Mezmera

Neither side of these power sets have a Build Up power. If you slot Suppressive Fire heavy with all kinds of procs it does lots of damage, but it also gives a great 1 in 3 chance for the Decimation proc to fire giving your follow up attacks tons more damage potential. My one two punch is a proc'd Suppressive Fire into an Eagles Claw that is likely under a build up affect you'd normally not be able to get with this pairing. Everyone's balloon is being popped with this change and all to a sub tier power set to boot.

On that same token there was so many more people giving feedback to the dislike of DP's new Suppressive Fire on a range of things from the hold being less effective to proc damage among other minor things and yet it's going to get pushed through as is. And the best counter argument using faulty testing numbers was that there was no real change in damage when at first non testers were exaggerating it to being 16x more damage when they couldn't have been bothered to test the power set from the outset of the change showing just how much they like playing the set. With regards to your AR it feels like they were looking for that one person to say it now breaks their immersion so as to reverse course and not give it to you too well. If the two AR players that don't want Aim are going to limit it's implementation there I'm sure DP players would like to take it off your hands and we can trade you this new 'improved' Suppressive Fire.

The best thing about using a tank though is just how easy it is to maintain control of the first 16 targets since with their aggro field and punchvoke the ooze aggro control. Tanks are easier on teams. The real experienced teams are better suited to have the scrapper. If you have a good group of players you're familiar with it's fine to use the scrapper but using a tank is just less risky and easier to make use with on less experienced more puggy teams. Bio tank would do well for decent teams and the puggiest of teams I'd rather have the Shield tank most.

Yeah Bio would be good. Absorb shields are big powers on these HM's. The team will have likely a few Colds on the team giving the scrapper access to high defenses and maybe even give them the hp buff they'd want too plus lots of holes are covered with dedicated barrier teams. Bio scrapper with the moxie and confront.

Offensive oriented sets are best with a good team built around the tank. Bio, Rad and Fire would excel. Shield is great too because it offers some flexibility to team makeup since you should be bringing a nice 15%+ team defense buff plus some not too shabby offense. Great all arounder for these things which can be built into likely the beefiest of the quasi offensive oriented tanks. Plus Shield is capable of 90%+ DDR which shines on ITF. With a well built coordinated and focused team a good damaging alpha is the best which would be a well built high hp scrapper.

Yes at me being 50+1 and the boss at 54 it would be +3 to me. If it were to matter that the boss were to be +4 to me shouldn't my numbers theoretically all be higher than yours and why does Apoc, Unbreakable, Neuronic, Net etc all still match with the numbers it's showing in my combat chat eh? This is why I like to test things against targets I would fight when playing the game.

Log into the game pew pew a target and monitor combat chat. Pretty simple stuff really. The Cimeroran boss I hit with most of those same procs listed out that I either did 69.60 or 46.63 damage per proc. It would be fine if you rounded up or down to whole numbers for your example but if I can point to your very first power point to see that you're off 11pts here and 11pts there it kind of calls into question your whole testing method wouldn't you say? I'd say you're far too long winded to try to prove whatever figures you want to provide are right that you can't just do something as simple as log in and monitor combat chat.

Damage procs are all standardized. If it's the moderate damage one it does 69.60 damage across the board no matter if it is the Blaster's Wrath, Unbreakable Constraint or Apocalypse. Then all minor damage procs are at the 46.63, don't know why you're getting other values for the various procs.

Because the devs are coders and have a good grasp on the inner workings of how things end up mathing out. Plus they also have access to back end data reflecting how much more effective a power that can proc 6 procs at a 90% fire rate is compared to 6 that proc at a 40-50% fire rate. But they don't really want to have this conversation in this topic as they know the deal. Which is fine and if you look at the change to Suppressive Fire in a vacuum it becomes the less abusive power they wish to achieve disregarding what else DP has in the kit to offset losing such an effective ability. I don't play psi blast but it looks to me like they compensated for the change in effectiveness to a few powers with buffs to other things which DP received nothing of the sort which makes this a much harder set to take serious about playing in comparison to what others can do. I enjoy DP for the fun of it but at a certain point effectiveness/fun > more fun/less effective.

I picked a Cimeroran boss as this game is also about the NPC's hitting back and seemed relevant due to the newest Hard Mode content. Which now the hold being lesser of a hold also adds to the survivability issue if you're not able to fire back the necessary high damage to clear said targets. I'd have no problem picking on a test dummy with you sure. But I have done my in game testing and found Suppressive Fire to be much less effective for fighting enemies that fight back.

It's focused feedback about directly testing the powers in question. Not a math theory class. If you've tested this power great please do add to the conversation. If you haven't then this topic is being diluted as Bopper is insinuating. I'll leave this here as the devs wish but please do test things out since this is a feedback thread to test the powers they want you to test.

Did you actually test this or is this theory crafting? Slot these procs as you list them on the current HC version and go spam Suppressive Fire on a +4 boss. Then slot Suppressive Fire on test however seems optimal trying to add onto that new internal damage which now two slots at minimum you'll at least be slotting to boost for more moderate damage, taking the place of two procs, and go spam the attack on a +4 boss to see how much faster you clear them. 16x increase to damage output seems like wonky math to me, in fact any reliable increase to damage seems wholly unlikely from how it tested out for me.

That's all nice and understandable if it weren't for the fact that a great majority of procs are slottable by lvl 20-30. Instead of adjusting procs to force people into creative slotting like the more procs in a power the less likely the later ones will fire we are just going to adjust the more ideal powers to slot procs until every power set is forced to slot sets instead due to having fast recharge ala Fire blast without the raw damage output of Fire blast. One of the most enjoyable things about this game is the IO system in its entirety including procs. If someone chooses to slot all procs into a power they are sacrificing a lot of set bonuses.

For testing purposes using my DP blaster on the current HC version here's how the damage output looks. Against a lvl 54 Cimeroran Boss: Suppressive Fire: Apoc, Unbreakable, Nueronic, Ghost, Javelin and Net all procs firing with the max 90% certainty due to the longer internal recharge 342dmg at a dpa of 206; given a proc may not fire from time to time. Using the next best attack in the set here's the damage: Executioner's Shot: 5 remaining IOs from Apocalypse set all +5. I didn't slot the Apoc proc here since at the recharge of this power it would be a sub 50% chance of firing. On the same boss it does 160dmg and 40 extra fire damage from the ammo. So 200 pts with a dpa of 120. That is supposedly the best attack in the chain and with the current setting on test for Suppressive Fire the internal damage will not surpass Executioner's Shot and the new proc rates will be sub 50% For giggles I logged in my Fire blaster and tossed a Blaze with a full set of Blaster's Wrath at that same boss for 490pts of damage plus it happened to proc the bonus damage from the set so a total of 560 for a dpa of 560 I'm not opposed to changing something if it feels so overpoweringly good but the set of DP as a whole is underwhelming dpa wise and we are kneecapping any creativity afforded it through procs with Suppressive Fire as it currently is which by the way is still trounced by a lot of attacks out there. So okay lets nerf this hold but can DP get something that can inherently hit a boss for 200+ dpa for starters then? I say this from an objective standpoint that okay put this in live as it is, there's other power sets I can play.

I would assume they slotted it for damage to test it out before even identifying the set they'd want to put in there if they were going to keep this attack. I put in 2 50+5 dmg IO's and 2 50+5 Acc just to test it since it seems the goal is to eliminate procing for internal moderate damage. I'd assume how they have it originally slotted would be comparative to how I have it slotted on my blaster which is all procs, Unbreakable Constraint, Apocalypse, Neuronic Shutdown, Ghost Widow, Gladiator Javelin and I like the Decimation proc 6th to amp up my damage for other attacks since DP doesn't have a Build Up type of power.

Yes totally agree. It's not like it already does extreme damage with absurd dpa plus has optimal procability like a lot of the other holds out there. Any unique stuff you could do with DP with this power in particular has been washed out and now you're shoehorned into a smorgasbord of low dpa attacks. The change to Piercing Rounds not having the -resistance debuff stackable anymore is irksome a bit but usually you're going to want to use fire or chem ammo anyway so it puts this power into play for you. Between the animation time and lets say a 3-4s recharge you'd only ever at best get that -res to stack for a few seconds. All in all Piercing Rounds I'm fine with but the Suppressive Fire was a bread and butter attack if you set it up right. I'll play my DP blaster a lot less now but my defender won't be phased by it.

Just as an fyi my point is not off topic if there's an insinuation directed the way of being critical of an attack chain nerf to DP. I logged onto my Trick Arrow / Dual Pistols Defender on Beta first before coming to speak in this topic so I am giving focused feedback. I alted to my 2nd build with Standard Ammo that has Suppressive Fire and Piercing Rounds. I wanted to see how the weapon redraw would now affect both pistols and the bow running together along with what I surmised would be a lowering of performance for the DP powers adjusted. The animations being more fluid is nice but I'll never alt to my 2nd build with those powers ever. The output was noticeably less. I'll never take the hold on DP again with that low dpa and I guess I will work in Piercing Rounds into my Chem Ammo build since I'm on a debuffer anywho, although that animation is atrociously long. It's working as intended is the feedback given although I'm not sure that's all a good thing.

DP lacks any major ST dpa attack like some of the other better assaults like fire and ice blast. Ice lacks a snipe which it makes up for with major ST damage along with a few highly procable powers a few of which are holds (one with more ideal recharge rate). Fire has raw damage output through fast animating high damage attacks in Blaze and its snipe. DP sacrifices fast animations with raw damage and snipes to have some neat proc'ing powers. If we're going to remove the best powers to proc then the ST damage is very lackluster and its aoe is just okay.

This nerfs the capable damage output big time. This does not give you another viable attack in your chain. At that old recharge time any damage proc you dropped in there had a 90% chance to fire. Since holds have a ton of damage procs you're losing out on 1 Moderate damage and 3 minor damage boost plus any last proc you want to toss in there to use that good fire rate like a Decimation proc just to lose all of that for a moderate damage. Big nerf on this attack in your chain.

At a quick first glance speaking on Dual Pistols this seems like a net nerf even with the redraw speeding up attacks a smidge. The redraw cleanup is great for all weapon sets sure but how good was it going to be that it all out nerfs the proc rate of the hold? Then there's the Piercing Rounds change that sure it's nice to now have that resistance debuff capable on all ammo builds but removing the ability to stack on itself is a half nerf since on some builds that are spec'd to standard ammo made use of this nice resistance debuff along with how great the hold used to detonate procs. It feels like we've taken a midtier powerset which with some creativity you could do some unique things to put yourself close to the almighty blaze/blazing bolt and removed the viability of building around Suppressive Fire and Piercing Rounds to stay competitive with other assaults.

Yes Spinning Strike with the bigger aoe now and having highest damage is quite nice, you can also slot a Force Feedback proc into it which it'll always fire. Typically yes I'll hit Combat Readiness into a Shield Charge then let the targets I just aggro'd group up on me a bit then I'll use Spinning Strike while the BU effect is still active. Then if the target count is low with tougher targets then I'll make use of the Crushing Uppercut with the max stacks. CU is real good it's both a hold and a stun and can slot lots of interesting procs which are sure fire based on the powers internal recharge even if you slot in some recharge. It is also pretty easy to build up to max combo with the other faster attacks like Rib Cracker and the t1 so that it's not just the BU effect that's optimizing your top damage output which other sets can't match. I have a StJ Stalker so I knew it was a strong set with top tier ST damage only second to the newly revamped EM so I gave it a chance on tank long ago. The problem was always how small Spinning Strike was but with the added area it feels great now for the damage it puts out.

Street Justice is quite a good secondary if you know how to make use of it. The biggest gripe about StJ before the tanker revamp was how small the aoes were but now that Spinning Strike is 9ft instead of 6ft it does feel a lot more useful. One of the best things about StJ is that the combo mechanic at max stacks will allow you to do highest damage comparably to any other tankers best aoe or ST attack. Max stack Spinning Strike does the best aoe damage and you have that uber Shield Charge to fill in for any extra aoe that you ma feel might be missing. A max stack Crushing Uppercut is the best ST damage you can get on a tank and it also procs really well even if you have the power slotted with a bit of a set. You can slot all kinds of hold procs into this one which on my proc build I have 3 of the Hecatombs with the dmg proc and then 3 more hold dmg procs, on my regular tanky build I sub in 2 of the Entombs with that nice Absorb Proc which between that and the tanker one I have a 900+ absorb shield always running. Then Rib Cracker is a nice little attack which comes with some debuffing of the targets resistances and damage output. Street Justice is a very fun and fluid set that you can get by with paring down to the best stuff which will allow you room for other things.

Honestly the sets we do have are already quite good. I think that's why we won't see new sets for Healing, Defense and Resists in terms of purples or winter sets. With how good most of those sets already are and the various special IO's in those sets I couldn't imagine what kind of OP unique they'd have to come up with to top all of the current ones.

I for one would like to see the last 4 incarnate powers introduced along with some more itrials to warrant their introduction. Once introduced it would be easy for a lot of people to instantly build their t4's which might take a little shine off of them so the t4 Very Rare salvage I'd only like to see get rewarded from any new itrials. Another thing though is that the devs are doing a good job of compensating for how much stronger you get with all of you and your teams incarnates so it might be tough with their current Hard Mode to compensate for additional incarnate powers. So it would have to be something where these last 4 that would get added would need to make you choose which can be active. It would be something where you would align the powers next to the current tiers and select which of them is active. For instance you could only have one of the Alpha or Omega active, then there'd be the Interface, Judgement and then a new power in that row and you could only have 2 of the 3 active, same with the Destiny and Lore row and Hybrid. That way if they make some new great incarnates by having them it just doesn't make all of their new stuff they are creating obsolete because you would have to lose either the Lore or Destiny spot which are both some real powerful powers.

But that's always happened. Way back when Excelsior was created there was a big SG called Phoenix Force that were able to put together the first runs of Hami on the server with just their members. The leads didn't stick around as long as Cosmic's and when that happens with no one to take the bull by the horns and constantly organize stuff then people find other avenues to join in on playing. That Cosmic has been able to maintain activities as long as it had is a testament to the dedicated leadership. But eventually people move on or take time off. The culprit is no one thing and specifically not the HM content or anything supposedly gating anyone. I'd say its the lack of content in such a long time is one thing causing people to take extended breaks more than anything.