page 3 [FOCUSED FEEDBACK] New Melee Set - Sonic Melee

[The Curator]

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Powers

New Melee Set

Sonic Melee

• New Melee Set for Brutes, Tankers, Scrappers and Stalkers
• Sonic Melee lets you use the power of sound waves to damage your foes with devastating close range sonic attacks that can inflict Migraines, debuffing their resistance to multiple debuffs, and holding foes for a short hold. This can be dramatically increased by using Sound Booster. With the ability to Attune your frequency to your target's, your single target attacks can trigger powerful reverberating damage over time, helping you quickly bring enemies to their knees. 

 

• Sonic Thrust - Melee, DMG(Energy/Smash), Foe -Res(Debuffs), Knockback/Repel

  • A focused attack of intense sonic power with high chance to violently knock a nearby foe off their feet. Deals minimal damage, but can be very effective. If used in conjunction with Attune, you will match your frequency with the target's resonance increasing Attunes damage over time.

  • This power's highlight icon indicates the last application of it's effects is about to expire or has expired.

• Strident Echo - Melee, DMG(Energy/Smash), Foe -Res(Debuffs), Chance for Hold
  • Strident Echo deals minor damage over time. It has a low chance of causing a migraine, leaving the target shaking in pain and helpless. If used in conjunction with Attune, you will match your frequency with the target's resonance increasing Attunes damage over time.
  • This power's highlight icon indicates the last application of it's effects is about to expire or has expired.
• Attune - Melee Toggle, DMG(Energy), +Special
  • A high-intensity sound wave that matches the resonant frequency of your target. This power does not inflict much damage but can be sustained for continued damage over time that will be boosted if you strike the target with Sonic Thrust or Strident Echo. Each of these attacks will further increase the strength of the damage over time.
• Sound Booster [Tanker/Brute/Scrapper only] - Self +DMG, +To Hit, +Special
  • Greatly boosts your attacks for a few seconds. Slightly increases chance to hit. Moderately increases the duration of mez effects. Moderately increases the chance for Sound Manipulation powers to induce migraines.
• Build Up [Stalker only] - Self +DMG, +To Hit
  • Greatly increases the amount of damage you deal for a few seconds, as well as slightly increasing your chance to hit.
• Sonic Clap - Melee (Cone), DMG(Energy), Foe Disorient, Knockdown
  • You generate a powerful sonic wave that damage foes in front of you with a decent chance to stun and knock them down.
• Sandman's Whisper [Tanker/Brute/Scrapper only] - Melee, DMG(Smashing/Energy), Foe Sleep, -Res(DMG)
  • You whisper on your foes ear with a slumbering effect. Foes affected might fall asleep and will have their resistance to damage lowered.
  • This power's highlight icon indicates the last application of it's effects is about to expire or has expired.
• Assassin's Whisper [Stalker only] - Melee, DMG(Energy/Smashing), Sleep, -Res(DMG)
  • A signature Stalker attack. This attack does superior energy and smashing damage on its own as a frontal attack and cannot be interrupted. However, if it is executed while you are Hidden, this attack will do tremendous damage, as you whisper at your unsuspecting foe. Affected target is likely to fall asleep and have their damage resistances lowered. This attack may be interrupted if you move or are attacked while executing this power and are hidden. Using this power while not hidden has a chance to critically hit equal to 33.3% times the number of stacks of Assassin's Focus. Using Assassin's Strike when not hidden will remove all stacks of Assassin's Focus regardless if you critically hit or not.
• Deafening Wave - PBAoE Melee, DMG(Energy/Smash), Foe Chance for Hold
  • You create a large field of sonic waves, causing damage to all foes around you. It has a moderate chance of causing migraines, leaving them shaking in pain and helpless.
• Earsplitter - Melee, DMG(Energy/Smash), Foe -Res(Debuffs), Chance for Hold
  • You generate an earsplitting sound wave right in the face of your foe, inflicting great damage. It has a good chance of causing a migraine, leaving them shaking in pain and helpless. Earsplitter will inflict 10% bonus damage for each attuned power against the main target: Sonic Thrust and Strident Echo.

• Brute	Scrapper	Stalker	Tanker
  1: Sonic Thrust 1: Strident Echo 2: Attune 6: Sound Booster 8: Sonic Clap 12: Taunt 18: Sandman's Whisper 22: Deafening Wave 26: Earsplitter	1: Sonic Thrust 1: Strident Echo 2: Attune 6: Sonic Clap 8: Sound Booster 12: Confront 18: Sandman's Whisper 22: Deafening Wave 26: Earsplitter	1: Sonic Thrust 1: Strident Echo 2: Attune 6: Assassin's Whisper 8: Build Up 12: Placate 18: Sonic Clap 22: Deafening Wave 26: Earsplitter	1: Sonic Thrust 1: Strident Echo 4: Attune 10: Taunt 16: Sonic Clap 20: Sound Booster 24: Sandman's Whisper 28: Deafening Wave 30: Earsplitter

[Alchemystic]

Still playing with this so I'll edit as I go.

 

Attune seems as though it's in a very perculiar place, it's feels like a combination of Follow Up (Claws), Molten Embrace (Fiery Aura) and Power Siphon (Kinetic Melee), while also having to compete internally with Sound Booster as the means of increasing the damage output of the set (albiet one that is far more restrictive). Not only that, but it's another gimmick ontop of the already present 'Migriane' mechanic which should probably be the focus here instead, as it already was present in Sonic Assault and works just fine as is.

 

I think a way forward here is to just drop Attune and give Migrianes a DoT element, or combine the functionality of Attune and Sound Booster into one power; a toggle that deals DoT to a target, with a (much higher) DoT boost from other attacks, and improves the chance of inducing Migraines. I feel this would definitely help refine the powerset to emphasise it's strongest points, removing the excess of conflicting and redundant mechanics, and ensuring that players are better able to utilize powers without several conditional factors complicating their use. It could look something like this;

 

 Attune: Melee Toggle, DoT(Energy), +Special, +Chance to Hold

A high-intensity sound wave that matches the resonant frequency of your target. This power does not inflict much damage but can be sustained for continued damage over time that will be boosted if you strike the target with any of your Sonic Melee attacks. Each of these attacks will further increase the strength of the damage over time, and have an increased chance to induce Migraines.

 

Stalkers, however, could just keep Build Up (or potentially Sound Booster) instead of Attune, as other powersets with similar unique variants (Staff, Dark, Claws, Kinetic) opt not to give them to Stalkers in order to fit more neatly into the archetype's playstyle. It just seems rather tedious trying to juggle your ability to hide and deliver stealth strikes ontop of a mechanic you need to lock into, which I imagine is why those other powersets dropped them entirely.

 

As for the rest of the set? Most of it is set up well enough, the main drawback is how much of it has become convoluted trying to include both the Attune and Migraine mechanics when the best course of action would be to consolidate the two features into one, especially if it helps powers feel less situational and far more user-friendly.

 

Whether Attune or Sound Booster are dropped, it probably means that there would be an opening for a new power to be added to the set, perhaps a ranged attack, narrow cone, or strong melee power? Making something new is probably a bit more hard work, so what about bringing over Howl or Shout from Sonic Attack?

All in all, the rest of the powerset seems fine, it's just unfortunately burdened by being pulled in too many directions at once. I think if we want it to thrive, we need to focus attention on streamlining it, and that means getting rid of the dead weight.

 

Edited 46 minutes ago by Alchemystic

[Sovera]

Ran few pylon tests on a Brute.

T1, T2, Attune. Earsplitter: average of 3 minutes (2:54, 2:55, 3 minutes). Rotation of Earsplitter, T1, T2, T1. Both T1 and T2 had 4 procs trying to get more damage.

T2, Sandman's Whisper, Earsplitter: 3:14. Rotation of Earsplitter, Sandman's Whisper, T2. Both T2 and Sandman's Whispers had four procs out trying to get more out of them.

 

 

In my opinion the ST damage is a tad low and we're not rewarded enough by Attune's jank. But it levels really well as the early Attune DoT damage is great, but it doesn't scale in the end game.

Suggestion, boost Attune's dot to get more oomph from Fury, and maybe allow it to crit for the other ATs?? Or just buff the numbers a bit since I tested neo Spines with the same setup and had consistent 30 seconds less (2:30 on average) and Sonic is supposed to be a ST centric set while Spines has better ST now but is still meant to be the AoE set.

[UnlimitedNoSugarAdded]

When using Earsplitter, it INCREASES the debuff resistance of the enemies?

 

This cant be right... right?

This test was done on the BRUTE AT. 

Edited 19 hours ago by UnlimitedNoSugarAdded
edited to include AT, wrong AT added lol

[Dombloo]

13 minutes ago, UnlimitedNoSugarAdded said:

When using Earsplitter, it INCREASES the debuff resistance of the enemies?

 

This cant be right... right?

Which AT is that? Looked to be working appropriately on stalkers to me. 🤔

[JayboH]

Version 28.3.7289 and 7292 (open)

 

Went to character creator to make a new Sonic Melee toon.  Both Sonic Thrust and Sonic Echo do not play their ripple wave FX in the creator.  The character animations play, but no sound waves appear.  The other powers are fine.  Sonic Echo fx does appear when trying an already-made character in-game, so I do not know if it is just tied to the character creator.

 

Not sure on that Assassin's Whisper animation - looks like a mental attack instead of an audio attack where the hands are placed and where the FX generates.

[UnlimitedNoSugarAdded]

25 minutes ago, Dombloo said:

Which AT is that? Looked to be working appropriately on stalkers to me. 🤔

Apologies, I should have included that its the BRUTE AT.

Edited 19 hours ago by UnlimitedNoSugarAdded
wrong AT character

[Sarigar]

I'll say it as I said it on CB : Attune need more interactions outside the T1/T2. Tying the set's mechanic to two incredibly low impact abilities around Attune which is janky in itself to reapply in moment to moment game play feels terrible. I know you want people to have a reason to take the T1/T2, but guess what? It's okay to have powers in a set that aren't taken. Skips are fine. I, as a matter a fact as a player, don't find it exciting to take abysmal damage abilities that do very little without Attune for my damage. Earsplitter and Sandman's Whisper should enhance Attune and I don't know why they don't.

[Kaika]

Was able to get around a slightly under 2 min pylon time on a fairly quickly thrown together Sonic/psi stalker build, which is respectable, specially considering how much AoE and control the set has. That's without using the -regen from devour psyche, though I did have a proc bombed out aura of madness and moonbeam, so it's not ALL just the sonic damage. I maintained attune with both stacks, but not sure how much it was really doing at the end of the day. Bringing it into a mission though, I'm not really a fan of attune, I don't think it's *bad* or anything but for all the effort you have to put into it, it really didn't feel all that impactful, especially with AS and crits in the mix, It's the kinda thing where the numbers probably add up to it being worth it, but just barely, but that's only a hunch, I'm sure someone will do the math. Honestly I think it would be alot better as just a melee based DoT toggle with no other interactions, thats already really unique and something thats not in the game, the interactions with the T1 and T2 just feel like they over-complicate things and sorta force you into taking powers that are normally somewhat skippable. It kinda feels like the old tank gauntlet issue again, and I would rather the T1 and T2 be strong enough to stand on their own then have to have this awkward interaction to make them worth it, as they feel very weak on their own.

 

Another issue I was having was losing my attune target in the mix of things, there is no VFX on the main target effected which makes them really easy to lose if you are switching around targets. Sure yo u can see damage numbers over their heads, but in alot of situations it's still hard to line it up, specially if it's a group like council and many of the enemies look identical. Also on stalker I kept having a issue with the DoT damage would cause the enemy to quickly start fleeing forcing me to chase or lose attune, which kinda just sucks, since it would happen very quickly. This isn't a issue unique to sonic melee, but it feels worse since you lose attune and have to set it up again.

 

All and all it works fine, just feels really over-complicated single target DPS wise, and not really great in normal misions due to how much setup it needs. AoE feels great at least. It's current state is fine, but I don't think I'd play it.

Edited 17 hours ago by Kaika

[Captain Powerhouse]

2 hours ago, UnlimitedNoSugarAdded said:

When using Earsplitter, it INCREASES the debuff resistance of the enemies?

 

Good catch! Fixed internally.

[UltraAlt]

12 hours ago, The Curator said:

Powers

New Melee Set

Sonic Melee

 

The default for the FX is all white.

Please don't do that. Some of us have light sensitivity, and it is blinding and can be like stick in the eye.

 

We would have an option to solo, use /noparticles # (at least I hope), or log out when the pain became too much.

And I like teaming and being able to see the FX of other characters (unless until it get to be too much of a light show).

 

Please make the default a color other than "white".

I don't think that any power should start with all white. It would be good to go back and change the default colors of any set that comes with white as the default color. For example: a bluish color would work for a cold set just as well as white but it wouldn't as blinding.

 

Of course, there are those players that just want to be a eye-gouging mass of as much all white as possible (powers, costume, auras, everything ... and, yes, I have run into players doing this more than once). Make them change their colors to all white instead of providing it as a default.

 

12 hours ago, The Curator said:

Attune - Melee Toggle, DMG(Energy), +Special

• A high-intensity sound wave that matches the resonant frequency of your target. This power does not inflict much damage but can be sustained for continued damage over time that will be boosted if you strike the target with Sonic Thrust or Strident Echo. Each of these attacks will further increase the strength of the damage over time.

 

 

Scrapper - leveled up from 1-6 solo with SOs like I usually do for beta testing.

 

Attune makes the set OP - to me. Very obviously so.

Foes crumple. Sometime I don't even worry about hitting them to take them out and move to the next target while the DoT takes the first one out.

 

 

 

 

Edited 9 hours ago by UltraAlt

[Shin Magmus]

   Since no one is going to point it out, there is an actual issue with the Stalker version of the set being quite literally THE ONLY STALKER MELEE SET where AS has a "rider" extra effect.  That's inconsistent with the rest of the game to a level I'd call design failure.  I would highly recommend the first change internally being giving Stalkers back Sandman's Whisper and taking away one of the meme powers like the knockback or Sonic Clap instead: the powers that many players are actually going to skip.  Having all AS powers be normalized in damage (they should also be normalized in animation time) is an important fundamental aspect of Stalker design and balance.  It is very very very weird to me that the balance/design teams think it's okay for one AS to not only have a rider, but for that rider to be -Res.  Seriously, just me huh?

 

   I have other issues with the set but that is the biggest thing that needs changing.  I have a feeling it was brought up in Closed Beta but ignored.

[BrandX]

1 hour ago, Shin Magmus said:

   Since no one is going to point it out, there is an actual issue with the Stalker version of the set being quite literally THE ONLY STALKER MELEE SET where AS has a "rider" extra effect.  That's inconsistent with the rest of the game to a level I'd call design failure.  I would highly recommend the first change internally being giving Stalkers back Sandman's Whisper and taking away one of the meme powers like the knockback or Sonic Clap instead: the powers that many players are actually going to skip.  Having all AS powers be normalized in damage (they should also be normalized in animation time) is an important fundamental aspect of Stalker design and balance.  It is very very very weird to me that the balance/design teams think it's okay for one AS to not only have a rider, but for that rider to be -Res.  Seriously, just me huh?

 

   I have other issues with the set but that is the biggest thing that needs changing.  I have a feeling it was brought up in Closed Beta but ignored.

 

Not going to say you're wrong, and I'm not even sure if the -Resist on it would be that powerful, but wouldn't...

 

Assassin's Psi Blade's +Insight

Assassin's Frenzy's +Blood Frenzy

Assassin's Staff's Stack of Perfection of Body

Assassin's Strike's 2 combo levels

 

...count as riders?

[Shin Magmus]

34 minutes ago, BrandX said:

 

Not going to say you're wrong, and I'm not even sure if the -Resist on it would be that powerful, but wouldn't...

 

Assassin's Psi Blade's +Insight

Assassin's Frenzy's +Blood Frenzy

Assassin's Staff's Stack of Perfection of Body

Assassin's Strike's 2 combo levels

 

...count as riders?

   No.  Assassin's Strike has to generate self-stack mechanics integral to the powerset otherwise Stalkers would objectively be at a handicap compared to Scrappers/Brutes/Tankers.  Self-affecting buffs need to happen in AS or Stalkers would be behind all of their contemporaries while using their best attack and main equalizer.  It's completely different from baking -Res into AS.  This is exactly like if Titan Weapons Stalkers existed, lost Rend Armor, but got the -Def and -Res added to AS instead.  That would be insane.

[Psi-bolt]

I started my testing on a Brute.  Going to go Regen with all ATs for consistency.   Will edit and supplement.

 

My first and biggest piece of feedback is that Attune needs to change.  I get the idea behind it.  When I read the descriptions, I wanted to play the set in the early game to see how it performs and it's very effective, but feels incredibly off.  First it is incredibly clunky.  It seems you want us to initiate with Attune, then the T1/T2 to juice the DoT damage.  That's great on bosses, but you're switching targets a lot in the early game.    I will say that I really liked in when doing the early King's Row arcs with the Elite Bosses.  Fury plus Attune just melted them.  Later game it falls off.   But there's still the need to move it around constantly.

 

As for the rest of the set, I'll have more to say, but I like that Clap is worth taking, that's a really good cone.   The AoE is great.    I think this has the potential to be a really popular set, but the feel of Attune is holding it back IMO.  

[Shin Magmus]

14 minutes ago, Psi-bolt said:

As for the rest of the set, I'll have more to say, but I like that Clap is worth taking, that's a really good cone.   The AoE is great.    I think this has the potential to be a really popular set, but the feel of Attune is holding it back IMO.  

   Did anybody ask for a melee set with a single-target toggle that you have to put on the enemy repeatedly?  Anyone?  Does anyone like this idea?  Put me down as a hard "No" for Attune as it currently works: not fun.

[Championess]

3 hours ago, BrandX said:

 

Not going to say you're wrong, and I'm not even sure if the -Resist on it would be that powerful, but wouldn't...

 

Assassin's Psi Blade's +Insight

Assassin's Frenzy's +Blood Frenzy

Assassin's Staff's Stack of Perfection of Body

Assassin's Strike's 2 combo levels

 

...count as riders?

 

Not to mention that Kinetic Melee's AS is by far the best AS of them all.  The long form animation is 1s faster cast than the rest and the short cast is faster than the others still.  KM's one saving grace is on stalkers and how much better its AS is compared to the others and how well it flows animation-wise. 

 

I'd like them to adjust KM to get better but I'd never want them to ruin its AS to hold it to some abject uniform universal standard.

[jojogladco]

9 minutes ago, Psi-bolt said:

I started my testing on a Brute.  Going to go Regen with all ATs for consistency.   Will edit and supplement.

 

My first and biggest piece of feedback is that Attune needs to change.  I get the idea behind it.  When I read the descriptions, I wanted to play the set in the early game to see how it performs and it's very effective, but feels incredibly off.  First it is incredibly clunky.  It seems you want us to initiate with Attune, then the T1/T2 to juice the DoT damage.  That's great on bosses, but you're switching targets a lot in the early game.    I will say that I really liked in when doing the early King's Row arcs with the Elite Bosses.  Fury plus Attune just melted them.  Later game it falls off.   But there's still the need to move it around constantly.

 

As for the rest of the set, I'll have more to say, but I like that Clap is worth taking, that's a really good cone.   The AoE is great.    I think this has the potential to be a really popular set, but the feel of Attune is holding it back IMO.  

No need to lead with the Attune. You can start with the T1 and T2 on a target, then Attune and Attune will still be boosted.  
 

[JayboH]

I mentioned the annoyance of using Attune in earlier versions of the beta - it's just the implementation, as you have to reapply it over and over.  If it was just an always-on endurance-eating toggle that affected the powers that it is supposed to affect to whoever your current target is, that would be better in my opinion.  

[jojogladco]

It appears right now that Fiery Embrace isn't impacting Attune, not sure if that's intended or not. This was on a Brute for reference. Build Up and Fury boost Attune so I'd expect FE to also. 

[JKwervo]

Here's my thing. My only thing:

 

As a player, why in the HECK do I want to manage toggles as a MELEE set? 

 

As a Melee character, im not looking to do the same damn things as a debuffing defender/controller, etc does. I go in, smack, taunt, smack some more smack harder, and smack even more hard. 

 

This set is just mind boggling. It is NOT good. The system, the mechanic, to me, is just NOT WORTH the time and effort because why? It's not fun. 

[Kaika]

7 hours ago, Shin Magmus said:

   Since no one is going to point it out, there is an actual issue with the Stalker version of the set being quite literally THE ONLY STALKER MELEE SET where AS has a "rider" extra effect.  That's inconsistent with the rest of the game to a level I'd call design failure.  I would highly recommend the first change internally being giving Stalkers back Sandman's Whisper and taking away one of the meme powers like the knockback or Sonic Clap instead: the powers that many players are actually going to skip.  Having all AS powers be normalized in damage (they should also be normalized in animation time) is an important fundamental aspect of Stalker design and balance.  It is very very very weird to me that the balance/design teams think it's okay for one AS to not only have a rider, but for that rider to be -Res.  Seriously, just me huh?

 

   I have other issues with the set but that is the biggest thing that needs changing.  I have a feeling it was brought up in Closed Beta but ignored.

Assassin strikes are very inconsistent across different powerset, Ice fire and BS all have longer animation times in both quick and long forms, KM has a insanely quick AS, and as other have stated  AS often interacts with the set's gimmick. Having them all be the same is not, and never has been, a fundamental aspect of stalker design, not all sets are built the same as the assasin strikes reflect this. In this case it's inheriting sandman's whisper's powerful secondary effect, which otherwise has no really good place to go. -Res is not only one of the most powerful de-buffs in the game but is  one of* the signature secondary effects of sonic powers. AS is also a decent place for it, as it's usually your opener, and does not benefit from the -res on the initial strike. Given the recharge lines up with the same duration of the -res this seems like a very good place for it, as stalker would be far weaker then scrapper without it. 

 

Also not sure why you think sonic clap is skippable because this is one of the best melee cones in the game by far, massive 180 degree arc with a 15 foot range, this thing is huge, decent CC, with low cooldown and decent damage, have you tried it yet?

And yes, if stalker were to get TW, thats exactly what I would expect, it would likely build momentum from hide as well, but thats for the devs to decide if they do ever give stalkers TW (please).

 

Edit*: clarified the secondary effect statement

Edited 57 minutes ago by Kaika

[JayboH]

18 minutes ago, Kaika said:

 is the signature secondary effect of sonic powers.

 

Some of them.  Others have the migraine effect like Sonic Assault.

[Kaika]

9 minutes ago, JayboH said:

Some of them.  Others have the migraine effect like Sonic Assault.

Sonic assault also has -res in the ranged attacks and Disruptive aura which is a -res toggle, it still has alot of it

[JayboH]

3 minutes ago, Kaika said:

Sonic assault also has -res in the ranged attacks and Disruptive aura which is a -res toggle, it still has alot of it

Yes, so I was correct when I said some of them.