/regen

[Slithershot]

So seeing as regen is apparently the most popular set in town.... can we get some buffs? Please? 😞

 

Like... can we make instant healing a toggle and double the healing? Something? Anything? Please I'm dying here.... (Literally)

 

Is there anything in the works by the current devs to make regen not completely worthless in almost every situation?

[Frostweaver]

We still have Hamidon...

[Werner]

Regeneration is fine.

[Frostweaver]

Okay, to add flavor, Once you IO the crap out of it and add in incarnates, it actually performs pretty well. especially backing something like TW. get it to soft cap defenses and decent s/l resistance, and...well.... at least you won't brownout constantly.

And you have a Rez! That's all that matters, right? Not that the rez has any secondary effects you can slot besides heal/end.

It's great for collecting debt badges?

Umm... it doesn't suck as bad as stone when fighting +0/+1's?

It has better end and resistance than /sr?

Moment of glory really does kick butt, though. for 15 seconds.

Come on, I am trying to throw you a bone here.

Just for you, I trowed together a quickie katana/regen to see if I could actually make it work, and managed to get up to 62% s/l resist, 50% vs everything else but nrg/dnrg/psi, soft capped melee, and midrange (30%) typed defense. umm... 18 seconds to heal to full, and just about doubled hit points. Reasonably fast attack chain, and the best part is, you only have a little over a minute of downtime in between MOG's! (Not to mention that you will almost always have a nice, convenient quick-recharging revive if you die at the 30 second mark) Perma-dull pain, not quite perma-hasten, instant heal up about half the time, and did I forget to mention Revive? Oh, and 70 HP/sec-177 HP/sec heal is actually a lot of damage.
It's not the prettiest girl at the Ball, but she should still turn a few heads. (no, it's not close to optimised)... I absolutely agree that Regen needs a little help, but it's not impossible by any means. I am certain you could survive and thrive in a farm with it even un-optimised as it is. You will be clicking a lot of buttons, though.

Throw a few incarnates at it, and you will make a decent enough brute. Not top-notch, but not unplayable.

Villain Plan by Mids' Reborn : Hero Designer 2.6.0.3
https://github.com/ImaginaryDevelopment/imaginary-hero-designer

Click this DataLink to open the build!

Level 50 Magic Brute
Primary Power Set: Katana
Secondary Power Set: Regeneration
Power Pool: Fighting
Power Pool: Leaping
Power Pool: Leadership
Power Pool: Speed

Villain Profile:
Level 1: Sting of the Wasp -- SprBrtFur-Acc/Dmg:50(A), SprBrtFur-Acc/Dmg/Rchg:50(11), SprBrtFur-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg:50(11), SprBrtFur-Rech/Fury:50(13), SprBrtFur-Dmg/Rchg:50(39), SprBrtFur-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg:50(39)
Level 1: Fast Healing -- Prv-Absorb%:50(A), Prv-Heal/Rchg/EndRdx:50(3), Prv-Heal/Rchg:50(3), Prv-EndRdx/Rchg:50(5), Prv-Heal/EndRdx:50(5), Prv-Heal:50(7)
Level 2: Reconstruction -- UnbGrd-Max HP%:50(A), UnbGrd-ResDam:50(7), UnbGrd-ResDam/EndRdx:50(9), UnbGrd-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg:50(9)
Level 4: Quick Recovery -- EndMod-I:50(A)
Level 6: Boxing -- Empty(A)
Level 8: Flashing Steel -- Arm-Dmg/Rchg:50(A), Arm-Acc/Dmg/Rchg:50(21), Arm-Acc/Rchg:50(23), Arm-Dam%:50(43), Arm-Dmg/EndRdx:50(45)
Level 10: Dull Pain -- NmnCnv-Regen/Rcvry+:50(A), NmnCnv-Heal:50(13), NmnCnv-Heal/EndRdx/Rchg:50(15), NmnCnv-Heal/Rchg:50(15), NmnCnv-EndRdx/Rchg:50(17), NmnCnv-Heal/EndRdx:50(17)
Level 12: Divine Avalanche -- Hct-Dam%:50(A), Hct-Dmg/EndRdx:50(42), Hct-Acc/Rchg:50(42), Hct-Acc/Dmg/Rchg:50(43), Hct-Dmg/Rchg:50(43)
Level 14: Tough -- GldArm-3defTpProc:50(A), GldArm-ResDam:50(34), GldArm-End/Res:50(37)
Level 16: Integration -- DctWnd-Rchg:50(A), DctWnd-Heal:50(19), DctWnd-Heal/EndRdx/Rchg:50(19), DctWnd-EndRdx/Rchg:50(21), DctWnd-Heal/EndRdx:50(23)
Level 18: Weave -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+:50(A), LucoftheG-Def:50(33), LucoftheG-Def/EndRdx/Rchg:50(33), LucoftheG-EndRdx/Rchg:50(33), LucoftheG-Def/Rchg:50(34)
Level 20: Resilience -- Ags-Psi/Status:50(A), Ags-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg:50(25), Ags-EndRdx/Rchg:50(25), Ags-ResDam/Rchg:50(27), Ags-ResDam/EndRdx:50(27)
Level 22: The Lotus Drops -- SprAvl-Rchg/KDProc:50(A), SprAvl-Acc/Dmg:50(34), SprAvl-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg:50(40), SprAvl-Acc/Dmg/Rchg:50(46), SprAvl-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx:50(46), SprAvl-Dmg/EndRdx:50(48)
Level 24: Combat Jumping -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+:50(A)
Level 26: Soaring Dragon -- SprUnrFur-Acc/Dmg:50(A), SprUnrFur-Dmg/Rchg:50(46), SprUnrFur-Acc/Dmg/Rchg:50(48), SprUnrFur-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg:50(50), SprUnrFur-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg:50(50), SprUnrFur-Rchg/+Regen/+End:50(50)
Level 28: Instant Healing -- HrmHln-EndRdx:40(A), HrmHln-Heal:40(29), HrmHln-Heal/EndRdx/Rchg:40(29), HrmHln-Heal/Rchg:40(31), HrmHln-EndRdx/Rchg:40(31), HrmHln-Heal/EndRdx:40(31)
Level 30: Maneuvers -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+:50(A)
Level 32: Golden Dragonfly -- Arm-Dmg:50(A), FrcFdb-Rechg%:50(39), ScrDrv-Acc/Rchg:50(45)
Level 35: Revive -- DctWnd-Rchg:40(A), DctWnd-Heal/EndRdx/Rchg:50(36), DctWnd-Heal/Rchg:50(36), DctWnd-EndRdx/Rchg:50(36), DctWnd-Heal/EndRdx:50(37), DctWnd-Heal:50(37)
Level 38: Moment of Glory -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+:50(A), Rct-ResDam%:50(40), ShlWal-ResDam/Re TP:50(40), RechRdx-I:50(42), RechRdx-I:50(48)
Level 41: Hasten -- RechRdx-I:50(A), RechRdx-I:50(45)
Level 44: Super Jump -- Jump-I:50(A)
Level 47: Build Up -- RechRdx-I:50(A)
Level 49: Assault -- EndRdx-I:50(A)
Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Dash -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Slide -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Quick -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Rush -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Surge -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Fury
Level 1: Sprint -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A)
Level 4: Ninja Run
Level 2: Swift -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Health -- RgnTss-Regen+:30(A)
Level 2: Hurdle -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Stamina -- EndMod-I:50(A)
------------

 

I am trying to make you feel better.

 

[Frostweaver]

My only real problem with Regen is how many darned clickies it has. I think IH should be a toggle (and much lower) just so you have less frantic button pushing, and maybe give regen's version of dull pain some low-end resistance (5%?) in order to make it less of a stretch to god-mode.

[Haijinx]

The problem with regen is that willpower is just easier.

 

 

 

[Werner]

I took a rough pass at recreating my old namesake Katana/Regen Scrapper as a Brute. I'm sure there's still plenty of room for improvement, but it looks pretty solid to me, as long as you're on point with all the ways you have of preventing and recovering from damage. You could get the resistance higher by swapping out the Achilles' Heels, but I want to be able to do at least a little damage.

 

Attack Chain: DA GC GD GC DA GC SD GC

 

Perma Hasten and Dull Pain. 3135 hit points. Decent resists. Subtract 30% from all the defenses to get his baseline - the game is including the buff from Vorpal Radial Final Judgment. It only lasts for 10 seconds, but it's one of your very many tools. I haven't tried it, or thought about it much, but it seems to me that Regeneration is in a particularly good spot to benefit from the incarnate powers that provide only temporary boosts. - in this case Barrier, Vorpal, and Melee. Regeneration is packed full of temporary boosts. The more you have, the less temporary it all feels. There should always be something there ready to go. You just have to be on your game clicking on it. I'm starting to remember what it was like better. It felt like Regeneration never let me down. Only my skill as a player let me down. I didn't die for lack of tools. I died for lack of using them optimally. 

 

Yes, this is a top dollar end game build. Yes, it benefits from the defense from Divine Avalanche (or Parry, or Defensive Sweep, or active mitigation, or whatever). Yes, Regeneration might feel a little squishy leveling when you're short on tools, short on defense, short on resistance, short on everything. But it's hardly the only set that feels less solid leveling than with a full end game build. That's what you're working towards, after all. 

 

I really think the main issue is how much attention Regen requires, how unforgiving it can be, and how much time all that clicking can take, reducing your damage output.

 

Spoiler

Hero Plan by Mids' Reborn : Hero Designer 2.6.0.1
https://github.com/ImaginaryDevelopment/imaginary-hero-designer

Click this DataLink to open the build!

Werner: Level 50 Magic Brute
Primary Power Set: Katana
Secondary Power Set: Regeneration
Power Pool: Leaping
Power Pool: Speed
Power Pool: Fighting
Power Pool: Leadership
Ancillary Pool: Energy Mastery

Hero Profile:
Level 1: Gambler's Cut -- SprBrtFur-Acc/Dmg(A), SprBrtFur-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(3), SprBrtFur-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(3), SprBrtFur-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(5), SprBrtFur-Rech/Fury(5), AchHee-ResDeb%(7)
Level 1: Fast Healing -- NmnCnv-Heal/EndRdx(A), NmnCnv-EndRdx/Rchg(7), NmnCnv-Heal/Rchg(9), NmnCnv-Heal/EndRdx/Rchg(9), NmnCnv-Heal(11), NmnCnv-Regen/Rcvry+(11)
Level 2: Reconstruction -- StdPrt-ResDam/Def+(A), Prv-Heal/Rchg(13), Prv-Heal(13)
Level 4: Quick Recovery -- EndMod-I(A)
Level 6: Combat Jumping -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A), Ksm-ToHit+(15), Rct-Def(15), Rct-ResDam%(17)
Level 8: Divine Avalanche -- SprBlsCol-Dmg/EndRdx/Acc/Rchg(A), SprBlsCol-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(17), SprBlsCol-Acc/Dmg(19), SprBlsCol-Dmg/EndRdx(19), LucoftheG-Def(21), LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(21)
Level 10: Dull Pain -- Pnc-Heal/EndRedux(A), Pnc-EndRdx/Rchg(23), Pnc-Heal/Rchg(23), Pnc-Heal/EndRedux/Rchg(25), Pnc-Heal(25)
Level 12: Hasten -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(27)
Level 14: Boxing -- Empty(A)
Level 16: Integration -- Prv-Heal(A), Prv-Heal/EndRdx(27), Prv-EndRdx/Rchg(29), Prv-Heal/Rchg(29), Prv-Heal/Rchg/EndRdx(31), Prv-Absorb%(31)
Level 18: The Lotus Drops -- SprAvl-Acc/Dmg(A), SprAvl-Dmg/EndRdx(31), SprAvl-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(33), SprAvl-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(33), SprAvl-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(33), SprAvl-Rchg/KDProc(34)
Level 20: Resilience -- GldArm-ResDam(A), GldArm-Res/Rech/End(34), GldArm-End/Res(34), GldArm-RechEnd(36), GldArm-RechRes(36), GldArm-3defTpProc(36)
Level 22: Tough -- UnbGrd-ResDam(A), UnbGrd-ResDam/EndRdx(37), UnbGrd-EndRdx/Rchg(37), UnbGrd-Rchg/ResDam(37), UnbGrd-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(39), UnbGrd-Max HP%(50)
Level 24: Weave -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A), ShlWal-Def(39), ShlWal-Def/EndRdx(39), ShlWal-Def/Rchg(40), ShlWal-ResDam/Re TP(40)
Level 26: Soaring Dragon -- SprUnrFur-Acc/Dmg(A), SprUnrFur-Dmg/Rchg(40), SprUnrFur-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(42), SprUnrFur-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(42), SprUnrFur-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(42), SprUnrFur-Rchg/+Regen/+End(43)
Level 28: Instant Healing -- Pnc-Heal(A), Pnc-Heal/EndRedux(43), Pnc-Heal/Rchg(43), Pnc-Heal/EndRedux/Rchg(45), Pnc-EndRdx/Rchg(45)
Level 30: Maneuvers -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A), ShlWal-Def(45), ShlWal-Def/EndRdx(46), ShlWal-Def/Rchg(46), ShlWal-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(46)
Level 32: Golden Dragonfly -- Arm-Dmg/Rchg(A), Arm-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(48), Arm-Acc/Rchg(48), Arm-Dmg/EndRdx(48), Arm-Dam%(50), AchHee-ResDeb%(50)
Level 35: Tactics -- HO:Cyto(A)
Level 38: Moment of Glory -- RechRdx-I(A)
Level 41: Vengeance -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A)
Level 44: Superior Conditioning -- PrfShf-End%(A)
Level 47: Physical Perfection -- Pnc-Heal/+End(A)
Level 49: Focused Accuracy -- EndRdx-I(A)
Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Dash -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Slide -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Quick -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Rush -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Surge -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Fury 
Level 1: Sprint -- Clr-Stlth(A)
Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A)
Level 4: Ninja Run 
Level 2: Swift -- Run-I(A)
Level 2: Health -- Mrc-Rcvry+(A)
Level 2: Hurdle -- Jump-I(A)
Level 2: Stamina -- PrfShf-End%(A)
Level 0: Freedom Phalanx Reserve 
Level 0: Portal Jockey 
Level 0: Task Force Commander 
Level 0: The Atlas Medallion 
Level 50: Spiritual Core Paragon 
Level 50: Melee Core Embodiment 
Level 50: Vorpal Radial Final Judgement 
Level 50: Degenerative Core Flawless Interface 
Level 50: Barrier Core Epiphany 
------------

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[Seigmoraig]

If you like having buttons to press, I don't even understand why people play /regen over /Bio.  Bio Armor does everything Regen does but better. Just turn on the minimum FX to get rid of the lobster legs and it's great

[Frostweaver]

Bio is fantastic, but it does NOT do everything regen does. Not even close.

[Radiaria]

At this point in the game, especially for brutes, I wouldn't pick regen on a bet. Brutes are a taunty in your face AT that loves to go from mob to mob to mob without much downtime. A secondary like regen just doesn't fit the bill for their playstyle. 

 

Want regen but better? Bio armor and willpower. MUCH sturdy and better for a brute. 

 

In all sincerity, I think what regen needs for a brute is just higher base values, fast healing to be a toggle or a permanent click power, and/or an absorb like on sentinels, that make it so you're so ridiculously durable that even a 1,000 hit is absolutely nothing to you.

 

I'd prefer a taunt aura in it somewhere.

 

Idk, it needs *something* more interesting. I don't understand why this secondary is so popular for anything other than PvP.

[Seigmoraig]

4 hours ago, Frostweaver said:

Bio is fantastic, but it does NOT do everything regen does. Not even close.

Other than the rez which you can get a cookie that does the same thing, what does regen do better then bio ?
Only real difference that I can see would be in the Instant Healing clicky which is reflected somewhat in Defensive Adaptation in Bio. Other than that,, you have the same amounts of clickies to stay alive (Ablative Carapace / DNA Siphon for Bio and Dull Pain / Reconstruction for Regen) and a long cooldown clicky for when it hits the fan in both.

Just curious as to what Regen does more than Bio and why you would want to forego the offensive and efficient adaptations you can toggle in Bio

Edited September 5, 2019 by Seigmoraig

[Frostweaver]

Dull pain, almost doubles the hit points available, actual hp/sec is almost triple what Bio can get with a decent build. That's why Bio has resists and regen doesn't. There's a reason that Regen is the choice to tank Hamidon, because nothing else heals fast enough to ignore those...things that ignore defense and resistance completely.

Don't you DARE try to put me in the position to try and 'defend' regen vs. bio. I personally vastly prefer Bio over regen... but I am not foolish enough to really believe that they are even remotely similar, even if they have some of the same tricks. Heck, stone and inv have some of the same tricks too. Regen absolutely has it's place, but it needs a little help.

There are three basic tiers of internal damage mitigation.... resistance, defense, and heal. and NO ONE, not emp, not anyone, can hold a candle to regen's ability at the third. No one even gets close. The problem with regen is that EVERY OTHER SET makes it pretty easy to stack at least two of those three tiers, which multiply each other. I understand WHY they don't want Regen to have the other two, but disagree with the need.... the greatest healing in the game, a full order above it's closest competitors, simply doesn't have the 'stacking' and secondary tricks that other sets have.... it pays too much for it's abilities...No aura, No secondary boosts, no external mitigation, slows, debuffs, NONE of those things that stack together to make an unkillable machine.... The only thing it has besides pure hit points is unmatched recovery.... a trick that is no longer particularly special or even that useful with IO sets and free fitness for everyone.

It's sorta like stone armor... It has an amazing trick that no other set can match, but the question is, with IO sets, is that trick really needed anymore? And is it really worth it's downsides anymore?

[ericc191]

Ironically, Instant Healing *was* a toggle until issue 5.

 

As for the set itself, my main was a Spines/Regen Scrap maxed out with a mix of defense and regeneration bonuses. In PvE, just pop a purple before jumping into an alpha strike and you'd be good to go. In PvP, Regen was and still is godly. 

Edited September 5, 2019 by koldkore

[Haijinx]

It could probably be a toggle now and regen would still only be a middle pack secondary.  

 

The big change would be some flexibility in how much recharge a regen needs.

 

And less clickiness

[Leogunner]

I think there are people who made a pretty good argument for giving Regen decent resistances to debuffs.  Give all its click abilities a chunk of resistance to some of the more detrimental debuffs (-def, -regen, -recovery and -rech) and a bit in the passives.  Have it so, with the passives and a couple stacks of Reconstruction, and you're sitting on moderate amount of debuff resist.  Stack Reconstruction with Instant Healing and you're sitting on a high amount of resistance to debuff.  Using Revive or Moment of Glory and you're momentarily practically immune to those debuffs.

 

The justification was pretty much any ill effects that affect you are quickly healed/callused and you just push through.  It still maintains the style of current Regen but fills a niche not already taken with the current sets (high Max HP, healing, regen and strong against debuffs).

[Frostweaver]

Well, I figure there's a reason Regen isn't available for tankers. can you imagine 4000 HP? With Regen buffs? able to heal umm....Well, brutes already heal nearly 200 hp per second enhanced. a Tanker would be like 300 per second.
Giant Monster territory.
Brutes already get a LOT more from regen than scrappers and stalkers... On a tanker it might be a top-tier set.

[Haijinx]

Tankers also get better.numbers from things like tough, weave, combat jumping.

 

And on regen their ATOs would be pretty good.

 

 

[Frostweaver]

no more 5 slotting or 3x3 slotting the Tanker ATO's, that's for sure.
regen would be helped insanely if it had more than 1 auto

[Seigmoraig]

Ok, well since /regen is only better for.... one encounter ? I will stand by my statement and say that regen is lacking and bio does 99% of things better

[Shadowsleuth]

I wouldn't mind if Brute Regen got some of the gooodies that Sentinel Regen got, Toggle absorb, Revive becoming a dual purpose power that can be used alive or dead (heal plus max health or rez).

[Yomo Kimyata]

If they made Regen more powerful, then what would we have to complain about in the forums!?!?

 

I have a staff/Regen brute at 40 who mostly solos at +3/x5.  Could he be at +4/x8 if he had a different secondary?  Sure.  But would I have more fun with it?  Probably not.  The best part was figuring out when I probably needed to “pre heal” before locking into a long animation.

[ShardWarrior]

After leveling a /Regen, a /Bio and a /Willpower toon to 50, have to say I agree /Regen is the worst of the lot.  IH should be put back as a toggle IMO.

[ericc191]

And your quick opinion between Bio and WP?

[Leogunner]

53 minutes ago, Yomo Kimyata said:

If they made Regen more powerful, then what would we have to complain about in the forums!?!?

 

I have a staff/Regen brute at 40 who mostly solos at +3/x5.  Could he be at +4/x8 if he had a different secondary?  Sure.  But would I have more fun with it?  Probably not.  The best part was figuring out when I probably needed to “pre heal” before locking into a long animation.

You're not wrong!

 

But from the perspective of Stalker /Regen, it's a pain in the cape set.  If any changes were made to the set, I'd hope it be in the vein to improve the usability for Stalkers and Scrappers while keeping it in line with Brute and possible proliferation to Tankers.

 

Note: I don't think /regen is bad for stalkers, but it often requires either a.) heavy IO defense/resist bonuses + the fighting pool, b.) a heavy hit&run style or c.) some combination of the two.  And this is solo or on teams.  Other sets like /dark and /wp aren't so strongly boxed into those set-ups.

 

Note 2: I remade my live Elec/regen stalker into Elec/bio and he's more boring 😞  I'm probably going to strip him and reroll lol

[Yomo Kimyata]

1 hour ago, koldkore said:

And your quick opinion between Bio and WP?

WP is great to set and forget.  But if you get in trouble, you don't have very many options.  That said, you don't get in trouble very often.

 

Bio can be extremely active if you choose.

 

Bio is probably a "higher performance" set.