Bopper

Thank you for the praise. I do agree, it has grown into quite the repository of knowledge and a Guide is definitely appropriate. I should clarify, I wasn't upset by the move, just surprised because I hadn't taken the time to reflect on what the thread had grown into. Sorry for all the extra build planning. That was my fault... I wanted folks to rethink what was capable 😛

There is nothing I can say that Soggy Tacos did just cover in absolute excellent detail. As for finding an optimal attack chain, that's some serious calculus... you have to think about so many things. Base damage, cast/arcana time, recharge time, proc damage, buffs, debuffs, etc. On top of that, you have to think about practicality. For instance, how long can you do your attack chain before you need to do something else (buff, taunt, heal, whatever)? How much does that interruption disrupt your chain? So much to consider. Honestly, try to focus on making a good attack chain as a starting point, then try to grow from there, piece by piece. If you would like help as a starting point, tell us your build/AT, and some of us can try to theory craft some ideas for you. But seeing as how you're aiming more for a "teach me how to fish", perhaps the best advice is simply to practice. Something that helped me was to build an excel sheet that could do the calculations for me. I put in all the information of each power I could pick (base damage, recharge, etc), then I type a chain (for Sonic Attack, I might type into 4 cells: Shriek, Shout, Shriek, Scream). My spreadsheet pulls the info of those powers into a formula that calculates the required recharge for each attack to keep it gapless (if it requires more that 400%, it calculates the gap time). I then plug in values for damage boost, resistance debuffs, proc damage, etc to try to calculate the effective DPS. Truth is, that's too much work. But that is what I did to get myself to start thinking about how to optimize attack chains. It helped me realize how to identify my bread a butter attack, then go from there, adding things into the attack chain that keeps my DPS up while still trying to get back to my bread and butter attack as soon as possible.

I want to thank everyone for what this thread has become. Originally it was a post I made in the General Discussion forum in hopes to find some smart folks who could help test the mechanics of the game (I still thought we were working off of percentages until a discussion on optimal Sonic Attack ST attack chains made me realize the game has changed... a lot). After some guidance from a CoH all-timer (shout out to Hopeling), I took it upon myself to do that testing and many things were discovered, which led to a snowball of other testers making their own discoveries which has greatly helped the community. Recently, this thread was moved to the Guides section. I was confused by that initially as I never thought of the work being done here constituted as a guide. Nonetheless, looking over everything that was discovered and all the information that has come to light, it seems it is indeed time to treat this thread as a Guide and provide as much information to the players to help them understand the new game mechanics of i25. With that said, I am starting to overhaul the front page of this thread in hopes to build it up as an Informational Guide. I hope to keep it up with anything new that is discovered/confirmed, and hopefully it helps all your min/max'ing theory-crafters to come up with new builds to show off. Anyways, thanks again for all the help. Although the front page will look different, the work going on behind the scenes won't change. I still want to test Pseudopets, I still want to find out why the FF proc sometimes stacks its duration (it shouldn't ... from what I've seen), and I still want to find a true chain attack :).

Let's do an example. If I'm wrong, someone will correct me. But this is how it works: For this example: Enemy has 50% ToHit Enemy attacks you with a ranged attack that does 10 smashing damage and 10 energy damage. Enemy has no accuracy boost (to keep numbers simple) You have 25% ranged defense, 30% energy/negative defense, and 35% smashing/lethal defense. You have 50% smash/lethal resistance and 25% energy resistance. The probability of getting hit is: HitProbability= 50% - max (range, smash, energy) = 50% - 35% = 15%. If you DO get hit, the damage you take is: DMGtotal = 10 x (100% - 50%) + 10 x (100% - 25%) = 10 x 0.5 + 10 x 0.75 = 12.5 damage total.

https://paragonwiki.com/wiki/Gaining_Hero_Badges_with_Effects

Don't forget added HP. It somewhat acts as resistance (takes more hits to kill you), plus you'll heal back more HP since your regeneration uses your max HP to calculate what you heal. So if you add HP, you're practically increasing resistance and regeneration. Either way, multi-layer it. Get some HP, resistance, defense, regen.

Unfortunately that might be by design. I took a look at the old city of data and those powers (and arctic fog) all seem to be tagged with "not affected by outside buffs/debuffs". I don't know why it's tagged that way, but that would explain why you're not seeing the power boost. http://web.archive.org/web/20140821110550/http://tomax.cohtitan.com/data/powers/powerset.php?id=Controller_Buff.Cold_Domination

You're right, I am not seeing a drastic reduction in proc performance between the cast and the pets. I'll need to go deeper on this, but my informal test on Perigrine Island seems to support your experience. This could be pretty sweet, as Jolting Chain could effectively be an AoE using ST PPM calculations. I probably won't touch it for 2 weeks (work/life schedule), but I'll definitely want to characterize the performance of proc rates between cast and all jumps. I'd like confirmation if the probability stays the same. If so, pretty huge exploit...cheep, quick recharge, with big proc probabilities. The possibilities are scary. You can drop 3 damage procs (1 purple), you can drop the FF proc, and the Build Up Proc, Assuming no recharge in the power, the Build Up can hit up to 15 with a probability of 16.8%. FF proc, double that. Damage procs, 58.74%. Purple Proc 75.5%. I'm gonna try it at Rikti Island and see what happens with a group of monkeys. Update: Below is one attack on the Rikti mob. Entropic Chaos gave me a 51 point heal, Decimation gave me a Build Up twice, Force Feedback gave me no Recharge Boost, sadly. The rest was sweet sweet damage. Yeah, this is definitely one worth testing out. Update 2: Here is an attack sequence....basically attacked until the mobs were dead. (I tried to add a line break for each attack, but I could have overlooked some)

Good catch, I forgot to apply the minimum. From what I see, it's 1 ST attack and 14 pets. The cast hits the target, then spawns 2 pets, which makes 4 more, which makes 8 more. Any chance you can test it for us and provide me numbers? My time on game tends to be limited, but if you provide me detailed results, I'm good with finding what formulas seem to work.

@HedgefundI did some digging and I might have found some info. Jolting Chain has an initial attack that has a base recharge of 8 seconds and a cast time of 2.07 seconds. That attack then creates 2 pets, which each creates 2 pets, with each creates 2 pets. So you can hit up to 15 times (1+2+4+8). The pets each have a recharge of 4 seconds and a cast time of 0 seconds and a spherical radius of 15 feet. So I assume you will see a good probability to proc on the initial attack, and then each subsequent pet will have a lower but equal probability to proc. I assume the following probabilities apply (assuming 33% recharge): Initial Cast Proc Probability = PPM x (8/1.33 + 2.07) / 60 = PPM x 13.475% Pet Proc Probability = PPM x (4 + 0) / [60 x (1 + 0.75x0.15x15)] = PPM x 2.4086% So assuming a 3.5 PPM proc, the probabilities are: Cast = 47.16% Pet = 8.68% I'm not sure if I'll get to it soon, but I would want to test this and confirm my assumptions.

This has not been looked at extensively yet. I can maybe look up some info tonight, but I can almost promise you that the Single Target formula you're using is not correct. But that's ok, we just have to figure out what is the correct Area Factor (AF) and apply that to your results. I know there is a specific (and unverified) AF for Chains, but I think that doesn't apply here. Instead, I suspect it works somewhat like Enflame, where it does the attack then summons another attack. If that's the case, I need to figure out what the area is for the summoned attack, and that would be applied. Honestly, there are a bunch of potential formulas here, so it's best to test it and see which formula fits best. I recommend closely monitoring the combat log and see what the proc rate is when you cast the power, then also look at the proc rate of the jumps. I suspect it would be different. After work, I'll look into the characteristics of the summoned Jolt Jump and see if it can help us in our analysis. If you get time to test, please share your results.

I'm unfamiliar with Sentinel version, but I know they have different damage acales, which likely led to different recharges and mez durations too. For a defender, SF only does 3.61 damage at base. So yay, I get more proc options, but the damage is worthless to enhamce. So it's proc or bust. I use 5 damage and the buildup proc.

It doesn't show my alpha? If not, I am T4 Musculature Radial, and I am using Assault Hybrid Core (but I could consider others). My endurance is not as much of a problem as you'd think (check out my video). Clarion+Power Boost is big for Farsight, sure I'm already defense softcapped, but not for incarnate trials, and I get the extra ToHit buff. I tested a Dark version, and I didn't like my survivability using only Clarion. I don't drop in a +4/x8 S/L farm with my Soul Build, but I dropped a few times (embarassingly) with my dark build. Soul Drain is the only reason for going Dark, but if I need double the uptime, I can just use red insps.

As for my accuracy, it's good. Farsight gives me 12.5% at base, and in theory that is boosted by 178.34%, which is a perma 22.3% ToHit buff. With a base of 75%, that puts me over the 95% max. As for not being perma...I'm perma. My FF procs so often with Bullet Rain, Hail of Bullets, and Executioner's Shot that I have no issues reaching perma status. If I'm not perma, it's because I'm not doing anything or stealthing, which doesn't require me to be perma anyways. I also play on Excelsior, my SG is Special Council (perhaps we're in the same coalition). My schedule is usually later since I am PST. PM me, and we can work something out.

Absolutely. When I got confirmation that there was a minimum proc probability, I immediately thought of AoEs and Toggles that could maximize that. Sadly, I hoped the Activation Period of the power would be used, but I think all the enhancements have their own Activation Period of 10 seconds that it's using, which limits the greatness I thought could happen. As for Build Up in an AoE (like Tactics), that's something I always loved seeing used. I put it in Soul drain knowing each target gives me a 90% chance to proc, which effectively makes it more that 90% probability. Same concept as using FF procs in AoEs. Only need 1 to hit. That's my chucking dice. As for putting it in Pistols, it's viable in the right situation. I like more reliability, so I put it in my Suppressive Fire. It already is a proc whore, and it has the greatest Cooldown + Cast time of my ST attacks, which makes it the highest probability to proc on a single activation (36%). Also, it doesn't benefit from Build Up, so I don't care that I can't cycle back to it. I know 36% of the time, my Executioner's Shot, Piercing Rounds, and Bullet Rain will be boosted.

For my team build, Tactics with Gaussian will likely be a no brainer. Might even grab me the Summon Pet from the epic pool lol.

I'm assuming you're talking about a Kin/Fire defender? Yeah, you can build that to farm faster I would imagine, given the higher base damage that comes with Fire Blast (damage boost helps it more than any other Blast set available to defenders) and Kin likely can help you cap your damage and you certainly have all the recharge you need. What is your clear time with your Kin/Fire?

I think I'm finished with a Jack-of-all-Trades Solo Proc Monster with my Time/Dual Pistols/Soul build. It's not optimized for recharge, it's not optimized for single target, it's not optimized for AoE. But I feel confident that I can go into almost any situation and come out on top. I still kept my soft-capped defenses with Power Boost (and I can go above and beyond with Clarion Radial). I still kept hard-capped resistances on Smashing/Lethal damage. I also weaponized everything. My Suppressive Fire that does about 3 damage at base, now hits on average for 363. I put every damage proc into it and the Build Up proc, which has a 36% chance to fire. My Distortion Field has major utility as it helps me survive with massive -recharge debuffs, but it also helps keep mobs from running away when I drop my Bullet Rain. Oh yeah, I slotted it with 4 damage procs that can average as much as 257 damage per target for the duration of the patch. It also can hit up to 16 targets. My Slowed Response can also hit up to 16 targets and does on average 129 damage and has a 90% probability of adding an extra 20% resistance debuff for 10 seconds. My Soul Drain also was proc'd up with 3 damage procs and a Gaussian Build Up proc. The added proc damage is on average 194. (Author's note, proc'ing Soul Drain for a mini-nuke once per minute may not be optimal, but it's fun for the proc concept. If I tweak this build, it might be to de-proc Soul Drain and to add slots to other powers. I also tried to beef up my regular attacks. Every attack either has no recharge added or it has 90% probability to proc. I can have full AoE chains with Soul Drain, Hail of Bullets, Bullet Rain, Slowed Response, Distortion Field, and Empty Clips. Empty Clips is an interesting power, as it can take more procs than I can fit. I have my choice between 5 damage procs, 2 -resistance procs, and the FF procs. I settled for the FF proc (it's an AoE, which is optimal) a single -Res, and 4 damage procs. For the single target attack chain, I have my beefed up Suppressive Fire and Executioner's Shot provided the majority of the damage, while sprinkling in Piercing Rounds (if I need the -res) and either Bullet Rain, Empty Clips, or Pistols depending on the situation. If my Suppressive Fire procs the Build Up, the next 3 attacks should all get the damage boost. Anyways, I thought I'd share, and I welcome constructive feedback.

So I found the old video I had. I think I only had Bullet Rain and Hail of Bullets slotted with the FF proc, and there are a few times you'll see where I use them back to back and my recharge never gets the +200% stack. My base recharge is 211.25% (with Hasten and Chrono Shift) and it never goes above 311.25%. @Darkir can you tell us what you did that got you to stack FF procs? Perhaps you can provide us a build or a video?

Thank you for the remarks, I'm glad my guide was able to help. If you want to focus on ST, you might want to drop all 4 hold dmg procs into Time Stop. If you're going to use it anyways, you might like the damage it can provide. You can average 290 damage per attack with the procs.

I have seen the FF proc twice on my AoE DoT attacks (Bullet Rain and Hail of Bullets), but it stacked the duration, not the amount. For example, I hit Bullet Rain, immediately got the +RCH, then 5 seconds later it triggered again without another attack. I have not looked to see if it stacks with other attacks. Luckily, I do have video at home of doing a S/L farm while monitoring the recharge boost. I'll have to go back and look, perhaps I can confirm your findings.

Certainly. I have not tested with MM pets, but with an epic powerset's summon pet I attempted to summon them after using Power boost, and their mezzes were not improved. My hope was they would get the 98.34% power boost for their duration, but no luck.

Do they inherit the Assault Radial for the remainder of the Hybrid's duration (up to 2 minutes) or for the duration of the pets?

I always go Musculature Radial for the extra damage, endurance, and debuff strength.

I keep one keybind for target location drop. I still maintain regular location capability with my other keys. It's added capability, not substituted.