New Stone/Stone Scrapper Build doubts

Meta Brawler · December 14, 2021

Morning folks. I've been toying around in Mids to finally IO out this scrapper but I have doubts. I usually like to proc attacks for max dmg but mids is telling me that the dmg from certain procs doesn't add up correctly or even make it worth it. Leveling up this build was an end monster so I slotted for that to cover end and health without the need for Ageless.

This is the current IO plan but I would welcome suggestions.

This Hero build was built using Mids Reborn 3.1.0.10
https://github.com/LoadedCamel/MidsReborn

Click this DataLink to open the build!

Brock Hard: Level 50 Mutation Scrapper
Primary Power Set: Stone Melee
Secondary Power Set: Stone Armor
Power Pool: Leaping
Power Pool: Fighting
Power Pool: Speed
Power Pool: Leadership
Ancillary Pool: Body Mastery

Hero Profile:
Level 1: Stone Mallet

(A) Touch of Death - Accuracy/Damage
(11) Touch of Death - Damage/Endurance
(13) Touch of Death - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance
(13) Touch of Death - Damage/Endurance/Recharge
(15) Touch of Death - Chance of Damage(Negative)

Level 1: Rock Armor

(A) Shield Wall - Defense
(9) Shield Wall - Defense/Endurance
(11) Shield Wall - Defense/Recharge
(31) Shield Wall - Defense/Endurance/Recharge

Level 2: Stone Skin

(A) Unbreakable Guard - Resistance
(5) Unbreakable Guard - Resistance/Endurance
(5) Unbreakable Guard - RechargeTime/Resistance
(7) Unbreakable Guard - Resistance/Endurance/RechargeTime
(7) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Increased Global Recharge Speed
(9) Luck of the Gambler - Defense

Level 4: Heavy Mallet

(A) Hecatomb - Damage
(15) Hecatomb - Accuracy/Damage/Recharge
(34) Hecatomb - Accuracy/Recharge
(34) Hecatomb - Damage/Endurance
(37) Hecatomb - Chance of Damage(Negative)
(50) Force Feedback - Chance for +Recharge

Level 6: Earth's Embrace

(A) Preventive Medicine - Heal
(42) Preventive Medicine - Heal/Endurance
(43) Preventive Medicine - Heal/RechargeTime
(45) Recharge Reduction IO

Level 8: Build Up

(A) Gaussian's Synchronized Fire-Control - Chance for Build Up

Level 10: Fault

(A) Annihilation - Accuracy/Damage
(37) Annihilation - Damage/RechargeTime
(37) Annihilation - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance
(39) Annihilation - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance/RechargeTime
(39) Annihilation - Chance for Res Debuff
(50) Force Feedback - Chance for +Recharge

Level 12: Mud Pots

(A) Superior Critical Strikes - Accuracy/Damage
(45) Superior Critical Strikes - Damage/RechargeTime
(46) Superior Critical Strikes - Accuracy/Damage/RechargeTime
(46) Superior Critical Strikes - Damage/Endurance/RechargeTime
(46) Superior Critical Strikes - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance/RechargeTime
(50) Superior Critical Strikes - RechargeTime/+50% Crit Proc

Level 14: Super Jump

(A) Blessing of the Zephyr - Run Speed, Jump, Flight Speed, Range

Level 16: Combat Jumping

(A) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Increased Global Recharge Speed
(17) Reactive Defenses - Scaling Resist Damage
(17) Shield Wall - +Res (Teleportation), +5% Res (All)

Level 18: Rooted

(A) Preventive Medicine - Heal
(19) Preventive Medicine - Heal/Endurance
(19) Preventive Medicine - Endurance/RechargeTime
(21) Preventive Medicine - Heal/RechargeTime
(21) Preventive Medicine - Heal/RechargeTime/Endurance
(25) Preventive Medicine - Chance for +Absorb

Level 20: Seismic Smash

(A) Superior Scrapper's Strike - Accuracy/Damage
(23) Superior Scrapper's Strike - Recharge/Critical Hit Bonus
(25) Superior Scrapper's Strike - Damage/Recharge
(33) Superior Scrapper's Strike - Accuracy/Damage/Recharge
(33) Superior Scrapper's Strike - Damage/Endurance/Recharge
(33) Superior Scrapper's Strike - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance/Recharge

Level 22: Crystal Armor

(A) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Increased Global Recharge Speed
(23) Luck of the Gambler - Defense
(43) Power Transfer - Chance to Heal Self
(43) Performance Shifter - Chance for +End

Level 24: Boxing

(A) Empty

Level 26: Tough

(A) Unbreakable Guard - Resistance
(27) Unbreakable Guard - Resistance/Endurance
(27) Unbreakable Guard - Resistance/Endurance/RechargeTime
(29) Unbreakable Guard - RechargeTime/Resistance
(31) Gladiator's Armor - TP Protection +3% Def (All)
(40) Steadfast Protection - Resistance/+Def 3%

Level 28: Weave

(A) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Increased Global Recharge Speed
(29) Luck of the Gambler - Defense

Level 30: Minerals

(A) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Increased Global Recharge Speed
(31) Luck of the Gambler - Defense

Level 32: Tremor

(A) Superior Avalanche - Accuracy/Damage
(34) Sudden Acceleration - Knockback to Knockdown
(40) Superior Avalanche - Damage/Endurance
(40) Superior Avalanche - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance
(42) Superior Avalanche - Accuracy/Damage/Recharge
(42) Superior Avalanche - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance/Recharge

Level 35: Brimstone Armor

(A) Unbreakable Guard - Resistance
(36) Unbreakable Guard - Resistance/Endurance
(36) Unbreakable Guard - RechargeTime/Resistance
(36) Unbreakable Guard - Resistance/Endurance/RechargeTime

Level 38: Hasten

(A) Recharge Reduction IO
(39) Recharge Reduction IO

Level 41: Conserve Power

(A) Endurance Reduction IO

Level 44: Physical Perfection

(A) Performance Shifter - Chance for +End
(45) Power Transfer - Chance to Heal Self

Level 47: Maneuvers

(A) Shield Wall - Defense
(48) Shield Wall - Defense/Endurance
(48) Shield Wall - Defense/Recharge
(48) Shield Wall - Defense/Endurance/Recharge

Level 49: Tactics

(A) Endurance Reduction IO

Level 1: Critical Hit

Level 1: Brawl

Gobbledigook · December 14, 2021

I am not really a big Scrapper player but one thing with the build..... i am not sure the +50% crit proc should go in a toggle damage aura. Maybe swap with seismic smash?

Meknomancer · December 14, 2021

I'm not sure what to go for with the stone armr it gets a ton of s/l def up front but not much e/ne/f/c without sets and the resistance needs a bump from bonuses too. High recharge builds its easy to start cycling fault and tremor and i'm pretty sure both need kb/kd in them and even with 3 PS in your endurance can drop fast. Seismic is great for procs and will hit like a truck. I'm running res toggles with 4 aegis bits for s/l res and aoe def but i'd like to know if it would be better switching to unbreakables. I've been aiming for 45% e/ne def instead of going for e/ne res its just been easier to hit the numbers. Been running the critical strikes proc in fault it goes off every mob, a lot like throwing it into ice melee's frost power. As much as i love recharge bonuses i ended up swapping numina set into rooted. Having 1 ranged attack makes a big difference, a full winter set can be thrown in which helps out massively. I don't have an updated mids so just throwing stuff out there.

Hew · December 14, 2021

I run a stone/stone/physperf stalker that has zero problems with survival or mitigation. It leverages tremor and fault heavily to manage inbound damage, and does so admirably with the accelerated cast on tremor, and does significant aoe damage as a result of brimstone procs.

A scrapper build shouldnt be much different. I am not into procs frankly, and am acutely aware of the likely inbound procgeddon and want zero impact on my builds as a result of that rebalancing.

That stalker does not have fighting pool.

Meta Brawler · December 14, 2021

Thanks for the replies. I slotted the wrong scrapper ATO on Mudpots, so thanks for the heads up. Hurl boulder is too slow for my taste as the recharge I have in the build is enough to use both mallet and heavy mallet in the same time it takes to hurl a boulder. The benefit of having the ranged as you say is with the winter set that gives another +5% def to melee if I'm not mistaken. I'll make another build with it and see what it looks like. Ideally I would like to slot Fury of the Gladiator proc in tremor to stack the -res debuff with annihilation proc but that would mean I would be bouncing enemies everywhere.

This is normally how I would set up the build without a ranged attack.

This Hero build was built using Mids Reborn 3.1.1.2
https://github.com/LoadedCamel/MidsReborn

Click this DataLink to open the build!

Brock Hard: Level 50 Mutation Scrapper
Primary Power Set: Stone Melee
Secondary Power Set: Stone Armor
Power Pool: Leaping
Power Pool: Fighting
Power Pool: Speed
Power Pool: Leadership
Ancillary Pool: Body Mastery

Hero Profile:
Level 1: Stone Mallet

(A) Hecatomb - Damage
(11) Hecatomb - Accuracy/Damage/Recharge
(13) Hecatomb - Accuracy/Recharge
(13) Hecatomb - Damage/Endurance
(15) Hecatomb - Chance of Damage(Negative)

Level 1: Rock Armor

(A) Shield Wall - Defense
(9) Shield Wall - Defense/Endurance
(11) Shield Wall - Defense/Recharge
(31) Shield Wall - Defense/Endurance/Recharge

Level 2: Stone Skin

(A) Unbreakable Guard - Resistance
(5) Unbreakable Guard - Resistance/Endurance
(5) Unbreakable Guard - RechargeTime/Resistance
(7) Unbreakable Guard - Resistance/Endurance/RechargeTime
(7) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Increased Global Recharge Speed
(9) Luck of the Gambler - Defense

Level 4: Heavy Mallet

(A) Superior Critical Strikes - Accuracy/Damage
(15) Superior Critical Strikes - RechargeTime/+50% Crit Proc
(34) Explosive Strike - Chance for Smashing Damage
(34) Gladiator's Strike - Chance for Smashing Damage
(37) Touch of Death - Chance of Damage(Negative)
(50) Force Feedback - Chance for +Recharge

Level 6: Earth's Embrace

(A) Preventive Medicine - Heal
(42) Preventive Medicine - Heal/Endurance
(43) Preventive Medicine - Heal/RechargeTime
(45) Recharge Reduction IO

Level 8: Build Up

(A) Gaussian's Synchronized Fire-Control - Chance for Build Up

Level 10: Fault

(A) Annihilation - Accuracy/Damage
(37) Annihilation - Damage/RechargeTime
(37) Annihilation - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance
(39) Annihilation - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance/RechargeTime
(39) Annihilation - Chance for Res Debuff
(50) Force Feedback - Chance for +Recharge

Level 12: Mud Pots

(A) Superior Scrapper's Strike - Accuracy/Damage
(45) Superior Scrapper's Strike - Damage/Recharge
(46) Superior Scrapper's Strike - Accuracy/Damage/Recharge
(46) Superior Scrapper's Strike - Damage/Endurance/Recharge
(46) Superior Scrapper's Strike - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance/Recharge
(50) Superior Scrapper's Strike - Recharge/Critical Hit Bonus

Level 14: Super Jump

(A) Blessing of the Zephyr - Run Speed, Jump, Flight Speed, Range

Level 16: Combat Jumping

(A) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Increased Global Recharge Speed
(17) Reactive Defenses - Scaling Resist Damage
(17) Shield Wall - +Res (Teleportation), +5% Res (All)

Level 18: Rooted

(A) Preventive Medicine - Heal
(19) Preventive Medicine - Heal/Endurance
(19) Preventive Medicine - Endurance/RechargeTime
(21) Preventive Medicine - Heal/RechargeTime
(21) Preventive Medicine - Heal/RechargeTime/Endurance
(25) Preventive Medicine - Chance for +Absorb

Level 20: Seismic Smash

(A) Gladiator's Strike - Accuracy/Damage
(23) Gladiator's Strike - Chance for Smashing Damage
(25) Touch of Death - Chance of Damage(Negative)
(33) Hecatomb - Damage/Recharge
(33) Ghost Widow's Embrace - Chance of Damage(Psionic)
(33) Neuronic Shutdown - Chance of Damage(Psionic)

Level 22: Crystal Armor

(A) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Increased Global Recharge Speed
(23) Luck of the Gambler - Defense
(43) Power Transfer - Chance to Heal Self
(43) Performance Shifter - Chance for +End

Level 24: Boxing

(A) Empty

Level 26: Tough

(A) Unbreakable Guard - Resistance
(27) Unbreakable Guard - Resistance/Endurance
(27) Unbreakable Guard - Resistance/Endurance/RechargeTime
(29) Unbreakable Guard - RechargeTime/Resistance
(31) Gladiator's Armor - TP Protection +3% Def (All)
(40) Steadfast Protection - Resistance/+Def 3%

Level 28: Weave

(A) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Increased Global Recharge Speed
(29) Luck of the Gambler - Defense

Level 30: Minerals

(A) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Increased Global Recharge Speed
(31) Luck of the Gambler - Defense

Level 32: Tremor

(A) Superior Avalanche - Accuracy/Damage
(34) Sudden Acceleration - Knockback to Knockdown
(40) Superior Avalanche - Damage/Endurance
(40) Superior Avalanche - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance
(42) Superior Avalanche - Accuracy/Damage/Recharge
(42) Superior Avalanche - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance/Recharge

Level 35: Brimstone Armor

(A) Unbreakable Guard - Resistance
(36) Unbreakable Guard - Resistance/Endurance
(36) Unbreakable Guard - RechargeTime/Resistance
(36) Unbreakable Guard - Resistance/Endurance/RechargeTime

Level 38: Hasten

(A) Recharge Reduction IO
(39) Recharge Reduction IO

Level 41: Conserve Power

(A) Endurance Reduction IO

Level 44: Physical Perfection

(A) Performance Shifter - Chance for +End
(45) Power Transfer - Chance to Heal Self

Level 47: Maneuvers

(A) Shield Wall - Defense
(48) Shield Wall - Defense/Endurance
(48) Shield Wall - Defense/Recharge
(48) Shield Wall - Defense/Endurance/Recharge

Level 49: Tactics

(A) Endurance Reduction IO

Level 1: Critical Hit

Level 1: Brawl

Onlyasandwich · December 14, 2021

3 hours ago, Meta Brawler said:

doesn't add up correctly

If you are running the latest mids download, note that is not really ready yet and there are some wonky bits they are ironing out for release.

I noticed procs not consistently adding up how they should as well. A bit tough to plan out a build for the time being.

subbacultchas · December 14, 2021

3 minutes ago, Onlyasandwich said:

If you are running the latest mids download, note that is not really ready yet and there are some wonky bits they are ironing out for release.

I noticed procs not consistently adding up how they should as well. A bit tough to plan out a build for the time being.

Truth. I noticed on my build it has my end/sec at some ridiculous level that doesn't seem quite right.

Meta Brawler · December 14, 2021

So I built out my scrapper based on the last build with procs that I posted and so far it feels good. My concern is the energy/negative energy dmg i get during end game content. Even with soft capped energy def, my health gets chunked by only having 37% energy res. The other change I'm considering is swapping the enhancements from heavy mallet to mallet so that I don't misuse the crit proc. Mallet comes back twice as fast as heavy mallet, so the crit proc on heavy mallet, gets used by mallet and not siesmic slam.

Current rotation is: Mallet, Heavy Mallet (crit proc), Seismic Slam, Mallet, Heavy Mallet, Fault

Proposed rotation w/ swapped enhancements: Mallet (crit proc), Heavy Mallet, Mallet (Crit Proc), Seismic Slam, Mallet (crit Proc), Fault

-Mallet would be Autocast. Hasten has a 90 sec cd which i can manually click with ease. Mallet in this case would be more like a DOT of constant dmg.

Hew · December 15, 2021

Could you explain chasing melee defense at all, when all defense in stone armor is typed? This means you are slotting heavily to overcome that gap to achieve the same defense you can get by simply going to typed defense. I am unaware of any significant source of untyped melee damage, so I kind of wonder why you chose to do this?

Unbreakables might be good for melee defense, but swapping them for 4 slot kincom in a garbage power gets you more than twice the _in kind_ defense that stacks with stone skin. Focusing on the 4 slot for low value in kind defense (s/l def is 1.56%...) seems a bad idea, when melee isnt getting you anywhere fast at all!

Also, I really think your massive reliance on procs is not going to end well whenever procs are rebalanced.

Meta Brawler · December 15, 2021

I chose the unbreakable set for two reasons: the energy/negative resistance and the melee defense. Most endgame content especially itrials deal energy dmg and Stone Armor has very little of that type of res so we need to make up for that with set bonuses. As for chasing melee defense, my understanding of the formula for enemy attacks has two checks for beating your defenses: Type of Attack ( melee, ranged, aoe), type of dmg (smash, lethal, energy negative energy, fire, cold, psychic). So by getting both checks for defense to soft cap, increases your chances of avoiding the dmg totally. Since I'm a scrapper, I'm in melee so getting melee def to soft cap or as close to it as possible is ideal.

Example with current build (melee soft cap def, dmg type soft cap def)

Enemy Attack: Punch (melee, smash)- Has to beat two defense checks to hit Me. My melee defense and my smash defense. Both are high so little chance to hit.

Enemy Attack: Gunshots (ranged, lethal) - With low range def, the attack has higher chance to beat this def check, but even if it does it also has to beat my lethal def check to do dmg.

The current meta for min/maxing a characters performance includes procs. I don't think anyone knows how drastic those changes will be nor when and if those changes will be implemented. So when it happens it happens and I will adjust accordingly on all my toons. No sense in worrying about something that you can't control or predict. If the argument is about saving influence, its irrelevant. Influence is easy to make and we get plenty of /respecs to make changes. I like to make my characters the very best that they can be.

InvaderStych · December 15, 2021

15 minutes ago, Meta Brawler said:

As for chasing melee defense, my understanding of the formula for enemy attacks has two checks for beating your defenses: Type of Attack ( melee, ranged, aoe), type of dmg (smash, lethal, energy negative energy, fire, cold, psychic). So by getting both checks for defense to soft cap, increases your chances of avoiding the dmg totally. Since I'm a scrapper, I'm in melee so getting melee def to soft cap or as close to it as possible is ideal.

Sort of:

The game polls all applicable defense categories, picks the strongest one, and compares the hit roll against that. There is only ever one roll/hit-check.

Generally speaking, if you're starting with typed, add more typed. If starting with positional (shield, etc) then add more positional. Edit: Emphasis on Generally, there are tricksie-and-false opponents out there with things like attacks with no positional component (usually Psi) and other exceptions out there. Some fire that isn't also smashing, for example, but not enough to worry about. S/L/N/E soft-capped is usually sufficient for typed def with some layers built under it.

From hcwiki, emphasis mine:

https://hcwiki.cityofheroes.dev/wiki/Defense

Defense bonuses carry tags as well, to specify what styles of attack they work against. Each Defense bonus applies only versus attacks whose tags match one or more of its own. There is one additional type of Defense bonus called Base Defense, or DEF(Defense), which applies against all attacks regardless of tagging.

Every time an attack is made against a target, the game checks the target's total Defense bonus against each of the attack's tags separately. Once the game has those separate totals, it uses only the best one in its calculations that determine whether the attack hits. The important result of this rule is that, for any given attack, Defense buffs only stack when they all have one of that attack's tags in common.

Example: Deflection Shield gives a Defense bonus against Melee Attacks, Smashing Attacks, and Lethal Attacks. Glacial Armor gives a Defense bonus against Energy Attacks and Negative Energy Attacks. A Tanker with both these buffs is ambushed by a nasty Council Vampyri who tries to hit her with Siphon Life. That power is tagged as a Negative Energy Attack and a Melee Attack. Our Tanker will only be protected by one of her two Defense buffs. Lucky for her, it will be whichever is larger.

Edited December 15, 2021 by InvaderStych

Sovera · December 15, 2021

1 hour ago, Meta Brawler said:

Example with current build (melee soft cap def, dmg type soft cap def)

Enemy Attack: Punch (melee, smash)- Has to beat two defense checks to hit Me. My melee defense and my smash defense. Both are high so little chance to hit.

Enemy Attack: Gunshots (ranged, lethal) - With low range def, the attack has higher chance to beat this def check, but even if it does it also has to beat my lethal def check to do dmg.

The logic is sound but as @InvaderStych it is not how it works. There are not two rolls for each attack, just one against the one that is higher. If it's melee then it rolls against melee, but if it's Smash then it rolls against Smash.

There is value in adding more of what you have highest in terms of buffering defense debuffing. Stone has a decent defense debuffing resistance but not enough to be considered immune to it. Also a small part of the content is not softcapped with just 45%.

Hew · December 15, 2021

2 hours ago, InvaderStych said:

Edit: Emphasis on Generally, there are tricksie-and-false opponents out there with things like attacks with no positional component (usually Psi

Stone has great def to psi thankfully 😄

Stone being a hybrid typed/resist set makes it interesting to play and gives you an enormous amount of leeway in build. Throwing positional at the problem just makes it not-as-good.

Erratic1 · December 15, 2021

@Meta Brawler Came at your build while referencing my Elec/Stone brute. So different damage powerset and different ATOs but I felt you could do better in the Smash/Lethal resistance department because sometimes one does face defense debuff and having resistance as a fallback can be quite handy. Of course there were tradeoffs. Take what follows less as a suggestion than as something to possibly mine for ideas:

Spoiler

This Hero build was built using Mids Reborn 3.1.1.2
https://github.com/LoadedCamel/MidsReborn

Click this DataLink to open the build!

Brock Hard: Level 50 Mutation Scrapper
Primary Power Set: Stone Melee
Secondary Power Set: Stone Armor
Power Pool: Leaping
Power Pool: Fighting
Power Pool: Speed
Power Pool: Leadership
Ancillary Pool: Body Mastery

Hero Profile:
Level 1: Stone Mallet -- Hct-Dmg(A), Hct-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(3), Hct-Acc/Rchg(3), Hct-Dmg/EndRdx(5), Hct-Dam%(5)
Level 1: Rock Armor -- LucoftheG-Def/EndRdx(A), LucoftheG-Def/Rchg(7), LucoftheG-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(7), LucoftheG-Def(9), LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(9)
Level 2: Stone Skin -- Ags-ResDam/EndRdx(A), Ags-ResDam/Rchg(13), Ags-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(13), Ags-ResDam(15)
Level 4: Heavy Mallet -- SprCrtStr-Acc/Dmg(A), SprCrtStr-Rchg/+50% Crit(15), ExpStr-Dam%(17), GldStr-%Dam(17), TchofDth-Dam%(19), FrcFdb-Rechg%(19)
Level 6: Earth's Embrace -- Prv-Heal(A), Prv-Heal/EndRdx(21), Prv-Heal/Rchg(21), RechRdx-I(23)
Level 8: Build Up -- GssSynFr--Build%(A)
Level 10: Fault -- Ann-Acc/Dmg(A), Ann-Dmg/Rchg(23), Ann-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(25), Ann-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(25), Ann-ResDeb%(27), FrcFdb-Rechg%(27)
Level 12: Mud Pots -- SprScrStr-Acc/Dmg(A), SprScrStr-Dmg/Rchg(29), SprScrStr-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(29), SprScrStr-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(31), SprScrStr-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(31), SprScrStr-Rchg/+Crit(31)
Level 14: Super Jump -- BlsoftheZ-Travel(A)
Level 16: Combat Jumping -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A), Rct-ResDam%(33), ShlWal-ResDam/Re TP(33)
Level 18: Rooted -- NmnCnv-Heal/EndRdx(A), NmnCnv-Heal/Rchg(33), NmnCnv-Heal/EndRdx/Rchg(34), NmnCnv-Heal(34), NmnCnv-Regen/Rcvry+(34)
Level 20: Seismic Smash -- GldStr-Acc/Dmg(A), GldStr-%Dam(36), TchofDth-Dam%(36), Hct-Dmg/Rchg(36), GhsWdwEmb-Dam%(37), NrnSht-Dam%(37)
Level 22: Crystal Armor -- LucoftheG-Def/EndRdx(A), LucoftheG-Def/Rchg(37), LucoftheG-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(39), LucoftheG-Def(39), LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(39), PwrTrns-+Heal(40)
Level 24: Boxing -- Empty(A)
Level 26: Tough -- Ags-ResDam/EndRdx(A), Ags-ResDam/Rchg(40), Ags-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(40), Ags-ResDam(42), GldArm-3defTpProc(42), StdPrt-ResDam/Def+(42)
Level 28: Weave -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A), LucoftheG-Def(43)
Level 30: Minerals -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A), LucoftheG-Def(43)
Level 32: Tremor -- SprAvl-Acc/Dmg(A), SuddAcc--KB/+KD(43), SprAvl-Dmg/EndRdx(45), SprAvl-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(45), SprAvl-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(45), SprAvl-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(46)
Level 35: Brimstone Armor -- Ags-ResDam/EndRdx(A), Ags-ResDam/Rchg(46), Ags-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(46), Ags-ResDam(48)
Level 38: Hasten -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(48)
Level 41: Conserve Power -- EndRdx-I(A)
Level 44: Physical Perfection -- PrfShf-End%(A), PwrTrns-+Heal(48)
Level 47: Maneuvers -- ShlWal-Def(A), ShlWal-Def/EndRdx(50), ShlWal-Def/Rchg(50), ShlWal-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(50)
Level 49: Tactics -- EndRdx-I(A)
Level 1: Critical Hit
Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Sprint -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Swift -- Run-I(A)
Level 1: Hurdle -- Jump-I(A)
Level 1: Health -- Pnc-Heal/+End(A), Mrc-Rcvry+(11)
Level 1: Stamina -- PrfShf-End%(A), PwrTrns-+Heal(11)
Level 14: Double Jump
------------

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		|3127DE8328BF4BE50755F0E053DE9C7A063E671E7B01BE045F3123341D7E0139FED|
		|79C71948CC3C8D8378C7EC67738227E89B9476583EA52829735A725F11A3B27AE80|
		|57C16BCC301D348472EE508A33A5D0D714FA9ACAB28CF42607A50D625417BFA8625|
		|81D348C3148630C3218830CC62003D9D95DBE448DCE1451078DD8F4081799C655BE|
		|714C48161392C584E43121F9132C321F61313A054F22589B44B1028AFF26A551B51|
		|9FD6733423D88A91EC4EEB2BCC236F3F83DF03EF880597AC8FC4999936AD692D05C|
		|82E61234CF407392344EA392368D019C016B749E9C6A482EC1C647340B4525BC788|
		|7EF61062D0C52BAB2AA5D5EE47ECC55C0F3E04566889C67D59CCF227D4C775EE49E|
		|D9B6A774A11EBBB7A61B59FADFB4ACAB579F4C9A63FAECDDFF3B10A2C4A9BF1C32E|
		|6D8F8F58051130956E65DE459FD76681367F5E2AC4F0AFBEF85FD0795FCC6AA|
		|-------------------------------------------------------------------|

As you can see the biggest changes are S/L defense gets considerably snipped in favor of notable boost in S/L resistance. Fire/Cold defense does come up decently but not to levels where you sneer at it and Energy/Negative resistance is lower. Recharge is probably not as bad as it seems since I think I turned off Hasten on the revision but you will want to check that.

Meta Brawler · December 15, 2021

Thanks everyone for the clarification on the defense formula. For years I have operated under the wrong assumption. Go figure lol

@Erratic1 Thanks for the redo on the build. It looks really interesting, but the lower energy / neg energy resistance is a big bummer. That fact became very apparent today when I ran a MLTF and our tank died to Recluse. I was able to offtank long enough to get our tank back up, but not before almost getting onshotted by Recluse. Went from Full 2409 Hp to 2% health in one hit. Any other ideas on how to increase energy/neg energy resistance up? As a scrapper I don't mind around 50% in resistances with all the def this set brings and having Earths embrace on a quick timer to get health back up + regen.

Edited December 15, 2021 by Meta Brawler

Hew · December 15, 2021

3 piece erradication, if slotted twice, is a massive 3.13% e/n def boost. Man and tactics arent really worth it imo, given their very low values on scrappers. Id rather (hurl boulder + 5 wintersbite) + (tremor + (3errad (1 proc))) for 8.13 e/n def, 1.8% end over maneuvers anything. Moving those slots off the low-ROI man to hurl boulder gets you a significant improvement targeted, over a minor improvement disbursed.

Meta Brawler · December 15, 2021

@Hew Normally I would agree, but the recharge is good enough that you only have room for 3 ST attacks. And cast time for Hurl boulder is rather long for a ST rotation. Remember tactics provides res to confuse and fear +to hit. Stone armor doesn't have protection against fear. Some is better than none.

Current ST Rotation with the changes I made is: Mallet (w/crit strike proc)(autocast), Fault (-res proc), Mallet (w/crit strike proc)(autocast), Seismic Smash, Mallet (w/crit strike proc)(autocast),Heavy Mallet - Repeat

Current AOE Rotation - Fault, Tremor

Hew · December 15, 2021

4 minutes ago, Meta Brawler said:

And cast time for Hurl boulder is rather long for a ST rotation.

Ahh I think you misunderstand. Hurl boulder is there solely as a mule. 😄

Your attack chain wouldnt change. Re: fear, I would go assault/tactics, way before man/tactics.

Edited December 15, 2021 by Hew

Meta Brawler · December 15, 2021

This is the revised build trying to increase the amount of energy resistance on the build. Also switched the enhancements on mallet and heavy mallet so that now mallet has the crit strikes proc in it. In play it triggers quite often. Still debating on the Hybrid Incarnate between Clarion Radial and Barrier Core.

Stone/Stone Scrap build 2.0

Spoiler

This Hero build was built using Mids Reborn 3.1.1.2
https://github.com/LoadedCamel/MidsReborn

Click this DataLink to open the build!

Brock Hard: Level 50 Mutation Scrapper
Primary Power Set: Stone Melee
Secondary Power Set: Stone Armor
Power Pool: Leaping
Power Pool: Fighting
Power Pool: Speed
Power Pool: Leadership
Ancillary Pool: Body Mastery

Hero Profile:
Level 1: Stone Mallet

(A) Superior Critical Strikes - Accuracy/Damage
(11) Superior Critical Strikes - RechargeTime/+50% Crit Proc
(13) Mako's Bite - Chance of Damage(Lethal)
(13) Gladiator's Strike - Chance for Smashing Damage
(15) Touch of Death - Chance of Damage(Negative)

Level 1: Rock Armor

(A) Shield Wall - Defense
(9) Shield Wall - Defense/Endurance
(11) Shield Wall - Defense/Recharge
(31) Shield Wall - Defense/Endurance/Recharge

Level 2: Stone Skin

(A) Unbreakable Guard - Resistance
(5) Unbreakable Guard - Resistance/Endurance
(5) Unbreakable Guard - RechargeTime/Resistance
(7) Impervium Armor - Psionic Resistance
(7) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Increased Global Recharge Speed
(9) Luck of the Gambler - Defense

Level 4: Heavy Mallet

(A) Hecatomb - Damage
(15) Hecatomb - Accuracy/Damage/Recharge
(34) Hecatomb - Accuracy/Recharge
(34) Hecatomb - Damage/Endurance
(37) Hecatomb - Chance of Damage(Negative)
(50) Force Feedback - Chance for +Recharge

Level 6: Earth's Embrace

(A) Preventive Medicine - Heal
(42) Preventive Medicine - Heal/Endurance
(43) Preventive Medicine - Heal/RechargeTime

Level 8: Build Up

(A) Gaussian's Synchronized Fire-Control - Chance for Build Up

Level 10: Fault

(A) Annihilation - Accuracy/Damage
(37) Annihilation - Damage/RechargeTime
(37) Annihilation - Chance for Res Debuff
(39) Detonation - Accuracy/Damage
(39) Detonation - Damage/Recharge
(50) Force Feedback - Chance for +Recharge

Level 12: Mud Pots

(A) Superior Scrapper's Strike - Accuracy/Damage
(45) Superior Scrapper's Strike - Damage/Recharge
(46) Superior Scrapper's Strike - Accuracy/Damage/Recharge
(46) Superior Scrapper's Strike - Damage/Endurance/Recharge
(46) Superior Scrapper's Strike - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance/Recharge
(50) Superior Scrapper's Strike - Recharge/Critical Hit Bonus

Level 14: Super Jump

(A) Blessing of the Zephyr - Run Speed, Jump, Flight Speed, Range

Level 16: Combat Jumping

(A) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Increased Global Recharge Speed
(17) Reactive Defenses - Scaling Resist Damage
(17) Shield Wall - +Res (Teleportation), +5% Res (All)

Level 18: Rooted

(A) Preventive Medicine - Heal
(19) Preventive Medicine - Heal/Endurance
(19) Preventive Medicine - Endurance/RechargeTime
(21) Preventive Medicine - Heal/RechargeTime
(21) Preventive Medicine - Heal/RechargeTime/Endurance
(25) Preventive Medicine - Chance for +Absorb

Level 20: Seismic Smash

(A) Gladiator's Strike - Accuracy/Damage
(23) Gladiator's Strike - Chance for Smashing Damage
(25) Touch of Death - Chance of Damage(Negative)
(33) Hecatomb - Damage/Recharge
(33) Ghost Widow's Embrace - Chance of Damage(Psionic)
(33) Neuronic Shutdown - Chance of Damage(Psionic)

Level 22: Crystal Armor

(A) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Increased Global Recharge Speed
(23) Luck of the Gambler - Defense
(43) Power Transfer - Chance to Heal Self
(43) Performance Shifter - Chance for +End

Level 24: Boxing

(A) Empty

Level 26: Tough

(A) Unbreakable Guard - Resistance
(27) Unbreakable Guard - Resistance/Endurance
(27) Unbreakable Guard - Resistance/Endurance/RechargeTime
(29) Impervium Armor - Psionic Resistance
(31) Gladiator's Armor - TP Protection +3% Def (All)
(40) Steadfast Protection - Resistance/+Def 3%

Level 28: Weave

(A) Shield Wall - Defense
(29) Shield Wall - Defense/Endurance
(39) Shield Wall - Defense/Recharge
(45) Shield Wall - Defense/Endurance/Recharge

Level 30: Minerals

(A) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Increased Global Recharge Speed
(31) Luck of the Gambler - Defense

Level 32: Tremor

(A) Scirocco's Dervish - Accuracy/Damage
(34) Scirocco's Dervish - Damage/Endurance
(40) Scirocco's Dervish - Chance of Damage(Lethal)
(40) Obliteration - Damage
(42) Obliteration - Chance for Smashing Damage
(42) Sudden Acceleration - Knockback to Knockdown

Level 35: Brimstone Armor

(A) Unbreakable Guard - Resistance
(36) Unbreakable Guard - Resistance/Endurance
(36) Unbreakable Guard - RechargeTime/Resistance
(36) Impervium Armor - Psionic Resistance

Level 38: Hasten

(A) Recharge Reduction IO

Level 41: Conserve Power

(A) Recharge Reduction IO

Level 44: Physical Perfection

(A) Performance Shifter - Chance for +End
(45) Power Transfer - Chance to Heal Self

Level 47: Maneuvers

(A) Shield Wall - Defense
(48) Shield Wall - Defense/Endurance
(48) Shield Wall - Defense/Recharge
(48) Shield Wall - Defense/Endurance/Recharge

Level 49: Tactics

(A) Endurance Reduction IO

Level 1: Critical Hit

Level 1: Brawl

(A) Empty

Level 1: Sprint

(A) Empty

Level 2: Rest

(A) Empty

Level 1: Swift

(A) Run Speed IO

Level 1: Hurdle

(A) Jumping IO

Level 1: Health

(A) Panacea - +Hit Points/Endurance
(3) Numina's Convalesence - +Regeneration/+Recovery

Level 1: Stamina

(A) Performance Shifter - Chance for +End
(3) Power Transfer - Chance to Heal Self

Level 14: Double Jump

Level 50: Clarion Radial Epiphany
Level 50: Freedom Phalanx Reserve
Level 50: Portal Jockey
Level 50: Task Force Commander
Level 50: The Atlas Medallion
------------

Meta Brawler · December 15, 2021

1 minute ago, Hew said:

Ahh I think you misunderstand. Hurl boulder is there solely as a mule. 😄

Your attack chain wouldnt change. Re: fear, I would go assault/tactics, way before man/tactics.

That makes more sense lol but Maneuvers is there for the Shield Wall 4 (+HP and energy res) slot while not loosing the other LotG recharge procs in the build.

Edited December 15, 2021 by Meta Brawler

Hew · December 15, 2021

12 minutes ago, Meta Brawler said:

That makes more sense lol but Maneuvers is there for the Shield Wall 4 (+HP and energy res) slot while not loosing the other LotG recharge procs in the build.

def/res is roughly 2 to 1...

3% e/n resist is worth 1.5 def

8% def is worth 16% res (roughly).

Loss of 7.5% recharge is not really build crippling in any way.

Meta Brawler · December 15, 2021

36 minutes ago, Hew said:

def/res is roughly 2 to 1...

3% e/n resist is worth 1.5 def

8% def is worth 16% res (roughly).

Loss of 7.5% recharge is not really build crippling in any way.

That's pretty interesting. Does that rule hold up between softcap and hardcap (40-45%)? Or is there a diminishing returns effect?

BZRKR · December 15, 2021

58 minutes ago, Meta Brawler said:

And cast time for Hurl boulder is rather long for a ST rotation.

With a range of 80ft and -Fly, Hurl Boulder has some utility use, and can mule for set bonuses! I like chucking a rock when the last Juicer in a group zips off at capped flight speed with 2 hp remaining 🙂

Erratic1 · December 15, 2021

1 hour ago, Meta Brawler said:

Thanks everyone for the clarification on the defense formula. For years I have operated under the wrong assumption. Go figure lol

@Erratic1 Thanks for the redo on the build. It looks really interesting, but the lower energy / neg energy resistance is a big bummer. That fact became very apparent today when I ran a MLTF and our tank died to Recluse. I was able to offtank long enough to get our tank back up, but not before almost getting onshotted by Recluse. Went from Full 2409 Hp to 2% health in one hit. Any other ideas on how to increase energy/neg energy resistance up? As a scrapper I don't mind around 50% in resistances with all the def this set brings and having Earths embrace on a quick timer to get health back up + regen.

Shift your slotting on Maneuvers to DE/DR/R/+5 Res while dropping the slot in Combat Jumping used for holding the +5 Res. Maneuvers low base Defense values results is no real penalty to your overall defense values and by doing this you save a slot.
Tremor's base Knockback value is 0.67. Since values under 1 are knockdown, that suggests you do not need to slot used for KB->KD, so drop it, saving a slot
Drop the Recharge IO in Earth Embrace. The power cyceles in 40s instead of 35s and you save a third slot.
Add the three saved slots to Weave and change its slotting to Shield Wall: DE/DR/DER/D + Luck of the Gambler: D+Recharge

That would pick up 4.5% E/N resistance. And because you increase the slotting in Weave your other Defense values come up slightly.

Hew · December 15, 2021

1 hour ago, Meta Brawler said:

That's pretty interesting. Does that rule hold up between softcap and hardcap (40-45%)? Or is there a diminishing returns effect?

Its flat. Look at total reduction at inbound damage:

Res: 80 vrs 90%

Def: 40 vrs 45%

At 90% res, you are avoiding ~= damage as 45% def. As such, 1 point def is roughly the same mitigation of 2 points of resist. There is undoubtedly an article about this somewhere on the forum. Small chunks of +res matter most when (like typed vrs positional def) _you already have something to work with_. 🙂

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