Set that gives AoE Immobs -Knock Back

[Solarverse]

There are a select few that already have -Knock Back built in to the Immobs. However, my personal favorite is Gravity, unfortunately, it does not prevent knock back. I would like a set that grants -Knock Back to sets that lack them in their AoE Immob.

[SuggestorK]

I play Gravity too (Lvl 50 Grav/Kin) , and as far i know and have seen it prevents Knockback till a certain magnitude of course.

 

Example i use propel on 3 foes the main gets knocked back the other 2 from area effect knocked down, i use Group Immobilze fist then propel all 3 get knocked down.

 

Also with my energy blaster i mostly wait if a controller is on group till he drops his group Immobilize and then use Energy Torrent, i see mostly way less Knockback then without.

Nova is a different matter, it still knocks em back somewhat but not as far as when they dont have Group Immobilize in em.

 

Then there are of course different factors coming together like in other Knockback Threads already said like some foes are weak to it (like clockwork) or are -1 or less so it increases the magnitude. In teams it can be even that there are more then one Knockback Power at same time hits... that would add to magnitude as well.

[Solarverse]

Double Post

Edited January 6, 2022 by Solarverse

[Solarverse]

2 hours ago, SuggestorK said:

I play Gravity too (Lvl 50 Grav/Kin) , and as far i know and have seen it prevents Knockback till a certain magnitude of course.

 

Example i use propel on 3 foes the main gets knocked back the other 2 from area effect knocked down, i use Group Immobilze fist then propel all 3 get knocked down.

 

Also with my energy blaster i mostly wait if a controller is on group till he drops his group Immobilize and then use Energy Torrent, i see mostly way less Knockback then without.

Nova is a different matter, it still knocks em back somewhat but not as far as when they dont have Group Immobilize in em.

 

Then there are of course different factors coming together like in other Knockback Threads already said like some foes are weak to it (like clockwork) or are -1 or less so it increases the magnitude. In teams it can be even that there are more then one Knockback Power at same time hits... that would add to magnitude as well.

 

Under controlled tests and according to all available info, Gravity AoE Immobilize does not prevent Knock Back. The only thing that prevents knock back is the single target and AoE Hold.

[Uun]

9 hours ago, Solarverse said:

I would like a set that grants -Knock Back to sets that lack them in their AoE Immob.

I could get behind this, but Gravity and Electric are the only control sets that don't have -kb in their AoE immobilize, so your audience is pretty small. I slot kb>kd in Wormhole and Propel (and Tornado).

[Solarverse]

1 minute ago, Uun said:

I could get behind this, but Gravity and Electric are the only control sets that don't have -kb in their AoE immobilize, so your audience is pretty small. I slot kb>kd in Wormhole and Propel (and Tornado).

 

True, but I have seen many people (including myself) say that Gravity was their favorite set. It's just a shame that it is one of the two sets that does not come with -knock back. So hopefully the audience is a bit larger than it may appear.

[TheZag]

Wouldnt KB>KD in your knockback powers accomplish the same thing as an enhancement that grants knock protection to an immobilize power?

 

It would be especially strange for an immobilize enhancement to be virtually useless in some immobilize powers.

[Solarverse]

3 minutes ago, TheZag said:

Wouldnt KB>KD in your knockback powers accomplish the same thing as an enhancement that grants knock protection to an immobilize power?

 

It would be especially strange for an immobilize enhancement to be virtually useless in some immobilize powers.

 

You kind of worded that a bit odd, but if you are saying it in a way that I think you are, you mean wouldn't it makes more sense to just have an IO that gives Immobilize powers a -KB mechanic? If so, that is pretty much what I asked for. It's no different than sets that grant KB to KD in attacks, not all attacks can use them. Kind of the same thing in my head.

[TheZag]

11 minutes ago, Solarverse said:

 

You kind of worded that a bit odd, but if you are saying it in a way that I think you are, you mean wouldn't it makes more sense to just have an IO that gives Immobilize powers a -KB mechanic? If so, that is pretty much what I asked for. It's no different than sets that grant KB to KD in attacks, not all attacks can use them. Kind of the same thing in my head.

 

My bad on the wording there,  i meant the existing kb>kd should just be put in knockback powers.  It would probably be better to advocate for KB protection to be added to immobilize powers where it makes sense instead of a KB protection enhancement.

 

There are a few other enhancements that dont make sense either.  Like the stun one that has chance for -to hit,  why do i need them to be less accurate while they arent able to do anything.  And then why do i need KB protection added to a power that already has KB protection.

 

So i think the route to go is ask for KB protection just be added to the power.  And it makes more sense that gravity is able to hold you to the ground then fire.

[arcane]

Yeah Sudden Acceleration and Overwhelming Force gotchu covered here brotato

[Solarverse]

44 minutes ago, TheZag said:

 

My bad on the wording there,  i meant the existing kb>kd should just be put in knockback powers.  It would probably be better to advocate for KB protection to be added to immobilize powers where it makes sense instead of a KB protection enhancement.

 

There are a few other enhancements that dont make sense either.  Like the stun one that has chance for -to hit,  why do i need them to be less accurate while they arent able to do anything.  And then why do i need KB protection added to a power that already has KB protection.

 

So i think the route to go is ask for KB protection just be added to the power.  And it makes more sense that gravity is able to hold you to the ground then fire.

 

I see. That wouldn't really work, since that only works for my Knock Back powers. That doesn't work for other people's knock back powers.

[Solarverse]

28 minutes ago, arcane said:

Yeah Sudden Acceleration and Overwhelming Force gotchu covered here brotato

See above post.

[Replacement]

We need a post to track all of these.

 

Ok!  Can do!

 

 

[Solarverse]

1 hour ago, Replacement said:

We need a post to track all of these.

 

Ok!  Can do!

 

 

 

 

Oh hell yes, thanks for that. I'll give it a longer look once I am able, but what I have read so far is insightful.

[DreadShinobi]

At this point I think I'd rather just see a change to wormhole decreasing the knockback mag to knockdown. When something like this becomes so standard to slot a kd io into a power you start to question if it should have just been designed like this. And no I'm not suggesting other standard applications of the kb-KD io to be looked at in reducing kb mag, just wormhole. Propel for example still makes sense that the base effect is knockback.

Edited January 6, 2022 by DreadShinobi

[Solarverse]

8 minutes ago, DreadShinobi said:

 Propel for example still makes sense that the base effect is knockback.

 

Not when you are shackled it doesn't. Setting aside everything else you wrote, being Immobilized is like having your ankles shackled to a ring in the concrete. If I throw a refrigerator at you, it's going to knock you down, not back...unless of course I throw it so hard your feet are literally left behind still shackled as your body flies backwards that is, lol. So no, If I immobilize, no targets should be getting knocked back when I put it all together in my head. Targets getting knocked when they are Immobilized seems very off, in a gaming mechanical sense and in a more reality sense.

 

 

Edited January 6, 2022 by Solarverse
typo

[TheZag]

I cant get behind an enhancement meant to stop other players knockback.  Either the power should have KB protection or it shouldnt.  I dont need people telling me my grav controller is wrong for not using it.

[Solarverse]

Just now, TheZag said:

I cant get behind an enhancement meant to stop other players knockback.  Either the power should have KB protection or it shouldnt.  I dont need people telling me my grav controller is wrong for not using it.

 

People are going to tell you how to play no matter what you do. Doesn't mean you have to listen. Not sure why this has to be any different. Not everyone slots their KB powers with a KB to KD either, in fact some actually slot KB enhancements, it's simply a choice...and how many times have I heard, "I am all for choices." What you are talking about is a forced action, and I typically try and stay away from forced changes.

[PeregrineFalcon]

The only controller that I've liked enough to not delete is my Gravity/Storm controller. And I've never understood why the AoE Immob from Gravity doesn't prevent knockback.

 

I would understand if the Rings of Fire from Fire didn't prevent KB, or Electric or Psychic, but this is Gravity. If any set locks you to the deck it should be GRAVITY.

[Solarverse]

5 hours ago, PeregrineFalcon said:

The only controller that I've liked enough to not delete is my Gravity/Storm controller. And I've never understood why the AoE Immob from Gravity doesn't prevent knockback.

 

I would understand if the Rings of Fire from Fire didn't prevent KB, or Electric or Psychic, but this is Gravity. If any set locks you to the deck it should be GRAVITY.

 

I couldn't decide if that deserved a laughing face or a thank you, but it's such a strong point thematically I had to go with the thank you, lol.

[arcane]

18 hours ago, PeregrineFalcon said:

 

I would understand if the Rings of Fire from Fire didn't prevent KB, or Electric or Psychic, but this is Gravity. If any set locks you to the deck it should be GRAVITY.

Good enough for me after thinking about it, make it so. 

[Teirusu]

I rather like the idea that Gravity's AOE immobilize would convert all knockbacks into knockdowns.  After all, if you are using high GRAVITY to lock the mobs in-place, it should be easier for them to just fall down but not necessarily flyyyy back.

 

 

As far as I know, it wouldn't need a special IO to do it, just have the power grant the mob high knockback resistance but no actual protection.  High enough resistance could/should reduce the magnitude of any knocks they are hit with to be under mag 1 which would then knock them down, but not away.

[Uun]

2 hours ago, Teirusu said:

 

As far as I know, it wouldn't need a special IO to do it, just have the power grant the mob high knockback resistance but no actual protection.  High enough resistance could/should reduce the magnitude of any knocks they are hit with to be under mag 1 which would then knock them down, but not away.

Which is how the AoE immobilize in every other control set (except Electric) works.

[Teirusu]

3 hours ago, Uun said:

Which is how the AoE immobilize in every other control set (except Electric) works.

 

 

...Huh, I was about to reply back that Mids clearly shows nearly all of them give 100 KB protection along with 10000% resistance.. but then I decided to check City of Data.  Sure enough, you're right.  https://cod.uberguy.net/html/power.html?power=controller_control.ice_control.frostbite&at=controller  The AOE immobilizes only give 10000% resistance, no KB mag protection.

 

I wonder how long its been since they changed that.. 😲

[Uun]

1 hour ago, Teirusu said:

I wonder how long its been since they changed that.. 😲

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