Sets: Fractions are your Friend

[cohRock]

A lot of players probably don't realize the math involved in figuring out how strong attributes from set enhancements compared to invention origin enhancements (IOs). It took me a while to fully figure it out, but I knew from the start, a set element enhancement two attributes offered less of each than an IO with just one attribute.  But how much less?  2/x, where x is the 2, 3, 4, or 5, or one higher than the number of attributes being raised.  In other words:

 

1 attribute: 2/2 of an IO, or exactly the same amount of buff as an equal level IO

2 attributes: 2/3 of an IO for each.  So if a level 50 IO offers a 42% buff to accuracy, a level 50 set enhancement with acc and dmg offers 2/3 of that to each, ie, 28%.

3 attributes: 2/4 of an IO for each.

4 attributes: 2/5 of an IO for each.

 

Now here is where friendly fractions make their mark.  Let's assume you have 2 slots in Build-Up, and slotted with IOs for recharge and toHit.  With level 50s, that would buff recharge by 42.4% and toHit by 25.6%.  Let's replace that with two elements of the Adjusted targeting set:

1) recharge/tiHit, (a 2/3), offering 28.1% recharge and 17.1% toHit

2)recharge/toHit/end, (a 2/4), offering 21.2% recharge, 12.8% toHit, and 21.2% end

3) total: 49.3% recharge, 29.9% toHit, and 21.2% end, as well as the 2% global damage set bonus.

 

I.e., even though the two set elements might have looked weaker than the two IOs, they were actually stronger in every way, including two extra ways above what  you had with pure IOs.

[Glacier Peak]

What about Special origin enhancements? Hami and all that. 

[Luminara]

37 minutes ago, Glacier Peak said:

What about Special origin enhancements? Hami and all that. 

 

They definitely aren't your friend.  They're plotting to kill you right now, in fact.  @Snarky will be along to offer his protection services at any moment, I suspect.

[Glacier Peak]

13 minutes ago, Luminara said:

They definitely aren't your friend.  They're plotting to kill you right now, in fact.  @Snarky will be along to offer his protection services at any moment, I suspect.

I'll gladly pay! 

[Scarlet Shocker]

18 minutes ago, Glacier Peak said:

I'll gladly pay! 

 

You can't afford whatever @Snarky asks for. You think it'll just be inf... but it's sooooooooooo much more! 

[Vanden]

2 hours ago, cohRock said:

1 attribute: 2/2 of an IO, or exactly the same amount of buff as an equal level IO

2 attributes: 2/3 of an IO for each.  So if a level 50 IO offers a 42% buff to accuracy, a level 50 set enhancement with acc and dmg offers 2/3 of that to each, ie, 28%.

3 attributes: 2/4 of an IO for each.

4 attributes: 2/5 of an IO for each.

 

These numbers are wrong. The formula for enhancement values in multi-aspect IOs, where x is the number of aspects, is (0.75 + 0.25 * x)/x. With this formula, we get:

1 aspect: 1/1, or 100% strength 

2 aspects: 1.25/2, or 62.5% strength

3 aspects: 1.5/3, or 50% strength

4 aspects: 1.75/4, or 43.75% strength

 

Edited Saturday at 09:38 PM by Vanden

[Glacier Peak]

If only there was a useful tool that a player could use when identifying Invention Sets and their bonuses!

[MonteCarla]

Yeah. This is the basis of "frankenslotting".

e.g. Power Sink: to maximise End Mod and Recharge would take 6 SO's, but can be done with 4 End Mod/Rech IOs 

 

[Snarky]

39 minutes ago, MonteCarla said:

Yeah. This is the basis of "frankenslotting".

e.g. Power Sink: to maximise End Mod and Recharge would take 6 SO's, but can be done with 4 End Mod/Rech IOs 

 

or 3 Hami End Mod/Rech

[cohRock]

3 hours ago, Glacier Peak said:

What about Special origin enhancements? Hami and all that. 

The two attributes of a Hami are both equivalent to an even level single-origin enhancement, or 33% or 20% (depending on the attribute).  Since IOs at level 30 and above are stronger than an even level SO, the main advantage of HOs, IMO, is that you do a lot with a few slots.  Two-slotted your Boxing?  Throw in an acc/dmg HO and a damage IO, and your two slots are doing the full work of three.  You've been two-slotting Teleport Target with acc and recharge IOs?  Replace the acc IO with an acc/range HO, making the base range you can teleport foes 1200 feet instead of 1000.

Edited Saturday at 10:51 PM by cohRock

[cohRock]

1 hour ago, Vanden said:

These numbers are wrong. The formula for enhancement values in multi-aspect IOs, where x is the number of aspects, is (0.75 + 0.25 * x)/x. With this formula, we get: ...

Thanks for the tweaks and exactitude.  The numbers are so close, I'll remember it my way, though, now knowing it is actually slightly better than that.

[Ukase]

20 hours ago, Luminara said:

 

They definitely aren't your friend.  They're plotting to kill you right now, in fact.  @Snarky will be along to offer his protection services at any moment, I suspect.

On retail I was always dubious of Hami-Os. It just didn't make sense to me. The idea that you would arm yourself with some element of the very thing that would try to kill you seemed suspicious. 

It wasn't until much later the idea of using a dragon's scales to protect you against the dragon's fire breath made perfect sense. So, not sure I can subscribe to this line of thought any more about HOs plotting to kill us. As for Snarky's protection offer, I'm pretty sure you're 100% right about that. 

[Luminara]

1 hour ago, Ukase said:

So, not sure I can subscribe to this line of thought any more about HOs plotting to kill us.

 

Man, you go to bed with a HO, you wake up with an empty wallet and missing a kidney... if you wake up at all.

[BasiliskXVIII]

2 hours ago, Ukase said:

On retail I was always dubious of Hami-Os. It just didn't make sense to me. The idea that you would arm yourself with some element of the very thing that would try to kill you seemed suspicious. 

It wasn't until much later the idea of using a dragon's scales to protect you against the dragon's fire breath made perfect sense. So, not sure I can subscribe to this line of thought any more about HOs plotting to kill us. As for Snarky's protection offer, I'm pretty sure you're 100% right about that. 

Mithridatism is the practice of consuming small quantities of a poison to attempt to develop an immunity to it. In some cases it works...

 

... don't try it with lead, though.

[Scarlet Shocker]

It'll soon be Xmas so we can HO, HO, HO to our heart's content! 

[FierceFluff]

Here's how I look at it; 

 

IOs (level 50 schedule A)

Single stat: 42.4% total enhancement value

Double stats: 53% total enhancement value (26.5% x2)

Triple stats: 63.6% total enhancement value (21.2% x3)

Quad stats: 74.2% total enhancement value (18.55% x4)

 

HOs (level 50 schedule A)

Double stats: 66.6% total enhancement value (33.3% x2)

 

Purple IOS (level 50 schedule A)

Single stat: 53% 

Double stats: 66.26% (33.13% x2)

Triple stats: 79.5% (26.5% x3)

 

This is why each tier is valued the way it is.  The complex wrench in this system is that HOs can only be +3 while IOs can be +5.

 

IOs (level 50+5 schedule A)

Single stat 53%

(didn't calculate the rest of this table because I nearly always catalyze non-purple IO sets, assume the pattern follows the purple IO +0 table)

  

HOs (level 53 schedule A)

Double stats: 76.6% total enhancement value (38.3% x2)

 

Purple IOS (level 50+5 schedule A)

Single stat: 66.2% 

Double stats: 82.8%

Triple stats: 99.3%

 

 

 

[Doomguide2005]

They are also advantages to multi-aspect IO in how the get treated by exemplar scaling.

[Scarlet Shocker]

I think it's worth pointing out that the title of this thread is only partially correct.