Enhancement Slotting Questions

[Bojutsu]

I'm getting back into the game after a long time. Back when I played Live I used SO enhancements. Now that I am getting my new Homecoming characters up to level 50, I need to learn about IO and AO enhancements, and enhancement sets.

When I was slotting with SO enhancements, I understood that putting more than 3 of the same type of SO in the same power would be wasteful, producing diminished results after 3 SO enhancements. I believe each SO improves the power by 30%, so 3 of those would equal 90%, making a 4th SO of the same kind go over the 100% point, making it far less effective.

Is this still the case? If I am slotting with SO enhancements, should I stop at 3 per type of SO enhancement?

If I put 6 slots into an attack power, for example, would 3 dmg and 3 acc be a common choice? I mean, if dmg and acc was all I was interested in slotting for in that particular power. 

 

I know I need to be looking into AO and IO enhancements, and I am. I just wanted to be sure I still understand how to slot SO enhancements for the time being. 

Thank you for responses. 

 

[Doomguide2005]

     Overall it works the same when accounting for ED.  The exact breaks value depend on the schedule of the enhancement.  Most are either schedule A (Accuracy, Damage etc.) or schedule B (Defense, To Hit etc.).  See the HCwiki article on Enhancements for more details.   Schedule A have drop offs at 70%, 90% and 100% reducing their effectiveness by 10%, 30% and 85%.  So yes in general 3 SOs worth is where you get next to no added value.  It's also why you'll see 2 lvl 50 generic IOs boosted by +5 placed in Hasten.  Because 2 lvl 50 boosted are also well into Diminishing Returns and ED.  First a generic IO is more enhancement than a +3 SO (~38% vs 42.4%) then each boost adds 5% more so each +5 boosted generic is a 53% enhancement (schedule A).

[Luminara]

https://homecoming.wiki/wiki/Enhancement_Diversification

 

To sum it up, the closer you move toward an enhancement schedule's (schedules are the broad categorization for enhancements, read more about that in the above link) soft maximum (soft because there are no sudden hard limits on IOs, like 100% or 112.5% or 56%), the less each subsequently slotted enhancement will boost that effect.  All enhancements, regardless of origin, type or method of acquisition, are subject to this rule.

 

IOs (and HOs and similar SO-based multi-boost enhancements, and Winter/AT enhancements) follow the same schedules, and the same ED rules, but most IOs combine multiple boosts (Acc/Dam, or Acc/Hold/Endurance/Recharge, for instance), which allows them to buff multiple effects.  Consequently, they allow players to maximize almost all aspects of powers, as opposed to being restricted to maximizing one aspect with SOs and having to settle for less in other ways (2 Acc/3 Dam/1 EndRdx with SOs, for example.  contrast that with using IOs to add 45% Acc/95% Dam/49% EndRdx/73% RchgRdx using an IO set in the same power).  IO set bonuses are NOT subject to ED, and are applied outside of ED's restrictions, which is why those bonuses tend to be highly valued by many players.

 

Common usage of set IOs includes frankenslotting (slotting multi-boost IOs from different sets to totally optimize a power, without regard for set bonuses), set slotting (when a set offers "enough" boosts and the bonuses are desirable), proc-slotting (packing powers with procs and designing a build to maximize proc chances), and muling (slotting powers exclusively for set bonuses or with unique IOs, with no intention to ever use said powers).

 

My kitten is trying to swallow my ankle, so that's all I have time to explain at the moment.

[Dragonfire]

Great info guys, thanks!  I have a claw/regen scrapper and I'm needing this kind of info myself.

[Ironblade]

On 6/14/2022 at 2:55 PM, Bojutsu said:

If I put 6 slots into an attack power, for example, would 3 dmg and 3 acc be a common choice? I mean, if dmg and acc was all I was interested in slotting for in that particular power.

You don't need that much accuracy.  So, if you only cared about accuracy and damage, you might put 3 damage and 1 accuracy and put the other slots elsewhere.  If I had six slots (and using SO's), I would put 3 damage, 1 accuracy and 2 recharge.

 

Definitely look into the IO's and ATO's.  And not every character needs two ATO sets.  Some of the sets really don't have great bonuses since not everyone is building for the same goals.  On the other hand, some are awesome and definitely worth having both sets.

[Doomguide2005]

     For 6 slots on SO's i be looking at 1 to 2 Acc highly dependent on 1) notoriety, 2) tolerance  for missing and 3) to hit readily available. Then 3 damage and 1 or 2 endred and/or recharge in my attacks.  Prepare to pant a lot without any endred if no +recovery/other end management in build.

[KC4800]

You also have to look at what is the starting accuracy of the power. Some powers start at 0.8, some start at 1.05 or 1.1. Most start at 1.0. Some DO need two acc. A lot do not.

[Doomguide2005]

6 hours ago, KC4800 said:

You also have to look at what is the starting accuracy of the power. Some powers start at 0.8, some start at 1.05 or 1.1. Most start at 1.0. Some DO need two acc. A lot do not.

Totally agree.  And primaries don't exist in a vacuum.  If you're an Earth Controller using Quicksand and other lower tier powers chances are excellent you're needing less accuracy enhancement than many other sets.

[Yomo Kimyata]

Accuracy -- enough to consistently hit your target.  Lots of people target 95% chance to hit; anything above that is wasted enhancement (unless you get debuffed)

Damage -- as much as possible.  Once all your other needs are met, pile it here.

Endurance -- enough to enable you to keep fighting at a consistent pace

Recharge -- enough to keep your attack chain up as close to seamlessly

Other -- very much depends

 

When I am playing a character with SOs, I will usually slot an attack (in order) with accuracy, damage, damage, endurance reduction, recharge, damage.

[Mr. Vee]

One other note about hitting stuff - level of the enemy counts. This won't matter to you so much when you're leveling and using common SOs and such but once you get heavily into IO/ATO/WO etc and lots of fiddling in Mids it'll become a factor. I think (i.e. it's what I have mine set at. I trust a forumite to slap me down if I'm wrong) if you go into Mids configuration under Exemping and Base values and change 'Base ToHit' to 48 it'll make your numbers when slotting right for fighting +4 enemies (assuming you're +1), which of course we all do tons of in the current state of the game. 

Edited June 18, 2022 by Mr. Vee

[Doomguide2005]

4 hours ago, Mr. Vee said:

One other note about hitting stuff - level of the enemy counts. This won't matter to you so much when you're leveling and using common SOs and such but once you get heavily into IO/ATO/WO etc and lots of fiddling in Mids it'll become a factor. I think (i.e. it's what I have mine set at. I trust a forumite to slap me down if I'm wrong) if you go into Mids configuration under Exemping and Base values and change 'Base ToHit' to 48 it'll make your numbers when slotting right for fighting +4 enemies (assuming you're +1), which of course we all do tons of in the current state of the game. 

Yep, I usually go ahead and set it to 39 which is the base against +4's without a level shift but you can set it to whatever you want.  And in the case of my Claws/SR main i made sure the final hit chance vs +4's was 95%+ for Follow Up ... and if it hit that was enough to readily push everything over 95% (a couple attacks were in the low 90's until FU landed.  I set to 39 as then I could hit pretty much everything even if exemped for low level content where level shifts don't apply.

[UltraAlt]

On 6/14/2022 at 2:55 PM, Bojutsu said:

Now that I am getting my new Homecoming characters up to level 50, I need to learn about IO and AO enhancements, and enhancement sets.

 

You lost me at level 50, but welcome home.

[Outrider_01]

Fun thing with IOs, you get an effectiveness of 8-10 slots in 6.  Crushing Impact in Melee, totals are something like 2ACC/3DMG/2Rech/2Endreduction equal to SO slotting using 6 enhancements. You can also franken slot random sets for no bonus and just play like its ED slotting with those 8 slots packed in 6.

[Ironblade]

19 minutes ago, Outrider_01 said:

You can also franken slot random sets for no bonus and just play like its ED slotting with those 8 slots packed in 6.

Also worth noting, you can frankenslot PAIRS of set enhancements.  Regen and recovery are generally the first bonus in a set so slotting 2 pieces from 3 different sets in one power can give quite a bit of regen/recovery.

[Doomguide2005]

11 hours ago, Ironblade said:

Also worth noting, you can frankenslot PAIRS of set enhancements.  Regen and recovery are generally the first bonus in a set so slotting 2 pieces from 3 different sets in one power can give quite a bit of regen/recovery.

     I recall doing that for a planned build for my Electric/Fire blaster back on Live prior to the addition of Blaster sustains as he obliterated his blue bar if he went even remotely full speed for more than a mob or two.  Don't think I've ever,  before or since, broken a Purple set into 3 pairs just to get that +recovery bonus 3 times.  Fortunately the sustains have made that a memory not a reality.

[tidge]

Not a blaster, but on a (Dark Miasma) Defender, I recently changed my slotting of Howling Twilight to use 2x slotting of two different Very Rares (Absolute Amazement, Ragnarok) to get twice the Recovery bonus. Previously, I was getting an additional resists (a 3x bonus, which helped) and an extra %proc, but I wanted just a little moar recovery from a power I was 6-slotting anyway. Either of those (2x, 3x) bonuses can be essentially had by SG buffs, so this is one of those choices that can be overthought. Generally, equivalence to the 4-piece (and higher) buffs can't really be achieved via SG self-buffs.

 

FWIW: I still haven't figured out what the game is referring to in terms of "healing boosts" from Howling Twilight when damage is slotted, the current best theory is that it is extra debuffing of enemy regeneration rates, but I haven't played with analyzers to really check.

 

EDIT: Oh, I realized I did a little bit on ANTI-Frankenslotting to get an additional 2x Set bonus... on that same character I had planned to use some (lvl 53) Hami-O for Accuracy/Damageto support Franken-slotting... but what I ended up doing in one power was to use a (50+5) PVP's Accuracy/Damage piece (Gladiator's Javelin) to get a (PvE) Recovery increase. In favor of MOAR frankenslotting, another power that originally had a (lvl 53) Accuracy/Damage Hami-O, was instead replaced with Superior Avalanche, because that was the best way I found to get Accuracy/Damage/Endurance in a spammable power that really needed help on the Endurance front. In (near) incanate-level content I have other tools (Cardiac) but at low level the power (Irradiate) was too much of a hog (and frankly too important to not spam).

Edited June 22, 2022 by tidge