Did any feedback matter in the threads? Or…

[Arcanum]

1 hour ago, Ukase said:

This is the part I don't get. You know there are issues - but you release it anyway. Why "push"? There's no rush. We could easily wait 6 months to a year between new stuff. I suppose it's a rhetorical question. Unless the answer makes a lot of sense, I probably wouldn't agree with the rationale anyway. But, like Snarky, I'm also a curmudgeon, but I end up liking the content after I get used to it. Not a big fan of change. 

No, it's a fair question - and there certainly isn't a rush. The dev team is excited for players to play the content they've created though, and if a known issue is considered minor and has a fix in place - it's not worth delaying another week in our opinion. There was one major issue that got reported to us very last minute yesterday. If the fix wasn't easy, then we wouldn't have released it yesterday and would've been fine waiting another week or so.

Ultimately though, there comes a point though where continuing to push stuff onto Open Beta no longer serves a purpose as we've lost the numbers for testing. Despite our best efforts, no patch is ever going to be 100% perfect (we are just a volunteer team doing our best, after all) - so it basically comes down to whether putting it to Open Beta for another week helps the team, or releasing it live would be better.

As I'm sure you can imagine, the Open Beta testing period, and the first week or so after a new patch pushes live is very time consuming on the team; so we try and be respectful of what would serve them best.

Although, as you said - you may likely not agree with the rationale, but in the spirit of transparency, trying to give you an answer anyways 😉.

[Ukase]

Well, I appreciate your taking the time.

[arcane]

19 hours ago, skoryy said:

There were several iterations of the patch that went through, with changes to Plant Control and Tanker inherents that I know were made due to player testing.

Yeah feedback was very obviously read, listened to, and implemented. Think Snarky is defining “feedback” as “my specific feedback in the Dark Miasma thread”.

[Snarky]

29 minutes ago, arcane said:

Yeah feedback was very obviously read, listened to, and implemented. Think Snarky is defining “feedback” as “my specific feedback in the Dark Miasma thread”.

Yes, true.  And still waiting for an example to be listed in this thread of the situation HC says they left intangible in the power for.   I may get my answer.  Or…

[Bionic_Flea]

1 hour ago, Arcanum said:

no patch is ever going to be 100% perfect (we are just a volunteer team doing our best, after all)

 

No patch to any game or software, whether volunteer or for profit, is 100% perfect.  Some of the biggest companies on the planet push out patches that need to be patched.

[Ghost]

24 minutes ago, Snarky said:

Yes, true.  And still waiting for an example to be listed in this thread of the situation HC says they left intangible in the power for.   I may get my answer.  Or…

 

[Captain Powerhouse]

37 minutes ago, Snarky said:

Yes, true.  And still waiting for an example to be listed in this thread of the situation HC says they left intangible in the power for.   I may get my answer.  Or…

 

A long time ago during the Force Field revamp we considered changes to Detention Field, we were told by many that they use these powers in combination to disable AVs in multi-AV encounters as they tend to have strong mez protection but no Phase protections. Due to the feedback offered at the time, we left Detention Field untouched.

 

Sleep is another tactic, but AVs will instantly wake up if anyone accidentally hurts them even with Deep Sleep as AVs are highly resistant to the effect.

 

It's a non-exploitative use of the power that did not need to be removed for this change to be introduced, so it was not removed. Someone would have to make a very strong case about exploits to have the phase element removed, or an alternative considered from there.

 

 

[srmalloy]

To parody Star Trek, "What Arcanum said is true; they read all the feedback. What Snarky said is unimportant, and we do not hear his words.". 😁

[Arcanum]

20 minutes ago, srmalloy said:

To parody Star Trek, "What Arcanum said is true; they read all the feedback. What Snarky said is unimportant, and we do not hear his words.". 😁

While I am amused at the reference, for transparency I'd be cautious of this too. All feedback is important and valuable - as a matter of fact, the team is typically so aligned on certain things, we need people with contrasting opinions to ask questions and disagree with our approach. The game is meant to be for everyone, so all the opinions matter.

To take it a step further, while we do sincerely want the contrasting opinions - we do appreciate when it's kept polite; as attacking dev members and/or HC staff results in the GMs whipping out the ban hammers.

@Ukase was a great example here - very respectfully asked the question, may not have liked the answer, but the feedback and opinion has been noted and we will likely reflect on it for the next patch.

[Snarky]

50 minutes ago, Captain Powerhouse said:

 

A long time ago during the Force Field revamp we considered changes to Detention Field, we were told by many that they use these powers in combination to disable AVs in multi-AV encounters as they tend to have strong mez protection but no Phase protections. Due to the feedback offered at the time, we left Detention Field untouched.

 

Sleep is another tactic, but AVs will instantly wake up if anyone accidentally hurts them even with Deep Sleep as AVs are highly resistant to the effect.

 

It's a non-exploitative use of the power that did not need to be removed for this change to be introduced, so it was not removed. Someone would have to make a very strong case about exploits to have the phase element removed, or an alternative considered from there.

 

 

I have NEVER seen a team use stacked intangibles to sequester an AV.  But, I am just one player.  It would require serious planning before (having the right players/powers) and it would be of a relatively short duration. 
 

In short I do not like the answer.  But only because I find it implausible.  Calculus was used for a hundred years without a “mathematical proof” that it worked. Because it makes a ton of sense just saying what you are doing. The explanation for this…. It makes no sense to me.  So I do not like it.  
 

No disrespect intended.  Thank you for answering.   

[mistagoat]

1 hour ago, Captain Powerhouse said:

It's a non-exploitative use of the power that did not need to be removed for this change to be introduced, so it was not removed.

Devs, thank you for answering some questions in this thread.

 

Here is what I really want to know: Will Blackhole make Hami intangible?

[srmalloy]

1 hour ago, Arcanum said:

While I am amused at the reference, for transparency I'd be cautious of this too.

The phrase popped into my head reading KaizenSoze's response to Snarky, and it seemed like it was both amusing and too outrageous to be believed -- although, if read closely, the implication that Snarky's 'did the devs just go ahead with what they planned no matter what people mentioned' was false aligns with your earlier statement. Not everyone's concerns may have been addressed, but they were at least read. 

[arcane]

1 hour ago, Snarky said:

I have NEVER seen a team use stacked intangibles to sequester an AV.  But, I am just one player.  It would require serious planning before (having the right players/powers) and it would be of a relatively short duration. 
 

In short I do not like the answer.  But only because I find it implausible.  Calculus was used for a hundred years without a “mathematical proof” that it worked. Because it makes a ton of sense just saying what you are doing. The explanation for this…. It makes no sense to me.  So I do not like it.  
 

No disrespect intended.  Thank you for answering.   

I’ve been on MLTF teams where intangibles were used to disable the towers and skip straight to burning down Lord Recluse.

[Snarky]

1 minute ago, arcane said:

I’ve been on MLTF teams where intangibles were used to disable the towers and skip straight to burning down Lord Recluse.

Thank you.  I have been looking for answers like this!   (Like, what the H is it good for…)

[Captain Fabulous]

20 minutes ago, arcane said:

I’ve been on MLTF teams where intangibles were used to disable the towers and skip straight to burning down Lord Recluse.

 

 

1 hour ago, Snarky said:

I have NEVER seen a team use stacked intangibles to sequester an AV.  But, I am just one player.  It would require serious planning before (having the right players/powers) and it would be of a relatively short duration. 
 

In short I do not like the answer.  But only because I find it implausible.  Calculus was used for a hundred years without a “mathematical proof” that it worked. Because it makes a ton of sense just saying what you are doing. The explanation for this…. It makes no sense to me.  So I do not like it.  
 

No disrespect intended.  Thank you for answering.   

Intangibles, like sleeps, are really useful while soloing or in small groups, especially at larger team size settings. Not so much on big teams where you have enough damage, control, and/or support to keep everyone alive. Definitely niche powers, but useful nonetheless.

[Maelwys]

19 minutes ago, Snarky said:

Thank you.  I have been looking for answers like this!   (Like, what the H is it good for…)

I'm pretty sure back in the day slotting Acc/Mez HOs increased the Magnitude of Intangiblility effects; as I distinctly remember using Sonic Cage to collar problematic AVs in tricky encounters solo without having to have another teammate with a similar effect to stack it with. Phasing Infernal whilst we killed his Summoning Portal was one of the earliest uses IIRC; and I'm fairly certain it still applied whenever the original Statesmans TF was released - I recall teams caging Ghost Widow; as well as the towers.

[Starhawk32]

On 6/17/2025 at 3:43 PM, MTeague said:

Really?  I like the +Def from Energy Cloak on my EM/EA Brute, but I hate the stealth effect / not being able to see my costume cleanly.

That keeps me from choosing almost any of the stealthy stuff on scrappers.  I still end up going with the Stealth powers to avoid invisible costume.

however I am known to not pick the most powerful powers stuffs because I am a costume nerd.  Came to peace with my mid-tier player perma-status long ago

[mistagoat]

17 hours ago, mistagoat said:

Will Blackhole make Hami intangible?

Does anyone know the answer to this?

[Snarky]

10 minutes ago, mistagoat said:

Does anyone know the answer to this?

I never take it (i did on my current project level 34) to experience the newness. 
 

I thought it would not work on AVs.  People here are saying you can easily get Ghost Widow, towers in MLTF long enough to kill Recluse.  
 

I have heard testers saying EBs are immune to trawl and so phase intangible.  
 

I kind if want to use my alt acct to make a Dark Dark and spam this thing on high level teams to find out how it works.  (I get enough hate, no need for more people to put me on ignore…)

 

oh, i wont. I dont gave time these days.  Just finishing 30-34 content is kicking my butt gaming time wise

Edited Thursday at 10:31 AM by Snarky

[Jacke]

18 hours ago, arcane said:

I’ve been on MLTF teams where intangibles were used to disable the towers and skip straight to burning down Lord Recluse.

 

But the Cage Powers in both Force Field and Sonic Resonance aren't autohit, so they always have at least a 5% chance to miss.  What happens then?

 

 

[mistagoat]

59 minutes ago, Snarky said:

I never take it (i did on my current project level 34) to experience the newness. 
 

I thought it would not work on AVs.  People here are saying you can easily get Ghost Widow, towers in MLTF long enough to kill Recluse.  
 

I have heard testers saying EBs are immune to trawl and so phase intangible.  

Yeah, In my beta testing it made every EB/AV intangible, no exceptions. The Trawl effect was also resisted by 100% of EB/AVs. I wasn't able to test it on Hami during beta and stuff like Hami and MSR is where this power has the biggest potential for trolling. I'm really hoping the devs saw that as well and maybe flagged Hami to be immune to intangible or something along those lines.

 

1 hour ago, Snarky said:

I kind if want to use my alt acct to make a Dark Dark and spam this thing on high level teams to find out how it works.

You would probably be an allstar on a PI radios team but if you were on a Maria Jenkins arc, you might land yourself on a few more ignore lists.

[Snarky]

On 6/17/2025 at 12:26 PM, Captain Powerhouse said:

 

If you bump into any critters that entirely resist the trawl effect but are made intangible with a single activation of Black Hole, please list them in a bug thread. Almost all enemies that entirely ignore trawl also have phase protection.

did i misunderstand this?

 

i thought that was the design, if trawl does not work they go intangible?

 

anyways, been using this power in my first hour of live gaming since the patch.  Devouring Earth Emanators and Swarm, both ignore trawl and go intangible.  non EB non AV, white enemies.  the emanators are pets...

[Yomo Kimyata]

On 6/17/2025 at 1:40 PM, Snarky said:

Did theybjust go ahead with every change theybolanned no matter what people mentioned?  

 

On 6/18/2025 at 11:28 AM, Arcanum said:

While I am amused at the reference, for transparency I'd be cautious of this too. All feedback is important and valuable - as a matter of fact, the team is typically so aligned on certain things, we need people with contrasting opinions to ask questions and disagree with our approach. The game is meant to be for everyone, so all the opinions matter.
 

 

I appreciate both of these posts.  I'm personally sunsetting if not sunset on this game, but I've generally been unhappy at how HC deals (or does not deal) with feedback.  It certainly does feel as if whatever has been planned is going to happen, and it does not feel as if contrasting opinions are solicited or even respected.  That's why I don't bother beta testing because at this point I don't feel as if I have any influence over the process and I'm just going to see what hits the live servers a week or so after it hits live beta because that's what is going to happen.  We are at war with Eastasia.  We have always been at war with Eastasia.

 

That said, I don't spend any time on the Gold discord server (or even know if I'm able to log in there) since I detest discord so much, so really I can only blame myself

[macskull]

13 hours ago, Jacke said:

But the Cage Powers in both Force Field and Sonic Resonance aren't autohit, so they always have at least a 5% chance to miss.  What happens then?

Then you take the L and you only get to cage one of the towers instead of two, and it takes you a little longer to finish.