laudwic

I can say that about every single power in existence. The potential redesign of this power is very different though. In essence your taking a primarily ranged effect, an AoE Hold, while coupling it with a Team AoE Resistance Buff. By having them in the same location, your encouraging a melee/close quarters play style. This is set to be a primary for one set and a secondary for three others. For Defenders, Controllers and Corrupotors, those ATs are primarily ranged. If the two parts of this power were separated into two separate powers, they would rarely applied in a situation where they would overlap (more if teaming with melee types admittedly.) I see this as a very good addition for melee oriented masterminds as it is a poor man's Faraday Cage with an AoE hold. For Defenders, Controllers and Corrupotors it does not have the same value as each of them are primarily ranged ATs that lack many defensive powers. Considering the difference between Melee damage and ranged damage, as well as limiting number of available attacks, range may be a better defense than fighting in this new cage. Also, every single power for Trick Arrow is a ranged power. The vast majority of Defender, Controller, and Corrupter powers are ranged. My suggestion would allow the power to have the same utility offensively by placing it on a group of mobs or defensively by having it effect those initially in (once) and effect any that enter during the duration as is done with certain lower level targetable AoE holds. I do not see my change as overpowered in a final set power. Admittedly, I am a primarily a solo player. For a solo, assuming offensive use only, the current beta version, loses a lot of allure as getting swarmed in melee generally equals a trip to the hospital. For groups, having brutes, tankers and scrappers as meat shields certainly makes a big difference to the utility of this power as you now care more about their defense as, hopefully, they are keeping everything away from you. The current version is far better for Melee masterminds and those that group, and less for those of us that solo.

I wish it was similar to the other area hold powers that can be placed. The way your describing requires you to place it over the enemies to get value for the hold (which is probably not a very high magnitude) then you have to get inside of that area to take advantage of the defense. That is fine for masterminds, but playing the set with a ranged controller, it would have a lot more utility if I could set the arrow near where I want a defensive perimeter, and then have the hold go off as things enter that perimeter like other similar holds.

With the EMP Arrow revisions, will the hold effect only occur on enemies that are in the radius when it is first case or will it also effect targets that enter the cage while the cage is still up?

If I remember correctly, there is a rocky outcropping behind where there are a ton of Nemeis in formation. Check that outcropping, there is a door there to a small base.

With my Psy/TM blaster, rather than up the group size I upped the enemy level for missions. Even at +1/0 most missions have a purple or two. I would expect that if you ran +1/0 or +2/0 instead of 0/+3 you would see the sets like PSI be higher rated and sets that shine in AoEs taking a hit.

Sorry, at work right now avoiding election coverage, can't log on to the game. I know I stumbled on a site before with numbers but I can't remember it. Plus, if I could play, I would do that rather than continue on the forums. Plus, I haven't played my brute for awhile once I learned the changes were coming. I don't remember Whirling Smash being less powerful than End of Time, but I'll take your word. Though, my brute has a far easier time soloing and taking on large spawns one after another in comparison to my blaster at the same levels. (One big spawn my blaster can nuke it, but compared to the Brute it is a one shot wonder.) Assuming your correct, I'm surprised they did not lower it more, but, again, the patch notes and explanation are lacking.

You forgot to add that Titan Weapons in its current pre-patch version is also clunkie to use and requires momentum to add to your argument. Although it also has knockdown. The Devs have put out that the damage for End of Time is 1.552 do you have a source for the base damage level of Whirling Smash? I have a TW/RA brute around the same level as my /TM Blaster. My perception is that End of Time was not doing as much damage, but I don't have the numbers right now. My Brute did run at far higher difficulty at the same level as compared to my /TM blaster. Again, if you were a developer, and this was the patch note, that would be a vast improvement. Especially if the base damage number was there as well.

I absolutely understand rule, but more importantly, I have a great understanding of rule making. In doing so I have a strong belief that you do not create rules or change rules for every perceived problem, only when you have a good reason. When you do make rules or change rules, you need to be transparent as to why. Doing so speeds adoption and following of the rules, increases satisfaction, and avoids comments on rules which require work to respond to them. My main complaint is that the patch notes are lacking in detail. The amount of damage going from 1.552 to 1.232 is not huge or earth shattering. I just don't understand why they are doing it. They give the change but no why. I just don't want to guess. The patch notes should have something similar to Aging Touch where they explained that the power was doing more than it was intended to do if that is their point. By just giving the 'Standard Damage Formula' they are giving the impression that the power was already following their guidelines but they are choosing to make it do less damage (As I said earlier, this is a power in it's current state that when slotted with an PBAoE IO set can not take out minion. Rikti Monkeys, sure, but not minions) without giving a reason. Frankly, I don't think the change makes much difference at all for a number of reasons, I just want to have an idea why this change is being made rather than my guesses. I don't see this as a necessary change as the damage is not sufficient to take out a minion in one hit or even the majority of a minions health, doesn't really fixes anything, and not a change that should be anywhere near the top of the priority list. I'm curious why they did it. I agree with your analysis that a blaster, being generally ranged, in using a PBAoE is probably using it as an 'oh <bleep> I'm surrounded' and wants more damage and the recharge/endurance costs changes are not an issue. (End is not an issue with TM) It isn't about feeling the downtime as strongly as not wanting to be in the position to use a PBAoE power on a generally ranged AT. In my mind, this is a very situational power to be used in situations that are forced upon you more than ones you create. (Power is darn good at Rikti Monkey clearance.) The changes are not going to have a big effect on this power for anyone, me included. Also, this is not a nuke in any sense of the term. If you tried to use this as a nuke (running into a large group to blow them up while hoping that one power takes them all out before they blow you to bits) you'll be face planted. I would never try to use this like Psychic Wail (Psychic Blast: PBAoE, Extreme DMG(Psionic), Foe Disorient, -Recharge, Self -Recovery) where you can get into a middle of a group, use a red or build up and take out an entire or almost an entire spawn, possibly without them firing back. Frankly, I'd take a cone over a PBAoE on a blaster any day especially the aggro generation of a PBAoE if your teaming. Range is your friend, if they are close enough to be hit by a PBAoE you are in melee range bad for a no inherent defense toon. (I do not subscribe to the Blapper idea or that there are times you should get down and dirty as blaster is a damage AT not range.) I do not see this change to End of Time as a priority or something necessary. My guess would be that this set, I believe, is a post live addition and they are simply seeking to re-balance it since it has now been on live for awhile and there is more experience and data as to how it is working. As for priority, I would guess it is because that they are looking at all the Blaster Secondaries and this is why this set came up. I would have preferred they expended their efforts in other areas, but I'm still appreciative of their efforts, even when I don't agree or question them.

I addressed every single point you made. If you choose not or unable to defend your position, that is on you not me. Please note, your initial statement is the one that included dismissive statements like "I would suggest you are providing tears instead of feedback." Despite that, I choose to treat it as a genuine discussion.

Just to comment on the edit. I'm not going to guess at what Vanden was referring too, I'll let Vanden clarify if that is their desire. If the formerly 'pay to play' sets are overpowered, or any set is overpowered there may need to be adjustments. (If your taking cash for xp boosts or other things in the P2W store, your pay to win.) My points are: 1. Sets should not be mirror images of each other. 2. Diversity of powers, not just theme and skins, is good and should be encouraged 3. Copying powers between sets should be avoided even if reskinned 4. Sets can NEVER be absolutely balanced and balancing is an art not a science 5. Some powers in a set should be better than comparable powers in other sets 6. Some powers in a set should be worse than comparable powers in other sets 7. It is ok that some power sets may be perceived as being better than others. 8. Just because some members of the community perceives a power or set as being not as good, does not mean that they are as good and they may be better than other generally perceived better choices. 9. The 'Standard Damage Formula' is a tool and a guide to help balance but not an end all and be all in balance 10. Change should be made when truly needed. There should not be change for change sake 11. Patch notes should be clear as to what is the rationale for the change. Ie. This power is doing more damage than we intended. This power is more effective than other similar powers because . . . 12. Numbers illustrating the change should always be given. A note should never be: Changed power X to give it the same recovery rate as power Y. It should be something along the lines of: Reduced the regeneration rate from X to Y but increased the amount of time for absorb stacking from 6 seconds to 12 seconds to make this power similar to <other power>. That way the reader does not have to be an expert in two powers to understand the changes to one.

I do not agree that End of Time is overperforming. So, we do not begin on the same premise. Nope, do not see it as iconic or as part of the set identity, but, apparently, if there is enough of a following then you are fine with things overperforming. Therefore, overperforming is fine if popular enough. Frankly, I do not see this 'overperformance' as to a level that justifies attention to this power when there are things that should be far more pressing based on over/under performance. For example, is anyone actually taking powers from Munitions Mastery? Actually, multiple powers in Temporal Manipulation are being changed/nerfed in addition to End of Time. Please see the patch notes for change to Aging Touch, Time Stop, Temporal Healing and Time Shift. I guess you missed that. Actually, you justified overpowered powers in your first statements related to 'iconics'. Interestingly, I wonder if they are 'iconics' because they are overpowered. Not failure with super strength, but taking your statement is true, people keep selecting a set when some powers are more powerful as compared to other sets and some powers are weaker sounds like design working properly. To quote The Facts of Life: "You take the good, you take the bad, you take them both. . . " Also, I guess you missed it but they are changing future pain in the opposite direction of End of Time. Don't care as much a I don't think Future Pain is a good power to begin with, but don't see the reason for that change any more than changing End of Time. Again, no reason is given for the change which seems to be poor patch notes to me. Oh, did you know that the 'Standard Damage Formula' does not take into consideration secondary effects? Basically, the only thing that formula is good for is comparing damage for powers with no or the same secondary effects because I doubt anyone is going to argue that fear, hold, stun, knockback, and -end are all just as good and interchangable. As for Time Lord, are you seriously suggesting that it is some great power now? Basically, its like vanilla ice cream, its good, everyone likes it but it is nothing to get excited about. The great thing about it is it is an auto power and no end for 20% blanket recharge. Now, you can get Hasten, make it permanent (at 50) with one additional recharge IO (for a total of 2) sure you have some end cost but you now have perma 70% overcharge. (Note, endurance is not a problem with this secondary.) Yeah, don't see it. If any power is 'iconic' for this set it would be Temporal Healing, and they are changing that one to mirror another power in another set. Ie. they are now the same reskinned power.

Because you do not find an argument persuasive does not give you free reign to state that an argument cannot be used or is not persuasive to others. Are you really advocating that every set at every tier must be balanced to every set at the same tier? That there cannot be areas in which a set has better powers in a certain area as compared to other sets? That one set cannot 'shine' in an area as compared to another set? Please explain the following statement: " It was stronger than an attack in a set that was literally designed to be overpowered but still available 10 levels earlier, and in a secondary set to boot." First of all, what set was 'literally designed to be overpowered'? Why would a set be designed to be 'overpowered' if there is a desire for balance in the game? How do you know that the 'overpowered set' was 'literally designed to be overpowered'?

So? First, lets look at the power itself. Even boosting it with an aim type power, it will not take out minions. It will hurt them. If you slot this power well with an IO set or SOs it can reliably take out. . . Rikti Monkeys. That is in its 'overpowered' state. Oh, you have to get into melee range to use it on a predominately raged AT. Next, we have to reduce its damage because it is, gasp, higher than other sets AoE powers. How is that a reason? Every set is going to have powers that are better or worse than comparable powers of different sets be it differences in level of access, amount of damage, secondary effect, radius, or so on. I do not expect there is a great migration to Temporal Manipulation because you can get a PBAoE power on a blaster secondary at an earlier level. Even if we adopt the idea that powers have to be balanced across all sets, then you might as well get rid of all the diverse sets and turn them all into thematic reskins of the same powers. Then there will be complaints because x power is stronger because it is not resisted as often as y so we need to bump them up, or this secondary effect is so much better than that one so there has to be a change. Also, Powers cannot be viewed in isolation. Because power the Tier 3 power in set A is better than the Tier 3 power in set B does not mean that set A is better than set B. The set must be viewed as a whole and some powers are going to be better when compared to powers in other sets and worse than others. The only concern comes into being when one secondary dominates the game. Is this set over-represented in the player base? I highly doubt it. Continuing that idea, if the 'standard damage formula' is worth something, then leaving the power alone, assuming the original version still was appropriate under the 'standard damage formula' and the 'formula' is worth a darn, is an absolutely viable option. If the 'formula' mandates for a change in damage there are required changes to include a reduction in recharge time and endurance to compensate the reduction in damage then you can balance the power at the current damage level by having a higher recharge time and end cost. You can't have it both ways, either the formula is an end all be all balance tool or not. If this power cannot be balanced under the 'standard damage formula' at its current 'live' damage level, then I would suggest that the 'standard damage formula' is broken. Going forward, why in writing the patch notes did the Devs not state, as they did with another power in this secondary, that it was doing more damage than intended? Why did they not state that they were bringing it in line as they did with two other powers in this secondary? Personally, my guess is those should have been added but the patch notes were poorly written in a summary fashion so as to not provide basic information which would have avoided questions like mine. This is the DEVs game, and I appreciate what they are doing and bring CoH back. Since they invite feedback, I'll give it. I still do not see a reason for this change as I do not agree that there is a need to balance powers between secondary sets as every set will have pluses or minuses when compared to others. If the sets must be balanced against each other, then your going to have a ton more work to do as the only truly effective way to accomplish that goal is to make every powerset mechanically the same but reskin what they appear to be.

End of Time Recharge decreased from 22s to 17s Endurance cost decreased from 20.176 to 16.016 Damage decreased from scale 1.552 to 1.232 (per the standard damage formulas) I've posted about this one twice now, and it doesn't seem to get any traction. Why is this change being made? It looks like a change for change only. The decrease in recharge and end cost is not a big deal as this is a 'oh, I'm surrounded power' on most blasters where damage is more of a premium. Since, apparently, it is continuing to follow a formula, what is this change being made. Time Stop Hold changed from Mag 3, Scale 8 to: Mag 2, Scale 10 (non stacking) Mag 1, Scale 6 (stacking) Time Shift Stun changed from Mag 3, Scale 8 to: Mag 2, Scale 8 (non stacking) Mag 1, Scale 5 (stacking) With the magnitude reduction we can assume that, at most, if you're lucky and don't have a resistant mob, one application of either may effect a lieutenant, but forget anything higher. Right? How will Time Wall effect these?

Mental note, the Wikis are not nearly as good as I thought and I really really will need to look at patch notes from before I knew the game was back. . . .

Thanks for posting this. Yeah, before my time back to CoH. Looks like they were trying to buff Tanks to make them more attractive vs. Brutes. The higher base damage percent + a 20% unstackable resistance debuff + improved AoE on powers + better inherit Aggro vs. Brute's Fury ability and PokeVoke.

Thanks, I have a Brute not a Tanker. Both Wiki's have problems. For example, a good number of blaster secondaries are missing from both. The Paragon Wiki version of Guantlet: Although many try, few can withstand the irresistible force of the Tanker. Each time a Tanker attacks, he enrages the target, and those around him, enticing them to attack the Tanker. Each punch continues to provoke your enemies and allows the Tanker to do what he does best. Gauntlet -- also referred to as "PunchVoke" -- causes the Tanker's AoE attacks and auras to taunt every PvE enemy they affect. Their single-target attacks taunt the enemy hit and up to four more around it. Gauntlet has reduced chances of affecting exceptionally high-rank foes like Giant Monsters, and even worse chances of affecting other players in PvP. Brutes possess a smaller version of this power, occasionally labeled as "PokeVoke" by the community, as it does not possess an official name. The Brute's version of Gauntlet does not apply in PvP, and their single-target attacks only taunt the one target hit. From the unofficial homecoming WIKI Gauntlet Although many try, few can withstand the irresistible force of the Tanker. Each time a Tanker attacks, he enrages the target, and those around him, enticing them to attack the Tanker. Each punch continues to provoke your enemies and allows the Tanker to do what he does best. Gauntlet -- also referred to as "PunchVoke" -- causes the Tanker's AoE attacks and auras to taunt every PvE enemy they affect. Their single-target attacks taunt the enemy hit and up to four more around it. Gauntlet has reduced chances of affecting exceptionally high-rank foes like Giant Monsters, and even worse chances of affecting other players in PvP. Brutes possess a smaller version of this power, occasionally labeled as "PokeVoke" by the community, as it does not possess an official name. The Brute's version of Gauntlet does not apply in PvP, and their single-target attacks only taunt the one target hit. Neither is the same as the screen shot you were kind enough to post. Was this how it was in live or is it a Homecoming thing? I solo my Brute, clearing trash mobs is important for all other ATs too. Still don't see why the the AoE would be increased except, maybe, to try to balance Brutes Fury and Scrappers critical hit.

I certainly believe you guys, just curious as to the decision making to increase melee range on this AT on shared power sets and that this is not listed as a Tanker inherent from what I've been able to look up in the old Paragon Wiki or the unofficial Homecoming Wiki. So, Whirling Smash was lowered from 15 to 10 for all ATs, but, as the Tanker AT has an unlisted inherent radius bonus, the effective range Whirling Smash is being reduced from 20 ft to 15 ft for Tankers.

Dumb question but why is this power different for Tankers? Whirling Smash Radius lowered from 15ft to 10ft (however, it remains at 15ft for Tankers) No longer inflicts additional damage over time I don't see a reason why it would be better for Tanker than, for example, Brutes. Frankly, I could make some arguments that the more offensive ATs should have the longer range than the more defensive/control the aggro Ats.

Has anyone tried out the changes to Temporal Manipulation and able to report back? Really interested in how the changes for Temporal Healing are working and detail on that. The notes are next to useless to understand what the change is if you do not have experience with Cauterizing Aura. For example, I have no idea what: "Absorb has been adjusted to match Cauterizing Aura's Heal per Second and can now stack up for up to 12 seconds" actually means. I really wish that this change was better explained to answer these two questions: 1. Does the amount of absorb increase or decrease? 2. Does the amount of time between administering absorb increase or decrease. Currently soloing a blaster, and this power really has been helping. I hope my gut is wrong but I expect this power won't be helping as much soon. Also, very much against the changes to End of Time. End of Time Recharge decreased from 22s to 17s Endurance cost decreased from 20.176 to 16.016 Damage decreased from scale 1.552 to 1.232 (per the standard damage formula Why? This is a power that, in my experience, is generally only going to be used once per fight if that. It is better to have the damage higher even at the cost of higher end and the really unimportant higher recharge. Except for blapper builds, I would expect this is an 'oh <bleep> I'm surrounded' power rather that what a blaster is going to build offence around. I don't see any good reason to change this power or any great utility or improvement that decreasing the recharge and endurance but lowering the damage brings. If the power is consistent with the standard damage formula before the change, I would prefer if you just left it alone.

I just started a Psi/Temp in Goldside and I've soloed that content to 10th so far. How are you enjoying your character? I see both builds have Psychic Focus and Chronos. Is it worth having both? Any powers from either set that you recommend skipping? Is leadership really worth it?

Running Demons/EA and have a good/easy time and have gotten to 38. Has anyone used the Mu Mastery epic set for the extra -End? I am hoping with the Immobilize and the additional -End I can get a getto hold to assist my Demons.

Just wanted to thank the Devs for this event! It was nice taking my newly level 50 and flying up to the top of the pumpkin in Atlas. The bench under the stem/tree was a very nice touch and it was fun to sit my character there as a new level 50 and look down on Atlas Park.

I'm no expert. I had a 50 on live before IOs were out. I have two 50 dominators and a 50 Sentinel. I have a Demons/EA Mastermind at 35 that I'm leveling quickly up and slotting. This is what I do for my characters. The first thing I do is take comfort in that I get a free respec every 10 levels, I can do a respec trial if I have to, and I can even get one from the Halloween event. Ie. If I make a mistake, I can fix it. So I don't have to worry. I also realize that I can buy unslotters from Merit Vendors if I find I put an expensive IO in a place I don't want it. Also, this game is very forgiving. Remember, your looking to have fun. Because others brag they can do +4/8 doesn't matter to how you choose to play and enjoy yourself. Do not let this stress you out. On power sets I'm not familiar with, I search this forum to see builds other people have done and advice. For example, with Demons, I look at builds that are posted to see what I like or not. For example, I have Corruption in my build for the range of the attack to pull and the -Res. The powers Enchant Demon and Abyssal Empowerment only have their original slot because it doesn't seem to make sense to slot them. I used to have lash but I found the range too little and I was busy with other things so I respected out of it. I look at what other people have done, and copy what I like. For example, my demons have a healing/absorb IO because I wanted to increase their healing and I don't mind missing one part of a pet set. My Demon Princes holds work very well, so I didn't bother adding something to improve his holds. I also look at https://hcwiki.cityofheroes.dev/wiki/Main_Page to know more about my powers but also to look at Enhancement sets that would be helpful. Remember, always buy these from the action house and buy the attuned version so that they increase level with you. You generally want to buy sets with the largest level range you can that go to 50 (they way they continue to improve as you level and are still available if you exemplor down.) Also, look for things that are helpful procs. For example, I picked up the Annihilation Proc that is a chance for -Res as one of my main reasons for using Crack Whip is to reduce the resistance of enemies (it already has -Res) so my pets do more damage. Added that Proc is just more of a good thing. Look at what works for your build. For example, with the Electrical Affinity Secondary, I'm slotting for resistance where your going to be slotting for defense. Also, take a look at the defender and corruptor forums to see what others have done with Cold Domination. It may be your secondary, but it is their primary and look what others have done in assigning slots and what they put into them. Also look at the power reviews.

Exit out of the game. Exit out of Tequila. Restart Tequila. Watch it run patcher. Restart Game. You should be able to play with no more problems. Profit.