Seed hamis on the market please

[TheZag]

Seeding the market would reduce Hamidon to a glorified merit farm.  At least the unique drops still make the endgame battle have a point.

 

And everyone knows what the good items are.  Short of a new exploit,  its near impossible to say something here that would change the prices on the market.

 

[srmalloy]

1 hour ago, BrandX said:

Put in cheaper bids?  I sell the one I get for the cheap all the time

Putting in cheap bids only works if the high bids get cleared out. You can put a hundred HOs on the market for 150k each, but if there are two hundred bids of a million or more, no one bidding 250k will get one.

[kelika2]

3 hours ago, TheZag said:

Seeding the market would reduce Hamidon to a glorified merit farm.

it already is.  80+40+40 is the only reason people go

[TheZag]

50 minutes ago, kelika2 said:

it already is.  80+40+40 is the only reason people go

 

I would agree with you but then i keep wondering where the AH is getting its stock of hami-o's from.

 

[BrandX]

2 hours ago, kelika2 said:

it already is.  80+40+40 is the only reason people go

 

Unless I need the 40 Merits, I grab 80 Merits and 1 Hami and sell it unless I have a current build that needs it

[UltraAlt]

17 hours ago, Saiyajinzoningen said:

Will making Hamios convertible upset the balance?

 

I think the real question is why are there Hamios.

Isn't the whole point of them being that they are the reward for being part of Hami raids?

 

On 6/14/2023 at 6:43 PM, kelika2 said:

Some of them are getting insane in prices.

 

Here are some questions.

Are you powerleveling characters to 50?

How many characters do you power level to 50 per week?

Do you expect to be able to get cheap Hamios to fill the slots you want without running Hami raids?

Do you expect it to be easy/cheap to get the best enhancements to slot all your level 50 powers instantly simply because you power leveled your character to 50?

Do you sell the Hamios that you get as drops from Hamis that you can't/don't want to slot at what you consider to be reasonable prices?

[Saiyajinzoningen]

4 hours ago, UltraAlt said:

 

I think the real question is why are there Hamios.

Isn't the whole point of them being that they are the reward for being part of Hami raids?

 

 

Here are some questions.

Are you powerleveling characters to 50?

How many characters do you power level to 50 per week?

Do you expect to be able to get cheap Hamios to fill the slots you want without running Hami raids?

Do you expect it to be easy/cheap to get the best enhancements to slot all your level 50 powers instantly simply because you power leveled your character to 50?

Do you sell the Hamios that you get as drops from Hamis that you can't/don't want to slot at what you consider to be reasonable prices?

 

1st of all im glad to not be on ignore 😉

 

Hamios are an obsolete reward for a system that currently while is effective, isnt meta.

Yes 

 

Depends on your definition of powerleveling, imo if you use 2xp no matter how you play its a PL. I don't farm or doorsit at all.

1 per month? maybe?

no

no

nope. I hoard mine like infinity stones 🙂 

 

How would you propose to fix the issues OP has raised?

[TheZag]

The easiest thing would be to do [redacted].  If we [deleted] before we [erased],  then we would be able to [blank][redacted].  However,  that would result in [removed] and require extra time doing [deleted].  The perfect fix that everyone would 100% agree on is [deleted].

 

This is clearly the best way to proceed and im sure the devs have already implemented these ideas.

 

[srmalloy]

1 hour ago, Saiyajinzoningen said:

Hamios are an obsolete reward for a system that currently while is effective, isnt meta.

Because we should all be doing only the current meta to maximize our rewards; this is the canonized One True Way™ to have fun, and anyone not playing to the meta should be penalized severely for having fun the wrong way.

[Saiyajinzoningen]

1 hour ago, srmalloy said:

Because we should all be doing only the current meta to maximize our rewards; this is the canonized One True Way™ to have fun, and anyone not playing to the meta should be penalized severely for having fun the wrong way.

 

it feels weird to be taken out of context. lol

I was answering @UltraAlts question. hence why i quoted his thread in my response.

I dont advocate or agree with any one true way.

I also do not know if your response is sarcasm, or to be taken at face value. 

Regardless, I am not in favor with penalizing anyone for a style of play. 

 

I believe the market will stabilize itself if Hamio's can be converted. 

This thread is about ways to improve a potential problem identified within Hamio's.

I am in favor of fixing issues and generally improving gameplay for everyone.

[UltraAlt]

5 hours ago, Saiyajinzoningen said:

1st of all im glad to not be on ignore 😉

 

Your rational and I enjoy your posts even when I don't agree with them.

 

5 hours ago, Saiyajinzoningen said:

Hamios are an obsolete reward for a system that currently while is effective, isnt meta.

Yes 

 

I'm confused by what you mean by this. Can you eleborate?

 

5 hours ago, Saiyajinzoningen said:

Depends on your definition of powerleveling, imo if you use 2xp no matter how you play its a PL. I don't farm or doorsit at all.

1 per month? maybe?

 

Yes. Power-leveling has different definitions to different people.

 

By "power-leveling to 50", my intent is to say in less words; 1) door sitting in Farms until level 50 or 2) Joining teams that are far above your level for the express intent of leveling far more quickly than you would with a team that is on or around your same level (many times in this case, the character stay back and/or maybe support the others on the teams or they are likely to die frequently).

I don't see x2 XP to be power leveling in comparison to what I said in the last paragraph. I generally only use 8 hours of it at the start of a character and then don't recharge it unless I'm running with someone that I'm trying to keep up with level-wise that does use it.

I don't see task forces or trials as being power-levelling.

 

I'm by power-leveling, I essentially mean avoiding as much - if not all - lower level content because the player's intent is only to play the game when they are at level 50. The player doesn't want the leveling experience and feels like the game can only be enjoyed at level 50.

This does leave one in a state where it requires a large amount of influence to slot and quite probably with the related mindset that they should only have be best and most cookie-cutter enhancements immediately without the need of earning the influence necessary to purchase the desired enhancements.

 

I understand that there is also power-leveling once one becomes 50 because, for some, it then becomes a race for incarnate powers.

 

5 hours ago, Saiyajinzoningen said:

Depends on your definition of powerleveling, imo if you use 2xp no matter how you play its a PL. I don't farm or doorsit at all.

1 per month? maybe?

no

no

nope. I hoard mine like infinity stones 🙂 

 

All these questions were directed at the OP, but thanks for answering.

 

But here we do see why they aren't on the market if they are being hoarded.

And that was part of my point in questioning the OP.

 

But now I have to ask of you are hoarding them to keep them away from others or to try to become the omnipotent ruler of the universe?

I had no idea that Hamios were that powerful! (I kind of keep thinking they were just a breakfast cereal with a random toy thrown inside the box...)

 

6 hours ago, Saiyajinzoningen said:

How would you propose to fix the issues OP has raised?

 

Play the game and you can eventually gain what you are looking for.

That is to say patience and game play.

Understanding that there is an additional cost for instant gratification.

 

Somethings are going to require grinding because inherently that is why they were put into the game system.

City of Heroes was designed as a subscription based game so many design features are focused on time-sinks to keep players engaged in the content.

Power-leveling and Farming are inherently counter-productive to that game design goal.

 

The Hamios are there to be gained through Hami raids. There are pretty much multiple hami raids going on on at least 3 of the servers every day and sometime multiple times a day.

 

Influence and/or drops to make enhancements are gained through any content.

Crafting is one path, but we know that most take the path of using the Auction House.

You can buy what you want there.

You can sell what you have there. If it isn't for sale there, it's because other people don't want to sell it.

 

Should the market be seeded with D-Syncs and whatever those new shiny things that you can use to buy hologram costumes with be seeded in the market as well?

I think these things should be left as they are as a special reward.

I don't mind elite things to keep the elite busy, but people need to understand that is what they are. Something meant to elite to keep the elite players busy (and, in the old days, keeping them paying to play the game).

[kelika2]

11 hours ago, UltraAlt said:

 

I think the real question is why are there Hamios.

Isn't the whole point of them being that they are the reward for being part of Hami raids?

 

 

Here are some questions.

Are you powerleveling characters to 50?

How many characters do you power level to 50 per week?

Do you expect to be able to get cheap Hamios to fill the slots you want without running Hami raids?

Do you expect it to be easy/cheap to get the best enhancements to slot all your level 50 powers instantly simply because you power leveled your character to 50?

Do you sell the Hamios that you get as drops from Hamis that you can't/don't want to slot at what you consider to be reasonable prices?

yes, but not all

0.25 a week on average, sometimes lower, sometimes higher

the rest of your questions rely too much on rng.  getting in the hive, or getting something good or watching an endo sit on the market for over a week at 444,444 inf or having the raid fail in some form or another.

 

aprox one hami raid a day, certain characters needing over 10 hamis, rng giving you dmg/mez when you need acc/dmg or end/heal when you need some cytos

[UltraAlt]

2 hours ago, Saiyajinzoningen said:

I believe the market will stabilize itself if Hamio's can be converted. 

This thread is about ways to improve a potential problem identified within Hamio's.

 

I agree with the rest of your statement, but not this part, so I had to give you the thumbsdown.

I wish I could only thumbsdown parts sometimes, but ... yeah...

[SeraphimKensai]

I personally would be open to hamis, synthetic hamis, titan-o's, and D-Syncs being convertible but only if they retain their own grouping. I don't want to see a HO rerolled into a D-Sync as that would trivialize Dr. Aeon SF.

 

That said with these types of IOs there's been vast price differences for years where if you get a microfilament you feel like you hit the jackpot compared to a golgi.

[UltraAlt]

1 minute ago, kelika2 said:

the rest of your questions rely too much on rng.  getting in the hive, or getting something good or watching an endo sit on the market for over a week at 444,444 inf or having the raid fail in some form or another.

 

Thanks for your answers.

The whole point of some of the content that was intentionally added is the time-sink. It is supposed to take time and not be insta-gratification.

 

3 minutes ago, kelika2 said:

aprox one hami raid a day, certain characters needing over 10 hamis, rng giving you dmg/mez when you need acc/dmg or end/heal when you need some cytos

 

Seems standard for someone that wants to spend their time playing the end-game. It is going to take time to fill those slots with Hamios.

The Hamios (and merits) are the reward to make you keep coming back to play the content.

[srmalloy]

1 hour ago, Saiyajinzoningen said:

it feels weird to be taken out of context.

I'm not sure how 'out of context' my response to your describing HOs as "obsolete" and "not meta" can be; slotting HOs in a build may not be 'meta', but how many players can say that they only play builds that are tweaked to the absolute limit of effectiveness and efficiency, rather than playing builds that are fun for them to play? And if HOs are obsolete, there would be no demand for them, because everyone would be using the better alternatives.

 

The OP is complaining about HO prices being outrageous on the AH, and this is clearly a problem, because the game (and the regular player-driven activities in game) does not offer them any way to earn HOs for themselves — they only avenue they have to obtain HOs is to buy them on the market. And, yes, this is a highly sarcastic statement; they want the HOs for their builds, but want someone else to go make the effort to obtain them, and their objection is that the ones on the market are too expensive because of high demand and limited supply. The prices other people are willing to pay is too much for them, so they want the market artificially forced down, because they're entitled to much lower prices for what they want.

[kelika2]

11 minutes ago, UltraAlt said:

Seems standard for someone that wants to spend their time playing the end-game. It is going to take time to fill those slots with Hamios.

The Hamios (and merits) are the reward to make you keep coming back to play the content.

But with merits being reselectable over and over it does diminish the point you were trying to make

I mean has anyone thought about people who want Hamis getting locked out by the masses who want the merits?

[srmalloy]

4 minutes ago, kelika2 said:

I mean has anyone thought about people who want Hamis getting locked out by the masses who want the merits?

The same argument can be made for people who want the four-emp reward. If you pre-position characters, on Excelsior you could cycle through three Hami runs in the Abyss and three more in the Hive and get six HOs or 24 Empyrean merits, although you'd be running the same gauntlet of beating other players getting in when you switch characters.

[Bionic_Flea]

Oh!  I had another possible solution to a non-problem:  Sell them like SOs in the Merit Vendor for some large value of merits -- larger than purples -- something like 300 merits.  That should effectively cap all HOs to 75 million or so on the market and allow a back door for folks that would rather pay in merits than inf.

[TheZag]

The problem with hami-o's is that there is no problem.  Good items being expensive isnt a problem and wanting a 90-99% discount as well as an unlimited supply isnt a fix.

 

How would i solve the problem proposed in the original post?  First,  it isnt a problem.  Second,  take those 160 merits a day and choose 120 + a hami-o instead.  And then use those 120 merits to make money on the AH while selling or hoarding the hami-o each day.  Third,  use the mountains of inf you will acquire to buy the stuff you want. 

 

...All without having to screw over the players that use hami-o's as their income source,  or the people that use converters to change crappy enhancements into good ones,  or the people that buy those good enhancements.  Since adding a new high demand for converters will drive up their price and marketeers will pass that cost on to the sale price across the board.

 

 

[UltraAlt]

3 hours ago, kelika2 said:

But with merits being reselectable over and over it does diminish the point you were trying to make

I mean has anyone thought about people who want Hamis getting locked out by the masses who want the merits?

 

It doesn't at all.

Merits were a reward for teaming and completing content.

You can get merits without teaming. You will get more merits by teaming...usually in larger groups than you will by soloing.

The rewards for merits to get do bypass the lowest level recipe+salvage>craft>attune, the purchase in the auction house, or random chance (for ATOs or Winterset IOs) out of card packs. All of those things (except for the ATOs and Winterset IOs) can randomly drop in any content.

The process rewards the community through teams being available to players. 

 

The Hamios and D-Syncs are content specific.

These also funnel players into content were they need to team with others.

 

 The end-game politics and state of mind are annoying to me, so I don't play past level 50, so If you are suffering and not enjoying playing end-game content, I suggest you play the game instead.

The issues you bring up are all part of the end-game that is supposed to be a grind and keep you busy ....  because it is there to keep players playing once they finished playing the actual game.

 

We were always given a huge number of character slots in THE CITY.

I was expected that we would play through the game and want to check out other power sets.

The game wasn't designed to have players powerlevel their characters to 50 or instantly slot everything they want without any kind of effort.

 

The grinding parts are in the game intentionally to be grindy parts and to keep you teaming with large groups in the open community instead of in small cliques that don't support the rest of the community.

 

Edited June 16, 2023 by UltraAlt

[Yomo Kimyata]

I dislike the initial suggestion of seeding HOs and/or DSOs at a given price, especially one that is so artificially low.  I dislike this because it in no way improves my personal playing experience and the only way I can see that it is improving anyone else's experience is that they want a given thing, but not at THAT price.  Someone's judgment on what the appropriate price is nothing but an opinion.  I wouldn't mind if all level 50s were seeded at 2bn, because much like rare salvage being seeded at 1mm, I'm generally able to get what I need for a lower price, and if I can't then I will save up for it.  So that's one opinion of mine.

 

I dislike the follow-on suggestion of making HOs convertible as well.  This is mainly because I've been told that making them that way would prohibit slotting more than one in any given set -- that would make my experience worse.  This is partly because this would advantage anyone who has accumulated huge stores of "worthless" HOs who then convert them and crater the prices of the high end items.  And again, I feel that people are saying "Oh, I really want that, yes I do.  But not at that price!  That's too much because I don't want to pay that much." And that's fine, but I don't see that as a good enough reason.  So that's another opinion of mine.

 

As several have said, there are plenty of alternatives to HOs.  Some are even better, but you can only slot one in a build.  Mostly I use HOs because there is nothing else to spend inf on.

 

At the end of the day, I think that there already is too much stuff on the /AH for a dwindling player base.  But it will not shock me when or if all enhancements become free because that's what one or more of the devs want.

[kelika2]

1 hour ago, SwitchFade said:

Sorry, no thanks any any proposed changes.

If we make our choices based on personal disposition can i nullify your post with this post?

because this is just getting silly.  because even if it was not true would your vote actually make the devs do something or is this just a suggestion box and you took this way too far?

[Rudra]

11 minutes ago, kelika2 said:

1 hour ago, SwitchFade said:

Sorry, no thanks any any proposed changes.

If we make our choices based on personal disposition can i nullify your post with this post?

because this is just getting silly.  because even if it was not true would your vote actually make the devs do something or is this just a suggestion box and you took this way too far?

This is a suggestions forum and none of us are devs. So @SwitchFade's opinion carries as much weight as yours. That is to say none. Because all of us are arguing our personal opinions unless we have empirical data to back us up. All any of us can do is present our opinion and any data we may have in the hopes the devs decide to agree and act upon it.

[kelika2]

44 minutes ago, Yomo Kimyata said:

I dislike the follow-on suggestion of making HOs convertible as well.  This is mainly because I've been told that making them that way would prohibit slotting more than one in any given set -- that would make my experience worse.

Ya know if the freedom phalanx can synthesize them, cant we break them down and rebuild them?

Break down 3 for Hamidon Essences or whatever mitochondrial word that we all had to look up and its variants and use said cell-like word paired up with Common and Uncommon salvage at high craft counts

Break down 3 Cents into an Essence as an example

Take that Essence + a mixture of Common and Uncommon salvage + crafting costs to make the hami you want?

 

This would make use of less popular Hamis

Maybe boost the common/uncommon salvage market to where you are not eating a loss selling it from the market cut

And be used as an inf sink from the crafting table