Regeneration

[BrandX]

1 hour ago, Keen said:

Quick thoughts:

• Regeneration Debuff Resistance should be the highest among all sets.
  • Pretty much like Super Reflexes has top resistance to defense debuffs.
  • Radiation Armor is currently the king of RDR and that set is already very strong.
    • I think its RDR should be drastically lowered.
• I don't think Absorption and Defense have any place in Regeneration.
• Low resists to all types of damage would be a nice to have.
• A small endurance drain and recovery debuff resistance would help bring the set more in line with other sets.
  • Some other non-themed sets (other than Elec Armor) that have enddrain/recovery debuff resists: Rad, Dark, Bio, Stone, Fiery, and Invul.
  • On the other hand, other non-themed sets without recovery resists include: Willpower, Ice Armor, Shield Defense, and Super Reflexes. But those sets have better protection layers than Regeneration to offset those debuffs, specially their defense-oriented aspects.
• Scaling Regeneration (as HP drops) sounds great and in theme.
• (Unpopular opinion) MoG is great as is.

 

 

For sure on the Regeneration Debuff Resist.  Agree on Absorption not belonging in Regeneration. 

 

Disagree on the defense and not just because I suggested adding an IOs worth to Resilience, but because MoG gives it.  However, I do feel the lack of Psy resist shouldn't be there, and I do feel Regen should have higher Toxic Resist and possibly Cold Resist, but that's thinking back to lots of Regens in comics making their way through winter conditions in almost nothing, but we could assume that's just the Regeneration regenerating them and keeping them from feeling the effect fully?

 

My big suggestion on MoG is Psy/Def All being added to it.  I do like the idea of it giving a bit more time though.

[Galaxy Brain]

17 hours ago, BrandX said:

 

People say don't count IOs for Slow Resist, but there is saying IOs for Recharge and Shadow Meld (so specific epic) for survival.  That can't be good either 😕

The main reason for that is those bonuses are not unique to Regen. A sturdier / more offensive armor could in theory get the same slotted bonuses and then when you compare to regen the points remain.

[Haijinx]

6 minutes ago, Galaxy Brain said:

The main reason for that is those bonuses are not unique to Regen. A sturdier / more offensive armor could in theory get the same slotted bonuses and then when you compare to regen the points remain.

Regen is definitely the worst armor set for scrappers, brutes and stalkers.

 

But something has to be the worst.  

 

It can perform really well for brief periods of time at least.  

 

It also has much better status protection than dark and fire.  

[BrandX]

1 hour ago, Galaxy Brain said:

The main reason for that is those bonuses are not unique to Regen. A sturdier / more offensive armor could in theory get the same slotted bonuses and then when you compare to regen the points remain.

 

But those bonuses are different for other sets.  WP doesn't care about the -RCH Resist as much for instance.

[aethereal]

1 hour ago, Galaxy Brain said:

The main reason for that is those bonuses are not unique to Regen. A sturdier / more offensive armor could in theory get the same slotted bonuses and then when you compare to regen the points remain.

It is plausibly the case that Regen gets more out of Shadow Meld and recharge bonuses than other sets do.  That said, it seems clear to me that that doesn't take regen to being a good set.

[Sarrate]

On 11/30/2020 at 3:18 PM, Galaxy Brain said:

Regen def should have scaling regen as mentioned in the Bopper Post though, I feel that is a given.

Scaling regen would be nice. One thing I'd suggest is that it should scale & last based off the lowest your hp has been in the past X seconds. As things stands, Regen's HP pool is its "mitigation," so if your health is yo-yoing between low and high health, you're still in danger, even if you're currently on the upswing.

 

7 hours ago, Bopper said:

Do you have a link for that? Something on the wayback machine?

I don't have a link, but I remember the incident going down as srmalloy described.

 

On 11/30/2020 at 1:16 PM, aethereal said:

I think it'd probably be useful for people in this thread who are making suggestions to preface their suggestions with something like:

 

This is what I perceive the problems of Regen to be (for example: ability to survive alpha, overall power, click-heaviness, particular holes)

Here's my vision for the set (for example:  "an overall high-end mitigation set without click-heaviness with weaknesses to -recharge and alpha strike but no weaknesses to -heal/-regen").

 

A bonus would be, "here's what I perceive a the niche of regen being as compared to willpower and maybe bio."

 

I was thinking about posting along the same lines, then I read your post. 🙂

 

Regen's Problems:

* Has no scaling mitigation (flat def/res mitigate more dmg as incoming dmg increases, no scaling on linear mechanics like RttC), so it is either immortal or dead.

* Needs to spend a lot of activation time on survival (taking time away from offense) for low overall survivability.

* Due to linear mitigation, overly sensitive to powersets with long activation times preventing the ability to react quickly.

* No meaningful protection against any debuffs (def to avoid them, or res to reduce their impact), which compounds the above.

 

I perceive Regen as:

* The ability to repair extreme damage. (eg: You cut off my arm, so I grew a new one. Counter Example: I see Willpower and being able to push through pain and stay in the fight, but they aren't growing limbs back.)

* More active in its mitigation, but that doesn't mean everything must be a click. I'd be perfectly content with toggle IH.

* I do not see absorption as anti-thematic to Regen at all, call it "instant healing" ready to be unleashed.

(Have not played Bio, so I can't really make a comparison to it.)

 

What I'd change (intentionally vague, presented as ideas to chew on rather than a fully baked solution):

* Give it some form of scaling mitigation. It could be straight up def/res, it could be additional regen based off circumstance (hp, enemy count, enemy rank), or some absorption somewhere.

* Somehow reward the activation price paid for survivability. This could mean increasing survivability dramatically compared to present, or giving them some other side benefit so that your activation time is doing double duty (Recon giving +dmg, +rech, a proc, etc). Revisit MoG's activation time vs duration.

* Possibly find a way to make Regen less sensitive to powersets with long animations. (eg: making Recon usable while activating another power).

* Possibly look into debuf protection. (Could be something clever like converting some +regen to heals that scale with MaxHP. Then Regen's regen could still be debuffed... but it wouldn't completely shut it down even at 0%.)

* Improve Revive somehow (eg: make it a click that buffs & prevents death, or make it a toggle that detoggles to prevents a death, just make it a power that you get for free when you pick up something else, like Fast Healing.).

[Troo]

9 hours ago, Bopper said:

Do you have a link for that? Something on the wayback machine?

Isuue 5 was:

• Changed Regeneration/Instant Healing from a Toggle Power to a Click power. Gave it a new animation so it activates faster.
  • The power was simply too strong as a toggle that could be kept on all the time. Rather than further increase the end cost or decrease the healing ability of the power, we made it a click power to be used when really needed. As a click with a long recharge, its Endurance cost can remain low, and its Regeneration boost can stay high.
• Slightly reduced the non-enhanceable health regeneration buff of Regeneration/Integration.
  • The health regeneration component was slightly too high when combined with the other effects of the power.

[BrandX]

I will admit.  I see lots of valid thoughts on why to add things, I may not think is the way to go with the set.  So, that's all good 🙂

[Wavicle]

1 minute ago, BrandX said:

I will admit.  I see lots of valid thoughts on why to add things, I may not think is the way to go with the set.  So, that's all good 🙂

Yea, I don’t agree with all the suggestions, but brainstorming is great. 👍👍

[Bopper]

42 minutes ago, Troo said:

Isuue 5 was:

• Changed Regeneration/Instant Healing from a Toggle Power to a Click power. Gave it a new animation so it activates faster.
  • The power was simply too strong as a toggle that could be kept on all the time. Rather than further increase the end cost or decrease the healing ability of the power, we made it a click power to be used when really needed. As a click with a long recharge, its Endurance cost can remain low, and its Regeneration boost can stay high.
• Slightly reduced the non-enhanceable health regeneration buff of Regeneration/Integration.
  • The health regeneration component was slightly too high when combined with the other effects of the power.

I was asking for a link to the discussion on something being bugged. I'd like to read about that bug.