Duck-Smokes-Quack

Haha the main man himself! Do you have a version of your build please for comparission? For some reason i cant open those COHplanner links youve send in previous responses 😢 A data chunk export would be great if youre able to please

Thanks for sharing! I'm a bit late to the party on this build just wondering what your attack chains are like? ST: MG > Smite > SL > Smite (and repeat? refreshing Soul drain whenever needed) AoE: Sheild Charge > Fireball > SM ? When if ever do you use DC? Do you ever use Char? Melt Armor? I am really intersted in running a Dark/Sheild but just trying to wrap my head around the concept

I know people like to say theres no reason to play Brutes ... but i would kind of like one I was thinking this might be a good combo? but maybe a tank does it better im not sure Pro Brute Def (mainly) set, less about resists Double taunt aura = fury skip shadow punch Pro Tank More HP benifits Hoarfros and Siphon life Bigger AoEs (is this correct?) Bigger resists What do we think?

Hi guys, I havnt had the ability to play for a long time for reasons I wont go into. I was just checking the forums because it had been a while as was shocked to find I have fully missed i27! Living under a rock 😉 i guess Earth blaster sounds so appealing to me! But how is it? Damage? Animations? Effects? Slotting? All that jazz Im not a super crazy min/maxer - but i like to know that the DPS is cometative at least If anyone has experience with the sets and would care to share their thoughts that would be something amazing to read as a I dream of one day being able to get back to my beloved CoH again Thanks!

@Galaxy Brain Incredible work as always. I always enjoy reading your findings, truely a pleasure Ive taken a bit of a break from the game more recently, trying to get back into it. Whats your take on Martial Arts as a set? Seems to do quite well with a good IO build, but its AoE is just so bad it seems that its doomed to be near the bottom of most testing lists

So you may be getting confused between resistance and defence Defence - the soft cap is 45% for reasons explained in great detail in other posts. This is the same for all Archetypes and is something a lot of people aim for when building a character. You can get way more defence than this by it has dimishing returns and isnt really worth it for non Tank/Brute/Scrapper toons without any DDR Resistance - the hard cap for resistance varies depending on archetype. Resitsance has a hardcap for example if you are a tanker with 90% resistance to smashing damge and get hit by an attack that hits for 100 you will only take 10 damage. There is no way to take any less damage than this from the attack thats why its a hardcap. Tank & Brute = 90% Peacebringer & Warshade = 85% The rest = 75% Obviously the best case scenario is to layer both defence and resitance, thats why sets like Invincability are so tanky. To use my above example again if you have 90% Smashing and also have 45% defence to either Melee/Smashing you barely ever get hit! and when you do get hit its only for 10% of the damage. Most squishy toons like Blasters/Defenders/Controllers often build only for defence for a couple of reasons: Set bonus give barely any Resistance but loads of Defence Defence is better than Resitance in terms of performance for squishy toons like those mentioned hope this helped a bit

I dont agree with this logic for a few reasons: SS + SJ are two distinct trees so why should that be comparable to the highest tier of a single tree? SS + SJ are very very active to use - you cant just go grab a drink when flying accross the shadow shard lets say. Flights ease of use and versitility are why it should always be the slowest. If flight was the fastest/join fastest there would be almost no reason to pick anything else (apart from SS for indoors) since it has unmatched compelted 3d mobility Flight is too powerful to not be the slowest

Astonished to see this thread so heated The one thing ive always long for were changes to travel powers (my no.1 thing was always for SS to run on water) Its great to see the tweaks IMO Fly - brain dead to use, unmatched mobility should always be the slowest. I thought that was obvious but apparntly not Jump - is very active but also such nice mobility that should always come in 3rd Super Speed - least mobility and so rightly is the fastest and always should be since the vertical sacrifice is so great, very active like SJ since few zones are like IP where you can just set and forget autorun Teleport - its own special thing - it used to be by far the most "difficult" to use and had/has the highest potential in return. Maybe the 15s hover buff is too generous? But imo TP should always be king for speed I think these chanes are cool and love them - not sure why people seem so angry (mostly about fly) Fly deserves to be the slowest.

This is something I have wanted for the longest time. I made a post once about Travel power customization, basically: Mystic Flight + Translocate Speed of Sound + Jaunt Warshade Teleport Peacebringer Flight Are all "normal" powers with cosmetic changes thrown in (Exception being jaunt which seems to be teleport with a massively or completley removed cast time) The powers should pave the way for Travel Customization imo Personally for Super Speed specifically I would like to see: Add the option to have the Afterburner "sonic boom" aura. Themeatically is makes sense since the run speed cap of 92.5mph is still faster than the flight speed cap even with Afterburner. And it would just look so fuckng cool Run on water! Yes yes yes and again yes. I dont know if its that easy to make happen for the dev team - but I suspect that since the water can already become "frozen" during the winter events if having Super Speed enabled would allow you to interact with the water as though it were Ice (without the slide) that could work? Although i doubt you would be able to stop running and fall into the water ... much more likely that while SS is on you stand on water even when stationary I have loads of other ideas of how to improve travel powers even just asthetically. The main thing for me is replayability for a game to thrive: Endgame content which the game lacks to some extent. Normally people playing their toons post 50+3 are speed running TFs etc as a form of end game (or maybe completionist badger/all archs types) The other major part is loving your character. Be it the costume / the bio / the feel / the way they move around thats what really keeps you playing a character! Its not just about getting a TW/Bio scrapper - its fun for 5mins being OP but if you dont love the character hes doomed to gather dust. Same goes for things like Ill/Rad trollers - its fun to solo a GM, but if you dont love the characters feel you wont play it much. My long time main is a MA/SR scrapper - neither set stands out. Someone even call them boring +or underpowered ... maybe they are right, and yet its my main toon. Why? because i love the "lore" of the character. I love running zipping around as fast as the server will physcially let me and leaving the afterimage of /SR as run - and i love it FAR more than i love some of my other objectivly "better" toons. Travel powers for me have always been so important in terms of building your characters concept. You have to think about how they get around and what makes sense for them. The current trend on forums in the min/max crowd is that Sprint/Ninja Run and temp jetpacks are good enough for every build and that travel powers are a waste of a pick. I will always disagree (unless thematically your character uses that like a Ninja/Natural/normal type) and think travel powers are fanastic. I actually disagreed with the change to make them available at level 4 with no prior pick. I think they should still be level 14 (but with no prior pick) to make those low levels feel fresh again. Maybe I just want the good old days back. Where a team would run through Hollows on foot together and everyone would be so jelous of the WS/PB with their travel power getting to the mission first. Now 90% of the player base takes Super Speed / Mystic Flight at level 4 and nobody ever stops to smell the roses agian *Sorry went off on huge rant - yes Super Speed run on water GIVE!

I thought my graphics card was playing up first time it happened to me the other day Disgusting I manually canceled the buff (as i do with non min fx ice sheilds) Maybe the indavidual character should be able to choose? Like you can toggle on/off teleport prompt toggle on/off costume/aura changes provided by others (with the exception of stealth see through?( Just a thought

Hey thanks dont know how I managed to not find this! Must have been the colon throwing off the search

Sorry to bring up an old thread but Ive just been gleefully updating my MA/SR build (having previously not known this proc existed thanks to an outdated mids version) But I come here to find that theres no benifit slotting more than 1 in an auto power? My search fu is failing me but do you know if this was ever a confirmed bug that is going to be fixed? Or is this how it is? (I dont mind it being a unqiue if they intend to change it - it would just be good to know!)

Hold hell that build is juicy @Werner bet it plays like a beast! Stacking stuns from OG and /MA Build up with FC followed by a second mini build up when going EC > DT (CAK ST) Do it not run into end trouble? (I know you love to solo - ive seen your solo MoITF +4 thread, gz) The slotting for -slow resist is incredible. When testing on the beta server i very, very quickly realized "holy shit im unkillable on Dark/) The only i enocountered where i thought I may actually die were anything with -rech leaving me unable to Dark Regen - that 80% figure you managed to achieve is magnificant im deinantly going to have to look at adding that into my Dark/Ice build Finally more of a comment than a question but holy is /MA strong on tanks! makes the +def from weapon sets seem pathetic in comparison

Strange one but I was looking into exactly how much KB protection its worth getting for a Tank who lacks it This Wiki page lists every KB/KB attack in the game! https://archive.paragonwiki.com/wiki/Knockback/Enemies_with_Knockback_Powers Plugging it into Excel shows the following - % of in game attacks you are protected from 4pts KB prot - 84.44% 8pts KB prot - 94.17% 12pts KB prot - 97.24% 15pts KB prot - 97.66% Im sure others have worked this out before but I just found it really interesting. I would definatly argue that a Dark/ Fire/ tank should have 8pts minimum - personally now knowing this I wouldnt settle for anything less than 12 (going beyond that seems to be a fools errand) I guess now whenever I see someone suggest "go for 12" I know know why

Youre right - guess i lost sight of why 32.5% was an important number (doh) forget it was only significant because it was a small purple away. My mistake., i was thinking it was something more than that. Again, call me old fashioned but incarnates, temps, none of them feature for me when considering a build. new build looks SUPER solid! Wow that god damn slow and rech resist! Holy hell great job dude - now i need to rethink everythig to improve mine! Also love seeing gloom haha Top notch build

Hey nice build! As i said i dont like building with incarnates in mind so i dont like to build with barieer in mind (not to say i wont use it) but i like it to be the cherry on top and not part of the core cake if that makes sense? There are some things I like and dislike about your build: Like Better M/S/L defences (although still not at 45% - for me 32.5% or 45%, theres no point being inbetween) Slow resists! Specicially the -rech resist! youre up to 50% which is great! From my testing on the beta server the only thing that could potentially kill my build was massive amounts of -rech. Now i didnt actually die, but the only time i ever even thought "holy hell this is getting sticky" was soloing +4x8 Arachnos is PI - those -rech debuffs STACK up. Im 100% gona look to add a slot to my Frozen Fist to 5 slot the Blistering cold and ditch Kinetic combat. Which will bring me to 35%, not quite youre 50 but i just dont see how i can fit another set in ... hmmm Dislike Higher end consumption, I can always turn Tactics off if ends a problem, which it isnt unless facing 10+ level 54 sapper types Low +ToHit, no Tactics or even a Kismet in there? Very low KB protection - from everything Ive read about KB for Fire/ + Dark/+ you want 12 and then the only the very niche things will get you Ice Sword - looks cool. Low DPA and with so many attacks do you even need it for a rotation? Hover - (but thats just a matter of taste - nothing objectivly wrong with Hover tanking) I dont think the build really needs or benifits greatly from hasten. Your Dark Regeneration recharges less than 1 second faster than mine and i dont use hasten) Epic choice - For me Gloom is too good to pass up, its better than every single /Ice power apart from Freezing Touch, and it fits thematically with Dark. I definatly wana try and wiggle in some more -rech resist but need to keep thinking For anyone interested this is currently the V3.0 of my build | Copy & Paste this data into Mids' Reborn : Hero Designer to view the build | |-------------------------------------------------------------------| |MxDz;1453;689;1378;HEX;| |78DA65944B6F125114C7EF3083150A6DE903FAA2A5B4150A6500EBC647D3A8B5DA5| |A12B4A65B42706C49B190A14D7469627D6C75E16770E3D667F45BF8FE0A551335A9| |0B83A7F3FF4B35DC00BFB9FF7BCEB9E79E3397DC8D79DF93F3B7E694E63B5B29D6E| |B852BC5CD0DCB76E78A6BE59292E19F2FDA1BE9C59215599D31336DA20CC0A4306F| |5DB336EB96B96F50386D5FAFDA41AEE4AC8A6599E28327E5CB57AB1573A56A972CF| |BA6DF992C94D7D6B7CA9B6B9DCE6CD92A5EB5ECFA7AB9E6FB3BAFC962E85CAD5C32| |CFD8DB5B5661A5BA5D29E48AF52D09D12F594CCAF799477EB4FD2C1B86FAA52B953| |594EB27F903344C0D4C83835EC5D1D0555E103554EC12387D194CAF80CF25BEC6F8| |5ABF3C840D75284432FE61EEE7DB038725BE8EF86EFDB6019B1DD07B87BC0BFAEE8| |1D9FBE00BD9CFCDFDDC8CDFC1F81D8CDFC5F374F13C2FC5A7CD2942C3DD36079BEE| |5932079BDE6EDDC9B9B7030C06C0B0E4EA41AECA537339B6AF4468470EEEF625C40| |92E80FD8BE44530D587F8A9EF983F155F3FCFEE7F0B6DF01DF99EF5F9407E04473E| |91924B2773E94C2A477B284D0E40D3029F91DFF410EC47C5BE87F63D63B077C9EBD| |947AD6F07F6BA68219C470F1DE55EAC6184358C24C0D792FF006CD5C0206246649F| |219E69288698913838364526C824982D88794CDE39D93BCC7E8659CB71D6729CB51| |CBFF07F2D03E2334A9F51FA4CD06782B613F4CDD227283E51F868D13DE5F436FD1B| |8C7A7157F6E34D1E477E474E9027C953606C162C49F8387DE229685326992633602| |20BF6480E49E690643FA61F63AD57D64CF6C564CE6FA4D6196A19F67BD868DE4DF9| |C8505346F38637122DAB991625DBA2CCB428C75A94E516256F705B513447F17435E| |F7563D7DBFC5F505A0AB97F3DD0746D4973FA1F5BC5591363E8577A17FCF2AF7F1C| |FEDF0E3497168136F280357E04FE01FAE3D7F5| |-------------------------------------------------------------------|

Please tell me you can Eagle Claw whilst Granite+Rooted? What a sight that would be to behold

would still really love to see the build if you dont mind sharing? I guess using Rune is kind of cheating 😅 just swapping one mguffin (Aid self) for another (Rune) both with the same goal as trying to make /SR tougher - in an ideal world we would solve both issues giving SR a heal and res, but the game really doesnt work that way. The overwhelming majority of IOs give pitiful +res bonuss and so its always a challenge to get those numbers up. I have always personally seen how difficult it is to build for +res & with how hard it is to build for any meaingful levels of regen on SR that i couldnt imagine not going with the Aid Self route. Especially with how much investment it takes to get Rune of Prot in the first place with 3 x power picks (1 travel power, and a choice between a bad ST ranged attack or an ally buff that doesnt help you)

Care to share a build? I like the sound of all those +res! but whenever I have tried to do it it realy hinders other aspects of the builds (particularly MA/ and KA/ very fast attack chains) I also disagree about Aid Self 😜 but each to their own

Katana best single target DPS chain is GD>GC>SD>GC and repeat which needs lots of recharge (which is great because /SR gives you +20% rech speed which helps a lot) Skip Divine Avalanche (/SR doesnt need the extra Def), Sting of the wasp (worse than Gamblers cut in everyway) and the taunt (no need on scrapper i find) Super Reflexes Take ALL powers apart from Elude (Elude is worthless, best thing about it is the animation) Pool Powers Hasten (for the high recharge needed for Katana attack chain) Tough + Weave (Weave is a must to help get /SR to the oh so important Defence cap - as a side note if you dont already know with /SR you want 45% defence minumium in Melee/Ranged/AoE - its the whole point of the se) Tough im sure someone people will disagree with me but for a set with no native resists (apart from the scaling as youre dying) tough helps a lot AID SELF - seriously for me its a MUST have on /SR (unless you have DM/ as a primary) it really is imporant Epic Powers My main is a MA/SR which is actually VERY similar to KA/SR - I find that with the high recharge attack chain I absolute chew through endurance so I took Body Mastery for Conserve power and physical perfection (my conserve power is up 1/2 the time, but i dont actually "need" it - dont have to slow down my attacks when its on CD, its just a 1 slot wonder to get physcial perfection unlocked I really dont like building relying on incarnates - so i fixed my end problems without needing Cardiac, which allowed me to take Musculture for MOAR DAMAGE *Note MA/ is way more of an end hog than KA/ so you may be fine without Body Mastery perhaps im not sure I adapted my MA/SR to a KA/SR for you to take a look at and consider. Now im looking I cant actually believe how similar MA/ and KA/ are - even in terms of slotting, i never realsied Anyway heres the build! hope i helped | Copy & Paste this data into Mids' Reborn : Hero Designer to view the build | |-------------------------------------------------------------------| |MxDz;1461;677;1354;HEX;| |78DA6593DB6E12511885F7C05484722C605B29E7729629A8379E62D45613294A3B4| |D6F7184DD4A42800026EDA50FA026D5C43730F1C65730DE7A7C120F89F1C20B833F| |F32FA74D98B4F9D86BEFB5F7FAF7A17EB0EE7E7BE7C975A1786F758DD1A8A9B786C| |66020870EBDD591BD9614F4B96A37CAFA7662B7AA551CD40CFF1FD3ACCBAE945ACD| |181B3D236EA9EB724FF64652D31F4F5BDB72AF2B0FE448B81AFD7E57D30752B6DDE| |6CF4D690C3ABD7D8FD9B8DDD97F34B65A75D9EEB43A3D19D818745ADACD7EFBB059| |374663393C5CA20059FA7F3A4D627E933991B3095155852D0F16986A112C314FBD2| |70655519F7A15785D8AD9B73A0FBA99590FE8057DCC670E58C9AB7CB0F3BC1F99A7| |3F819F99AE2FE057669ABC76F60A7B5998DA3DD2E6388B3A87B572582B876C39642| |920E37DF23890DFF1971055853FC47D7E3FF34C180C32D702CC06799DEC15CE2467| |784EDA3CE752E64BACC5DED05E85C84F7D1E1EAF78306735C2F56C519F8FFBECBE1| |A6B4BC8B1841C69788E686C80D7500397F83C162E835798A1ABE035E6367982C81A| |C47EA5480B234F1859CBA0427D8BD8DFC5097DE20529CB38ADE5554E78360366992| |B3930CBABAEBDE35BA2933782EA22BF7082A82E8DEA56519D9DC646718AD145C53C| |91D879F6C4FE3093BF996B15E64BF2C4912DFE4035B584013E045BCC641B94CC1DF| |2A6B05E0AB7A6805B53C0AD29E2B614717B54F264E0C9A08E22EA38B7C02CA39E32| |6E4D943C79EC68DEDCD1382925566CA51DB875708BA953811A5C1ACEE6B547880AC| |EB2F28A777A45B5DE30FD99B3ABD6CB9C14677A2B334A7546B930A35C9C51364F2A| |4ECED250AD772D94086776FAADF73AF9E6A27EE45770177F1C6BAAB2CBB5BB937CB| |AEEBBD4CED15B4970BB1A637E3F394F9EE7F979ACD994046BDE23CEE5C55ED58A56| |E6C93F1775CB4F| |-------------------------------------------------------------------|

Thanks so much for the feedback, im glad im on the right track. Not too sure how concerned about Toxic I should be? From what I gather is relativly uncommon as a damage type. Just to be sure I went over to the test server and tried my luck north of PI on monster island - aggroed a bunch (I heard the mushroom ones do a lot of toxic) and was just fine so I think its ok? What makes you think the damage will be good? It seemed OK in solo testing but I dont really know what kind of damage tanks do in all honesty. Just curious what youre seeing I dont even have boxing on the bar and wouldnt use kick if I had it either in all honesty I dont think. Could be a good idea as a 1 slot wonder though? For those times when i get massive -rech buffs from Arachnos + others - pop a kick and pray to the rng gods its procs and you can use Dark Regen again OG seems a bit annoying with the wandering off. Since I have Ice patch anyway maybe its not needed - could be worth dropping i suppose Darkest night looks good! but not really sure how to jig around the slots to allow me to slot and run it. Youre 100% right about the end usage - when playing it seemed to be right on the line between viable. I eneded up slotting the Cardiac alpha on the beta to help with testing. Any ideas with how to help? I notice the ATO in death shroud only reduces end by 39% which is far from great (also i could turn tactics off depending on situation) ... I really dont like building with incarnates in mind (call me crazy) but i prefer to have a solid build thats just improved even further by incarnates - rather than *needing* cardiac to make a build function. Another annoying thing is teh lack of end reduction the Purple sets bring ... tough

So no takers yet in terms of feedback? Well I have been playing around somewhat with some ideas to increase the DPS. I added up the total DPA value of various powers with various slotting - i dont know if this is in anyway meaningful? or maybe Im going down the wrong track chasing DPA but i found the best attack slotting to increase damage was to 6 slot Frost with Tanker Guanlet Fist to allow Freezing Touch to get double damage procs + Damage proc in Frozen aura (rather than a seemingly useless heal proc) Any thoughts? I know Ice Melee is very unpopular so not expecting a lot of interest in the /Ice part, but some Dark/ experts might be able to let me know if im doing any of it right? Or overchasing E res and neglecting defence? Feedback welcome and wanted! (Its so Dark, Cold and lonely in here ... and not just becuase of my power choices 😋) V2.0 below | Copy & Paste this data into Mids' Reborn : Hero Designer to view the build | |-------------------------------------------------------------------| |MxDz;1449;683;1366;HEX;| |78DA65945B6F12511485CF74062B945EE8057AA3A5B4150A6560D417B54DA3D66A6| |B49D09ABE1282634B8A850C6DA28F265E5FF5C1DFE08BAF5EA3FFC2FB5FA89AA889| |3E18DCCC5A520D13E0E3ACB3F73E6BF666C85E5BF43F3E7B634169FED3E542AD96B| |F54D8DEB21D4FB6B0512A2AB93A160BCE567AB96847D6AD76590F2120BF685FB1B7| |6BB6D9D8CE9F74AE569C2077B276D9B64DC9C037E5CF552A6573ADE2146DE77AA7B| |B582A6D6CEE94B637BADDD5AA5DB86C3BB5CD52D5FF775D95CDD0996AA9689E7276| |77ECFC5A65B79CCF166A3B5262505C4CCBFBA9573EB486C7BAA17EE94A59866AFB4| |17E070D5303D3E0B04FF1AAEB2A27881A2A76019CBD085A6BE033A9AFB1BE36285F| |C2863A102259FF20CFF3FF0447A5BE8EFA1EFDA681985BA0EF367907F4DF05AD7BE| |07339CFC3F33CACDFC5FA5DACDFC3FBE9E1FDBC909C76B709754FFB02627AE7C939| |B0BF57773DF77781C1001816AF5E7855DE6A9B1BFB52840E78F074AC203FB8040E2| |E93E7C1D4003CA4BE61FD44723B99DBF906DAF05BF21DFBF39EFC008E7D24C54B37| |BD742795AB3D902107A069814FF0373B82F87189EF637CDF04E235F9790E501BA8C| |BA574514270A4870EF3247630C20E4612E02B713F845835348C8A11396584D31C89| |C141240E4ECC900932095A79098FC92F4ECE0E739A617672929D9C642727CFFDDFC| |980E48C33679C3953CC9962EC1473D3CC094A4E14395A945AFAB772271CF5E14969| |D49B3E067F878E9327C83930360F16A57C9C39F114B419934C93193061817DE2214| |90F494E63F611F6FA65CFE4544CFA7B2DBDCE50CB70DAA346F3C99457637A3346F3| |F9AE275A76332D8AD5A21C69518EB628AB2D4ACEE0B1A268AEE2ED693ED5F53D5FF| |35F41692978FFB2AFE9DA8AE6CE3FB68E7B4D4C705E7BE0E77FF3E3C8FFBAAFB569| |116863F7D9E387E01F4B13D9F6| |-------------------------------------------------------------------|

That is a hidden pearl of wisdom! I had no idea, very very good to know

Hi guys, Dont have a much experience with tanks or these two sets in particular so hopefully im not too far off the mark here I went for 32.5% Def S/L + M (farily standard for a non Weapon secondary Dark/ ?) It seemed like the choice was between going for 45% S/L + M vs improving the Energy resist hole on Dark/ ... i went for the latter. I don't know if I've gone for too much Energy resist? The Tanker ATO+res i put into Death Shroud since it seems to be the done thing, if that is almost always going to be 2 stacked maybe that means I can ease off the Energy resist chasing a bit and go for Def instead? Main questions: Is the build any good + how can it be improved? Gloom worth it for Tankers? is it a huge ST DPS increase like it is for Brutes or less important for a Tank? Endurance ... I dont like to build with Incarnates in mind so not sure how the end use looks - might have to end up going Cardiac if its too bad What do you think? | Copy & Paste this data into Mids' Reborn : Hero Designer to view the build | |-------------------------------------------------------------------| |MxDz;1449;684;1368;HEX;| |78DA65944B4F13611486BF61A6624BB9944B0B94422920A5D0692BA85121444514A| |44915C3B669EA080D953653487469E275AB0B7F831BB75EA36BFF80F7BF809AA889| |2E4C3D9DF7B5683A69FBCCF77EE7F69D33D3F4D505EFA333D7E795E63D55CC552AD| |98BB9AD4DCB76A573EB85BC92AB6521676F2696F256782DD52CEB3E186417ACCBD6| |56C5326BDBD913F69592EDE74EDA2A5A96291EB853DE4CA95434574B76DEB2AFB53| |A8BC5C2FAC676616BBDDD59AD58B94B965DD92894BD7FD765D90C9C2E17F2E6497B| |67DBCAAE96768AD974AEB22D217AA58A31F93E71CB8F56ABB16AA85FBA52294335F| |D20BF8386A98109B0DFA37855759511440C35751E4C5D2057C1A7125F637CAD576E| |4286DA1720197F3FF3797F8203125F477C439F6E82CD0CE839441E06BD47C06792C| |7C53C2EC66D63DC36C6EDE0393A788EE7E2D3EC1CBEEA6A9E874DE71C390B7677EA| |4EADDD6DA0DF0786A446376A54EE326A7821420B6A70B52CC3DFBF08F62E91E7C07| |80F6A887FC3FAB1F8B6229EABF50DB4FEB7E43BF6E53DF9011CFC484A2DEDACA57D| |5239DA7D19AE0F9AE6FB84FAA682B01F12FB2EDA770DC35E93C7B2875A4F552EA58| |B12C069F4C041666207C3EC603806BE94EAFB60ABFAFA11312C59823C51F08601ED| |26387C8BBC4DDE0153774143728738CD103B39C24E8EB0932367FFEFA44F7C86E83| |3449F51FA8CD27694BE09FAF8C527021F2D422DF15B39138E78F086D4EA1F3B8A0E| |1E38461E2767C1F139F23562E4254D944F70348EBD09934C9049309602BBA496494| |E6C9253997A88BD6ED933391D9375BE929E27A92539F501A3FE66CAA736C509A3FE| |7E57630DBBC90625D5A04C3728330DCA4A839231985614CD51DC1DF5B7BABAEBA9F| |F2B282D8EDABFEC69BAB62C37E3D2CF359C3536CCB9ED829FFFF58FC2FFEB9ED6A4| |85A10DDE638F1F807F009E1DDAA5| |-------------------------------------------------------------------|

Nice guide, Ice/ doesnt get a lot of love round these parts, and those that support it seem to be the exception to the rule. I can't say ive ever taken an Ice/ tank very far - in fact recently I tried Ice/WM but got bored of it ... it could have been the secondary that was the problem though. On paper Ice seems quite strong. Based on your own rankings you actually seem to suggest /Ice is the best partner for Ice/ - with /Dark being a very close second. I have had it suggested to before though that Ice/Dark, Ice/ doesnt really need the tools that /Dark brings since it already has a heal, and end managment etc - all that /Dark adds is a bit of -tohit for a (mostly) Def based set. I can see an Ice/Dark being almost unkillable thought, and it certainly wont have any end issues which frees you from a burden that a lot of builds have to bear. I might get one up on the test server now i think about it and have a play and see what i think about the combo