Some things I'd like to see

[MUPlayer]

I believe there are some old topics on a few of the things I'm going to mention but my search-fu isn't the best.  So, forgive me if I'm being redundant..

 

Martial Combat as a full ranged damage set - I believe this could be done fairly easily.  The melee attacks currently available for Doms could be swapped out for ranged attacks using the grenade and dagger throw animations. The only challenge might be with the large AOE, but I see parts of some Dual Blade animations could be utilized.  Thoughts, anyone?

 

Mind Control - Mass Hypnosis/Sleep effects - I know there have been multiple threads on this set, so I'll try to be brief.  The change to sleep abilities doesn't really address how situational it can be.  I propose sleep for Mind control work a bit differently: an affected enemy (one that actually goes into sleep status) that is hit with another sleep affect goes into "deep sleep", meaning they will wake after two tics of health change AND all offensive abilities go into cooldown. If an enemy is it with 3 sleep consecutive effects, they are 'Comatose' meaning it will take four tics AND all offensive and defensive abilities go into cooldown. I think this would make sleep effects more of a threat, but it might too strong.  Thoughts?

 

Poison - Thematically, I like the set but even with the ranged debuffs getting a little 'splash effect' it still underperforms.  Given that the heal animation is an underhand throw, I'd like to see it become a targeted AoE heal with those on the outer range of the AoE receiving less healing.  As for the ranged debuffs with 'splash', just make them true cones.  Lastly, I think the slow cone (can't recall the power name) should have an additional effect, something making it unique to the set.  Since the set already has -res,-acc, -dam, -def, and -regen in other abilities, how about a periodic KD? The rationale would be the substance is slick, making it hard to keep balance.  Thoughts?

 

Sorry for the long post but I am curious what others think.

[MTeague]

I love love love the melee attacks on Martial Kombat.  I'm not against the creation of a powerset based around thrown weapons.... more options is good!  But I love my half-melee half-ranged run-and-gun blaster. 

 

also, I do believe at least one Throw Weapons set has been proposed under: 

 

[Menelruin]

10 hours ago, MTeague said:

I love love love the melee attacks on Martial Kombat.  I'm not against the creation of a powerset based around thrown weapons.... more options is good!  But I love my half-melee half-ranged run-and-gun blaster. 

 

also, I do believe at least one Throw Weapons set has been proposed under: 

 

I'd love to get a thrown weapons set, but I've also suggested they could reskin Archery with throwing knives, and for added fun, reskin Trick Arrow as specialty grenades.

[Uun]

11 hours ago, MUPlayer said:

Poison - Thematically, I like the set but even with the ranged debuffs getting a little 'splash effect' it still underperforms.  Given that the heal animation is an underhand throw, I'd like to see it become a targeted AoE heal with those on the outer range of the AoE receiving less healing.  As for the ranged debuffs with 'splash', just make them true cones.  Lastly, I think the slow cone (can't recall the power name) should have an additional effect, something making it unique to the set.  Since the set already has -res,-acc, -dam, -def, and -regen in other abilities, how about a periodic KD? The rationale would be the substance is slick, making it hard to keep balance.  Thoughts?

 

There have been multiple threads discussing potential buffs to Poison, this one from 2 weeks ago. Many have recommended converting Alkaloid to an AoE. Most have recommended increasing the splash radius for Weaken and Envenom from 8 feet to somewhere between 10 and 15 feet. (I don't think these powers could be converted to cones while maintaining a stronger debuff on the primary target.) While some have suggested adding an additional effect for Neurotoxic Breath, the more frequent ask is to increase the arc (btw, NB does accept 3 procs). 

 

 

[MUPlayer]

I figured there had to be other threads on stuff like this.  Thanks for pointing the threads out to me!  Here's hoping the powers-that-be are seeing them.

 

I had another idea for a Mind Control pet - replace Mass Confusion or Mass Hypnosis with a new ability that would create a copy of the enemy. I call it Super Ego and have the ghostly appearance like echoes from the Shadow Shard. The copy would act like the Carnival Phantasm, in that it would initially attack the person to whom it was linked and would disappear once the target was defeated, or after 30 secs, whichever is longer.  No more than one copy per enemy and if the host is defeated in less than 30 sec, the copy would attack the nearest enemy. The copy would only do moderate psi dmg of course and if the host person has confusion protection, a copy wouldn't spawn.  This would prevent copies of Giant Monsters, Hamidon and most AVs.  Given the pet wouldn't always be available (wouldn't work against objects, for example) I suggest a low recharge.  Thoughts?

[Rudra]

There are players that take and use Mass Confusion and Mass Hypnosis, and like them. Why should they have to give those up?

 

As for what your Super Ego can duplicate? It should not be allowed to affect anything stronger than a lieutenant. No bosses. No EBs. And not even some AVs. And it should not have a recharge any faster than Phantom Army. (And it cannot replace an existing power in the set. Because you are asking to take powers away from players. So you would need to come up with a new power set that has it, and it would need to be sufficiently differentiated from the Mind Control set.)

[MUPlayer]

1 hour ago, Rudra said:

There are players that take and use Mass Confusion and Mass Hypnosis, and like them. Why should they have to give those up?

 

As for what your Super Ego can duplicate? It should not be allowed to affect anything stronger than a lieutenant. No bosses. No EBs. And not even some AVs. And it should not have a recharge any faster than Phantom Army. (And it cannot replace an existing power in the set. Because you are asking to take powers away from players. So you would need to come up with a new power set that has it, and it would need to be sufficiently differentiated from the Mind Control set.)

In truth, I was hoping to replicate the effect of Mass confusion but as a pet. It doesn't even necessarily have to be a replacement for Mass Confusion; it could be an 'either or' option, like the Super Reflexes options for Sentinels.

Even now, Bosses and stronger enemies aren't effected by Mass Confusion (unless domination is active and even certain mobs still take multiple hits).  So, I think the concerns around Bosses/EBs/AVs/GMs, etc., wouldn't be an issue.  Unlike PA, Super Ego pets aren't following the caster and are only holding aggro on their host.  This means unaffected enemies will still attack as normal. 

Super Ego would work like a confuse ability and be required to check against that flag (so it can miss).  If the target is no longer confused, the pet goes away. If a target has high enough resistance/protection, the pet never spawns (a 'miss', basically).  Now, if enough people stack it could it temporarily break a mob's protection? Sure, depending on the enemy but that's true of most status protection.  Even then, the effect is short.

I'd like to understand your concerns around recharge.  Under my suggestion, the pet effect isn't stackable so once there is a pet from an enemy another can't be generated.  Also, the attack can simply miss, like any other.  Is there something else to consider?

 

[Rudra]

30 minutes ago, MUPlayer said:

it could be an 'either or' option, like the Super Reflexes options for Sentinels.

The devs have already said they will not be doing that again. I don't remember why. It does seem to have been an absolute nightmare for them though.

 

Your previous description is not Mass Confusion except as a pet. How would Mass Confusion even work as a pet? Your proposal that I responded to was a follows:

3 hours ago, MUPlayer said:

I had another idea for a Mind Control pet - replace Mass Confusion or Mass Hypnosis with a new ability that would create a copy of the enemy. I call it Super Ego and have the ghostly appearance like echoes from the Shadow Shard. The copy would act like the Carnival Phantasm, in that it would initially attack the person to whom it was linked and would disappear once the target was defeated, or after 30 secs, whichever is longer.  No more than one copy per enemy and if the host is defeated in less than 30 sec, the copy would attack the nearest enemy. The copy would only do moderate psi dmg of course and if the host person has confusion protection, a copy wouldn't spawn.  This would prevent copies of Giant Monsters, Hamidon and most AVs.  Given the pet wouldn't always be available (wouldn't work against objects, for example) I suggest a low recharge. 

That describes a pet that does damage, not a mass confusion effect. Now if the summoned pet is locked at normal damage for its tier in the power set and not the damage of the cloned target, there is no issue. Treat the proposed power as Phantom Army. If the summoned pet does damage as per the cloned target? Now you're looking at being able to summon a boss, EB, or even an AV to fight for you. Even if it takes multiple uses of the power to achieve. Or even if the pet can only attack the target it was cloned from. And once a pet is summoned, it doesn't go away until defeated, timed out, or dismissed; so I don't see your summoned clone just going away when the target mob breaks free from being confused. It may go away when the target it was cloned from dies, that's easy enough to script, but when confusion wears off is probably another matter entirely. And is likely to get angry players on the forums demanding the pet stay longer anyway since no one wants to spend a power slot on a power that just up and fails when a temporary status wears off.

 

41 minutes ago, MUPlayer said:

'd like to understand your concerns around recharge.  Under my suggestion, the pet effect isn't stackable so once there is a pet from an enemy another can't be generated.  Also, the attack can simply miss, like any other.  Is there something else to consider?

My thinking is based on the only other power I can think of that works even similarly: Phantom Army. And given the concerns I have in the preceding paragraph, most notably how powerful the clone is compared to the cloned target, the recharge should not be any better than Phantom Army's.

[MUPlayer]

You have a point; about coding. It might be a nightmare have the pet's duration be checking against two values with the current code.  It would be best to have it expire when the target is defeated or the pet is dismissed.  I don't know if being able to miss would cause any noticeable grief, though.  Plenty of abilities can miss at inopportune times (*points to Transfusion*).  I think it's a chance we all take.

 

 I can also concede my idea is a form of Phantom Army.  As for being able to 'copy' a boss unit, I don't think that's any worse than a typical controller pet. The pet would still do psi damage like a controller (or Dom).  As for AVs and such, even if stackable confuses allow for a pet to generate, again, the pet isn't going to do any more damage than any other control Pet.  Must admit though, it would be fun to see two Nemesis fighting :-).

I still feel the recharge should be shorter than PA because the pet the will disappear once the target is now and will not follow the caster.  I think the recharge should be comparable to, say, Enervating Field or another toggle debuff.

[Communistpenguin]

On 12/8/2022 at 8:57 PM, Rudra said:

As for what your Super Ego can duplicate? It should not be allowed to affect anything stronger than a lieutenant. No bosses. No EBs. And not even some AVs. And it should not have a recharge any faster than Phantom Army. (And it cannot replace an existing power in the set. Because you are asking to take powers away from players. So you would need to come up with a new power set that has it, and it would need to be sufficiently differentiated from the Mind Control set.)

The solution to this is easy.

First, have the duplicate be one tier lower than whatever is targeted, so a LT -> Minion etc

Second, have it obey the same rules that mez powers operate by, and have it set at LT strength for the initial application. That way if you want to duplicate a boss, you can, but the cost is two casts of the power before the "mezz" debuff wears off, and they duplicate will show up as a LT instead of a boss. If you really want to prevent a AV from being duplicated, simply make the recharge long enough so that you cannot get like enough casts on the AV before the first wears off. 

[Zect]

On 12/8/2022 at 11:16 AM, MUPlayer said:

The change to sleep abilities doesn't really address how situational it can be.

 

I'm amused that you assume this is some kind of problem when it's not. Situational powers are fine. They are part of what gives rise to build variance, which increases the replay value of the game by offering different play experiences.

 

Creative players will find a way to make use of situational powers. Those who play in the situations where they are useful will take them. The rest can skip them, and that is alright.

Edited December 10, 2022 by Zect

[biostem]

It would be nice if multiple applications of a sleep power could put an enemy into a "deep sleep" that would be harder for them to wake up from, or perhaps add a "grogginess" debuff on enemies waking up from a sleep effect...

[golstat2003]

1 hour ago, biostem said:

It would be nice if multiple applications of a sleep power could put an enemy into a "deep sleep" that would be harder for them to wake up from, or perhaps add a "grogginess" debuff on enemies waking up from a sleep effect...

 

Now this . . . THIS would be a great idea!

[MUPlayer]

2 hours ago, biostem said:

It would be nice if multiple applications of a sleep power could put an enemy into a "deep sleep" that would be harder for them to wake up from, or perhaps add a "grogginess" debuff on enemies waking up from a sleep effect...

I mentioned something like this in my initial post:

 

Mind Control - Mass Hypnosis/Sleep effects - I know there have been multiple threads on this set, so I'll try to be brief.  The change to sleep abilities doesn't really address how situational it can be.  I propose sleep for Mind control work a bit differently: an affected enemy (one that actually goes into sleep status) that is hit with another sleep affect goes into "deep sleep", meaning they will wake after two tics of health change AND all offensive abilities go into cooldown. If an enemy is it with 3 sleep consecutive effects, they are 'Comatose' meaning it will take four tics AND all offensive and defensive abilities go into cooldown. I think this would make sleep effects more of a threat, but it might too strong. 

 

@Zect To be clear, I never tried to imply that there is anything wrong with situational abilities.  I don't think a control set should have 2, though, like Mind Control does (Telekinesis and Mass Hypnosis) unless there is a way to change it. My first character in Beta and on live was a mind control/forcefield controller. That character was my first 50, back during issue 2 (or whenever the level cap was boosted from 40 to 50).   Sure, a clever player can find ways to use those abilities (I did) but none of the other control sets have this requirement for TWO of their abilities. Gravity & Fire Control used to, but the adjustment to Wormhole and KB-KD enhancements for Bonfire took care of that. I just think the same should happen for Mind Control. 

 

  

[srmalloy]

9 hours ago, MUPlayer said:

 I propose sleep for Mind control work a bit differently: an affected enemy (one that actually goes into sleep status) that is hit with another sleep affect goes into "deep sleep", meaning they will wake after two tics of health change AND all offensive abilities go into cooldown. If an enemy is it with 3 sleep consecutive effects, they are 'Comatose' meaning it will take four tics AND all offensive and defensive abilities go into cooldown. I think this would make sleep effects more of a threat, but it might too strong. 

Also remember that any changes will be used on you as well as by you -- if changes like this are made, your characters can find themselves stuck in the 'recovery-of-the-month club' by being hit with multiple sleep effects. If you can't accept the chance of being on the receiving end of these effects, you shouldn't be able to cause them.

[MUPlayer]

Yes, if my suggestion had to be implemented to all sleep effects, that would be the cost of doing business. Like fighting mobs using Taunt and Confuse, its smart to have break frees on hand. However,  looking at how mobs can blind us while our equivalent ability no longer has the same effect, I don't think it has to replicated to mobs (but I could be wrong).

[Rancor01]

I would like to see my melee be able to have at least one ranged power, like my axe/sword being able to toss them.

 

 

[Rancor01]

On force fields could they be used offensively like Sue Storm around the head to cut off air to suffocate or to hold, levitate (friend or foe) or as a battering ram. Not just as a defensive power.

 

How about a magic and sorcery set one that encompass different features holds, teleport, cast fire/water/air/ground/energy, levitate things like Dr. Strange, Dr. Fate. And not just have sorcery as an add on power set.

 

And as we have fire/water/ground/ice powers how about air. Hurricane/gust/propel/suffocate/tornado/straight line winds

 

 

[Rancor01]

New henchmen pirates, Vikings, cops, Family, kitty cats, snakes etc.

[Rancor01]

There's an idea. A knives set can have both thrown and melee. Like characters like christmas (Jason Statham and Denzel Washington from the Expendables) Can already throw knives as that temp power and can use melee from swords. Even a dual wield maybe.

[Rudra]

12 minutes ago, Rancor01 said:

How about a magic and sorcery set one that encompass different features holds, teleport, cast fire/water/air/ground/energy, levitate things like Dr. Strange, Dr. Fate. And not just have sorcery as an add on power set.

There are no primary or secondary power sets that are specifically designated as being a specific origin. Let's keep it that way. Robotics, Devices, and Traps look like technology because they have to have some model for use in the game, but as has been discussed in several other threads, fit any origin. If you want a multi-element power set, make one and propose it. Keep it fairly generic though. (And teleport is available in the Teleport pool. Grab it for any character you want.)

[Psyonico]

6 hours ago, Rancor01 said:

I would like to see my melee be able to have at least one ranged power, like my axe/sword being able to toss them.

 

 

Some melee power sets do have a ranged attack.  What powers would you have removed to fit in a ranged attack on other sets?

 

Also, there are ranged attacks in a few pool sets you could always use.

6 hours ago, Rancor01 said:

On force fields could they be used offensively like Sue Storm around the head to cut off air to suffocate or to hold, levitate (friend or foe) or as a battering ram. Not just as a defensive power.

 

How about a magic and sorcery set one that encompass different features holds, teleport, cast fire/water/air/ground/energy, levitate things like Dr. Strange, Dr. Fate. And not just have sorcery as an add on power set.

 

And as we have fire/water/ground/ice powers how about air. Hurricane/gust/propel/suffocate/tornado/straight line winds

 

 

A third of FF targets enemies, additionally there is a toggle that affects enemies.

 

Hurricane, Gale, and Tornado are all part of the Storm Summoning set.

[biostem]

6 hours ago, Rancor01 said:

There's an idea. A knives set can have both thrown and melee. Like characters like christmas (Jason Statham and Denzel Washington from the Expendables) Can already throw knives as that temp power and can use melee from swords. Even a dual wield maybe.

I imagine such a set would function like a cross between dual blades and claws, perhaps with 1 or 2 additional ranged attacks.  You'd have a single target throw, a cone throw, and maybe something like a PBAoE throw.

[MUPlayer]

7 hours ago, Rancor01 said:

New henchmen pirates, Vikings, cops, Family, kitty cats, snakes etc.

One of the challenges with doing this is that it'd be basically copying an existing in-game faction (family, pirates, cops, snakes) and require brand new animation (kitty cats especially).  I don't believe it's possible for us to add a new completely new objects/animations to the game without breaking existing stuff.  Even for the henchmen, one would also need to come up with new animations/character models to differentiate them from the in-game versions.  I don't think anyone would want a basic copy-n-paste job (which is probably why we don't have an Elemental mastermind set).
 

[Saiyajinzoningen]

my second favorite character was a mind/psy/psi dom and i loved it so very much until illusion was released for Doms and now i have a new favorite. Sleep has always been extremely situational and while mass confusion is effective my regular confuse achieves the same results if slotted properly. Illusion replaces those abilities with pets and i could not be happier.