 2019 Share Posted October 13, 2019 On 10/9/2019 at 11:39 PM, IscreamMan said: I'm a game programmer myself, so I'd be interested in checking out adding the feature if homecoming devs would promise to add it. Look up BobbleWrap on Reddit. He's done it, I think. It's on the i24 codebase, though, so maybe you could collaborate with him to fork it to i25/26? Doctor Fortune Soulwright Mother Blight Brightwarden Storm Lantern Shadow Self Corona Borealis Blood Fortunado Dark/Dark Corruptor Rad/Rad Brute Gravity/Time Controller Storm/Water Defender Warshade Dark/Dark Tanker The Good Missions Guide: A Heroic Levelling Journey through Story Arcs Blueside Guide Easy IO Cheat Sheet The Mean Missions Guide: A Villainous Levelling Journey through Story Arcs Redside Guide Fortunatas are the Bestunatas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Herotu Posted October 17, 2019 Share Posted October 17, 2019 (edited) On 10/13/2019 at 9:06 PM, Gulbasaur said: Look up BobbleWrap on Reddit. He's done it, I think. It's on the i24 codebase, though, so maybe you could collaborate with him to fork it to i25/26? Wow, look at that! https://imgur.com/a/d1otgm1 Edited October 17, 2019 by Herotu Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rigged Posted October 18, 2019 Share Posted October 18, 2019 (edited) On 10/10/2019 at 4:06 AM, Shazbotacus said: I understand the original devs' worry that players would make Masterminds of all female henchmen with... certain outfit themes and name themselves stupid, degrading middle school/4chan crap whenever the topic of customizable henchmen came up, but I wouldn't be opposed to certain henchmen summons having just one female model to be picked out by random as the game assigns an appearance to summoned pets. Like how the Skulls started taking on female members. This was never the case. It was purely conjecture by players on the original CoH forums as to the reasons, the usual "no, nothing needs to be changed" argument made every time someone wants something new. The reason we never got customisable henches was entirely technical - it was hard, it was something they wanted but was low priority, and it would possibly kill frame rates as each MM could potentially have a half dozen costumes to load at once. Years later the rumour has taken a life of its own and people are blaming SJWs for ruining their fun, which is just ridiculous since Cryptic was nowhere near resembling anything enthusiastically woke. Straightforwardly the devs simply didn't make very many female NPCs. In issue 0 there were in fact NO female enemies. The first time we got them was in I1 with Carnies and Knives. No female default henchmen was just an extension of that attitude, that it was just easier to make male NPCs. Edited October 18, 2019 by Rigged Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rigged Posted October 18, 2019 Share Posted October 18, 2019 On 10/10/2019 at 6:39 AM, IscreamMan said: This makes no sense and sounds like the dev just wanted an excuse as to why they didnt do what in hindsight was obvious. I mean by the same logic, City of Heroes shouldn't have even been developed bc someone might make an offensive character or a marvel clone. IMO, the lack of customization in the MM pets, in a game where the biggest and best feature is its character creator, is just lunatic design choice. I'm a game programmer myself, so I'd be interested in checking out adding the feature if homecoming devs would promise to add it. As I mentioned, this was never said by a dev. It should be obvious that there are several MM sets without human henchmen and none of them got any kind of customisation, even alternate models. The limitation was purely development time, not a design choice. As a programmer I do believe you can appreciate this reason. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shazbotacus Posted October 18, 2019 Share Posted October 18, 2019 5 hours ago, Rigged said: This was never the case. It was purely conjecture by players on the original CoH forums as to the reasons, the usual "no, nothing needs to be changed" argument made every time someone wants something new. The reason we never got customisable henches was entirely technical - it was hard, it was something they wanted but was low priority, and it would possibly kill frame rates as each MM could potentially have a half dozen costumes to load at once. Ah, that makes sense. All righty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IscreamMan Posted October 29, 2019 Share Posted October 29, 2019 (edited) On 10/18/2019 at 2:29 AM, Rigged said: This was never the case. It was purely conjecture by players on the original CoH forums as to the reasons, the usual "no, nothing needs to be changed" argument made every time someone wants something new. The reason we never got customisable henches was entirely technical - it was hard, it was something they wanted but was low priority, and it would possibly kill frame rates as each MM could potentially have a half dozen costumes to load at once. Years later the rumour has taken a life of its own and people are blaming SJWs for ruining their fun, which is just ridiculous since Cryptic was nowhere near resembling anything enthusiastically woke. Straightforwardly the devs simply didn't make very many female NPCs. In issue 0 there were in fact NO female enemies. The first time we got them was in I1 with Carnies and Knives. No female default henchmen was just an extension of that attitude, that it was just easier to make male NPCs. That makes A LOT more sense. On 10/18/2019 at 3:06 AM, Rigged said: As I mentioned, this was never said by a dev. It should be obvious that there are several MM sets without human henchmen and none of them got any kind of customisation, even alternate models. The limitation was purely development time, not a design choice. As a programmer I do believe you can appreciate this reason. As an indie solo programmer, I can appreciate limitations based on development time. No problem. I get it. IMO this would be at the top top top of the feature list and be a feature from the start, but I understand - as an indie developer. However for a full AAA MMORPG company like Cryptic back in City of Heroe's prime, there is no excuse. We all know it wasn't for lack of the engineer's desire, ability, or time. It wasn't even for the lack of money. It was purely red tape BS. In fact I'd be honestly surprised if it weren't the case that the entire team of engineers and artists wanted the idea at the top of their priority list, but due to not having any voice and thus no say in the matter (with non-gamer leadership always obsessing over money/greed/profit) I'm sure the leadership thought "But where's the profit?" and probably asked questions to anyone who brought the idea up, like, "So...where is the profit? Do...we charge them for customization? Is this P2W? Oh oh I love it. Oh...we don't do P2W right now? I don't quite understand. You want to implement it because it increases....what? What is q-quality? Is that French? Huh? F...fun? Is that a foreign currency? I'm sorry but I'm gonna have to say no. We really need to push the update no one asked for instead." 😛 Joking aside, it is always extremely disappointing in AAA. Nearly every time I have ever found out the truth of why a company didn't do something obvious, something overwhelmingly popular among the userbase, or something that would greatly improve or fix the game, the answer was always disappointingly about the top leadership's bank account or manipulating stock value. Or even worse in some cases, like with the Marvel Heroes CEO running out the door with all the money in his briefcase, grabbing as many women's asses on his way out with the money as he could. That example is a lot less hyperbolic than it sounds too 😄 On 10/13/2019 at 3:06 PM, Gulbasaur said: Look up BobbleWrap on Reddit. He's done it, I think. It's on the i24 codebase, though, so maybe you could collaborate with him to fork it to i25/26? Thank you very much! I'll definitely check this out, but I doubt I could be of any real help at this point if it is already finished. By the time it would take me to get caught up to speed on the codebase, it'll probably already be long since ready. I am really hoping the homecoming admins accept this in 25/26 when/if it's ready. Edited October 29, 2019 by IscreamMan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
biostem Posted October 31, 2019 Share Posted October 31, 2019 On 10/9/2019 at 10:21 AM, SaintD said: By 'all quite masculine' he means 'women simply don't exist in MM primaries'. Masterminds are a hardcoded sausagefest unless you have a death wish and wanna try it on with a lioness. Are you assuming my bots' gender? 😅 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaintD Posted November 1, 2019 Share Posted November 1, 2019 On 10/31/2019 at 8:45 AM, biostem said: Are you assuming my bots' gender? 😅 They're obsessed with brawling, especially to their own detriment. If you think they're female, you're wrong. Sorry. 3 The idiot formerly known as Lord Khorak Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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