Dacy

I am sorry, I wanted to respond and then I didn't finish reading first. Usually I only jump to the keyboard once, but you have me jumping several times. Anyway. There is a huge interest in base building. People like this game why? Usually because they have an emotional connection to the world of comics, movies, or they like highly customizable characters. For many, they like to imagine characters, backstories, settings, even whole worlds. People who just want to run thru and get the powers and the build tend to be the kind who get bored faster than those who are invested in their characters with stories and world building, in my experience. There are gamers who like to try games, then move on (who tend not to be builders), and there are the dedicated City folk. Not all the dedicated people stay forever, but a good portion will stay as long as they can manage. And those are the ones that want bases that fit their characters. And there are a lot of us, percentage wise, it's what's kept this game going, imo. I'm not saying base building has kept this game going, mind, I'm saying base building fits in with the sorts that are the most faithful to this game, because it allows them to realize their characters' stories, backgrounds, and create their own realities within the game, and our particular base editor is awesome for that. You should have seen us trying to figure out the categories for the bases for the new directory. The sheer volume of categories here is mind boggling, and I know we did not get them all, trying to figure out what more general term might encompass many outliers, but still, one of the more popular categories of descriptions is "Defies Description". So if you think there is a "lack of interest" in bases, quite the opposite. Building, because prestige is gone now, has exploded. We have well over 33,000 bases that have been created on Everlasting alone. And how many players, do you think? Yeah. Clearly no interest in bases there. Excelsior has fewer, but still over 30,000. "We don't need CRs", I keep hearing this (from others as well), and yet, "Please do continue being helpful and supportive" and "I've enjoyed visiting the tech showcase". I'm guessing by, "we don't need CRs", you mean, we don't need a titled person, because then going on to say that you want the continued support and you enjoy the showcase tells me that you like things a CR does, regardless of whether or not we have the title. Being helpful, supportive, and doing events is most of the definition of the CR position. So to say you don't need CRs and then immediately talk about how you like what a CR brings...to me, what we did as CRs defines the position, it IS the position. So I'm trying to frame what you say into what I think it is you actually mean, but just fyi, when I see "we don't need CRs" I hear "your work as a CR meant nothing and made no difference, and community relations and communication to the devs is unimportant." And I have to work to reframe that to what I hope it is you meant. But it doesn't feel good to hear, every time.

I'm sorry to give that impression! No, far from, our contest had so many entries, we had to limit those who got a judge's tour to a smaller list. No, the thing I don't see is people volunteering to RUN base events that don't promote a specific SG. That's all. And yes, there are many who don't like contests, myself among them, (I hate judging!), so we are doing the non-competitive base showcases. We are doing our best to include all. 1) If you've seen my videos, I do my best to point out the disadvantages to building above the plot. I heavily prefer to build inside the base, and have done on most of mine. And 2) contests are not about who can build above the base!! In fact, most of the winners utilize inside the base for at least half. In my experience, there is a faction (usually inexperienced builders) who think that above the base is somehow superior. It is not, imo, of course, there are things you can do there that you can't do in a base. Contests are not about the size or the location of a base. They are for people who want to be evaluated for base impact and building skill. And yes, we have a LOT of super talented people, so winning is HARD. Judging is also HARD. The smaller shards DO have wonderful builders. Easter Bunny has quite a few really nice bases on Indom, including my favorite of his, Shard Warrior has bases on all the shards, the best mural example there is is on Torchbearer...and on and on. Which is why I like to see them included. There may not be as many, but there are great builders on all shards. But not so many that maybe contests happen so much there.

I certainly didn’t mean to imply that they weren’t players doing events because of course I know that the there are. And Shard Warrior is indeed, quite helpful, as are quite a few others. But I was referring specifically to base events, and most of the base events that are held are like the Fusion Force events, they are super group specific. I’m saying I have not seen base events run that are, for instance, like the showcases, where everyone is included, no super group is associated, and it’s across all the shards. Generally things are run from a particular group. The CR position was a neutral one, and everyone was included by design. It would be wonderful to see more people running events that aren’t associated with a particular group, because some groups don’t like other groups, but it’s not some thing I have seen yet. But now that it’s been demonstrated, perhaps we will see that. I appreciate that you appreciate the work that Easter bunny and I have done, and that you don’t feel like the title was any part of it. I feel very much like the title granted an authority and access that we didn’t have before, but you’re free to disagree, of course. As you have. Not to say we can’t continue to work without a title, because we are, and others do as well. I know the title are not necessary to do things. They were just a help in focusing attention, and giving us authority.

And a last note: no one ever claimed this was even a goal. Collating and keeping track of and communicating player wants is not at all the same thing as that being a way to make sure all those wants are executed. Player wants are endless. Some are impossible. Some are repeating what others have already said. What CRs were supposed to help with, and indeed, did and we continue to try to do this, is help present, but more importantly, narrow down the list to what's the most desired or beneficial (as in, useful to the most people). This is a time and labor saver, but it never was intended to make all the wants into reality.

K, well, I still don't think you fully understand what it is I'm trying to say, and yes, I have been in leadership, and yes, I know you can't please everyone, and if I didn't know that before, I CERTAINLY know that after the contest we held. So, yeah, you're never going to get all to agree, I think culture can be improved, and I know games exist where such culture exists, but clearly, you're happy with the status quo. And just as clearly, you'll stick around regardless, presumably. I would rather proactively work to make things as good as possible and not just leave it as "working for now", but we'll just agree to disagree on that one. I think more volunteers would help. Sums it up. As far as my definition of toxic, I can't make all of the points I want to make without talking about things I don't wish to talk about, so I'll just stop there. I didn't say it before, but thank you for your support. I agree, I don't need a blue title, but not having it does take some of the pressure off to do quite so much. I have to hope you are right, that others, who also do not need blue titles, will step up and do more event organization, especially ones that include other servers than their own.

They are part and parcel of the same thing. Burnout happens because of any number of reasons, usually multiple ones: Either people are overextended and overwhelmed, or feel disenfranchised, or hate the environment, which can be toxic for a number of reasons. What I feel like I'm failing to communicate, here, is that I want them to bring in more volunteers with skillsets that address these very things. Devs right now are having to do 1) game development 2) keep up with the forums to some extent, so they know what players want, and to some extent, 3) deal with the playerbase. Why do they have to do this? Well, comes back to connectivity: if they are off in their own bubble, they will work on what they want to do, which may or may not be something well received by the community. Maybe that's okay with you, but again, games survive by being popular with their player base. We've already seen this game fragmented by people with different ideas as to the direction and focus of the game. Games die, that's the nature of the industry. And yes, we've had an influx recently, but there are also players leaving, and our population had dropped significantly before that, overall. This game is highly loved. But players can and do leave, and they will, and they will leave faster if they aren't happy. Without promotion, new people won't hear about the game, and it will inevitably fade. I'd prefer to give a game I love as much longevity as possible. Players, like workers, also leave for a variety of reasons, and games try and keep them as best they can: with new things, usually powers and content, which is what the devs mostly work on. But as Dythok pointed out, the games he has liked the most have been the ones that felt like he was a part of, it was "our game" not "their game". You point to an involved community, and both of those points are very valid and complimentary. My point is, culture and the community environment go a long way towards fostering that, and we have, but toxicity seeps in and destroys that. That's probably why I prefer to remain positive; complaining incessantly about this or that is a sign a player is not happy, and those people will probably eventually leave, but in the meantime, they fan the flames of discontent. Not that pretending everything is perfect is a good answer, by far, but your focus sets a tone for others. As you also demonstrated, there is a disconnect between the leadership here and the community. For you this means, hey, we don't need them, we're doing fine on our own. But how much better could it be if we were all working together? How much less work would they have to do if someone could compile the communications from the forums and the community so they didn't have to wade through all of it? Work culture is important, too, even when or perhaps especially when it's a volunteer organization, and I won't speak specifics of the culture here, but I believe there is room for improvement. And we DO need them, they are piloting the ship, so to speak. Yeah, passengers can find their own amusements on a ship without having to speak with the captain, but imagine a ship without a crew that interacted with the passengers. You need a drink? Tough, figure it out. More blankets? Oh, is your room too hot? Deal with it. Did you want a show? I'm sure some of the passengers must have talent...maybe they will volunteer to put on a show. Imagine if the crew piloting the ship had to also deal with all of these requests. You say you can't figure out why I say CRs were responsible for the Showcase, why, people put together things all the time. Yes, and we did and we will, but the CR title, while maybe some saw it as a prestige thing, was really more like a marker saying, I'm responsible for this. While several sgs have held contests for bases, no one did one that included all of the shards, and the smaller shards did not really even do them. No one did a crawl. Ever try and get someone to volunteer to lead a large activity? Heck, it's hard enough to find people willing to take the star on missions or on leagues. Last year I tried to find bases for hosting the Halloween giveaway on all the servers, but 2 of the shards, for the first time, had no one, and I even had titles and awards for anyone who'd bothered. Finding volunteers can be hard. A named position, even a volunteer one, conveys not only a certain authority, but a certain responsibility. And people could see in the HC discord, who to ask about base things when they needed to know and weren't sure about things. We were helpful and present before being made CRs, but we did not put together all of the things we've done since becoming CRs until that responsibility weighed on us, and the authority granted us a pathway. CRs were neutral parties, not affiliated with SGs or really even servers. That's often very important. So, sorry you can't see who we were or why, but I still think it's a good position to have for the game, for the community, and for the devs.

Please read what I wrote more carefully. Public relations is not about just promotion of the game to the press. This wouldn’t be about promoting the game although, the game only exists because there’s a Community. If people leave and no one comes to replace them, it will die. So, despite the fact it’s not a money making venture, they still need a certain amount of promotion to keep the game going at this level. They also need donations to keep the servers running. People are not going to play or donate if they don’t feel good about the game. Your first paragraph, @ZacKing, indicates that you don’t have great feelings about the staff here. And from what I have heard, you are far from being alone in that regard. This is why I’m saying that people who have skills with people are needed. And the idea is to make less work for the devs so they don’t have to try and do things outside of their field of expertise. As far as the CR role goes, this is not a campaign to try and get it reinstated. But I am not sure you understand why it was created in the first place. I’ve heard you complaining lots about the editor. Lots of people want different pieces added. Other people also want to see changes made. Nothing seemed to be happening with bases for a while. And then, even when we were getting pieces, they weren’t ones we needed the most. Base builders felt ignored and marginalized. CRs were created to be a liaison so that base builder needs could be heard and addressed. We also were given the powers to do the contests that had been dropped, and many people wanted to see. I know not all people want contests, and that’s why we started things like the base crawls. Which you enjoy, and you would not have without the CRs. The liaison part did not work as well as we had hoped, since, as noted, the communication structure is not good, and the structures for CRs to operate within is not well established, but the idea was again, to remove some workload from the devs, so that they didn’t have to spend so much time focused on the forums to figure out what things best to focus on. Community Representatives themselves were supposed to be a time and energy saving position for the developers. We did and still do things they don’t have the time to do. I hope this has helped you understand what the heck a CR even is.

HC has never and will never provide influence for a contest or anything else. They have in the past given out merit rewards. Their current thinking is that they will provide aethers for us to use as prizes, instead of the merits. They definitely have a limit to how many contests they will sponsor. And I think they tend to look at the scope of the event as well as to whether or not they will sponsor it, but I don’t know their thinking. Since they themselves do some costume contests, sometimes, I can’t say that your costume contest could be sponsored. But you can always try.

Yes, a fair number of base builders, at least, saw that article, and yeah, I wasn't authorized. I think their concern was twofold: one, I was representing them and they had no control over what I'd said, had no knowledge that I'd said it until it was printed, and I had had no instruction on what to say or avoid saying. There's an IP agreement to consider here that is very important. Two, not only had they not trained us, but there was nothing in place to train us with, and nothing on the horizon, which meant that such materials needed to be created. These are game developers working in their spare time on a volunteer basis. Not only do they not have the time to work on such materials if they want to continue working on the game, let's be honest: game developer curriculum does not typically contain classes on public relations, community relations, and human resources, so not only do they face a time crunch to develop any such materials, they face trying to create things they do not have the training to do. That's why, I think the priority before even attempting to bring back any CRs should be finding NON tech volunteers to help with the business and human side of things. People who can help build community relations. People who can perhaps project manage to improve workflow and communication. And I'd like to see more trust and flexibility. I am sure you can have flexibility when you have trust and not have people violate your IP. And yes, perhaps an organization that trusted more could have looked at what I said, which was entirely positive and beneficial to HC, but unauthorized, and could have taken my history into consideration and accepted my intentions as good and in line with organizational goals, and then done as you said, told me not to speak to the press without authorization, and trusted that I would have followed that directive. However, it's very possible there are more hidden rules that I am unaware of, and so it came back to "we can't train you now". But again, I feel like if there was more trust and openness, they could have discussed their dilemma with us before arriving at a decision, even if that decision had to be the same one, instead of deciding, executing the decision, and then telling us it was done. It seems to me an organization should be able to trust that people who are so dedicated and who have even BEEN through the training, can be trusted to say things within the guidelines, but that does not seem to be the case. I think someone with training in business administration would be able to set up a system where there was more openness, communication, and trust, and I think people would respond positively to that. This would benefit the game tremendously, because the devs would have more time to devote to the game development instead of the non-dev stuff, and, it should improve the working environment and community relations, which imo have not really been addressed much at all. They are doing their best to work within the framework of rules that have been established, but I think it'd be worth looking at those rules with someone whose training and experience can evaluate which are good and necessary, and which are impediments to long term viability. Mind you, no one asked me, but I'm going to put it out there anyway. 🙂

It's possible that it's a new policy(?) because we were deactivated. It was news to me, so it's possible they just decided to do that. I doubt it's just for base builders, but, of course, whether or not they decide to provide rewards is at their discretion, and I know, previously, I was told, "not too many or too often". That was vague, and never defined for me, but that holds; so if a contest is not HC backed by rewards and titles, it's likely that they've decided they've done enough in that area for now. Again, it's clear, it's at their discretion, but it's also clear in an opaque sort of way, that they don't have a set idea in place of how many or how often. Or all the titles they give for costumes have tired them out. 🙂 (Smol joke)

@twozerofoxtrot, I don't believe that HC traditionally publicly addresses staff comings and goings. At least, I have not seen them particularly doing so. For example, when the base dev retired, she was the one who posted about it. I do think it would do much to help build a relationship with the community, however, if they did show more openness about what is going on. I realize they feel very distant to the community, but I am not sure they realize HOW insular they appear. We knew they were not going to address the issue, just from past experience, but we also realized, that since they had already taken down the titles and CR character names, people would quickly notice. We are quite visible, especially since we were in the middle of the Tech/Sci Fi Base Showcase. So it had to be announced immediately. EB and I prefer to be as open as possible. That's how trust is built, and the response from the community to us on a regular basis shows me that we are generally well regarded and have a relationship here. 🙂 I appreciate all views expressed here, the support, the concern, I think it's all valuable to us and to HC as feedback. And the more views expressed, the more weight can be given to the topics being brought up. 🙂

No, specifically, they have said that gold titles and prizes will still be provided from HC, and not just for us, anyone can submit a request.

they are now allowing others to do contests; and apparently, that was always the case, we just did not know it. 🙂 They can still refuse to support a contest if they think there are too many or for whatever reason. But yes, that does seem counterintuitive.

Just to be sure all are clear: the videos were mine before I was CR, and are not a part of being a CR. HC has nothing to do with their production. It's just the place where I make them. 🙂

Yesterday, we were informed that the Homecoming City Council has decided to dissolve the Community Representative role. This means, effective immediately, the Base CRs are not officially CRs anymore, and no other CRs will be assigned for any HC faction or group. The City Council cites the reason for this change is that an official role within the community requires ongoing oversight and support. And they have determined that they are not currently able to provide the level of support they feel the position deserves, and hope to bring it back at some point if they are able to give it the support it needs. However, they assure us that they value our insight and communication, and still would like to hear from us, but informally. What does this mean for you? Probably very little! We, Dacy and Easter Bunny, are still committed to being just as present, helpful and transparent as we’ve always been. We will continue to help those in need on Discord, on the forums, and on the in-game Base Building channel. We will also continue to maintain the new Base Directory (so, please, continue to add your bases!) We are also committed to continuing the Base Showcases. Not just the current one for Tech but for all remaining categories as well. What is not certain is the fate of the Official HC Base Contests or our role in them. We will be taking a hard look at whether or not we feel that the community would want us to run another such contest, and if there would be good participation, and if we have the motivation to do so. Would the community consider it an "Official HC Contest" if we are no longer official? That's not important to whether or not the contest is held, but does hold relevance to the titles. And it gives us some indication as to whether you, the community, still want us to act as your reps in an albeit unofficial capacity. However, on the topic of base contests, the City Council has informed us that any player is always welcome to reach out to the Game Masters and ask for their support and participation in events. They are willing to support contests with titles and merit rewards, to some extent. This means that now YOU can host base contests of your own! All contests must be submitted well ahead of time for approval, and approval is at the discretion of the City Council. If interested, please submit a Support Request or contact a Lead GM. Your request should be forwarded to the appropriate people. We continue to appreciate this community, and we feel blessed for all of the wonderful people we've met and gotten to know, and all the amazing bases we've watched (and sometimes helped) you build! Thank you for being such a wonderful community. Your former CRs, Easter Bunny and Dacy

Avyanna, Escape (oldtimers) is a park, so that's better in the Natural showcase. Finite-12021 is an incorrect code.

This means you placed it on the default grid. Changing the grid selection will change the measurements. (that's not a critique, that's just an fyi for everyone who may not have known that.)

I had to remove this from the hub listing because listing the bases in the directory is required for me to put it in the hub. I sent you messages, and you said you'd do it, but it never was done. If you add it now, I will return it to the hub listing.

@Elfis, I will be on much of today, off and on, and I sent you a global request.

👍 Thank you, Etched. Just a reminder to all, I created a topic just to complain about the editor, or tell us what you'd like to see, so, that's perhaps a better place for such discussions/arguments; it would be awesome if folks could remember that we're all different and do things differently and see things differently, which includes the functioning of the editor. Some people look at it, experience it, hate it and see problems. Some people look at it, experience it, work with it, and see possibilities. It has both! 🙂 Personally I hope that the people who are experiencing problems will eventually start to see more of the potential and possibilities the editor can offer, even tho it is not automating much for you. Hopefully I can get online at the same time as @Elfis soon, so we can see what's going on. *veers back to topic at hand* 🙂

Do you want comments, and where would you want those sent, if so? To what global or email or in the guestbook of the directory...?

I think there is, perhaps, a human tendency to feel like one's own experience is similar to others'. Etched, those kinds of speeds are something you and I might be comfortable with, but I suspect that you are going to see fast editing speed from people with not only fast keyboarding skills, but those who are also comfortable with the editor and use it frequently. Which would mean, even some very experienced editors won't be so fast. Clearly Elfis is not someone who is comfortable with the editor; they do not trust the editor at all, so how could they be comfortable with it? (Not referring to skill, merely trust, here. I trust the editor to do what I want it to do 95% of the time; for the other 5%, when it does something I don't want it to do, I can immediately correct it, and it rarely even slows me down much; this, I'm realizing, is a luxury that affords me a great deal of speed, but it comes from a great deal of editing time, and from learning many ins and outs regarding the editor.) Telling people how much faster you are doesn't help them become faster, it only makes them feel discouraged. 😞 Let's think about how we can communicate hope for improvement and accept the truths of where people are now with their editing? I know I myself need to work on this. And Elfis, I'm sorry the editor has given you such problems! I hope that, with some experience, it gets easier, faster, and less problematic. Fast placement speeds are not going to apply to every base, even for a fast editor. In a high count base, there will be longer placement times per item, and a higher chance for the editor to pull a fast switch when you're placing the item. Things I've found that help there are 1.) if you are doing several moves with an item, such as turning it with clicks, then rotating it at an angle, then moving it across the floor to position it, and it does something wonky, try doing those things in separate moves. Place and rotate. Angle it. Move it. Takes a little longer, but not as long as repeating everything you did several times because the memory processing won't let it let you finish the placement. Also, on that final placement, get it in position and pause before clicking to release, because it's basically lagging here. The program rewrites the entire base every time you move one piece, so the bigger the base, the more it has to do with each move. The interaction between the system requirements and your computer system and your internet and even what base it is all work together to determine how easy and fast it is to place things. Elfis, could I come into your base and place the water where you want it, and place some markers next to the NPCs and in a few other places so I can better see what is moving where, and how much? And do you have any other bases where you've seen this? Some bases, as I mentioned above, actually do seem to be more difficult to work in than others, and I'm curious if you've seen this in other builds. If the problem shows itself again, I'll report it, and maybe take a demorecord so they can see what's going on.

No, as in, the empowerment buffs are not retrieved items, they are created in the base, so they are not kept in storage. It's just the things you put in and then later take out that are part of the base code.

That's a lot of checking; I just watch the item window. Also, angling your camera down so you are focusing on fewer items when building is very helpful. Not only do you not grab so many things accidentally, but if you do and you're not in the habit of holding on to control as you work (that's me, I hold control most of the time), items won't scoot across the base if you DO accidentally grab them. The editor can swap out items sometimes after you've selected and positioned them as you place them, but this has happened to me only when the base is very full of items. So, you carefully did not move it, but you did not answer whether or not you'd re-positioned it and seen it repeat the sinking or not.

The grid thing should only change the height of the water if they had the water selected and changed the grid. But ohhh...that's a BIG item. I bet it's easy to grab accidentally. Have you edited the base since placing the water before you noticed changes? In other words, did you edit, but didn't think you touched the water, but then saw that the water level had dropped?