The Unloved SR/Claws Tank

Aurora_Girl · October 31, 2021

Willing to let my /SR brute try to main tank MoM next week? 😒

Bill Z Bubba · October 31, 2021

1 hour ago, Aurora_Girl said:

Willing to let my /SR brute try to main tank MoM next week? 😒

I'm trying to figure out how to get elusive mind when there are no rikti invasions going on...

Doomguide2005 · October 31, 2021

5 hours ago, Bill Z Bubba said:

I'm trying to figure out how to get elusive mind when there are no rikti invasions going on...

Oh that's easy @Bill Z Bubba. Just solo the LGTF, trigger an invasion, rinse repeat until you get the needed badges

OR

Send large gift to the appropriate GMs to get them to trigger a few 😜

Meknomancer · October 31, 2021

I love claws for a long time it was my favourite melee set but no matter how many times i play sr i just don't find it fun. So i'll just say this- damage auras. We need a new power pool set. A damage aura would make sr fun.

ihatethewind · November 2, 2021

Never tried clawz but sr is fantastic, it’s my new main. It’s a lot different than other tanks which I find refreshing, you actually see your health low sometimes! :)

It’s not invincible, usually the thing that gets me is being end drained, which seems to happen easily despite all the defense. Kinda wish there was a power that could plug that hole but I suppose every set needs a weakness

Sovera · November 2, 2021

17 minutes ago, ihatethewind said:

Never tried clawz but sr is fantastic, it’s my new main. It’s a lot different than other tanks which I find refreshing, you actually see your health low sometimes! 🙂

It’s not invincible, usually the thing that gets me is being end drained, which seems to happen easily despite all the defense. Kinda wish there was a power that could plug that hole but I suppose every set needs a weakness

It's not a magic bullet but at least grab Recovery Serums off the P2W vendor. They save my butt in Freak heavy missions since Consume does not keep up with multiple Super Stunner deaths.

Bill Z Bubba · November 2, 2021

Carnie death drains aren't autohit, malta sappers can't sap what they don't hit, super sappers have to be in melee for their autohit, so when they're close to death, jump out and finish them with focus.

This is not to say that a set with no end drain protection or recovery tools with 3 toggles (or 6 when you add in CJ, Tough and Weave,) won't run into issues. Quickness' +20% recharge reduction doesn't help either. Then throw on hasten's end suck every 2 mins....

Since my SR/Claws tank has 7 toggles (CJ replaced with tactics and assault,) I absolutely had to go ageless core but that's useless before level 45 exemplared. Even conserve power and physical perfection will go away before lvl 30 and 36 respectively while exemplared in his current build.

Workable but true that it's something to keep in mind.

ihatethewind · November 2, 2021

3 hours ago, Sovera said:

It's not a magic bullet but at least grab Recovery Serums off the P2W vendor. They save my butt in Freak heavy missions since Consume does not keep up with multiple Super Stunner deaths.

Oh I definitely do, between it and ageless it usually takes care of me for most things

Bodhivajra · November 4, 2021

So my main, and without a doubt the all-around strongest character I've ever made, is an SR/Claws tank. But at the same time, I confess to two of the epistemic flaws mentioned in this very thread.

First, I didn't believe, prior to trying it, that SR could be effective on tanks, because I drastically underestimated the scaling resistance. I just didn't think of the set as layered mitigation, but as a one-trick pony, as Werner put it earlier in the thread. I had tried it once on live on a tank, but not to max level, and definitely not to the point of having a serious build or taking on serious opposition.

Second, I never tried Claws on live. Just didn't like the theme; I know, I know, I'm a namby-pamby concept guy, but I didn't like the notion of my characters running around and gutting people with claws. I'll just punch them into brain damage, tyvm. But I did make a sort of casual bio/claws tanker on Homecoming and I really got to enjoy the set's gameplay, for reasons everybody on here already understands. It plays incredibly smoothly, it's got a great balance of single-target and AoE, and most important for my simple mind, Followup means that I don't have to pay attention to a Build-Up power. One less thing to think about.

Even THAT didn't really click for me -- the bio/claws was just funsies, not a serious build -- until I ran across a thread in which Bill Z. mentioned the exact amount of recharge necessary to run a gapless FU-Foc-Slash attack chain. Now, I'm not good at attack chains -- I'm more of an impulse button-masher -- but I saw the number and I thought, well, dang, I can put that together on an SR tank, no problem. Let's give it a try. So I did. It really was that simple -- one thread, a global recharge percentage, and some back-of-a-Post-It math that put primary and secondary choices together for me.

And it is MAGIC. I took the Widow claws to kinda make it look like he's punching, and this character is glorious fun. I'm not going to pretend it's as bleeding-edge as the builds of some folks posting in this thread, but it exemps well all the way down to level 1, can do the stupid pet tricks stuff, suffers anxiety from Rularuu but can still take them at 4/8, et cetera. Only has to worry about four offensive buttons, which is good for my simple mind.

So cheers to SR/Claws, I say. And a special thanks, Bill, for casually posting a number that gave me my favorite character.

Edited November 4, 2021 by Bodhivajra
Went back, saw who advanced the one-trick-pony meta-hypothesis

Bill Z Bubba · November 5, 2021

Just main tanked MoM iTrial. No deaths. No issues at all. I did replace some damage procs to 6 slot 3 purple sets and we did have a widow with mind link.

Bodhivajra · November 5, 2021

For what it's worth, just thinking the about the endurance issues some people have mentioned vis-a-vis SR:

While I can't summon the math offhand, my character doesn't seem to lack for endurance most of the time (though see the next paragraph); obviously endurance never needs to be a problem for anyone post-Incarnates, but Bruno took Ageless Radial for the debuff resistance and +recharge rather than the endurance, primarily, and I frequently forget to even use it. Looking back at Bill's build at the beginning of the thread, I see that I built for endurance recovery just about the same way, which seems to me basically the sensible way -- accolades, Physical Perfection, performance shifter procs, all the relevant healing globals and procs, as much endurance modification in Stamina as I could fit in. Under those conditions, the character can run constant fu/foc/slash or fu/spin/fu/foc/slash chains (I know, I don't use Shockwave in AoE, for Reasons, or possibly just Idiosyncrasies) for... well, I guarantee at least 45 minutes, because that's the longest time I remember paying attention to in one continous fight. And if you can do it for 45 straight minutes, you can pretty much do it forever.

Mind, endurance recovery is a bit stochastic, but that's just a way of life for SR; sometimes the dice come up badly and the blue bar shrinks unexpectedly, just like the green bar, but it seems to work out fine over the course of things. Indeed, my experience is that this is true even exemped down to the lowest level at which those chains can be run, which is well below Physical Perfection's availability.

It is perhaps also worth noting that the lack of endurance debuff resistance doesn't really bother me on SR; a single Malta Sapper hit is sufficient to drain about half a bar, but odds being what they are, the chances of even a sizeable, high-level Malta spawn hitting twice before I can burn them all down are quite small. And perhaps regrettably, experience teaches that an SR tank is sufficiently durable to survive a complete toggle drop in the middle of a reasonably challenging spawn (Malta 4/8) just by popping blues, retoggling, and starting over. Not that this should happen normally except for my own stupidity.

So what I'm saying is, I don't even consider the endurance thing, either self- or other-induced, to be a hole for SR. Indeed, it's one more thing I like about SR: Its primary layer of damage mitigation is (almost) perfectly smooth and gapless. You can wander into virtually any situation (hi eyeballs, Hami) without having to think too hard in advance about what you might be facing. I'll trade some situation-specific durability for that go-anywhere utility.

(I'm obviously fired by evangelical furor by this thread....)

Uun · November 5, 2021

Other things to include for endurance management (aside from the +end accolades):

Reactive Defenses - 3.75% endurance discount for 5 pieces

Unbreakable Guard - 2.5% endurance discount for 2 pieces

Gift of the Ancients - 2% endurance recovery for 2 pieces, 1.8% +end for 4 pieces

Superior Gauntleted Fist - 3.6% +end for 2 pieces

I really like the endurance discount bonuses, but they're only available in 4 sets and 2 of them are tricky fits for SR (Annihilation and Preventative Medicine).

PyroBeetle · December 29, 2021

Indont mean to thread necro, but I recently put one of these together. I attempted to use the Teleportation pool in place of the Leadership pool, but found that to be largely superfluous, so moved it back to enjoy the status protection on Assault and Tactics (only toggled on when needed, helps with the end).

Recovery Serum is more than sufficient to keep up with the endurance on the build even with the additional toggles, so the only reason to go ageless would be for the convenience or no temp runs. I have been detoggled but never died to it, thanks to the sound of my toggles crashing. Always tough enough to get out, rebuff, and re-engage.

Saw another thread for smoothest tank, and this is certainly the smoothest playing build that I have run 1 to 50 and beyond without problems or even thinking in most instances, just muscle memory mashing keys and eating mobs. I'd tend to pop up to use my Shockwave, though not always needed, habit from Scrapper days on live, you really wanted the KB to be KD.

Slithershot · January 19, 2022

The reason SR is not ultra popular on tanks is quite simple. Most people who play tankers don't like seeing their health bar move. They want to feel invincible, not just tough. They want to exit a battle unscathed so their cape can flap in the breeze under the beaming sun.

People like us... we don't mind having a little bloody lip, cause at the end of the day we're still standing, and still dropping bodies. 💪

Edited January 19, 2022 by Pizzamurai
stuff

Major_Decoy · January 19, 2022

So... build goals here are 1) No fighting pool 2) a self-rez and 3) Incarnate softcap without alpha slotting.

Spoiler

This Hero build was built using Mids Reborn 3.1.2.5
https://github.com/LoadedCamel/MidsReborn

Click this DataLink to open the build!

Rikki: Level 50 Natural Tanker
Primary Power Set: Super Reflexes
Secondary Power Set: Claws
Power Pool: Presence
Power Pool: Leaping
Power Pool: Leadership
Ancillary Pool: Energy Mastery

Hero Profile:
Level 1: Focused Fighting

(A) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Increased Global Recharge Speed
(3) Luck of the Gambler - Defense
(3) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Endurance

Level 1: Swipe

(A) Mako's Bite - Accuracy/Damage
(5) Mako's Bite - Damage/Endurance
(5) Mako's Bite - Damage/Recharge
(7) Mako's Bite - Accuracy/Endurance/Recharge
(7) Mako's Bite - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance/Recharge
(9) Mako's Bite - Chance of Damage(Lethal)

Level 2: Focused Senses

(A) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Increased Global Recharge Speed
(9) Luck of the Gambler - Defense
(11) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Endurance

Level 4: Slash

(A) Superior Gauntleted Fist - Accuracy/Damage
(17) Superior Gauntleted Fist - Damage/RechargeTime
(17) Superior Gauntleted Fist - Accuracy/Damage/RechargeTime
(19) Superior Gauntleted Fist - Damage/Endurance/RechargeTime
(19) Superior Gauntleted Fist - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance/RechargeTime
(21) Superior Gauntleted Fist - RechargeTime/+Absorb

Level 6: Practiced Brawler

(A) Recharge Reduction IO

Level 8: Dodge

(A) Gift of the Ancients - Run Speed +7.5%
(21) Gift of the Ancients - Defense
(23) Gift of the Ancients - Defense/Endurance

Level 10: Provoke

(A) Accuracy IO

Level 12: Evasion

(A) Red Fortune - Defense/Endurance
(23) Red Fortune - Defense/Recharge
(25) Red Fortune - Endurance/Recharge
(48) Red Fortune - Defense/Endurance/Recharge
(50) Red Fortune - Defense
(50) Red Fortune - Endurance

Level 14: Agile

(A) Gift of the Ancients - Run Speed +7.5%
(25) Gift of the Ancients - Defense
(27) Gift of the Ancients - Defense/Endurance

Level 16: Spin

(A) Superior Avalanche - Accuracy/Damage
(27) Superior Avalanche - Damage/Endurance
(29) Superior Avalanche - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance
(29) Superior Avalanche - Accuracy/Damage/Recharge
(31) Superior Avalanche - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance/Recharge
(31) Superior Avalanche - Recharge/Chance for Knockdown

Level 18: Lucky

(A) Gift of the Ancients - Run Speed +7.5%
(31) Gift of the Ancients - Defense
(33) Gift of the Ancients - Defense/Endurance

Level 20: Follow Up

(A) Superior Might of the Tanker - Accuracy/Damage
(33) Superior Might of the Tanker - Damage/Recharge
(33) Superior Might of the Tanker - Accuracy/Damage/Recharge
(34) Superior Might of the Tanker - Damage/Endurance/Recharge
(34) Superior Might of the Tanker - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance/Recharge
(34) Superior Might of the Tanker - Recharge/Chance for +Res(All)

Level 22: Intimidate

(A) Accuracy IO

Level 24: Unrelenting

(A) Preventive Medicine - Heal
(36) Preventive Medicine - Heal/Endurance
(36) Preventive Medicine - Endurance/RechargeTime
(36) Preventive Medicine - Heal/RechargeTime
(37) Preventive Medicine - Heal/RechargeTime/Endurance
(37) Preventive Medicine - Chance for +Absorb

Level 26: Quickness

(A) Run Speed IO

Level 28: Focus

(A) Superior Winter's Bite - Accuracy/Damage
(37) Superior Winter's Bite - Damage/RechargeTime
(39) Superior Winter's Bite - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance
(39) Superior Winter's Bite - Accuracy/Damage/Recharge
(39) Superior Winter's Bite - Damage/Endurance/Accuracy/RechargeTime
(40) Superior Winter's Bite - Recharge/Chance for -Speed & -Recharge

Level 30: Combat Jumping

(A) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Increased Global Recharge Speed
(46) Shield Wall - +Res (Teleportation), +5% Res (All)
(48) Winter's Gift - Slow Resistance (20%)
(48) Reactive Defenses - Defense
(50) Reactive Defenses - Scaling Resist Damage

Level 32: Maneuvers

(A) Gift of the Ancients - Run Speed +7.5%
(40) Gift of the Ancients - Defense
(40) Gift of the Ancients - Defense/Endurance
(42) Gift of the Ancients - Defense/Endurance/Recharge

Level 35: Eviscerate

(A) Scirocco's Dervish - Accuracy/Damage
(42) Scirocco's Dervish - Damage/Endurance
(42) Scirocco's Dervish - Damage/Recharge
(43) Scirocco's Dervish - Accuracy/Recharge
(43) Scirocco's Dervish - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance

Level 38: Tactics

(A) Gaussian's Synchronized Fire-Control - To Hit Buff
(43) Gaussian's Synchronized Fire-Control - To Hit Buff/Recharge
(45) Gaussian's Synchronized Fire-Control - To Hit Buff/Recharge/Endurance
(45) Gaussian's Synchronized Fire-Control - Recharge/Endurance
(45) Gaussian's Synchronized Fire-Control - To Hit Buff/Endurance
(46) Gaussian's Synchronized Fire-Control - Chance for Build Up

Level 41: Conserve Power

(A) Recharge Reduction IO

Level 44: Physical Perfection

(A) Performance Shifter - Chance for +End
(46) Power Transfer - Chance to Heal Self

Level 47: Vengeance

(A) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Increased Global Recharge Speed

Level 49: Elude

(A) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Increased Global Recharge Speed

Level 1: Gauntlet

Level 1: Brawl

(A) Empty

Level 1: Sprint

(A) Empty

Level 2: Rest

(A) Empty

Level 2: Swift

(A) Run Speed IO

Level 2: Hurdle

(A) Jumping IO

Level 2: Health

(A) Numina's Convalesence - +Regeneration/+Recovery
(11) Panacea - +Hit Points/Endurance
(13) Regenerative Tissue - +Regeneration
(13) Numina's Convalesence - Heal

Level 2: Stamina

(A) Performance Shifter - Chance for +End
(15) Power Transfer - Chance to Heal Self
(15) Power Transfer - EndMod

Level 1: Prestige Power Dash

(A) Empty

Level 1: Prestige Power Slide

(A) Empty

Level 1: Prestige Power Quick

(A) Empty

Level 1: Prestige Power Rush

(A) Empty

Level 1: Prestige Power Surge

(A) Empty

Level 4: Ninja Run

------------

I didn't quite get there

Edited January 19, 2022 by Major_Decoy

Erratic1 · January 19, 2022

@Major_Decoy It falls within the realm of preferences but with a tiny 0.63% reduction in defenses and loss of 1.5% S/L resistance you could pick up 80 hp, 0.16 Recovery, and 7.5% global recharge.

Spoiler

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Major_Decoy · January 19, 2022

I think losing two performance shifter: chance for endurance procs and a Panacea: chance for health and endurance proc kind of negates the .16 Recovery from set bonuses.

LastHumanSoldier · January 20, 2022

What damage scalar does claws teo range attacks use?

.95 or 5?

Uun · January 20, 2022

9 minutes ago, LastHumanSoldier said:

What damage scalar does claws teo range attacks use?

.95 or 5?

Melee Damage (0.95)

Sovera · January 21, 2022

On 1/19/2022 at 11:41 PM, Major_Decoy said:

I think losing two performance shifter: chance for endurance procs and a Panacea: chance for health and endurance proc kind of negates the .16 Recovery from set bonuses.

By far. Any single one of those is worth more than 0.16, and it's the loss of three.

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