Simple Fix for Mercs

[Hedgefund]

After spending the first 9 months here getting reacquainted with my favorite MM primaries, I've been revisiting the ones I liked less, most notably Ninjas and Mercs.

 

I can't dispute anything said above, especially with regards to damage output.  One special oddity I noticed with the slow kill speeds - higher HP mobs like bosses would take off running even at like 60% health.  

 

I did manage to have a good pairing with Mercs - Electric Affinity.  One positive for Mercs with the new AI changes they're quite disciplined and would stay in my Faraday Cage with little micromanagement needed.  Also they stayed clustered together which works well with EA's chaining buffs.

 

Anyway, just multiply all the damage numbers by some X where (1.5<X<2) and be done with it, no need to dedicate resources to a major overhaul, just make them suck less.

[Elthenar]

18 hours ago, JayboH said:

Didn't we find out that toxic is actually the most commonly resisted?

Did we? I thought toxic was among the least. Its possible I am out of date on that one. 

[Galaxy Brain]

1 minute ago, Elthenar said:

Did we? I thought toxic was among the least. Its possible I am out of date on that one. 

@JayboHis right, Toxic is technically the most resisted type... but few player powers actually use it.

 

Lethal is the 2nd most resisted tho.

[Shazbotacus]

Yeah, toxic is oddly resisted quite often, but while a few sets involve toxic it’s not like any set focuses on that damage as AR and Mercs focuses on lethal.

[JayboH]

On 7/11/2020 at 3:34 PM, Elthenar said:

 

You know your set is weak when you could literally double its damage across the board and it would still only be middle of the pack

Cripes I missed this post.  That is insane. 

 

Then again I think the whole AT could get a revision and that would be a ton of work.  We already mentioned in other threads the whole end penalty is misguided and how wonky it gets doing high content with pets 6 levels below +4s and so on, and of course Mercs

[kiramon]

Nerf demons 

[kiramon]

11 minutes ago, JayboH said:

Cripes I missed this post.  That is insane. 

 

Then again I think the whole AT could get a revision and that would be a ton of work.  We already mentioned in other threads the whole end penalty is misguided and how wonky it gets doing high content with pets 6 levels below +4s and so on, and of course Mercs

The post (you can google coh most resisted) is just cuz a lot of mobs have 40-50%. Toxic is still behind lethal 😛. Fire and negative are the least resisted.

[Vanden]

1 hour ago, JayboH said:

Then again I think the whole AT could get a revision and that would be a ton of work.  We already mentioned in other threads the whole end penalty is misguided and how wonky it gets doing high content with pets 6 levels below +4s and so on, and of course Mercs

In the only content where you're expected to be fighting +4s (i.e. incarnate trials), Supremacy grants extra level shifts to lower tier pets so they don't fight +5 enemies or more unless the MM is also undershifted for the content. Running +4 in normal content is not something any given set should expect to be able to do.

Edited July 24, 2020 by Vanden

[Shazbotacus]

10 hours ago, JayboH said:

Cripes I missed this post.  That is insane. 

 

Then again I think the whole AT could get a revision and that would be a ton of work.  We already mentioned in other threads the whole end penalty is misguided and how wonky it gets doing high content with pets 6 levels below +4s and so on, and of course Mercs

Pretty much. And "middle of the pack" doesn't account for their Ninjas-tier survivability, just their damage.

[JayboH]

17 hours ago, Vanden said:

In the only content where you're expected to be fighting +4s (i.e. incarnate trials), Supremacy grants extra level shifts to lower tier pets so they don't fight +5 enemies or more unless the MM is also undershifted for the content. Running +4 in normal content is not something any given set should expect to be able to do.

Huh?  I run in +4 radio missions in Peregrine often as well, where the player is only +1 - not saying solo

[Jaguaratron]

Isnt the upgrade power on one of them the wrong one?

[Elthenar]

On 7/24/2020 at 1:28 AM, Vanden said:

In the only content where you're expected to be fighting +4s (i.e. incarnate trials), Supremacy grants extra level shifts to lower tier pets so they don't fight +5 enemies or more unless the MM is also undershifted for the content. Running +4 in normal content is not something any given set should expect to be able to do.

How so. Virtually every AT can with IO's. Some of them could do it while AFK.

[Capitancopyright]

“This chart which I got from the discord from @黒の色  (Dunno if he was the creator or not)”

Also from Galaxy Brain. Kuro doesn’t do much numbers since utilities matter more to them.

[Shazbotacus]

A Mercs/? Mastermind is just a gimped ?/ Defender rn 😂

Edited August 19, 2020 by Shazbotacus

[Ralathar44]

On 7/24/2020 at 6:07 PM, JayboH said:

Huh?  I run in +4 radio missions in Peregrine often as well, where the player is only +1 - not saying solo

 

On 7/26/2020 at 11:26 PM, Elthenar said:

How so. Virtually every AT can with IO's. Some of them could do it while AFK.

Yeah the power creep is real, especially in teams.  Between plentiful IOs and how many people have alot of spare endos endo these days it's not uncommon to see 3+ layers of leadershup buffs, more if Spiders/Widows are present.  I've been able to engage into +4s without issue on Beasts due to this.  +3 used to be a struggle for a great deal of end game teams and +4 able to be handled by very few.  7%-10% defense, +50%+ damage, and + 15%-20% to hit is a pretty huge difference.

TBH Leadership is prolly too prevalent right now.  I'd like to see changes that diversify the pool powers people use and that means some should prolly come down a little and others should come up.  Not having every high level team rocking 3+ leaderships would definitely go a long way in +4 not being the expected mob level faced.  +4 utterly screws over debuffers, some buffer sets, and Masterminds.  Not to mention the power creep leans everything heavily towards "delete enemy mob" teams.  TTK of the average +4 enemy mob is often low enough on a great deal of teams that control and sustainability just do not matter.  Your team plows into the pack of mobs, they melt, and the fight doesn't even last long enough for support to be needed.  I've had to switch characters numerous times because I was dead weight against +4s for this very reason.  To-hit and damage have many ways of compensating with leadership being one of the most prevalant, debuffs and buffs really don't have the same amount of options and not near as accessible.  Heck even common inspirations can help you overcome the +4 gap temporarily.

Edited August 20, 2020 by Ralathar44

[JayboH]

On 8/19/2020 at 10:44 PM, Ralathar44 said:

 

Yeah the power creep is real, especially in teams.

Power creep was planned and designed intentionally.  We only got half of the announced incarnate abilities.  Now it's true that they also expected to have harder content for those abilities but power creep was definitely intentional.

[Ralathar44]

On 8/21/2020 at 2:45 AM, JayboH said:

Power creep was planned and designed intentionally.  We only got half of the announced incarnate abilities.  Now it's true that they also expected to have harder content for those abilities but power creep was definitely intentional.

If you're getting stronger but you can only wield that power vs equally more challenging content then that's not power creep, that's just normal power progression.  Existing content being easier during the even the leveling power curve because everyone is more powerful is what power creep is.  Level 30+ teams these days feel like the same power level as level 50 teams used to feel like back on sunset.  No incarnate needed. 

Edited August 23, 2020 by Ralathar44

[JayboH]

On 8/22/2020 at 7:34 PM, Ralathar44 said:

If you're getting stronger but you can only wield that power vs equally more challenging content then that's not power creep, that's just normal power progression.

Last I heard you could use all of your incarnate abilities on non-incarnate content...

[Shazbotacus]

It's been a long while, maybe I should bring this topic to light again. Thought about making a new thread but I don't have much new to add.

[Clave Dark 5]

Seconded, I'd like to hear if this all is being look3ed at or not.