Focused Feedback: Teleportation Pool Revamp

[Rodion]

I have a couple of questions:

 

If I leave a character at the Peregrine base portal, on the roof where it is now, will that character accrue credit toward the base day job if I don't log that character on until the portal has been moved in the next issue? That is, does day job credit get assigned based on your location in proximity to the portal when you log in? Or the location you were at when you logged out?

 

If the former, people should be aware that we should leave characters by portals that won't move, if they're prepositioning characters in order to be sure that they'll have access to the base teleporter as soon as possible.

 

Is there any way for us to test that the Long Range Teleporter accolade is awarded for characters that have the zone exploration badges when the next issue is released? That is, if I've already got the Atlas tour guide badge, will I automatically get the LRT when the issue hits live?

 

One way we could test that is if there was a way to copy characters to the test server. Is that possible now, or it it in the works?

[capricorpse]

I love combat teleport!  I have several characters that run Speed of Sound 24/7 just for access to Jaunt.  This is a much more efficient replacement.  I do agree it could use a more dynamic animation/pose for the blink moment.

 

I'm a little baffled by the responses that are bemoaning the buff on Combat Teleport?  It's a basic version of a common travel power, it's a movement utility.  And a really good one!  I don't expect them to buff the minor stat boost in order for it to make a splash in an incarnate build that's IO'd to the teeth.  It wouldn't make sense.  Seems like a weird conversation to have about a teleportation power when the only use some people can envision is to spam it in-place three times before a fight...?  I like that more utility powers are being added that don't just grant stat increases, but aim to be used strategically.  The +tohit is just a little icing that will mostly be felt as a low level character and that's ok.  There are still people who play the game at low levels.

 

I like Fold Space as well.  I think it's different enough from Wormhole.  My wish would be that in response to Fold Space, you raise the magnitude of Wormhole's teleport, so that it shines by being able to teleport +4 Bosses.  Gravity Control should do it a bit better than the pool power. Other than that, ship it.

 

I do think Team Teleport should be remade into Assemble the Team.  Team Teleport has only felt useful on my Dark Defender for bringing a pile of teammates corpses into an area for Howling Twilight.  But ATT would have worked there too, and in many more situations. 

 

[Koopak]

3 hours ago, capricorpse said:

I do think Team Teleport should be remade into Assemble the Team.  Team Teleport has only felt useful on my Dark Defender for bringing a pile of teammates corpses into an area for Howling Twilight.  But ATT would have worked there too, and in many more situations. 

 

I wanna revise my glowing endorsement a bit to match capricorpse and a few others here. I think it speaks volumes that, in my enthusiastic testing of all these changes, i strait forgot Team Teleport was changed, mostly because I long ago plumb forgot it exists! Its just nightmarish to use, what with the way eveyroen gets bump scattered (which if yer zoomed in even a little makes spotting your next teleport location a pain), and it doesn't really have any use.

I feel even group fly is more useful, allowing a flight user to safely help their team across certain map tiles that are a pain to traverse without falling into a pit of some kind. Team Teleport generally just bumps people into the pit. Also Group Flight has nice RP opportunities, but again Teleport Team, really doesn't because of how awkward it feels and looks. I feel like it needs to be replaced just as much as LRTP does, or otherwise overhauled in some kind of way. Even if it stayed as the same basic function, perhaps a fun one would be to give LRTP the ability to interface with Team Teleport, but im just spitballing.

I hope the endurance improvements result it in it getting some more experimentation from the community but yeah, its just blech. Otherwise, everything else is solid imo.

[aethereal]

Okay, here's my feedback on Combat Teleport after a couple hours of playing with it on a lowbie EM/Invul scrapper.

 

Combat Teleport feels good.  That's no surprise, I think that it was clear from Burst of Speed and Jaunt that people were hungry for a fast, fluid teleportation power, and Combat Teleport provides that.  My experience is that you do not run out of charges unless you try really hard to, which is good, and was the major problem with Burst of Speed.  Jaunt of course required you to have Speed of Sound on, which had its own downsides.  Combat Teleport also provides you with an unequivocally teleport-y looking power activation, which is nice for some concepts.

 

But is Combat Teleport good?  I'm going to say...  not really.  If you had a choice between Combat Jumping and Combat Teleport on pure utilitarian grounds, I think CJ is the clear winner.  In terms of movement utility, they're different but I would certainly hesitate to say that CT is better, just given how un-fluid teleportation is in this game (I use a trackpad on a laptop, it is possible that a multi-button mouse would change my mind here).  In terms of the buff, the continuous defense of CJ is just clearly better than the inconsistent to-hit of CT.  And of course CJ is a great slot-mule for LotG global recharge, there is no equivalently useful slotting for CT.  In terms of Hover, the slotting/buff is the same, and Hover is almost certainly more movement-power useful for blast sets than CT.

 

EDIT to add:  Probably there are some clever movement things that CT enables that Hover and CJ do not.  But tactical movement isn't super important in PvE in this game.  Getting a bit more defense is going to be vastly more important than a clever movement trick for 99% of PvE play.  I expect that CT may have a PvP niche, but I don't PvP enough to say.

 

I've been trying to proactively use the CT for the to-hit buff.  In terms of feeling -- I don't notice it.  I mean, I'm sure it is giving me the to-hit buff, but it doesn't feel noticeable.  I'm not like, "Oh wow, I'm hitting a lot more."  And this is with a not-very-well-slotted lowbie, probably the place we'd expect to see some noticeable improvement from a to-hit buff.

 

What about theory-wise?  I think it's really hard to use the to-hit buff from CT in a disciplined way.  Here's my thinking:

 

1.  We generally are going to be building for capped or near-capped to-hit rolls[1].  I'm not just talking about optimized end-game builds here, this is advice for slotting that goes back to the SO-only days.  Maybe more casual players don't build for enough accuracy to cap to-hit rolls against +4s, but then they don't tend to play against +4s.  In general, people don't like missing, and if you just drop CT into a pretty standardly-slotted build, it's unlikely that the inconsistent +10% to hit is going to help much.

 

2.  Okay, so fine, maybe we can change slotting to take advantage of CT.  Okay, but how?  Are we really going to drop our accuracy slotting in order to take advantage of the to-hit from CT?  That feels...  not great.  The buff from CT is short-lived and it takes a lot of attention and button pressing to keep it up.  Are we going to deal with our to-hit rolls dropping very significantly without managing the uptime of the CT buff?  I don't want to do that.  I don't think many people do.

 

3.  Well, is there an advanced strategy here?  I can think of a couple.  You could use CT with Follow Up in claws and similar powers.  Follow Up gives a potentially stacking, large to-hit buff once it gets going, so you can underslot accuracy in your attacks and use Follow Up to paper over that.  Then the issue is what if Follow Up missses?  Well, you could kind of kick off the virtuous cycle by doing CT->Follow Up->your actual attacks.  Okay, that's great and all, but what are we really getting there?  We can just slot Follow Up itself for accuracy and get the same benefit, right?  Here, CT isn't saving us broad accuracy slotting across all of our attacks, but accuracy slotting for a single power.  Not amazing.  I guess we can just use CT to paper over the inescapable miss chance for Follow Up.  If you get a miss on Follow Up, just hit CT and then go ahead with your attacks as normal until the next time FU comes up.  That sounds...  fine?  A bit niche.  The other thing I can think of is that you could use CT with a heavy defense-debuffing set like say Rad Blast.  Use CT to make your first couple of attacks hit, and then you don't need to worry about uptime of the CT attacks because your stacking defense debuffs have made it so that you're gonna hit regardless.  Honestly, this sounds to me like it'd only work on Rad Blast, but maybe it would work okay on some of the weapon sets.  So then you can underslot those attacks for accuracy and, probably what you're going to do is proc them out, right?  Like, this sounds like a tactic that's way too sophisticated and complex for someone to do with common IOs or SOs, and if you're using sets, you basically get plenty of accuracy from the sets, so this sounds like a tactic for proccing.  I'm a little dubious that this ultimately works out -- after all, you can already use Tactics, Aim, Build Up, Kismet, potentially Bio Armor or Invul, and others to get global to-hit bonuses, and we aren't hearing about procced out Rad Blast as a monster.  But maybe someone can make it work.  It sounds niche to me.

 

So my belief is that CT feels good but is mechanically disadvantageous.  I think people will take it for concept reasons even if it's not great.  Some people are going to say, "Great, mission accomplished, the power will be reasonably popular," but my opinion is this is actually the worst case.  Powers that people really want to take, but are bad, are worse than powers that are bad and people don't want to take.  People shouldn't be mechanically punished for wanting a thematic, cool-seeming power, and the game shouldn't be mechanically incentivizing hodge-podge collections of unthematic power picks.

 

What could be done?

 

The easy thing to do is give CT a Combat-Jumping-Equivalent defense buff, non-stacking with itself, lasting I don't know, 15-30 seconds.  Yes, yes, I know, it's boring and also we may all feel a bit dubious about putting in yet another pool defense power.  But look, people can already get all the pool defense powers they might possibly want.  You can take weave, combat jumping, hover, maneuvers, and stealth, that's more than the number of power pool picks you get guys.  And you can also get invisibility and afterburner.  We aren't going to see any power creep here -- CT will substitute for one of the other 1st tier power pool defense picks that already exist.  It'll be a QOL benefit for people who want teleport for thematic reasons and now are also picking up CJ or Stealth or whatever when they don't really want them, in order to pick up LotG slots and stack defense.

 

If we feel really strongly that we shouldn't do that, I see a couple of options.  1.  Let the to-hit buff last a lot longer, so that you can viably improve its uptime and use it to decrease your overall need for accuracy slotting with a broad variety of sets.  2.  Keep the buff short but make it bigger or let it stack, so that you can use CT to break through enemies which floor your to-hit chance, such as enemies with dark attacks that give you big to-hit debuffs (CoT ghosts, Shadows, etc), or ones that have high defense (Paragon Protectors etc).  Neither of those cases are very much of the game, but they're annoying as hell, and if CT lets you counter them, that's SOMETHING.

 

[1] There's a thorny terminology issue here.  What I mean is not that we max the to-hit stat, but rather we max the actual chance to hit, once to-hit, accuracy, defense, and purple patch are all considered together.  I'm calling that the "to-hit roll," since as far as I know there's no official term for this.

Edited October 27, 2020 by aethereal

[macskull]

11 hours ago, arthurh35353 said:

Fold Space: I think this power steps too close on Wormhole (and is in essence a clone of wormhole that you can give to everyone) that seems more like a power farming tool than a situational combat power. I think it should in fact get axed. It seems like something that would get abused post haste and could be used to drop higher level mobs on people, ie. griefing. I have never seen a power added to the game that was so potentially broken towards griefing and farming in my life. I'm pretty sure mines and traps characters are salivating at the fact they will never miss their groups in the future.

• Wormhole: Ranged TAoE that teleports mobs to a specified location, not necessarily in your line of sight, and then stuns said mobs.
• Fold Space: PBAoE that teleports mobs to you and then does nothing else.

There are some interesting uses for this power, for sure - Tankers pulling mobs to them, Kinetics characters gathering mobs up for Fulcrum Shift, Traps/Devices users pulling mobs onto their tripmines... I think what's going to keep this from being super popular is the opportunity cost of having to go three powers deep into a pool that is honestly not that useful compared to the alternatives. I don't really see this as a griefing tool since when mobs are teleported they aggro on the caster.

[Hew]

Putting defense in ct is fine by me, as long as you can't slot defense set ios. 

[macskull]

11 minutes ago, Hew said:

Putting defense in ct is fine by me, as long as you can't slot defense set ios. 

There was some discussion on this in earlier builds. One of the goals was to give the teleport pool a mobility option like Hover or CJ and in that measure it's succeeded, but it's also a simple fact that some players take those powers to act mostly as set bonus mules which means the teleport pool in its current implementation isn't going to be useful to those players. I don't think it's a bad thing that a power can be taken to act as a set bonus mule - it allows for greater build versatility and using fewer slots.

[ScarySai]

I find the logic behind not letting it use LOTGs 'because set mule' to be arbitrary.

 

If I'm using CJ, it's because I'm using super speed as my travel power, and don't want to fly or teleport.

 

If I'm using fly/hover/afterburner, it's likely a range focused build, or because flying is awesome.

 

If I'm using teleport, it's because I want to instantly relocate as my main method of getting around in combat, whether it's to escape a bad situation, punch a sniper in the face or to slip through a crack that would otherwise not be doable.

 

LOTG is just a bonus on top of that. Letting CT use it does not cause any problems, nor does it infringe on the former two power options. Denying it the best buff just because of some unfounded fear of min/maxing is ridiculous.

---

As for fold space

 

The more I play with this, the more I feel like it needs SOMETHING to stop mobs from scattering the minute you drop them. Crowd control would be too much, and likely steps a bit on gravity's toes too much, so I was thinking, what if we added taunt to it?

[capricorpse]

8 minutes ago, aethereal said:

Spoiler

 

Okay, here's my feedback on Combat Teleport after a couple hours of playing with it on a lowbie EM/Invul scrapper.

 

Combat Teleport feels good.  That's no surprise, I think that it was clear from Burst of Speed and Jaunt that people were hungry for a fast, fluid teleportation power, and Combat Teleport provides that.  My experience is that you do not run out of charges unless you try really hard to, which is good, and was the major problem with Burst of Speed.  Jaunt of course required you to have Speed of Sound on, which had its own downsides.  Combat Teleport also provides you with an unequivocally teleport-y looking power activation, which is nice for some concepts.

 

But is Combat Teleport good?  I'm going to say...  not really.  If you had a choice between Combat Jumping and Combat Teleport on pure utilitarian grounds, I think CJ is the clear winner.  In terms of movement utility, they're different but I would certainly hesitate to say that CT is better, just given how un-fluid teleportation is in this game (I use a trackpad on a laptop, it is possible that a multi-button mouse would change my mind here).  In terms of the buff, the continuous defense of CJ is just clearly better than the inconsistent to-hit of CT.  And of course CJ is a great slot-mule for LotG global recharge, there is no equivalently useful slotting for CT.  In terms of Hover, the slotting/buff is the same, and Hover is almost certainly more movement-power useful for blast sets than CT.

 

I've been trying to proactively use the CT for the to-hit buff.  In terms of feeling -- I don't notice it.  I mean, I'm sure it is giving me the to-hit buff, but it doesn't feel noticeable.  I'm not like, "Oh wow, I'm hitting a lot more."  And this is with a not-very-well-slotted lowbie, probably the place we'd expect to see some noticeable improvement from a to-hit buff.

 

What about theory-wise?  I think it's really hard to use the to-hit buff from CT in a disciplined way.  Here's my thinking:

 

1.  We generally are going to be building for capped or near-capped to-hit rolls[1].  I'm not just talking about optimized end-game builds here, this is advice for slotting that goes back to the SO-only days.  Maybe more casual players don't build for enough accuracy to cap to-hit rolls against +4s, but then they don't tend to play against +4s.  In general, people don't like missing, and if you just drop CT into a pretty standardly-slotted build, it's unlikely that the inconsistent +10% to hit is going to help much.

 

2.  Okay, so fine, maybe we can change slotting to take advantage of CT.  Okay, but how?  Are we really going to drop our accuracy slotting in order to take advantage of the to-hit from CT?  That feels...  not great.  The buff from CT is short-lived and it takes a lot of attention and button pressing to keep it up.  Are we going to deal with our to-hit rolls dropping very significantly without managing the uptime of the CT buff?  I don't want to do that.  I don't think many people do.

 

3.  Well, is there an advanced strategy here?  I can think of a couple.  You could use CT with Follow Up in claws and similar powers.  Follow Up gives a potentially stacking, large to-hit buff once it gets going, so you can underslot accuracy in your attacks and use Follow Up to paper over that.  Then the issue is what if Follow Up missses?  Well, you could kind of kick off the virtuous cycle by doing CT->Follow Up->your actual attacks.  Okay, that's great and all, but what are we really getting there?  We can just slot Follow Up itself for accuracy and get the same benefit, right?  Here, CT isn't saving us broad accuracy slotting across all of our attacks, but accuracy slotting for a single power.  Not amazing.  I guess we can just use CT to paper over the inescapable miss chance for Follow Up.  If you get a miss on Follow Up, just hit CT and then go ahead with your attacks as normal until the next time FU comes up.  That sounds...  fine?  A bit niche.  The other thing I can think of is that you could use CT with a heavy defense-debuffing set like say Rad Blast.  Use CT to make your first couple of attacks hit, and then you don't need to worry about uptime of the CT attacks because your stacking defense debuffs have made it so that you're gonna hit regardless.  Honestly, this sounds to me like it'd only work on Rad Blast, but maybe it would work okay on some of the weapon sets.  So then you can underslot those attacks for accuracy and, probably what you're going to do is proc them out, right?  Like, this sounds like a tactic that's way too sophisticated and complex for someone to do with common IOs or SOs, and if you're using sets, you basically get plenty of accuracy from the sets, so this sounds like a tactic for proccing.  I'm a little dubious that this ultimately works out -- after all, you can already use Tactics, Aim, Build Up, Kismet, potentially Bio Armor or Invul, and others to get global to-hit bonuses, and we aren't hearing about procced out Rad Blast as a monster.  But maybe someone can make it work.  It sounds niche to me.

 

So my belief is that CT feels good but is mechanically disadvantageous.  I think people will take it for concept reasons even if it's not great.  Some people are going to say, "Great, mission accomplished, the power will be reasonably popular," but my opinion is this is actually the worst case.  Powers that people really want to take, but are bad, are worse than powers that are bad and people don't want to take.  People shouldn't be mechanically punished for wanting a thematic, cool-seeming power, and the game shouldn't be mechanically incentivizing hodge-podge collections of unthematic power picks.

 

 

 

I'll start by saying, I wouldn't reject a defense buff on Combat Teleport.  Anywhere there's more defense is going to be helpful.

 

What you wrote is a perfectly reasonable thought process of why you or someone else might not put Combat Teleport into a certain build, because of how you'd like to slot that build.  Which, again, is a valid decision for any player to make!  And I have to say I appreciate that you are looking at it from multiple levels of slotting. I'm usually somewhere in the middle between optimizing and fun/concept.   I also agree that the +tohit could either be longer or stronger.   Defense would be great, but doesn't feel totally necessary since there are two travel-lite combat powers that do this already.  On the other hand, it also makes sense for every travel power skill line to start with a way to use that power defensively in combat. 

 

But this reply is an example of the point I was trying to make earlier.  You're searching for a reason that this power should exist, when the reason is as simple as a quick teleport.  You don't seem to enjoy integrating that into your playstyle, because you said yourself, you're using a trackpad, which sounds annoying to use with teleport.  I play with one hand on the keyboard and one hand on a mouse - what I assume is a common and straightforward setup.  I keep teleports/dashes on F or C.  Because I'm already using the mouse for the camera and for stuff that's not in convenient tray spots, it's easy to use CT to zip all over the place hitting melee, PBAoE, zipping out, etc.  It's instant.   You "take advantage" of Combat Teleport by... instantly being somewhere else.  Out of the tar patch/caltrops/flaming oil slick/earthquake, many of which prevent jumping.  into your ally's healing plants. behind a wall so you can ambush a pull.  Use it on the ceiling above an upper floor that's annoying to take the hallway stairs to reach.  Go from the door of Portal Corp to the elevators instantly.  Perfectly line up those narrow cone attacks.  Avoid the rings on the ground in the higher level trials.  Possibilities are endless at all levels, even with no enhancements. 

 

It could be implemented with zero buff attached and I would take it on half my characters without second thought.  Mitigation through positioning is a really valid form of defense.

 

At the end of the day it's just... instantaneous teleport.  That's what the essence of the power is, and I think for many players that's enough reason to pick it up.  It makes CoH combat much more dynamic!

[aethereal]

11 minutes ago, capricorpse said:

But this reply is an example of the point I was trying to make earlier.  You're searching for a reason that this power should exist, when the reason is as simple as a quick teleport.  You don't seem to enjoy integrating that into your playstyle,

 

I do!  I enjoy Combat Teleport.  I think a lot of people will.  That's something I explicitly called out.  It's a fun power.  I just don't think it's a very good one.

 

And yes, I may not be able to take as full advantage of its tactical movement opportunities as people with a different input setup can.  But honestly, tactical movement just isn't that important in CoH PvE.  Most enemies do not have patch powers.  You can get CJ instead and have just as much ability to move around, with a more fluid control setup, and get defense as well.  There are a few cases where CT will enable you to do things that CJ would not -- like get out of caltrops fast -- but there are other cases where just tapping jump will be faster and easier, or where it's hard to place the reticle of CT because of an intervening obstacle, or where you screw up and teleport somewhere you don't want to be.  In terms of movement powers, it's a wash.

 

For blasting characters, in every place that doesn't have low ceilings, almost certainly Hover outperforms both CJ and CT in terms of actually getting a benefit from tactical movement.  Huge benefits there that CT and CJ won't be able to match.  Now, I think CT is cooler than Hover.  I probably under-pick Hover because the kind of pokey feeling of it isn't great for me.  But being able to reliably deny your enemies melee attacks is big.

 

I really want to call out the idea that if we make a power that people like for thematic/fun reasons, but it underperforms mechanically, that's in a lot of ways worse than making a power that's not compelling either mechanically or thematically.  The "bad both mechanically and thematically" power is just a waste of space, but it doesn't really hurt anyone.  The "bad mechanically but good thematically power" gets picked and creates a frustrating situation for players where their attempts to build a unified conceptual hero/villain feel punished compared to the guy who just picked all the good powers.  Not that this one power will move the needle a lot in terms of thematic-versus-effective, but it's part of the death of a thousand cuts of CoH right now.

 

[arthurh35353]

1 hour ago, macskull said:

• Wormhole: Ranged TAoE that teleports mobs to a specified location, not necessarily in your line of sight, and then stuns said mobs.
• Fold Space: PBAoE that teleports mobs to you and then does nothing else.

There are some interesting uses for this power, for sure - Tankers pulling mobs to them, Kinetics characters gathering mobs up for Fulcrum Shift, Traps/Devices users pulling mobs onto their tripmines... I think what's going to keep this from being super popular is the opportunity cost of having to go three powers deep into a pool that is honestly not that useful compared to the alternatives. I don't really see this as a griefing tool since when mobs are teleported they aggro on the caster.

Tanker taunts a mob of 16 highest level mobs for a zone. Uses fold space to drop them on lowbies in zone. Then teleports straight up once or twice to break aggro range.

 

Congrats, you just wiped some lowbies. Grab your two trolling buddies and see how much you can do this.

 

[Edit] Possible Fold Space griefing is to have you herd mobs to the edge of the drone range, you fold space a couple of times to get them to the doors for the interior spaces of AP/Grandville and see if you can fold space while trying to enter the interior zones. Or maybe you get your friend to teleport other while folding space.

Edited October 27, 2020 by arthurh35353

[Hew]

What is the current bind for CT? I saw @capricorpseuses either f or c. I macro shield charge/ thelightningone/spring attack, but CT looks like its going to be a kind of weird sort of semi-travel.

 

Reading someone else who said ninja run + CT is the bees knees, I REALLY want in on that action. How are you guys binding that, and is it per char, or global?

 

Thanks!

[Luminara]

5 hours ago, aethereal said:

Yeah, like I said, I'm not sure how much we even care about how travel powers work when you can do so much with temp powers.

 

I don't use any travel powers, temp or pool, on most of my characters, and there are always areas that are slightly annoying to navigate.  I've trained myself to instinctively detour around them or into them from the "right" direction.  But I've been liking everything I've seen in regard to Combat Teleport, and I like your feedback about using it without travel powers to bypass speed bumps in places like Steel Canyon.

 

I think I'm going to be doing a lot of respecing, between Combat Teleport and the changes to Trick Arrows.  I'd be annoyed, but actually having too many good choices for once, instead of trying to figure out how to squeeze in mules for set bonuses, is a really nice problem to have.

[arthurh35353]

1 minute ago, Hew said:

What is the current bind for CT? I saw @capricorpseuses either f or c. I macro shield charge/ thelightningone/spring attack, but CT looks like its going to be a kind of weird sort of semi-travel.

 

Reading someone else who said ninja run + CT is the bees knees, I REALLY want in on that action. How are you guys binding that, and is it per char, or global?

 

Thanks!

I think people are doing the LSHIFT+LBUTTON macro click for area and then an attack macro that lets you select a mob and then teleport loc to it.

[Hew]

Just now, arthurh35353 said:

I think people are doing the LSHIFT+LBUTTON macro click for area and then an attack macro that lets you select a mob and then teleport loc to it.

Hm, but the one guy is using it as a travel power I saw. Just an empty powexec_location with no target? I am REALLY curious and REALLY want to try this out, but I am definitely not a binds guy, and have to keep my teleport macro in a text file because I always forget and end up asking on the forum 😄

 

An exact syntax for that use would be awesome! Ah, this person: @aethereal

[aethereal]

5 minutes ago, Hew said:

Hm, but the one guy is using it as a travel power I saw. Just an empty powexec_location with no target? I am REALLY curious and REALLY want to try this out, but I am definitely not a binds guy, and have to keep my teleport macro in a text file because I always forget and end up asking on the forum 😄

 

An exact syntax for that use would be awesome! Ah, this person: @aethereal

powexeclocation camera:max combat teleport

is what I use.  Jumps you to the place where your camera is currently pointed.  But people with mouse buttons to spare may find that they want to do:

 

powexecname combat teleport

With a mouse button, which will not actually execute the entire jump, it will bring up the targeting reticule on the mouse, and then you can click the mouse button to execute the teleport.  So it's like maybe thumb-mouse-button, look at the reticule, possibly adjust, left-click, teleport.

 

(I also use powexeclocation target combat teleport for bringing me to a target, of course.)

 

((You may also find it useful to make a macro to teleport straight up while traveling, which I believe would be powexeclocation up:max combat teleport, but you might have to actually specify like powexeclocation up:100 combat teleport?  Not sure, haven't used it.  That may be particularly useful if you want to multi-port, first port brings you up in the air for better line of sight, then immediately follow up with a horizontal movement port.))

Edited October 27, 2020 by aethereal

[capricorpse]

55 minutes ago, aethereal said:

Spoiler

 

I do!  I enjoy Combat Teleport.  I think a lot of people will.  That's something I explicitly called out.  It's a fun power.  I just don't think it's a very good one.

 

And yes, I may not be able to take as full advantage of its tactical movement opportunities as people with a different input setup can.  But honestly, tactical movement just isn't that important in CoH PvE.  Most enemies do not have patch powers.  You can get CJ instead and have just as much ability to move around, with a more fluid control setup, and get defense as well.  There are a few cases where CT will enable you to do things that CJ would not -- like get out of caltrops fast -- but there are other cases where just tapping jump will be faster and easier, or where it's hard to place the reticle of CT because of an intervening obstacle, or where you screw up and teleport somewhere you don't want to be.  In terms of movement powers, it's a wash.

 

For blasting characters, in every place that doesn't have low ceilings, almost certainly Hover outperforms both CJ and CT in terms of actually getting a benefit from tactical movement.  Huge benefits there that CT and CJ won't be able to match.  Now, I think CT is cooler than Hover.  I probably under-pick Hover because the kind of pokey feeling of it isn't great for me.  But being able to reliably deny your enemies melee attacks is big.

 

I really want to call out the idea that if we make a power that people like for thematic/fun reasons, but it underperforms mechanically, that's in a lot of ways worse than making a power that's not compelling either mechanically or thematically.  The "bad both mechanically and thematically" power is just a waste of space, but it doesn't really hurt anyone.  The "bad mechanically but good thematically power" gets picked and creates a frustrating situation for players where their attempts to build a unified conceptual hero/villain feel punished compared to the guy who just picked all the good powers.  Not that this one power will move the needle a lot in terms of thematic-versus-effective, but it's part of the death of a thousand cuts of CoH right now.

 

 

Ah yes okay I see what you mean, and I agree.  I guess I just don't see combat teleport as falling into that category.  

 

41 minutes ago, Hew said:

What is the current bind for CT? I saw @capricorpseuses either f or c. I macro shield charge/ thelightningone/spring attack, but CT looks like its going to be a kind of weird sort of semi-travel.

 

Reading someone else who said ninja run + CT is the bees knees, I REALLY want in on that action. How are you guys binding that, and is it per char, or global?

 

Thanks!

So replacing jaunt with combat teleport, I usually set up like this - 

 

/bind button4 powexec_name combat teleport

(this makes the side button on my mouse bring up the target reticle for precision porting.)

 

/bind f powexec_location target combat teleport 

(this replaces the Follow function and just brings me to my target)

 

/bind c powexec_location back:35 combat teleport

(this scoots me back about 15 feet.  this is also ESPECIAlLY good in the new patch, which changes it so now your camera stays pointed the same direction instead of turning 180 degrees!)

 

I'm interested to try the method I think I saw up-thread, using Shift+w/a/s/d to create a separate layer of movement keys that are all teleports.  Probably something like 

/bind lshift+w powexec_location forward:35 combat teleport

/bind lshift+d powexec_location right:35 combat teleport

/bind lshift+a powexec_location left:35 combat teleport

/bind lshift+s powexec_location back:35 combat teleport

 

You can change your number values to whatever you want, but I find the mid-thirties to be a nice amount of actual distance while usually still in the same room. Maybe I'd set the forward to be the highest, and the side directions to be a bit lower, like 55/25/25/35 ?

 

***Edited for bind corrections, which may still be wrong lmao

Edited October 27, 2020 by capricorpse

[Hew]

5 minutes ago, capricorpse said:

Ah yes okay I see what you mean, and I agree.  I guess I just don't see combat teleport as falling into that category.  

 

So replacing jaunt with combat teleport, I usually set up like this - 

 

/bind button4 powexec_name combat teleport

(this makes the side button on my mouse bring up the target reticle for precision porting.)

 

/bind f powexec_location target combat teleport 

(this replaces the Follow function and just brings me to my target)

 

/bind c powexec_location back:35 combat teleport

(this scoots me back about 15 feet.  this is also ESPECIAlLY good in the new patch, which changes it so now your camera stays pointed the same direction instead of turning 180 degrees!)

 

I'm interested to try the method I think I saw up-thread, using Shift+w/a/s/d to create a separate layer of movement keys that are all teleports.  Probably something like 

/bind lshift+w powexec_location forward:35 combat teleport

/bind lshift+d powexec_location right:35 combat teleport

/bind lshift+a powexec_location left:35 combat teleport

/bind lshift+s powexec_location back:35 combat teleport

 

You can change your number values to whatever you want, but I find the mid-thirties to be a nice amount of actual distance while usually still in the same room. Maybe I'd set the forward to be the highest, and the side directions to be a bit lower, like 55/25/25/35 ?

 

***Edited for bind corrections, which may still be wrong lmao

Holy shit this is AWESOME.

 

I literally just cut and pasted this into my own file.

 

How can i figure out what buttons are what on my mouse? I have 4 on the side.

 

[capricorpse]

26 minutes ago, Hew said:

Holy shit this is AWESOME.

 

I literally just cut and pasted this into my own file.

 

How can i figure out what buttons are what on my mouse? I have 4 on the side.

 

haha i'm not sure, other than binding button1 thru button6 to different powers and heading into a fight?  Though buttons 1 and 2 might mess with some basic clicking/camera functions and break your game, for which I claim no responsibility!  haha

[jkapu]

Fold Space is a fantastic addition to this game. Many classes like scrappers, stalkers, and blasters have a problem with mobs running away all the time, but this power will allow you to quickly gather all the mobs and aoe them down. This power will also be great for teams that do not have a tank because the front runners can use Fold Space to peel any stragglers off the squishier members. Combat Teleport is also pretty nice in combination with the normal teleport. You can cover distance with teleport and use CT to get around corners and into small spaces. 

[ScarySai]

1 hour ago, Hew said:

Holy shit this is AWESOME.

 

I literally just cut and pasted this into my own file.

 

How can i figure out what buttons are what on my mouse? I have 4 on the side.

 

Typically unless you are using an MMO mouse, for modern gaming mice the top button near your thumb is button5, the one below is button4 and the mouse wheel is button3.

 

For binds, left click would be 'lbutton'

 

Double check with Synapse/logitech/whatever you use, or just look up your mouse if you aren't sure.

Edited October 27, 2020 by ScarySai

[csr]

Is there a reason for the double "Untouchable" status when using Teleport?  One expires with the Hover component as expected, the other about 2 second later.

[csr]

1 hour ago, Hew said:

Holy shit this is AWESOME.

 

I literally just cut and pasted this into my own file.

 

How can i figure out what buttons are what on my mouse? I have 4 on the side.

 

You can go into Options->Keymapping, pick something you want bound to the button, left-click on one of the settings to select it, then just click the button you want bound there.  That will tell you what the game sees the button as (if it sees it at all).

Edited October 27, 2020 by csr

[dtj714]

Don’t think it’s already been put out there, so here are the numbers -

 

Unlocking the hero zones, coop zones, First Ward and Night Ward (everything a hero could/would get I’m guessing) for the accolade power requires...147 badges.  For non-badge hunters, that’s a bit much.
 

If you insist on this implementation, then you should at least give those who already took LRTP the accolade automatically. The fact that they would also have an “extra” power pick should be your opportunity cost for removing a pool power put in the game with Issue 21 and providing a substitute of an entirely different nature.  
 

Speaking of which, since not everyone may like/want the new powers/pool, you should give all those affected a free respec, instead of just swapping out the powers...

Edited October 28, 2020 by dtj714

[Sif]

5 minutes ago, dtj714 said:

Unlocking the hero zones, coop zones, First Ward and Night Ward (everything a hero could/would get I’m guessing) for the accolade power requires...147 badges.

Is that for every possible destination, or just what the old LRTP could do? Remember you don't need everything to get the accolade, so you'd only need the zones that LRTP provides to get equivalent functionality.