Passively hitting 90 resist without tier 9 powers/Incarnate powers

[DRoddo]

Hiya guys. I'm challenged myself to make a build where I attempt to passively hit 90 on all the resists. This is my attempt at it. Still shy of 90 on a lot of things but this is really the best I can do. Is there something else that can be done to improve it?

Passive 90 - Tanker (Invulnerability - Staff Fighting).mbd

[Nightmare Shaman]

You can get higher resists with elec and probably rad.  (rad is busier than elec though)  Invulnerability was the king when the game first came out before ED, inventions, and invention slot bonuses.  It's still pretty good, but in your particular build there's a lot of wasted potential going into smashing/lethal since so many bonuses have sm/le added in.  Your build has 126.16% sm/le which is 36.16 of waste.  

 

Here's some quick facts in regard to making any functional build in this game:
 

1) The biggest problem/obstacle in end game is debuffs.  

2) A build with max defense/middling resists > a build with high resists/middling defense in all the hard content.  (people will debate this, but it's my opinion)

3) Most theoretical builds ignore the difference between endurance recovery and end drain.  Your build is so so on that front, +1.3.  But, inv has no means to acquire endurance, neither does your secondary, and you only have 25% res to end drain/recovery.  That's gonna hurt against stunners, arachnos, and anything else that saps end.  

4) What do you plan on fighting?  Some people strive for farms, some ITF, some generalists, some pvp.  Very important consideration.

5) There are a ton of fire/cold set bonuses, but much less so nrg/dark bonuses.  Doesn't make too much difference when dealing with inv, but it does with other set considerations.

6) It's always good to click on "view totals" in mids to see what debuff resists you have.  One of the reasons I never build inv builds is because the set is severely lacking in this department.  Anything with -def is going to chew through any middling defenses, even when you're softcapped over time.  That's why defense debuff resistance is so sought after, and in the absence of that I'd say end drain/rec is next in importance.  

7) One of the biggest obstacles to making a sound build is having enough slots to take advantage of the 6 slot bonuses.  Something that is frequently overlooked imho is how many powers do you have to take and slot to maximize your build.  Elec has virtually all of its armors in 3 powers.  You can compare this to something like stone with has all of its armors spread out  over multiple powers which all require at least four slots to be effective.  (I hope this makes sense.)  Having fewer powers in a set allows you to maximize your slots into a variety of damaging abilities getting more and more 6 slot power bonuses.  

😎Incarnates - People always suggest fixing end problems with incarnates but in my opinion that's a huge wasted opportunity.  You really want to take advantage of that +45% damage increase from musculature.  So, it's imperative to either have some kind of end drain/rec resists, high end recovery over usage, the ability to acquire end (power sink or similar), and focus on any and all end reduction or recovery bonuses you can squeeze from sets.  Damage is king in this game, and pretty much all mmo's nowadays.  The days of standing there tanking and taunting with little to no consideration for damage are long gone.  You can do insane damage as a tank.  

With all that in mind, you could both hit higher numbers, have end drain/rec not affect you at all, have speed/recharge resists at 100%, have an endurance refill with power sink, and overall achieve better results with elec.  (assuming you want the goal of 90% to all)  In my opinion, elec is one of the best resist sets considering everything in my list.  Unfortunately, you have limitations with increasing your defenses and zero defense debuff resistance.  Despite that, it's a very strong set.  I know my last elec tank could tank ITF and I believe my melee defense was softcapped, and aoe/ranged was around 38%.  (something like that)

But, never forget with a resist set that every single debuff will affect you.  And, the more enemies, the more likely you will be hit by these debuffs.  -regen, -acc, (-end won't matter with elec but will with others), -per, are the more annoying ones.  

One last point just to hopefully give a morsel of credibility - I have never used other peoples' builds, and have made at least 50+ fully functional builds in game with those details in mind.  I learned from experience just how important 45% defense is versus 35, 38, 40, 42, etc.  How different 90% resist performs against 85, 80, 75, etc.  (hint-it's huge, like exponentially different).  How important the endurance deficit is, endurance drain, etc.  I've solo'd ITF and others, and have finished *4 TF's.  Good luck!

[Xandyr]

18 hours ago, DRoddo said:

Hiya guys. I'm challenged myself to make a build where I attempt to passively hit 90 on all the resists. This is my attempt at it. Still shy of 90 on a lot of things but this is really the best I can do. Is there something else that can be done to improve it?

Passive 90 - Tanker (Invulnerability - Staff Fighting).mbd 42.12 kB · 7 downloads

 

Keep in mind with Staff, when you have 3 levels of perfection while in Form Of The Body and execute Sky Splitter, you get a bonus to all Resistances. The build I am posting gives you capped S/L, F/C at 87.87, E/NE at 89.03, Toxic at 55.62, and Psi at 53.57. With the bonus from SS, everything is capped except for Toxic (68.92 and Psi at 66.87).

 

Of course, you can take Cardiac Core to increase your Resistances (and help out with Endurance).

 

 

Tanker (Invulnerability - Staff Fighting).mbd

[Zect]

Invuln has a relatively hard time hardcapping resists through set bonuses alone because it has below-average exotic resists, in exchange for above-average SL resists and substantial+def.

 

Its unenhanced exotic resists from passives and toggles combined are 20% on tankers (Psi: 15%). Most tanker toggles give 30% to damtypes they are not intended to be weak against, with elec being higher across the board. Res enhancement enters red ED at around +50% enhancement value, and there is approximately 50%* of easily achievable resistance set bonuses in the IO system. That means that an invuln tanker can reasonably get to ~80% exotic resists.

 

However, slot-efficiency sinks deeper than the wreckage of the Titanic trying to get that last 10%. Your options are, and you may need more than one of them:

• Barrier core T4 (can be considered perma-5% def & res to all). This means passing on rebirth or ageless.
• Take a resistance alpha, usually cardiac (resilient does not provide enough slot-efficiency given invuln's low base exotic resists). Note that this means passing on agility which in turn means a harder time getting perma-DP and softcapping def, and costs offensive power.
• Take a 2ndary with a res bonus - this is the route you choose.
• Use Unstoppable. This is technically not "passive" since it is not permanent, but it deserves a mention as the route that best preserves offensive power (procs).
• Suck it up and get the set bonuses. This tends to cost all your damage and recharge potential and generally relegates you to the status of a turtle-tank. Further, the slot-efficient resistance bonuses tend to come from attack IO sets, so some powersets struggle harder than others depending on how many attacks they want to take, and what kinds of powers they have access too; it may limit your choice of epic and pool powers too since invuln is already costly on power choices.

* Includes the res uniques, 1 stack of Might of the tanker proc, and non-stupid build design

 

Pick your poison.

 

Your build above relies on rune of protection which only has 1/3 uptime, which is okay if you are taking advantage of the lower resistance needed to build in offensive power. But you don't do that, and relying on rune is also not what I would usually consider "passive 90%". You choose some very inefficient sets such as aegis (the SL res is wasted) and harmonized healing (harmonized healing??).

 

The @Xandyr build has a severe psi/tox hole due to failure to leverage purple sets for FC and psitox resists; 6x armageddon for example is effectively 12% resist, or 2.4% RPAS, on top of formidable acc and rech bonuses.

 

Both of you make critical mistakes, such as failing to split up gauntleted fist into two sets of 3x for EN res, and non-perma dull pain; accoladed invulns should always shoot for perma-max HP because of its powerful synergistic effect with your high mitigations.

Edited July 21, 2023 by Zect

[Zect]

On 7/15/2023 at 1:24 AM, Nightmare Shaman said:

2) A build with max defense/middling resists > a build with high resists/middling defense in all the hard content.  (people will debate this, but it's my opinion)

 

Softcapped defense mitigates more than hardcapped res does (95% vs 90% of incoming damage), but the most dangerous critters in the game have always been either very debuff heavy, e.g. Vanguard Sword, have tohit bonuses, e.g. hardmode critters, or both e.g. Rularuu. In practice this means that def tends to fail in the situations where you desire tanker survivability the most. Add to the fact that ally def buffs tend to be abundant in-game (e.g. maneuvers) and def inspirations are pound for pound stronger than res ones, and that tends to push max survivability builds towards prioritizing res over def, while maintaining sufficient capacity to softcap def in an emergency or when really needed.

 

However in babymode difficulty (ITF, farms, radios etc) max def and middling resists, with remaining build capacity dedicated to offense is definitely very strong and generally more useful than a turtle-tank.

 

Quote

😎Incarnates - People always suggest fixing end problems with incarnates but in my opinion that's a huge wasted opportunity.  You really want to take advantage of that +45% damage increase from musculature.  So, it's imperative to either have some kind of end drain/rec resists, high end recovery over usage, the ability to acquire end (power sink or similar), and focus on any and all end reduction or recovery bonuses you can squeeze from sets.  Damage is king in this game, and pretty much all mmo's nowadays.  The days of standing there tanking and taunting with little to no consideration for damage are long gone.  You can do insane damage as a tank.  

 

Musc is not bad, though tanker damage scalar (0.95) is still low enough that you can nearly always produce more dps by using the alpha for slot-efficiency and slotting damage procs in your attacks instead. Every tank ST attack can fit at least 4 non-unique damage procs. Of course, if you manage to take both that's even better.

 

In general however you have correctly identified some elements of good build design: designing while keeping the target content in mind, and a proper respect for the value of DPS.

[Sanguinesun]

On 7/14/2023 at 4:40 PM, DRoddo said:

Hiya guys. I'm challenged myself to make a build where I attempt to passively hit 90 on all the resists. This is my attempt at it. Still shy of 90 on a lot of things but this is really the best I can do. Is there something else that can be done to improve it?

Passive 90 - Tanker (Invulnerability - Staff Fighting).mbd 42.12 kB · 20 downloads

 

You could make a build for a different primary/secondary for a tank that can get you all resists except one (0.4% shy of cap on that one mind you). before you factor incarnates.

 

But then, it is going to be not an optimal build.  Making a goal of a 90% all cap on resists before incarnates often means the build is less than optimal when you factor all the other mitigations/benefits etc of a build.   

 

One of the reasons rad is often suggested is because while it cannot hit 90% cap on all damage types, what it does hit cap on are the more common resists(cold is its hole) and that it has other mitigations like heal/absorb, decent aoe damage output etc and not sacrificing the overall effectivity of it being a tank.   Expectation too then is for the team to also be bringing other things to help with.

 

You can also build various means with dark to(and yes that was the one I mentioned above getting almost all capped before incarnates) but most build dark either with a 67-80% energy hole only or that only when, say, rune of protection is on cool down instead so that the rest of the build doesnt suffer in damage, acc, healing, recharge etc etc.

 

Invuln isnt bad and its cited by some to be the semi go to armor for those wanting be in the minority doing the hardmode content(other armors can be effectively better mind you but with a preplanned team that helps complement your build so everyone survives optimally.). 

 

 

So another question becomes what are the actual play goals for that toon you have.  If you're going to be building to play more of the general content then literally -anything- is going to be fine because most teams are going to patch your limitations so to speak.  If you're looking into making a hardmode content toon, then check out the various threads that have suggested builds(most of those build makers also give their "general" builds too as they tend to keep their best builds closer to their chest mind you).

 

 

 

9 hours ago, Zect said:

However in babymode difficulty (ITF, farms, radios etc) max def and middling resists, with remaining build capacity dedicated to offense is definitely very strong and generally more useful than a turtle-tank.

 

 

 

While I dont think you were meaning to insinuate that the general player base of the servers are relegated to "baby mode" and implying there is a smidge of elitism going on, I do think that it is of merit to mention that calling such things "baby mode" is a derisive misnomer given that most(sans farming of course discussed below) of that cited content is rather normal and compelling evidence too of being that the majority of the player base participate in such content of the game. 

 

With regards to farms, that's a different creature entirely, as they build tank/brutes to specific damage type resists (capped for those damage types and not middling) and damage type/positional defenses.

 

So they're a specific subset of game play from what the OP seems to imply their goals are for. 

 

The rest of the content such as hard mode task force starred content, is played by a pretty small set/minority of the player base by all accounts of things beyond that.  

 

 

Edited July 22, 2023 by Sanguinesun

[Xandyr]

10 hours ago, Zect said:

 

 

The @Xandyr build has a severe psi/tox hole 

 

Both of you make critical mistakes, such as failing to split up gauntleted fist into two sets of 3x for EN res, and non-perma dull pain; accoladed invulns should always shoot for perma-max HP because of its powerful synergistic effect with your high mitigations.

 

I didn't know that 68.92% Toxic resist and 66.87% Psi resist was severe. Not the greatest, but didn't think it would qualify as severe. I'll make note of that.

Yes, perma DP would be nice, but trying to get capped resists, I wasn't able to get it there. I guess I could have dropped SJ for Hasten, and just relied on Temp travel powers.

 

I changed a couple things, and got the following. With this new slotting, everything is capped except for Toxic, which is at 81.13%. This is, of course, with 1 stack of SMotT, and combo level 3 Sky Splitter in Form of the Body.

 

 

Tanker2 (Invulnerability - Staff Fighting).mbd

[MonteCarla]

I posted about this in the Brutes forum, after making an Electric Armor Brute who hit 90% to six types (not Negative and Toxic).

 

I'm still not sure if you could hit 90% to everything. But there's lots of numbers in my post that may help guide you.

 

Here's some numbers where you 3-slot every resistance power and Tough, and add in the Shield Wall and Reactive Defence IOs, P2W buffs and Base Empowerment buffs. You can see the shortfalls you have to make up with set IOs.

 

                   Tanker slotted with Shield Wall/Reactive Def IOs, P2W and Base Empowerments
Powerset                S/L       F       C       E       N       Psi     Tox
Electric Armor           99.5    75.8    75.8   146.9    67.9    75.8    20.5
Fire Armor               91.6   162.7    36.3    67.9    67.9    20.5    83.7
Dark Armor               91.6    67.9    67.9    52.1    83.7    99.5    52.1
Rad Armor                91.6    75.8   32.35    91.6    75.8    44.2    99.5
Bio Armor                  60    20.5    20.5    20.5    20.5    20.5      60
Willpower               79.75    20.5    20.5    20.5    20.5    20.5    52.1
Invulnerability         107.4    52.1    52.1    52.1    52.1    52.1    52.1

 

Electric Armor looks like your best bet still, although there's not a great chance still of closing the gap with Negative and especially Toxic.

Edited July 22, 2023 by MonteCarla

[Hyperstrike]

15 hours ago, Zect said:

• Use Unstoppable. This is technically not "passive" since it is not permanent, but it deserves a mention as the route that best preserves offensive power (procs).

As something of an Invuln addict, THERE IS NO WAY IN HELL I would recommend this.

Can it get you better Resists?
Sure!
However the power is essentially a delayed self-destruct button.
And unless you're monitoring it VERY carefully, you're gonna get bit.

There are more effective things you can do to maximize your overall survivability.
IMNSHO, Unstop is a waste of a power pick and really needs to be revamped into something actually useful.

[Biff Pow]

Here you go, capped resists with Invulnerability!

 

...Okay, and three stacks of Might of the Tanker (also bonus Gaussian Build-Up!) But seriously, even 70+ in all the exotic damage types is ridiculous. Remember when Arachnos was a pain because of all that Psi and Toxic damage? Haha, not anymore.

 

[Zect]

13 hours ago, Hyperstrike said:

As something of an Invuln addict, THERE IS NO WAY IN HELL I would recommend this.

Can it get you better Resists?
Sure!
However the power is essentially a delayed self-destruct button.
And unless you're monitoring it VERY carefully, you're gonna get bit.

There are more effective things you can do to maximize your overall survivability.
IMNSHO, Unstop is a waste of a power pick and really needs to be revamped into something actually useful.

 

I was a skeptic myself, but having tried it out, I changed my mind. There are ways to deal with the crash, it is nowhere as hard as you're making it out to be. However, it's not for players used to a very passive playstyle where you expect to not have to pay attention to clickies and buffs (such players should go with the set bonus route instead).

[Hyperstrike]

3 minutes ago, Zect said:

 

I was a skeptic myself, but having tried it out, I changed my mind. There are ways to deal with the crash, it is nowhere as hard as you're making it out to be. However, it's not for players used to a very passive playstyle where you expect to not have to pay attention to clickies and buffs (such players should go with the set bonus route instead).

I've had builds that lean on Unstop as well.
Again, there are other, cheaper, better ways to make yourself more durable WITHOUT a suicide button.
Because the crash and the MANDATORY RESET due to bottoming out your blue bar and tanking your Recovery  is just that.

You, the guy dragging most of a team's aggro has to somehow withdraw from in your face combat, hope you don't get chased down, and then reset all your armors.


 

 

10 hours ago, Supertanker said:

Here you go, capped resists with Invulnerability!

 

...Okay, and three stacks of Might of the Tanker (also bonus Gaussian Build-Up!) But seriously, even 70+ in all the exotic damage types is ridiculous. Remember when Arachnos was a pain because of all that Psi and Toxic damage? Haha, not anymore.

 

Build plan?
 

Edited July 22, 2023 by Hyperstrike

[Zect]

19 hours ago, Sanguinesun said:

While I dont think you were meaning to insinuate that the general player base of the servers are relegated to "baby mode" and implying there is a smidge of elitism going on, I do think that it is of merit to mention that calling such things "baby mode" is a derisive misnomer given that most(sans farming of course discussed below) of that cited content is rather normal and compelling evidence too of being that the majority of the player base participate in such content of the game.

 

This post was so passive-aggressive and veiled in insinuations. If you think I'm being elitist or denigrating, just say it. "Zect, calling normal mode 'babymode' insults the people who play it," and explain why. And I'll have you know that like the overwhelming majority of players, I play babymode content and do so frequently, enthusiastically and joyfully.

Edited July 22, 2023 by Zect

[Zect]

23 minutes ago, Hyperstrike said:

Build plan?

 

If you read the post you're quoting, you'll see it says 3x might of the tanker proc. That's the secret sauce.

 

(Which - and yes, I know the posted image is just for fun - I don't recommend, because it's a 6PPM, 10s duration proc. Developer intent is clearly that you can maintain 1 stack on average, no more. Don't get too used to it, then feel bad when it's inevitably fixed.)

[Bopper]

When it comes to gunning for 90% resistance to all, I always think to my Stone/SS Tank. It's only 89.5% resistance to Energy/Negative/Psionic, but that's with only 1 stack of the Tanker ATO proc. With Reactive Defense's scaling resistance, you'll hit 90% resistance to all at 94% health. Or, you can get 2 stacks of the Tanker ATO on occasion. *Note, you don't need to be SS to achieve this. Almost any melee set will allow you to hit these numbers with a Granite build. I just like the convenience of having one stack of Rage perma'd. I also did not add incarnates to this build. So feel free to tweak how you like. Musculature Radial is my go-to for alpha, but since this is not a proc build, feel free to get extra defense and recharge from Spiritual, or resistance and endurance reduction from Cardiac.

 

Other highlights of the build, it has 44.83%+ defense to F/C/E/N and 47.33% defense to S/L. It has capped HP of 3534 and 60 HPS from its 407% regeneration, as well.

 

No taunt in the build, I would rely on Teleport Target, Fold Space, Gloom, and Dark Obliteration to get the attention of foes that are away from me. It is also a rooted granite tank, so expect to only travel via Teleport. Remember, you have toggle suspension now, so feel free to swap into your Athletic Run and one-slotted mule armors to get between places a little more quickly. Feel free to trade Teleport Target for Combat Teleport if you want some more zipping around, especially in combat.

 

Cross Punch is the engine for helping to fight off Granite's recharge debuff. It will get 10% recharge for each target hit, and you have a chance to proc FF on each target as well.

 

Finally, the build comes with 80% resistance to slow debuffs. Just good to have for Stone tanks. You can use a Base Empowerment temp power to get you to 100% for up to 90 minutes.

 

Proc Rocks - Psi Resists - Tanker (Stone Armor - Super Strength).mbd

Edited July 22, 2023 by Bopper

[Sanguinesun]

1 hour ago, Zect said:

 

This post was so passive-aggressive and veiled in insinuations. If you think I'm being elitist or denigrating, just say it. "Zect, calling normal mode 'babymode' insults the people who play it," and explain why. And I'll have you know that like the overwhelming majority of players, I play babymode content and do so frequently, enthusiastically and joyfully.

 

Given I did clearly state that I didn't think you were meaning to insinuate such things and essentially giving you the benefit of the doubt, that response from you does make for compelling evidence that such possibilities may have more merit to be dispelled at this point...

[Thrax]

Unstoppable doesn’t detoggle like elude does. You still have some end. I like it now that it adds psi as well. It’s kinda handy on apex for toxic hard cap. It’s way handier than most think. Only needs the one slot, and a good slot to mule a proc. 

Edited July 22, 2023 by Thrax

[Thrax]

52 minutes ago, Bopper said:

When it comes to gunning for 90% resistance to all, I always think to my Stone/SS Tank. It's only 89.5% resistance to Energy/Negative/Psionic, but that's with only 1 stack of the Tanker ATO proc. With Reactive Defense's scaling resistance, you'll hit 90% resistance to all at 94% health. Or, you can get 2 stacks of the Tanker ATO on occasion. *Note, you don't need to be SS to achieve this. Almost any melee set will allow you to hit these numbers with a Granite build. I just like the convenience of having one stack of Rage perma'd. I also did not add incarnates to this build. So feel free to tweak how you like. Musculature Radial is my go-to for alpha, but since this is not a proc build, feel free to get extra defense and recharge from Spiritual, or resistance and endurance reduction from Cardiac.

 

Other highlights of the build, it has 44.83%+ defense to F/C/E/N and 47.33% defense to S/L. It has capped HP of 3534 and 60 HPS from its 407% regeneration, as well.

 

No taunt in the build, I would rely on Teleport Target, Fold Space, Gloom, and Dark Obliteration to get the attention of foes that are away from me. It is also a rooted granite tank, so expect to only travel via Teleport. Remember, you have toggle suspension now, so feel free to swap into your Athletic Run and one-slotted mule armors to get between places a little more quickly. Feel free to trade Teleport Target for Combat Teleport if you want some more zipping around, especially in combat.

 

Cross Punch is the engine for helping to fight off Granite's recharge debuff. It will get 10% recharge for each target hit, and you have a chance to proc FF on each target as well.

 

Finally, the build comes with 80% resistance to slow debuffs. Just good to have for Stone tanks. You can use a Base Empowerment temp power to get you to 100% for up to 90 minutes.

 

Proc Rocks - Psi Resists - Tanker (Stone Armor - Super Strength).mbd 45.94 kB · 0 downloads

 

I’ve got a stone/ma that does this as well. MA helps get defense soft capped too. 

[Bopper]

2 hours ago, Thrax said:

 

I’ve got a stone/ma that does this as well. MA helps get defense soft capped too. 

MA is another very popular choice for that reason. Takes your softcapped defense to incarnate softcapped defense. Here is a similar build using MA where S/L sits at 62% defense when using storm kick, ~55% for F/C/E/N. Psi resistance and slow debuff resistance takes a hit, but you'll have an overall smoother rotation with your attacks.

Concrete Breaker - Psi Resists - Tanker (Stone Armor - Martial Arts).mbd

[Thrax]

25 minutes ago, Bopper said:

MA is another very popular choice for that reason. Takes your softcapped defense to incarnate softcapped defense. Here is a similar build using MA where S/L sits at 62% defense when using storm kick, ~55% for F/C/E/N. Psi resistance and slow debuff resistance takes a hit, but you'll have an overall smoother rotation with your attacks.

Concrete Breaker - Psi Resists - Tanker (Stone Armor - Martial Arts).mbd 42.95 kB · 0 downloads

 

I’ll have to check that out. I’ve got one built already. Its resist is hard capped aside teom a half or so psi. And run speed is fine in granite. 
 

I originally made him just cause I love MA and wanted to see a granite tank do eagles claw. It was worth it just for that. 
 

I’m still unsure if it is any tankier than my sr/kat tank though. Neither one of them dies. 

[Hyperstrike]

3 hours ago, Thrax said:

Unstoppable doesn’t detoggle like elude does. You still have some end. I like it now that it adds psi as well. It’s kinda handy on apex for toxic hard cap. It’s way handier than most think. Only needs the one slot, and a good slot to mule a proc. 

Self -90% Hit Points, -100% Endurance (after 3 min delay)

Saying "it doesn't detoggle" is disingenuous.

Yes, it doesn't auto-detoggle ANYTHING.

Technically having ALL your Endurance "go away" is what does.

[Thrax]

2 hours ago, Hyperstrike said:

Self -90% Hit Points, -100% Endurance (after 3 min delay)

Saying "it doesn't detoggle" is disingenuous.

Yes, it doesn't auto-detoggle ANYTHING.

Technically having ALL your Endurance "go away" is what does.

 

Use it in game.  Just tried it in game again.  I did loose half toggles but not all.  This was solo outside of teaming.   Depends on what is going on and when it crashes.  I've had it crash several times on teams and didn't have a single toggle drop.  Likely depends on other buffs and perf shifter and panacea firing.  

 

 

[Thrax]

2 hours ago, Bopper said:

MA is another very popular choice for that reason. Takes your softcapped defense to incarnate softcapped defense. Here is a similar build using MA where S/L sits at 62% defense when using storm kick, ~55% for F/C/E/N. Psi resistance and slow debuff resistance takes a hit, but you'll have an overall smoother rotation with your attacks.

Concrete Breaker - Psi Resists - Tanker (Stone Armor - Martial Arts).mbd 42.95 kB · 1 download

 

 

Mine looks to be old cause it says brimstone isn't possible, guess they moved it.  Anyway, here is mine.

 

 

Super Thrax 2021.mxd

[Hjarki]

On 7/14/2023 at 1:24 PM, Nightmare Shaman said:

2) A build with max defense/middling resists > a build with high resists/middling defense in all the hard content.  (people will debate this, but it's my opinion)

If you're built for comprehensive resists - include debuff resistance - I'd argue the reverse. The full resist Tanker never has to worry about environmental damage and their health is extremely predictable.

 

More importantly, you'll almost certainly have massive buffs to defense while getting buffs to resistance is rare. A team of 8 is probably giving you around +25% Defense to everything just from Maneuvers. In contrast, unless you're specifically bringing along certain support sets, your resistances are what they are. Even with Barrier, the defensive bonus is far more significant than the resist bonus.

 

On 7/14/2023 at 1:24 PM, Nightmare Shaman said:

5) There are a ton of fire/cold set bonuses, but much less so nrg/dark bonuses.  Doesn't make too much difference when dealing with inv, but it does with other set considerations.

The different damage types tend to also have a different emphasis. S/L/E are by far the most common - and hardest-hitting - types of damage. Having both resist and defense is ideal. However, resist is generally better - and a lot better for Lethal unless you also have DDR (Radiation also debuffs defense but not many enemies use Radiation).

 

Beyond this, you tend to want to resist Fire and Toxic while defending against Cold, Negative and Psionic. If you're immune/near-immune to the secondary effects of Cold and Negative (which is relatively easy with set bonuses and Focused Accuracy), you can almost discard them from consideration.

 

On 7/14/2023 at 1:24 PM, Nightmare Shaman said:

Incarnates - People always suggest fixing end problems with incarnates but in my opinion that's a huge wasted opportunity.  You really want to take advantage of that +45% damage increase from musculature.  So, it's imperative to either have some kind of end drain/rec resists, high end recovery over usage, the ability to acquire end (power sink or similar), and focus on any and all end reduction or recovery bonuses you can squeeze from sets.  Damage is king in this game, and pretty much all mmo's nowadays.  The days of standing there tanking and taunting with little to no consideration for damage are long gone.  You can do insane damage as a tank.  

This might make sense for a Blaster or Scrapper who is built entirely around damage. For a Tanker, not so much. While doing more damage is nice, it's not really all that much more damage - assuming you took Assault and have no other damage boosts, you're going from 2.15x damage to 2.45x (14% improvement for base damage). But then you have to consider that about half your level 50 team probably has Assault as well. Not to mention that if you bring along a Defender/Corruptor/Controller/Mastermind, there's a good chance they'll boost your damage as well. Moreover, that 14% is 14% of the Tanker's damage - which is a lot lower than the tip-of-the-spear folks. And, of course, you can chew reds like candy while you can't do the same with other features of your build.

 

But supplemental features - healing, control duration, etc. - aren't likely to be boosted in this fashion. Moreover, these features are often ones where you get the full bonus (rather than 1/3rd of it being ED'd into irrelevance) since you don't slot your attacks for it.

 

With that in mind, I generally agree with the notion that taking Cardiac to solve your endurance issues is a poor design choice. If this is your approach, your character will be unplayable in exemplar'd content.

[Nightmare Shaman]

There's been a lot of people "correcting" me, but I need to re-emphasize I'm not a theory crafter.  I've solo'd ITF on several builds, done high level +4/8 content including DA missions, and against all enemy types.  I've tanked *4 ITF, and done it on regular (+4/8) teams countless times.  I'm a pragmatist who speaks from experience and what works, not by using a calculator and arguing over percentage points.

Also, someone mentioned that softcapping defense equals 95% mitigation and that is not accurate.  The purple patch changed how defense works.  I don't think the specific details are available online as I remember having to calculate it years ago in excel.  Oh, I found my post and calculations on these forums:



+1 enemies: .05 X 1.1 = .055 (5.5%)
+2 enemies: .05 X 1.2 = .06  (6%)
+3 enemies: .05 X 1.3 = .065 (6.5%)
+4 enemies: .05 X 1.4 = .07  (7%)

So this is strictly for regular mobs.  There are additional modifiers for different ranks as follows:

 

Lieutenant	1.15
Boss, Elite Boss, Sniper	1.30
Monster, Giant Monster, AV	1.50

 

Lieutenant
+1 enemies: .05 X 1.25 = .063 (6.3%)
+2 enemies: .05 X 1.35 = .068  (6.8%)
+3 enemies: .05 X 1.45 = .073 (7.3%)
+4 enemies: .05 X 1.55 = .078  (7.8%)

Bosses
+1 enemies: .05 X 1.4 = .07 (7.0%)
+2 enemies: .05 X 1.5 = .075  (7.5%)
+3 enemies: .05 X 1.6 = .008 (8.0%)
+4 enemies: .05 X 1.7 = .085  (8.5%)

AV's
+1 enemies: .05 X 1.6 = .08 (8.0%)
+2 enemies: .05 X 1.7 = .085  (8.5%)
+3 enemies: .05 X 1.8 = .09 (9.0%)
+4 enemies: .05 X 1.9 = .095  (9.5%)

So, softcapping does not equal 95% mitigation.  I think that's only true against +0 level minions.  Everything else increasing incrementally based on the level and type of enemy.  

I stand by my original statement that consists of the following:
1) The most dangerous thing at end game is not damage, it's debuffs.  Especially when dealing with large numbers of enemies as you do when challenging yourself or doing hard content.
2) Thus, mitigation becomes mostly irrelevant when 50 enemies are hitting you with -regen, -acc, -def, etc.  It simply ceases to matter and you will die quickly or slowly, but either way you will eventually die.
3) Max (softcapped) defense is preferable to almost anything, and although it's true that many times people have barrier, they don't always and it creates a build that requires other people to have powers, buffs, etc. that are required to maximize my build.  That is never my goal, nor is it optimal imho.  I like to have the ability to go in blindly, on any PUG, and carry the team or carry myself.  Softcapped def is almost always the optimal way to achieve that.
4) There are some enemies that have +acc, but they are rare.  Especially for the content I do.  (ITF, DA missions, end game TF's)  The only ones that stand out to me as being a real thorn in my side were DE because they appear before I have full set bonuses.  But, then you outlevel them anyway.  

To restate, I don't theory craft.  I use mids to create an outline of a build, then I play it.  If I like it and it performs well, I use it.  From that experience I give advice and I stand by that advice because I've used it in the hardest content, solo and in a group.  I started playing back in beta 2004.  

Edited July 23, 2023 by Nightmare Shaman