Neiska

Hey Forums, I have a question regarding power pairings. When I'm making a character for end content play, I usually try to pick powers with some sort of HP or END tools built into the set so I am not reliant on Incarnates to make a build work, or even worse, Inspirations. (I hate having to rely on consumables. They should be a bonus, not required to make a build work IMO.) But when I read builds such as Broadsword/Shield, or Street Justice/Invlun, such pairings have no such tools. I am contemplating on making a Shield/Energy Melee tanker, but I am worried about the lack of HP and END tools. So here are my questions - You are going to take "some" damage, its unavoidable. Even with DEF/RES cap, some damage is going to get through. With some sets like Bio, absorb/regen is plenty to take care of this most of the time. Other sets have built in Heals. So how do other armor sets deal with juggling HP and END drain unless you are relying on Melee Hybrid for the RES/Regen boost, Ageless or Rebirth Destiny, or popping green and blue candy. So how do you manage this? I rarely see Tankers take something like, Medicine Pool, even on sets with zero built in self healing. Even fewer have built in END tools to speak of. I do have a Dark Armor brute who takes very little damage, and what she does take she heals back herself. Rarely does she have to use her Heal, but it's still there if she needs it. But I doubt all sets are capable of this, healing damage purely with their natural regeneration. Or am I mistaken? I have zero playtime on a tanker with Shield, Invulnerable, and so on. My tankers have largely been Radiation, Dark Armor, Bio Armor, and Electric. My only experience with Shield is with a Elec/Shield stalker, and she is constantly END starved, and I don't want to be a tanker in a same situation. Thanks bunches in advance. TLDR - How do you manage Hitpoints/Endurance when taking Primary/Secondary powersets without any built in tools?

Looks like things were more expensive, and INF was harder to come by then. Still, was just wondering. I am sure there are many reasons why. Supply, demand, player numbers, ways to get INF, so on.

I didn't play live, it was before my time. But I am curious as to what the prices now are compared to what they were then? Not sure if they had the same tools like AE that we do, or methods of getting INF, so the comparison might not be fair. But still, am curious as to what an average purple might cost, an average AT might cost, and an average winter set might cost. We haven't gotten any new purple sets they didn't have back then, have we?

Personally, I get a warm feeling when I imagine CoH having a smaller, yet more passionate community. Despite our bickering sometimes. It really goes to show just how great CoH is after all this time it still boasts a community of people who return to it as their main game entertainment when given the options available now, as well as after so much time passing. To me CoH is a game that will always stand apart from the rest. Sure, things might have been done better, but it's done a lot of amazing things too. I mean, even in present day we still boast some of the biggest character options in any game anywhere, which was years ahead of its time. So a smaller, but more dedicated fan base. I could be wrong of course, but I like to believe so.

My highlights is going to page 4 and seeing several level 50s I have not touched in a year, log into them only to find things on the auction house, 100 sold things, a tray full of purple enhancements, or piles of money that I had entirely forgotten I had.

My thoughts for what they are worth. 1.) I have seen some people say farming is bad. My honest reply is, why is it bad? Farmers do more than just mindlessly grind away for money/exp, and they have several positives. They spend more money into the economy. Moving wealth is always a good and healthy sign for a community. And for those who use the AE often have several characters that eventually, all require enhancements. I would bet that AE users/Famers make up a sizeable chunk of auction house activity. Without such persons or such a high turnover of new characters, the market would grow stale due to supply out growing demand. "Everything would be cheaper!" you might say, but that also would devalue INF more than it already is. At least currently there are some INF sinks and uses, and demand. Plus, with such demand a new player or At without much in their pockets can get lucky, find a purple, sell it, and be largely set for themselves all the way to 50. Without the AE this might not be possible, or at least, the flow of money might slow to a crawl. Some like myself "Shadow Sponsor" events. Just last week I went to a smaller SG hosting a rp event, so I came in and ordered a Bloody Mary, and donated 1 billion to use as they pleased. Some of us host events as well, such as costume or origin story contests. And a lot of the time unless INF is involved, people wont come. Also keep in mind that people can have multiple accounts, and all that "1 billion CC at Atlas" money has to come from "Somewhere", and considering the frequency of such hosted player events, vs the time required to accumulate such numbers in the "open world", I would bet that the vast majority of money for such events comes from Farming/AE. No one is going to make that much INF doing open world stuff in a month, much less week. So without the AE you might very well see a noticeable drop in such events, or at the very least, their rewards. Many folks like myself like to build characters, and no that isn't always power builds either. I have made builds based on theme, roleplay, or even purely chose ATs and Powersets purely for visual effects sake to use in small RP events, just to add that extra spice to them. I know it's not much, but we use the tools we have. And farming is a great tool for those of us for whatever reason like to try many things. For some of us we have already played through the stories a few times now, and don't want to go through all the time for a build we want to try for whatever reason, only to hit level 38 and go "Op! well, that didn't work!" or "Eh.. I'm just not feeling this, Imma try something else." If we had to go through the monthly effort to level up a character each time in such a diverse game, I suspect many players would suffer Burnout. Personally I would have likely moved on long ago. It is also a tool. You can pick your damage types on different environments. Want to see how well you do vs fire enemies? How about toxic? Psi damage? Against things higher level than you? Want to try and beat up a GM solo? You want to play but don't have a lot of time to do it? Or have to step away often when real life calls? Then AE is a great option. Another thing I would like to highlight is that you never know who is sitting at the seat of another character, and this is true of all games. One friend of mine who shall remain nameless only has one hand and is missing fingers on that one as well. Yet he plays. He may be slow, but I think that's pretty amazing. Using myself as another example, in another game I used to be a high end raider. But I ended up quitting because as time went on it became less and less fun because I am in fact deaf IRL, and more and more fights and tools such as DBM are sound based. In a new fight that you have only read about, with so much going on at a time, its quite easy to miss a flashing word or warning. And I don't hear the loud kaboom or alarm blaring. The results from that were disheartening and depressing to say the least. For those who consider the farmers here "toxic", I can only politely gesture to the Raid Community in other games where people are called out for not gearing to the umpteenth degree or not min/maxing to be .0032% more effective. (And yes, I have had that argument before.) How does this relate to CoH? (Whom I hasten to add, does have a more friendly and welcoming raid scene than other games!) Well, on your random TF groups, its very much go-go-go-go where everyone assumes everyone already knows everything. My friend I mentioned no longer does TFs, because he is too slow to keep up or contribute. By the time he gets there, the fight is over and the "Mission Completed" flashes overhead. This is nobodies fault directly, it's just how it is. But that is why he told me he plays AE things more than open world content. He can fight AVs and GMs there. He can go at his own pace. He controls the game interaction, and can play with whom he wants to. And I think that is okay. Finally, like it or not it's something to do. Sometimes, its just quiet. People are standing around quietly roleplaying, or no one is doing missions/tfs etc. So instead of going around the world, you just load up an AE to play until a friend logs on in an hour. Its a timesink, and its a good one. 2. ) As far as the Farm Channel itself, well, I would like to point out to those who might be unaware, that there are Farmer Discords out there. There is far more activity there than there is in the LFG channel, at least where farms are concerned. There are many folks who run entire farm groups and you ever even see or hear them. And until I just mentioned them, some of you might have never even known they were there. And topics like these are why. Farmers aren't mustache twirling villain's in the dark, nor are they economical masterminds whom seek to dominate the value of your INF. (Its funny but some of the richest folks I know are level 2-5. They are the die hard rpers who and play the markets between their rp, and have never stepped foot in an AE, TF, or Raid.) Now do I think a Farm Channel is required? No, not really. I see all kinds of things in all of the channels. From mistells to embarrassing emotes. While I am not personally bothered by such things and laugh sometimes, I can understand how some might see them as aggravating or irritating. But I think a Farm Channel would further divide the community, which I don't see as a good thing, but I would urge people who feel in such a way to use the tools already provided such as the Ignore tool, if they feel so strongly about it. But for those who are arguing that Farms don't belong in LFG, I would ask why not? Looking for Group is empty of context. It isn't the "Looking for Task Force" channel, or the "Looking for Raid" channel. Its the "Looking for group" channel, which is used for people to run TFs, Raids, Paper Missions, Story Missions, or just run around the open world. But Farming is Grouping. For someone to make that argument about Farming not belonging with the other activities and was singled out by itself, makes me wonder if the heart of their argument is really "Farming isn't legitimate play." For those arguing for the removal of AE, I would like to highlight that AE is keeping a good portion of folks still around, people who do more than only just AE farms. And the AE being removed would do more harm than good. That, and I strongly oppose the entire mentality of "People who don't enjoy the game exactly as I do are wrong." In closing, the proposed Farm Channel itself, well, I would consider it an issue, but a minor one, and hardly worthy of such measures, particularly when tools such as the ignore and closing or moving the LFG tab already exist. This goes doubly so for the size of the staff, which is indeed a volunteer staff, whom I would rather see them work on more things such as bug fixes or additional powersets and content. Just my thoughts about it. Best wishes to everyone out there, wither you Farm/Use the AE or Not. P.S - An afterthought. One thing I would support would be adding a PVP channel. While I am not a PVPer myself, to my limited knowledge those who do enjoy hardcore PVP do not have any such tools or channels to find others of a like mind. And I believe that such a channel might attract others who enjoy a similar gameplay. As well as finding others whom also enjoy that kind of gameplay can be difficult, from what I understand. So a dedicated PVP channel may help with that.

Thank you!

Hello Forums! Lately I have been experimenting with Brutes, and I am interested in making a high damage brute. I am wondering which power pairings would really shine? And I know "high damage" is subjective, as in game difficulty, AT/GM vs ST vs AoE that's not what I mean. I mean with the fury mechanic and Brutes lower base damage, some sets perform better on brutes than they do on Tankers or Scrappers. I know that Spines/Fire is the AoE king, but rad melee/fire or even /bio might perform as well. Either by having 2 damage auras, and I am also uncertain how well Frankenslotting Procs on damage auras are for Brutes, as it works well on tankers. I was thinking perhaps an Energy Melee/Bio Armor Brute, for decent AoE but very strong ST, with both a damage aura and different stances for different situations, with a proc slotted damage aura, if that works with the fury mechanic well. I am just uncertain just what all stacks, with maximum damage cap and fury and whatnot. I mean, if you are at maximum fury, would Build Up, Offensive Stance from Bio, a "build up" proc, musculature alpha, and so on all stack or are there diminishing returns as there are with other effects? And is the "damage cap" for Brutes still +700% as it says on the old wiki or has that changed? Basically, I would like to make a Brute that can rip a battleship apart, and far as sets go I am thinking EM/Bio might be the best performer, but I am open to suggestions! TLDR - asking for clarification on Fury, because I have read and heard conflicting things about it. Thanks bunches in advance, and happy friday!

I've seen similar done with Spring Attack from Jumping pool, with Cross Punch combo, and a few other things. I can't claim the expertise to know if these would be any better than the personal MM attacks, but still, neat concept.

Thank you! At work right now but will give it a browse when I get home.

Still pretty awesome, now I am wondering if that is why they named the game that too. But I did want to ask if you had a Radiation Melee/Dark Armor Brute build. I am working on one as a current project, and I didn't see one in any of your posts, but I could have missed it. Thanks bunches!

Just found this thread, must say all this is impressive @JJDrakken ! Also out of curiosity, is your name in any way related to that old SNES game, Drakken? Loved that game.

I would like to take a moment and just say life is rather short, too short to sweat the small things. Particularly when they are a small inconvenience or irritant. Not everyone will agree on what is just an inconvenience or irritant, or what is genuinely a problem. People are free to host teams as they see fit, no rules against that. That said, I see tells as a tool, one that most people are used to. And the "no tells please" does fall a bit out of the normal. I hasten to add that's not good, and its not bad, its just different. And there's nothing wrong with doing things differently. At the end of the day we all want to log in and have fun in our own way. Some people team, some people solo. Some people run story missions, some people badge hunt. Some people go GM and AV hunting, and some like to spend hours base building or playing the auction markets. Others spend hours in the costume editor. Some just hang out and roleplay. And all of this is fine too. I just think that some things simply aren't worth getting bent out of shape for. It takes more than words from a random stranger on the internet to spoil my day, but that's just me. Others may not see it that way. And that's fine as well. But we all have to meet in the middle somewhere in order to play together. And I think there is a good compromise to be had in any sort of activity, so long as someone isn't "my way or the highway/you are wrong." Even when having disagreements, I try to take a cool head by remembering there are people here that know more than I do, and that we have different priorities. And there is nothing wrong with saying "I just like it better this way" either. I also have to give a hat tip to @Snarky who is still a "stinky fartfaced doodoo head" because I admire his outlook. I wouldn't call it carefree, or antagonistic. More of a "Meh. That's not worth getting bent out of shape for." Which I would call easygoing. I do want to add that in the end, they are words made of pixels from a complete and totally random stranger on the internet, whom is very likely to have zero influence and control in your life outside of the game, whose words can only bother you if either you let them, or you care about their opinion. As far as the OP's thing, well, they are free to lead as they like. So long as they understand that the no tells thing might catch some by surprise, and in this day and age of the internet some people are bound to go "what the heck" and could be rude about it. Best wishes to everyone. Even you Snarky. 😋

Not sure how active this thread still is, but I would also like feedback on my version of Dark Melee/Shield Scrapper. The highlights - 1. 45% to Melee and Ranged, and 42% to AoE. 2. I took leap attack for another AoE tool to help with Dark Melees mostly ST attacks. Plus it should be fun to use it after a shield charge. 3. I took Sorcery for Rune of Protection, the thinking is that I can juggle RoP, with Melee Hybrid and One with Shield for a nice boost to Resistances. While not tanker level of resists, I hope this would make for quite a tough Scrapper, especially being Def capped. 4. Soul Drain is right at a 30 second recharge, making it perma. Siphon Life is also on a very short cooldown, which hopefully will provide ample healing when needed. 5. Between Rune of Protection and Activate Defenses, there is plenty of built in Status Protection as well which is very nice. The Cons - 1. The thing that worries me is Endurance. I don't have any base tools for it, so I may have to take Ageless later on which I usually like to save as last resort, but I am open to suggestions there. The only incarnates I have planned so far is Agility for my Alpha and Melee for my Hybrid. 2. I also don't have much experience with scrappers. As far as offence goes I am unsure how this will stack up next to other scrappers DPS wise. I think it will have good ST damage, with a few decent AoEs from Charge and Leap Attack. I toyed with the idea of taking Adrenal Booster from Experiment, for an additional DPS buff, but opted for Rune instead, because when I did it didn't seem to boost the damage numbers for some reason, even though I don't believe I was at the damage cap. Anyway, here's my attempt at a Dark Melee Scrapper. I usually play Masterminds and Tanks, so any imput would be appreciated. It would be nice to have a DPS character for a change. Thanks bunches in advance! Baroness.mxd

I use it in 3 different ways - 1. On my Robots MM, i can stand in my own fire and pull enemies to where I want them to be, in my stacked t3 pets fire patches and my bonfires. This works on the ground, but also works VERY well with group fly, because you can hover right where you want them to be, use fold space, and they appear mid air next to you, and they "drop" right below you. 2. On my Tanker, it helps group things up when I use a PBAOE, which could be many things - either straight damage, or even on something like /shield or /bio for maximum targets affected, and so bigger buffs. It also helps with "corner pulling" or LOS pulls if that's a concern. You can also pull things up to your level if you are above them, or below if you are under them. 3. I also use them to pull runners back, or to pull mobs away from team mates that are in trouble. I've found that its possible to "cheat" with it as well, combining it with knockback heavy sets like /storm is good for a giggle. I was on a team with another who had fold space and we sort of played ping-pong with the mobs, tossing them back from one to another as we engaged different packs. I've found that you can also pull down flying mobs down to you which is also convenient. So there's really all kinds of neat ways to use a tool that pulls mobs to yourself. PS - 4. Just remembered this one. On my Dominator, you can use it to pull enemies into your CC effects, like creepers and so on. This is particularly useful against some enemies like Dark Mages that like to stay ranged and pewpew at you.

The standard END fix is to take Ageless as an incarnate later on, but personally I don't like relying on that to make a build work. Keeping your enhancements up to date will help, and slotting your Stamina will also help. One thing you can try is putting a Performance Enhancer + chance for END to proc in, that way you have a chance to get stamina back, which will proc more than you might think with a high attack rate set like claws. Lastly, you can see if there are toggles you don't need all of the time and try to manage those. You can also try putting another END reduction in them in the meantime, as that will lower their costs. Aside from that its difficult to give any for sure fixes without seeing your build in MIDS. Hope this helps!

@Seigmoraig - awesome, thank you very much. Just what I needed!

Hello Forums! Trying my first Dom out, and decided to go Plant/Psi/Psi, as it seemed to have a mix of everything I wanted to do. But this is my first, so any imput/corrections would be appreciated. When slotting I tried to focus on recharge as much as possible, to get Domination/Drain Psyche down as much as possible. I managed to get Domination down to 72 seconds so I "think" it would be perma, and Drain down to 31 seconds. Creepers is down to 129 to, so its nearly perma as well. Problem is, is that I have zero experience with Doms. (Usually play Masterminds and Tankers) And the slotting looks odd, very back end heavy. Again this isn't 100% done, its in progress but its just looking odd to me, so imput would be appreciated. Also wanted to ask, what incarnates? I went with Agility (mostly for the recharge), but wasn't sure if there was incarnate goodness to make our CC's and such better. Also added a pic of her costume, I'm just happy how it turned out. Tricky to get a costume that matches powersets sometimes! Thanks bunches in advance. Thornia Plant-Psi Dom.mxd

@Snarky - I am surprised you don't type that up in case you misplace it, also easier to share if you decide to. But well done, I keep game logs too about my experiments, tests, ideas, and theorycrafting.

Hello fellow Masterminds, Time for another update. Apologies for the delay, I took a month break from the game for a bit. Now I am back and was doing some testing with Thugs, and the results are quite surprising. 3 Boxing with Thugs turned out to be quite different from both Robots and Demons, so much so that I had to go back and rethink and try new things, but in a good way. For those unaware, the Thugs come with their own leadership toggles. Maneuvers, Assault, and Tactics. Similar to Demons, the Thugs will buff each other, even other Thug MMs. This does not affect the Masterminds themselves, other players, or even other pet types. Only other Thugs. So, with 3 Thug Masterminds on the same team, your pets will get 2 free sets of leadership toggles. That’s right, not one, but two! This is because you have two enforcers, and each one of them comes with them. So with three Thug Masterminds, this means that all of your pets will pretty much be defense capped, without you even doing anything. Plus the damage and accuracy toggle. Now this made me pause and do some thinking. If they were defense capped, I could run something else besides /Time. I opted to go with /Electric, /Kinetic, and /Pain. I chose pain for the additional healing and resistance buffs. But in hindsight, I might also change /Electric for /Thermal, more on that later. Note: I am in no way saying you shouldn’t use a Defense Secondary set with Thugs when playing one of them. It’s just when playing 3 of them, it wouldn’t have been needed or felt it would be optimal. But I did manage to fit in a few noteworthy things – Fold Space + Bonfire - Kept these from the Robots and Demons, as it is a good CC and damage tool, and wonderful for procs. It is also very handy for yanking things back not just into your bonfire and AoE, but its great for pulling runners back to you too, making it a nice pet control tool as well. Gangwar – Chance for Knockdown – Aside from using it as a mule power and DPS cooldown, it is actually a really good place for the unique knockdown proc, as so many pets attacking so often can and will knock many things down each activation. It is especially funny when you go "all out" and seeing mobs everywhere getting knocked down. Gangwar + Burnout – Burnout resets your activated powers. So you can pop a Gangwar, use Burnout, then immediately use Gangwar again, making a great power even better. Plus on top of that, I had 3 Masterminds, all of them with this in their build. So for fun’s, let’s do the math – 1 (The Mastermind) + 3 (T1 pets) + 2 (T2 pets) + 1 (T3 pet) + 10 (Gangwar 1) + 10 (Gangwar 2) + 2 (Lore pets) = 29 total bodies in the fight. Now we times that by 3 for each Mastermind – 29x3= 87 Total bodies on the field! So needless to say, it’s quite chaotic. It’s just a sea of Band T shirts, Logos, and Bandannas shooting anything that twitches. The best part? They could always engage targets! They may bunch up around the same target, but they all raise their guns and fire, unlike demons who often have to be within claws reach. Lastly, I tried to time my /Kinetic’s Fulcrum with the total Gangwar. I am uncertain if the 60 pose were affected to be honest, because with so much going on it is hard to tell what damage is coming from where. I am also unsure if the Pose are affected by all those free leaderships, because you can’t actually check their stats. For those wondering, it is “extremely” effective, both in farms as well as AV’s and GM’s. Even without the Burnout, using 3 gangwars at the same time is quite the sight to see. However, there were some cons that I wanted to mention. The first, is so many bodies was actually a detriment to /Electric. If I were to do it again, I might say to /Thermal instead. Because your chain powers will bounce to pose and count as a “target”, meaning it is quite likely you will hit pose and not pets with your heals and absorbs. This didn’t always seem to be the case, but often seemed to be. Another /Thugs feature, is both a blessing and a curse. They are mixed, melee and ranged DPS. Some pets will stay close by and pewpew away, while others will run off and out of range of buffs and quickly splatter. They also have a good mix of single target and AoE attacks as well. Their AoE isn’t quite as good as robots is, but better than Demons, and their single target damage is also good, far better than Robots is. But I found them the most overall difficult to wrangle and control. Both Demons and Robots were predictable and easy to 3 box. Thugs on the other hand, even without the 60 bonus bodies running around, was more challenging. Another downside was END use. Thugs are definitely the most END hungry of the three, as usually /Electric alone was enough to keep all three MM’s going at full throttle. This should be resolved with a single one of them taking Ageless as a Destiny power, but it was troublesome enough to mention as it was the first time I found myself popping blue inspirations in a while. Next, it is also important to note that with 3 resistance/buff secondaries, your own defenses will be low. I compensated for this with the usual maneuvers/combat jump and so on, but all of my MMs personal defenses were lower than I would have liked. But it would have felt like a waste of potential to take a defense secondary for this test. Lastly, despite the Thugs buffstacking, being capped at both Def and Res, I found myself having to replace them more than any other pet I have multiboxed so far. The Demons were pretty much immortal, as I rarely if ever lost one. (Even the cinders from Hell on Earth didn’t “die”, they seemed to last until they expired every time.) The Robots I may loose one now and then if I bite off more than I can chew or get too eager, but it rarely poses trouble replacing them. With the thugs however, in particular the Arsonist and the Enforcers, I would often loose some. I would have to replace some every map, which is something I only occasionally have to do with Robots, and never had to with Demons. I suspect this might have something to do with the Gangwar and Chain mechanic from /Electric, but I even had Kinetic and Pain’s healing on Auto, the /Electric was actually applying absorb shields. I still wouldn’t call triple boxing thugs “fragile”, only the most fragile 3 boxing so far. Now for the comparison to Robots and Demons. The “fresh 50” thugs were strong enough on their own to do +3/8 without even having their Alpha incarnates unlocked. I have gotten them all their first level shift (huge power boost for masterminds) and now they are doing +4/8 just fine, with times quite comparable to /Robots, despite not having any Judgements, Lore pets, Destiny, or Interface slots to help. I ran several farms with them, and their average time on the AE map was 6 minutes. So not quite as fast as my Robots were, but not as slow as Demons were either. Also keep in mind, My robot MMs all have their T4’s while my Thugs only have their T3 Alphas, which I am sure would improve their time. So, to compare 3 boxing Thugs, Demons, and Robots, all with similar builds and inf invested, here is how I would rank them – Durability – Demons > Robots > Thugs. Demons win here, hands down. I rarely lost any of them. I’ll loose a robot now and then, and I saw myself replacing thugs pretty much every map. But as mentioned, I suspect that /Electric mechanic might have something to do with that, but I never experienced that with Demons and their Hell on Earth either, so it could be something else. Damage/Map Clear Speed – Robots > Thugs > Demons. Robots win here, but not by a terrible margin. I suspect Thugs would be close with similar incarnate levels. Demons are far behind, being almost twice the time required as Robots to clear the same maps due to a lack of AoE and available space to engage targets, being almost all melee. Average Thug Times - Moon Map: 5:52 Night at the Movies (large city map): 52 minutes. Ease of Play/Boxing – Demons > Robots > Thugs. I would say Demons win this one. I never felt panicked or pressured, even when completely surrounded by 8+ spawns of mobs. They were reliable as a stone wall in every circumstance I put them in, and very easy to control. With robots you at least had to keep everything balled up in your fire patches, and with Thugs its sheer chaos. So if you are new to multiboxing MMs, I would recommend Demons for a first try. Honestly with 3 Demon MMs, you could likely go AFK on some maps or scenarios. So long as pets stayed in autoheal range, you would be fine. GM/AVs – Thugs. It’s not even close. Thugs bring so much to bear that it almost laps Robots and Demons, even with the Robots heavy –regen debuffs and higher incarnate levels. Against a lone target, dropping all 6 Gangwars makes them almost vanish in a cloud of smoke as everything, the entire army you have, all focus on one single target. Again, this is not in any way meant to compare 1 on 1 MMs, but 3 on 3 multiboxing. I think we all know 1 on 1 rankings would rank differently. But having more than 1 MM present, as well as “En masse” farming/fighting style of engaging as many targets at a time completely changes the dynamic. I am tempted to try 3 boxing Necro MMs, even though I suspect they wouldn’t perform as well as the “big 3” pet types. Or I might even see what 3 boxing Mercenary MMs is like, because who knows, this has been quite surprising. Anyway, Pics included to show the +defense stacking and resistance levels, and the builds I used are included. And yes, I am aware the builds are not optimized for solo play, but they are meant to be played as a box team. Thugs-Electric.mxd Thugs-Kin.mxd Thugs-Pain.mxd

Personally I consider Omega Maneuver one of the worst T9's in the entire game. It has a very long cooldown, a laughable taunt effect, and only does Superior Damage. I am curious as to how it is intended to be used? On teams, the "fuse" on it is too long, between the cooldown, and the delay in its activation, it is unwieldly to use on fast moving teams. The damage on it is pitiful, you are better off sticking with your Venom Grenade > Suppression > X attack chain. The taunt on it has such a low cap, that it won't be saving your fragile spider pets. And even if that were the case, it lasts mere moments before disappearing, freeing all those mobs to go right back to your pets, and you have to wait over a minute to use it again. It is a power with multiple effects that is good at neither. Its terrible at damage, and terrible at taunting, so I am genuinely curious as to the thoughts that went into it. If it had a more realistic cooldown, or it was a taunt dummy that actually stayed up a bit of time, or even did actual meaningful damage, then it might be worth using. But the last time I checked most crabbers don't take it.

Decided to give Dominators a try myself, usually I play Masterminds though. Have my heart set on a Plant Dom, secondary I am still musing about. Would like something to be both good and thematic if possible, so this thread has been a good read.

Thank you for the input everyone. I was more or less wondering what other noteworthy uses there were for it, outside of /Time. There was a brief discussion about it in Discord last night, but overall it seems Buildup is the much better option for the classes with it available, at least offensively speaking. This was mostly me musing what other builds/powers might make use of it outside of /Time. IIRC in the discord last night people did point out it affected CC, but not its "Mag" effect, but its duration. I don't often play CC focused characters so I can't personally say how valuable that would be. It is nice to know it affects +absorb though, which makes me wonder about /Nature, /Electric, and even the new /Sorcery pool if you could apply it to give "bigger bubbles". I love finding little "gems" in games, or power combinations, especially if they are outside the box so to speak. I was thinking something like Power Boost, then activating a power, then hitting burnout, and using that power again all within the Power Boost Window sort of thing, but even if Power Boost isn't that grand outside of /Time, that makes me wonder about Buildup/Aim/Focus and Burnout. I am still reading conflicting thoughts though, some say outside of /Time and Farsight, Power Boost isn't really worth taking in a build. Other's say its good, but don't provide many examples or list specific powers aside from @Mezmera above. Still, fun to think about.

Not needed, but it is the only aggro tool available to MMs. Personally I dislike its low target cap and brief duration. I think its the weakest of all taunt effects in the game if I am not mistaken. You could take it to give it a try perhaps, and can always remove it later if you find you don't use it. If there was a way to increase its area or target capability, it might be more worthwhile but I was never impressed with it. And I am usually the sort to take tools like group fly and fold space just to have them available, and I am hard pressed to validate taking provoke.

Sorry @Kazyone but i have never played Beasts and have only limited experience with /Cold, but if you post your build I can take a look and give you my best guess! I have quite MM's quite a bit so maybe you are just missing some things?