Brutal Justice

I just don’t see why energy punch would need it also. The other archetypes have the choice. Better dpa or guaranteed stun. From level 1. It just creates a build choice which I think is a good dilemma to have. Tanks have to decide if they want to save a power pick and roll with barrage instead of getting better dpa with energy punch. It feels like an equal dilemma to me.

Making them take barrage for the stun is not much different from how they currently have to take stun for the stun. It’s actually better because barrage does more damage than current stun.

I think most end game builds probably stop using barrage even though they are forced to take it. Most of those T1 powers end up removed from power trays later in the game

It doesn’t force people. It’s a stun in a set that stuns already.

Why not just remove the bone smasher combo and add the stun combo to barrage? This allows people to build for the stun combo if they want and frees up bone smasher. It would also give tanks “something” for being stuck with barrage. It would give them some more cc which is somewhat what tanks do, and at low levels where they need it most.

Crane kick should have been the recipient of these changes to eagle’s claw. The animation matches much better. Crane kick and cobra strike are also clones in animation time and damage per activation, which makes taking both of the powers uneconomical, considering they are mediocre performers.

As a trick arrow player I am not a fan of tactical arrow getting oil slick arrow.

The sound effects and the way the animation beam hits the target, then pause, then the damage hits keeps me from sticking with one. I really enjoy the lower levels but the more attacks I get the more I notice the projectile speed doesn’t match the applied damage timing.

I don’t bother with placate or the hidden status crit. I open fights with venom grenade. The crit is 50% venom gives 20% for the whole team and prevents a double redraw going from mace, to gun, back to mace. Here are some numbers to consider concerning placate. Placate animates in 1.848 arcanatime. It provides a +50% damage crit. Other mace attack numbers. Activations listed in arcanatime. Bash - 1.584, 72.3 dam pulv - 1.716, 119 dam shatter - 2.5, 154.6 dam crowd cont - 2.244, 117.3 dam placate + shatter 1.848 + 2.5 = 4.348 seconds 0 + (154.6 *1.5)= 232 dam pulverize +shatter 1.716+2.5= 4.216 seconds 119+154.6= 273.6 dam bash + shatter 1.584+2.5= 4.084 seconds 72.3+154.6= 226.9 dam placate + shatter provides 77.3 extra damage. Anything that activates in a similar time as placate and does more than 77.3 damage will be a dps increase over placate. If you use anything other than shatter after placate that damage increase gets smaller. Placate + pulverize 1.848+1.726= 3.574 seconds 0 + (119*1.5) = 178.5 dam that’s .5 seconds faster than bash + shatter with 48.4 less damage. Without working out an attack chain I couldn’t tell you if placate into pulverize will cost you dps or not. Maybe I will try to work it out later but with a 60s recharge on placate I would guess using placate will lower your dps.

If there was increased rewards for running with those settings more people would do it. Buffed enemies and debuffed players would wreck many players, and bring back the old feeling of the game. A tank may be able to charge into that room solo, maybe survive, and possibly be able to clear it, but it’s going to take him so long that having a team outweighs any reason for him to do it other than for bragging rights. You also wouldnt be seeing fire blasters blitzing everything. Maybe they could pull and whittle things down eventually but, again, the time involved would make it purely for bragging rights. If there was a reason to run those difficulty options people would do it. It would restore team play, provide harder content, and still provide achievable challenges for those interested. The tools already exist. There is just no other reason than bragging rights to use it. Create sufficient rewards and people will chase them.

Took a minute but I found it. Edit: I thought it would link to the right page. Page 2 has the important stats. I will link this page every time. @Galaxy Brain did some quality work that everybody considering regen’s performance and proposed changes should read. Sentinel version just makes regen more lazy with lower performance than the current scrapper version. Displayed by the scrapinel numbers at the bottom of page 2.

The reason toggle IH was so much better than the click version is not only because it was perma. It’s also because of how people try to use it as a click. I feel like a lot of people try to use IH as a save click. Clicking it when they start to notice they are in trouble, hoping it will save them. It’s much better used as a preventative click. Proactive instead of reactive. As a toggle it filled that proactive role and performed much higher. Perma IH is obviously much better than non perma, but if you want to get the most mileage out of the current version, that is how it should be used. Current MoG is the same way, much better proactive than reactive. Regen is a set that requires a lot more awareness than a lot of other sets. It’s not “set and forget” like most sets and that’s why I like it. I don’t want it to function the same as other sets. I liked @Bopper‘s suggestions. I want to see a slew of debuff resistances. I want to see some form of perma +hp. I want a regen tank! I don’t want to see absorb. I don’t absorb, I regen! Perma +hp will help with alpha strikes and regen rate/amount. Get away with that absorb stuff.

I wish shatter armor had a different animation just because I shatter and shatter and shatter and shatter. You get it. But changing the animation to clobber wouldn’t help that much because you don’t get it until late and shatter armor has a 30s recharge while clobber has a 16s recharge. It takes a lot to be able to work it into an attack chain.

Not to be contrary but there are some important things to consider when looking at those numbers. Combined VEATs are about 2/3 as popular as stalkers. That’s not too bad considering there are only about 6 different combinations of VEATs. Night widow, blood widow, fortunate, huntsman, bane, crab. There are 15 primaries alone for stalkers. Chances are also high, if you have 50’d one path of soldier or widow you won’t do another in the same branch. This all applies to HEATs as well. Neither should ever be anything but at the bottom for popularity. It doesn’t reflect their performance. If they ever become more popular than a mainstream archetype then that archetype is having serious issues.

I feel like this covers most of the things they might need. Banes and widows fall behind scrappers for only a few reasons. The ATIOs are one of those reasons. The scrapper and stalker versions are far superior when it comes to dps output. I largely ignore the stealth crits and just open with venom grenade so I am not interested in a stalker clone ATIO. If crabs can fire a venom grenade from their arms why can’t a bane fire one from the mace? Being able to fire that one attack from the mace would make a big difference in performance and concept. Even if the mace animation was longer than the rifle animation it would “feel” better. The reason bane mace is underperforming war mace is clobber. The animation times and damage scales are largely the same for the attacks they share. Criticals also help scrapper war mace but that is an archetype characteristic and not a power set characteristic. When clobber was changed from a minimal damage stun to its current “set carrying” status, bane mace was forgotten about and left behind. If bane mace had an equivalent it would be right back in the running. Change one of the ranged mace attacks into clobber. This one change would transform banes just like it did war mace.

I avoid left handed weapons due to the run animation. Why do I have to run like that just because I’m holding something in my left hand? Kept me from playing a shield toon for a very long time even though I really wanted to. i make all lefties ninja run or beast run even if it doesn’t fit the character. I also wish I could ninja run with my weapon perma out.

I agree with the OP. I form a lot of teams. I form mostly task forces unless I am specifically trying to run some contact missions and avoid task forces... for a while. I have been thinking about why I do this and what keeps me mostly blueside. Most of the reasons, I feel, directly result in staying blue or are a byproduct of people staying blue. The list: Population - this is a big one but I think it’s partially a result of other things on the list. TF Commander vs Invader - another big one. You are doubly rewarded for doing tf’s as opposed to sf’s. I get TF Commander by just earning merits and xp. You can out level those bank jobs and not be able to come back to them. I feel if invader was tied to the sf’s and not paper missions people would run more sf’s. They did it to push a new mission system but I think it was a mistake. Defeat badges - It has already been stated that Moonfire helps to attain several defeat badges that are tied to another accolade. Penny Yin - freakshow badge. Synapse - clockwork badge. Again with the accolades and “double rewards” of task forces. Level ranges and XP - this is directly related to the OP. I know I can hit lvl 8 and start a Posi 1. Then I can tf all the way Into the mid to late 20s, sometimes farther if I’m in sync with the WST, before I even need to see a contact or get a radio. I’ve now blown through levels, earned a good chunk of merits, and put in solid work towards some valuable accolades. I feel these couple things greatly affect side population. The bang for your buck is so much higher for tf’s than sf’s. People join tf’s much more than normal missions because they also earn merits, not just the mission holder. If the Devs could rework merit rewards for story arc completions to reward teammates as well in some manner, then I think that would help contact mission teams form and subsequently help redside as well, since that is the main gameplay redside. Create a Wretch 1 and 2 with snakes and gang buster progression. Also auto exemp for paper missions so you can’t out level the banks. If you open the paper or radio you should be able to get a zone appropriate mission.

I want the coral hammer as a skin for stone melee! Wrap my hands in starfish for the punches, I don’t care, just give me that hammer!

Hack Barrage!

I suggested making it like hack from broad sword. Hack has a 1.722 damage scale, 1.33 activation, 8s recharge. Hack is the tier 1. Slash, the tier 2, has 1.05 damage scale, 1.33 cast, 4s recharge. Slice, the tier 3, has an 8s recharge as well. That’s 8, 4, 8 for recharges. (Scrapper numbers from Red Tomax) Energy melee would have 8, 4 ,8. The same attack cycle just with better single target. Which is sort of what I would like to see from energy melee. - edited this paragraph due to incorrect numbers. If barrage was improved, there really is no reason energy punch or bone smasher would need anything done to them. In fact, the point was to make barrage better than energy punch, and if you improved energy punch as well, then you defeat the purpose.

I prefer the animation of barrage to energy punch. Energy punch is pretty boring. It would also be much easier to increase the damage of barrage then to swap tiers. If barrage was a better power then tanks wouldn’t have to worry and it wouldn’t affect other archetypes because they still have the choice.

I would also like to see barrage be to energy punch what hack is to slash. It’s damage was increased at one point but not by enough. It’s a dot single target attack with a longer animation. It should be superior to energy punch.

This! I would also like to see the faster total focus ported to all versions of the animation, tremor for example. Also also, I want stalkers to have full crits instead of a special crit and a half crit. There is no reason total focus shouldn’t have a full crit when newer powersets have, equally or harder hitting attacks, that have full critical damage. Devastating blow, greater psi blade, crushing uppercut, etc. Make energy transfer crit the self damage portion also. Risk vs reward. Full critical concentrated strike as well.

I have never done this before so be brutal if I am way off! 🙂 Using the numbers from Red Tomax I tried to calculate some attack chains for the scrapper and bane. I don’t know how to calculate for criticals so take that into account in regards to the scrapper numbers. I also don’t know if these animation times include arcanatime. Scrapper chain: sh-clobber-JB- repeat damage numbers: 2.4+3.07+2.06 = 7.53 damage animation times: 2.33+1.23+1.83 = 5.39 seconds To somewhat match the bane attack chain I am going to multiply these by 4 since the scrapper can run this chain about 4 times during the bane chain. 7.53*4= 30.12 damage 5.39*4= 21.56 seconds Bane chain: VG-shatter armor-p-SH-CC SV-SA-p-SH-CC-repeat The numbers for this chain are slightly more complicated. Venom grenade, shatter armor, and surveillance all apply -20 res for 20 seconds. These are applied during the chain and then perma at -60 res after one rotation. Damage numbers: .98+(2.76*1.2)+(2.13*1.4)+(2.78*1.4)+(2.11*1.4)= 14.13 dam thats the first half of the chain 0+(2.76*1.6)+(2.13*1.6)+(2.78*1.6)+(2.11*1.6)= 15.67 dam for the second half of the chain 29.8 damage total animation times: 1.67+2.33+1.5+2.33+2+1.5+2.33+1.5+2.33+2= 19.49 seconds The bane does .32 less damage but does it 2 seconds quicker. The bane also has at least 2 pets available to add free dps. I would personally have 3. The -60 res is also multiplying your team’s damage and you’re likely giving +15 damage if not +30 damage to your team. The bane IS using a patron attack, shatter armor, in the chain. I don’t know if moonbeam adds to the scrapper attack chain. Other things to consider. The bane can slot all 3 -res procs in this chain with at least Achilles heal having a 90% fire rate. The scrapper can only slot the Fury proc. Surveillance can also take some damage procs which would replace the big fat +0 that is in the chain. I may may be way off, but without testing, the bane appears to be at least on equal footing with the scrapper, if not pulling ahead. I didn’t use any IOS in the calculations other than the obvious +recharge that would be required to run the chains. It IS possible that scrapper crits + their ATIOs cause the scrapper to pull ahead. I don’t know how to figure that out without actual testing. It may take some ramp up time but I don’t think bane mace is as lagging in regards to war mace as is perceived. Again, I don’t want to spread misinformation so tear this apart if there are errors.

I don’t have the game in front of me so I ran over to the link you provided to Red Tomax. I looked at all of the numbers on the mentioned sets but I’ll just list and comment on warmace and banemace. Bash, pulverize, shatter, and crowd control all have the same cast time listed for scrappers and banes. Banes do not have jawbreaker or clobber. Bane damage numbers: Bash - 1.3 pulverize - 2.14 shatter - 2.78 CC - 2.11 Attack chain - shatter, pulverize, CC = 7.03 shatter, pulverize, bash = 6.22 Scrapper damage numbers: bash - 1.05 pulverize - 1.72 jawbreaker - 2.06 clobber - 3.07 shatter - 2.4 CC - 1.69 Attack chain - shatter, clobber, jawbreaker = 7.53 Clobber is carrying warmace for all archetypes. Especially with its 1.23 activation. Aside from that, the bane numbers are actually higher for banes according to Red Tomax. I don’t know if the scrapper damage modifiers cause the equivalent powers to catch up. I have some thoughts that stem from this information. First, the clobber buff skyrocketed war maces’s performance. Banes were forgotten when this happened. Second, criticals vs -res. Without the ATIOs do scrapper criticals outperform the - res from surveillance? Third, the ATIOs for scrappers are far superior for damage, especially with Dominion of Arachnos using a debuff/cc rather than a form of +damage. Forth, does the scrapper damage modifier overcome the available +15% damage of banes? Fifth, the scrapper secondary really over powers the bane. IE bio or shield. Sixth, do the pets close the gap between scrappers and banes, or even surpass it? The cause of the performance gap is not actually do to the mace animations and damage, but rather, clobber. Bio and shield also contribute with no counterpart available for the bane. I suggest dropping one of the ranged mace attacks for a clobber equivalent. That’s all that is needed to help banes.