Would something like this be of interest to anyone?

[Bill Z Bubba]

Followup request: Might we also get up to date AT mods? Or is that what the Dmg2 column will be after more tweaking where Dmg2 = Dmg*AT-Mod?

[Bopper]

19 minutes ago, Bill Z Bubba said:

Followup request: Might we also get up to date AT mods? Or is that what the Dmg2 column will be after more tweaking where Dmg2 = Dmg*AT-Mod?

I think i can add that

[Bopper]

1 hour ago, Bill Z Bubba said:

Followup request: Might we also get up to date AT mods? Or is that what the Dmg2 column will be after more tweaking where Dmg2 = Dmg*AT-Mod?

I should have clarified what Dmg2 is. That's splash damage. So attacks like Thunderstrike, you can now see how much damage the main target takes and how much secondary targets take. If there is no difference, the Dmg2 is unused. You will see some cases where Dmg2 is displayed, but not Dmg. Thats the case when powers have an effect that hits the caster (main target) and damage that doesnt hit the caster (secondary tgts only). Some blaster damage auras do that.

[Bopper]

I am working on code updates for some of the feedback I received so far. One of those feedback items is the AT Mod Damage...basically, what is the base value for damage? I can show this one of a few ways, but I want to limit how many extra columns I create. So I propose two options, I could:

• Add a Base Value column next to the DMG and DMG2 columns, in which case it becomes the user's responsibility to multiply the Base Value to DMG and DMG2 to get the Base Damage of a power.
• Or, I can replace the Scalar values of DMG and DMG2 with the Base DMG by doing the multiplication for you. This would keep the number of columns the same, but you will no longer see the normalized scaled damage.

[M3z]

Looks good!

 

We've been doing something similar in the PvP community where we check spike damage, kills, evasion, heals, how many attacks someone used, how often people are locked etc etc.

 

Here's an example

 

Definitely made things a lot more interesting for me, I love looking at stats

 

 

 

[Bopper]

I added Base Damage. I'll show a preview of Warshade since it's probably the most interesting given the different forms it can take and the varying base damage those forms have.  Next up, work on adding some categories for easier filtering.

 

Edited September 16, 2020 by Bopper

[Sir Myshkin]

1 hour ago, Bopper said:

So I propose two options, I could:

You know, if there were an enhancement set database like this, you’re only a UI away from an Excel based Mid’s 😉 

[Bopper]

Here is another look, with Base Value, Scales, and Base Damages all shown in one. Is this too busy, or ok? I also converted DPA to be actual damage, not scaled damage

 

[Sir Myshkin]

I personally don't think it looks bad, but... a thought about what that addition becomes to the page:

 

What if there were an extra tab to the spreadsheet, maybe a primary initial page that has a handful of drop downs that select AT, power set (primary, secondary) and calls data from the associated AT tabs and fills it onto the first tab automatically. Have that primary tab do all the math, have the columns for damage adjustment (base, dpa, etc) along with stuff like scaling for Res based on AT mod. You could simplify the math impact into one page, and leave the core of everything else as the raw values. Having a primary page like this would also give you the ability to layer in enhancement rows to input Acc/End/Rech/Dam/etc in each power (and maybe even global adds) and have it reflect just for that page using the called up data.

 

Ultimately would depend on how much time you've invested in the current path and whether doing something like the above may help save time collectively over adding columns to everything else and data checking each page's math.

[Bopper]

6 hours ago, Sir Myshkin said:

I personally don't think it looks bad, but... a thought about what that addition becomes to the page:

 

What if there were an extra tab to the spreadsheet, maybe a primary initial page that has a handful of drop downs that select AT, power set (primary, secondary) and calls data from the associated AT tabs and fills it onto the first tab automatically. Have that primary tab do all the math, have the columns for damage adjustment (base, dpa, etc) along with stuff like scaling for Res based on AT mod. You could simplify the math impact into one page, and leave the core of everything else as the raw values. Having a primary page like this would also give you the ability to layer in enhancement rows to input Acc/End/Rech/Dam/etc in each power (and maybe even global adds) and have it reflect just for that page using the called up data.

 

Ultimately would depend on how much time you've invested in the current path and whether doing something like the above may help save time collectively over adding columns to everything else and data checking each page's math.

I lkke the idea, but I would need a tutorial on how to do that in excel. 

[Mister Mass]

2 hours ago, Bopper said:

I like the idea, but I would need a tutorial on how to do that in excel. 

This reminds me that many of the tricks I learned to do in Excel were for spreadsheets I wrote for games I was playing.  Nothing inspires me more to work than games!  (And usually the tricks I learned for games eventually were useful for work. 🤷‍♂️)

[Bopper]

6 minutes ago, Mister Mass said:

This reminds me that many of the tricks I learned to do in Excel were for spreadsheets I wrote for games I was playing.  Nothing inspires me more to work than games!  (And usually the tricks I learned for games eventually were useful for work. 🤷‍♂️)

 

That is the only reason why I learned how to code (somewhat). I wrote simple games like Yahtzee to learn how to make GUIs using MATLAB. That's the program I'm using to make these excel spreadsheets, doing a bunch of actxserver commands that I used before and relearned for this project.

[siolfir]

I just want to say thanks for the work putting it together - I had started something similar and burned out before I got even halfway through the ATs, and mine didn't have a couple of the columns (specifically Dmg2 and Time Hit).

 

That Time Hit column also puts to numbers what people have been complaining about for a while in terms of power speed and corpse-blasting, too. Just look at Concentrated Strike having an animation time almost a half second less than Total Focus (2.83 vs 3.3), yet the damage hits 0.23 seconds later from the power activation (2.53 vs 2.3). Energy Transfer went from 0.5 seconds to 2.2 when it was nerfed, while other "heavy hitters" have times like 0.83 seconds (Seismic Smash), 0.9 seconds (Crushing Uppercut), with even the comparatively slow 1.3 (Eagle Claw), 1.6 (Knockout Blow), and 1.67 (Greater Psi Blade) still landing their damage more than a half second earlier. 

 

[Omega-202]

Finally got a chance to take a look at this and it is an amazing resource.  Great job as always.

 

On thing that looks to be missing/maybe an error is that Spring Attack doesn't have damage listed under either the power or the psuedo pet down below.  It should probably be in the psuedo pet's line, like Shield Charge and Lightning Rod, but it seems to be missing.  

Edited September 16, 2020 by Omega-202

[Bopper]

4 hours ago, Omega-202 said:

Finally got a chance to take a look at this and it is an amazing resource.  Great job as always.

 

On thing that looks to be missing/maybe an error is that Spring Attack doesn't have damage listed under either the power or the psuedo pet down below.  It should probably be in the psuedo pet's line, like Shield Charge and Lightning Rod, but it seems to be missing.  

Good catch. It appears there are two reasons why I don't have it. One, Spring Attack uses Requires that checks the AT of the user. I only do this check on Epics because I thought that was the only time the AT source gets checked...whoops. But, it does not matter because the damage doesn't show up in RubyRed's tool anyways. I checked the Def file and it appears that each effect that checks for a specific ATs has a damage scalar that changes based on the AT. I don't think the tool has a good way of handling that. This problem likely exists elsewhere with any power that changes Damage Scales based on the AT. 

 

For what it's worth, this is the scaled damage for Spring Attack. It works like Thunderstrike with a MainTarget portion, and an AoE (hits MainTarget and Secondary Targets) that has a max target of 10 with a radius of 5 feet. I imagine, since the damage scalars vary, the base_value is the Pet base_value of 55.6102

AT | MainTarget | AoE 

Scrapper | 1.13 | 0.56

Dominator | 1.05 | 0.52

Blaster, Stalker, VEATs | 1.00 | 0.50

HEATS | 0.85 | 0.42

Tanker | 0.80 | 0.39

Brute, Corruptor | 0.75 | 0.37

Controller, Defender, Mastermind | 0.55 | 0.27

Sentinels | 0.95 | 0.4631

Edited September 17, 2020 by Bopper
forgot about sentinels

[Omega-202]

4 minutes ago, Bopper said:

Good catch. It appears there are two reasons why I don't have it. One, Spring Attack uses Requires that checks the AT of the user. I only do this check on Epics because I thought that was the only time the AT source gets checked...whoops. But, it does not matter because the damage doesn't show up in RubyRed's tool anyways. I checked the Def file and it appears that each effect that checks for a specific ATs has a damage scalar that changes based on the AT. I don't think the tool has a good way of handling that. This problem likely exists elsewhere with any power that changes Damage Scales based on the AT. 

 

For what it's worth, this is the scaled damage for Spring Attack. It works like Thunderstrike with a MainTarget portion, and an AoE (hits MainTarget and Secondary Targets) that has a max target of 10 with a radius of 5 feet. I imagine, since the damage scalars vary, the base_value is the Pet base_value of 55.6102

AT | MainTarget | AoE 

Scrapper | 1.13 | 0.56

Dominator | 1.05 | 0.52

Blaster, Stalker, VEATs | 1.00 | 0.50 HEATS | 0.85 | 0.42

Tanker | 0.80 | 0.39

Brute, Corruptor | 0.75 | 0.37

Controller, Defender, Mastermind | 0.55 | 0.27

Awesome info!  Also, good god, I forgot how crappy SA is.

 

~1.5 scalar to one target and ~0.5 in a 5 m radius, on a 120 recharge, but using the psuedopet proc calculation, so you can't even manipulate the upside of it?  

 

....ewww

[Bopper]

1 minute ago, Omega-202 said:

Awesome info!  Also, good god, I forgot how crappy SA is.

 

~1.5 scalar to one target and ~0.5 in a 5 m radius, on a 120 recharge, but using the psuedopet proc calculation, so you can't even manipulate the upside of it?  

 

....ewww

Last I recall, the attack was bugged. I don't honestly know if it ever got fixed. It used to not take the enhancements that you slotted, so you couldn't enhance the damage and the procs wouldn't fire. Some have said that was fixed, but I have not seen anyone show evidence of that.

[_NOPE_]

This is amazing @Bopper. Can I ask, where did you get your data from? And how did you parse it? I'm curious about your methodology and source. Is this a "static point in time" from a certain code release, or do you have sources that are feeding you new information?

[Bopper]

1 minute ago, The Philotic Knight said:

This is amazing @Bopper. Can I ask, where did you get your data from? And how did you parse it? I'm curious about your methodology and source. Is this a "static point in time" from a certain code release, or do you have sources that are feeding you new information?

I am using PiggViewer to convert the pigg files into binary files, then I am using RubyRed's tool to convert those binary files into JSON files. RubyRed's tool does all of the heavy lifting. I then use my MATLAB tool to parse the file structures and JSON files to build up my datasheets, then I take those sheets and output them into the excel file. I can run it on Homecoming, Beta, whatever. I can generate this on any server as long as I have the pigg files and the converted binary files are still structured the way RubyRed's tool can handle.

[Bopper]

@Sir Myshkin I have added a few extra columns. It's bordering on cluttered, but I tried to keep it as tidy as possible while still providing you with the ability to filter as you wanted.

 

All,

Some known bugs with no ETA on fixes... some attacks don't have damage parsed so nothing shows up. Also, some attacks use magnitude expressions which I do not try to parse and incorporate. Case in point, Proton Volley (Quick Snipe) shows up as a 9.12 scale damage attack. This is because the snipe does 4 ticks of Scale 2.28 damage. However, the Magnitude Expression uses a To-Hit formula for the damage (like all Quick Snipes do), but that expression is different from others in that it divides it by 4. So the devs chose to accomodate the DoT in the mag expression instead of the scale...so, that's why my tool shows the data incorrectly. Oh well. 

CoH_Homecoming_of_Data_Page5.xlsx

[siolfir]

3 hours ago, Bopper said:

Last I recall, the attack was bugged. I don't honestly know if it ever got fixed. It used to not take the enhancements that you slotted, so you couldn't enhance the damage and the procs wouldn't fire. Some have said that was fixed, but I have not seen anyone show evidence of that.

Other bugs that were known: the Sentinel version did no damage (guess which AT isn't listed in your damage scales?) and if those scales are actually using the pet AT modifier then the Tanker version is bugged since it uses their old melee scale.

 

I know the Sentinel version did damage the last time I played my Sentinel, but that was a while ago. There might have been a merge issue reverting the fix if those are from current pigg files.

[Bopper]

1 minute ago, siolfir said:

Other bugs that were known: the Sentinel version did no damage (guess which AT isn't listed in your damage scales?) and if those scales are actually using the pet AT modifier then the Tanker version is bugged since it uses their old melee scale.

 

I know the Sentinel version did damage the last time I played my Sentinel, but that was a while ago. There might have been a merge issue reverting the fix if those are from current pigg files.

Good point, I'll look. Its possible I'm looking at an old set of def files. I also didmt scroll throw everything, so Sentinels might have been listed at the bottom of the effects list.

[Bopper]

@siolfir Yup, user error. I didn't look at every effect. I added the sentinel damage to the post above.

[siolfir]

2 minutes ago, Bopper said:

@siolfir Yup, user error. I didn't look at every effect. I added the sentinel damage to the post above.

Which still doesn't get rid of it using the old Tanker melee modifier rather than the current one, but if the plan to normalize all the pseudopets to use the AT modifiers rather than differing scales on the pet modifier is imminent, then there may be no reason to change it.

 

I was just pointing it out since I thought that there could've actually been an issue with the pigg files based on those details. Either way, thanks again for creating the spreadsheets.

[Bopper]

You did notice a good thing, tankers should have their scale changed. But if they can do the same thing to Spring Attack as they did with Tar Patch, they could get rid of all the extra effects and just give it the Scale of 1.00 that they seem to be trying to do