Pylon Damage Thread

[Tsuko]

8 hours ago, nihilii said:

Purely theorycrafting here: could it make more sense to run TF -> AS -> ET -> BS (-> EP)?

 

You shouldn't need 2 stacks of EF anyway, and you get 1 stack of EF even if TF misses. ET would heal you >50% of the time, and has slightly higher crit damage than TF.

 

 

I tend to use a priority rotation due to the Energy focus, random Assassin Focus mechanic and random Build UP procs.

I have an EM / SR stalker with a build based on standing power : to be able to solo and staying at mélée range almost in all situation.

 

My goal is to use ET (slow and fast) as much as possible, mainly during Build up windows.

 

Slow ET / TF / EP / Fast ET / AS and priority to Crit AS 🙂

 

Ho and yes, i dont use BS cause no crit AS is a perfect placeholder and i want to keep a 2 slot Placate to have a burst / CC ability.

Edited November 29, 2020 by Tsuko

[Tsuko]

14 hours ago, nihilii said:

My man.  Still in the process of PLing/IOing mine on Live. Those numbers are inspiring.

 

I'm planning to go Blaze Sting GD Blaze Sting BB for a chain, with a build fairly similar to yours (except fire epic and Ageless, because I can't stand having low S/L res and don't mind living on amplifiers). Blaze and Sting have the best DPA so it seems good to use them as much as possible, although perhaps that means less -RES uptime from GD compared to a priority system, and less DPS in the end? Time will tell.

For my Fire / NIN Blaster, i dont use Sting cause i dont want to be forced in mélée, i use a heavy proc'ed Golden Dragonfly as a debuff / burst tool as Inferno.

 

I took Char and Shoking powder as Double heavy proc'ed hold to have a ranged rotation with Blaze / Blazing Bolt / Fireball, on top of being able to hold any boss with a fast double hold.

 

 

[StrikerFox]

On 11/29/2020 at 12:33 AM, nihilii said:

Purely theorycrafting here: could it make more sense to run TF -> AS -> ET -> BS (-> EP)?

 

I agree with you, you're suggestion totally makes sense. I did a couple runs using that chain and ended up with 124s and 125s, for 437 dps and 435 dps. Switched back to the original chain and got 110s for 476 dps.

 

It's the exact same build. No reslotting was required to go from one chain to the other. I probably need to do more testing to figure out why. Guessing it's just bad rng. Random misses and proc activations.

 

Wish I could post videos. People used to tell me where I'm messing up back during live.

[nihilii]

EM/Bio/Soul Scrapper

T4 Musc, T4 Degen Core, T4 Ageless Core, T4 Assault Radial

TF -> ET -> BS -> Moonbeam -> EP -> BS

If TF crits and gives a double stack, ET replaces the second BS, then the ET -> BS order is inverted to BS -> ET on the next rotation. This also works if ET misses (and keeps its stack).

Hybrid ON

1:21 = 601 DPS
1:00 = 766 DPS
1:14 = 646 DPS

1:07 = 700 DPS

 

Hybrid OFF

1:17 = 625 DPS

1;26 = 573 DPS

1:24 = 584 DPS

New EM is so much fun. Doesn't seem to reach old TW levels of ST damage (which is good, god that was broken), but it's definitely up there with War Mace. Also with a less resisted damage type, and less reliance on -RES procs as well. You really see the potential come together when on a team with someone who has a way to apply Achilles' and Fury consistently, and then your damage output skyrockets relative to other meleers.

 

I like the DPE efficiency, too - with ET costing 0 end. That 766 DPS run was a result of not having to use Ageless, because I was still under the last 30 seconds or so of the previous Ageless when I engaged the Pylon. Perhaps this messes up with the validity of that run, but on the other hand, my other meleers in the 600+ DPS range NEED a fully recharged Ageless at the beginning of a fight, and can run out of end in protacted fights without additional help such as Recovery Serum and so on; whereas EM is infinitely sustainable out of the box. So in a sense, this run reflects a meaningful reality for actual gameplay - and if you added ~3 seconds to the time to account for a hypothetical Ageless cast, we'd still be looking at 736 DPS anyhow.

 

Why not run TF -> ET -> BS -> Moonbeam -> slow ET?

- BS and EP have DPAs fairly similar to slow ET when procced out

- sticking to faster animations gives me more mobility and room to react in real fights

- the damage taken from ET is not insignificant on a scrapper build geared for damage. With my chain, I get a Critical Strikes proc from TF 90% of the time, and more often than not ET crits; instead of losing HP or even evening it out between fast ET crit and slow ET later, we end up HP positive with this setup

 

I was on the fence on introducing combos to EM, and still am nonplussed by it as a matter of principle. But on a personal level, I'm having a blast. The chains flow smoothly, and the minigame of managing your stacks with ET, and of handling double stacks or recovering from misses, gives an enjoyable layer to the character yet doesn't commandeer your playstyle either (which was my pet peeve with TW).
 

Build:

Spoiler

| Copy & Paste this data into Mids' Reborn : Hero Designer to view the build |
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		|MxDz;1588;742;1484;HEX;|
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		|94DF04963C848474A8A40869AD847BF81EB9B69B5EA832F26FA318CCB17708F26B5|
		|AB899AE883C1C33DFF020924E477EFFFACF7DC99495C3FED7A76F6C6A4503A4EE58|
		|C5229954C5B46B1685AF68491C9A645E5D7427FCFAE9E4A9839D3D4A7F2A69559E2|
		|4DB06A3B6D5E31F325533F992DA4CE5919239F4DA74E58570B9670CD160A397DC63|
		|48AD97CC62937C9A269CEB5CBE5996C667E910C9DBB5E73A6559ACF1607A78AD9B4|
		|9E5C34720B943D59B8964B258CD2A2692D0D504F31FADFD7047E65BBB84808A9A22|
		|9052E10E3AA506FA9CCB04DB2F96665EF10EF46C8AEC85855FC62DBC06FE6F05FB0|
		|9F1CBCAA081CE0FDB28610AAA7A04E73A449DA5AB52699B715759DA8E70CB3FE9EE|
		|AD9B89E625BB349ADEB3BFBAC505E3BE715F6A79CEF03F9B7A0BF965E456AAE9FEC|
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		|3F0D3E06E7|
		|-------------------------------------------------------------------|

 

Edited December 3, 2020 by nihilii

[Gobbledigook]

2 hours ago, nihilii said:

EM/Bio/Soul Scrapper

T4 Musc, T4 Degen Core, T4 Ageless Core, T4 Assault Radial

TF -> ET -> BS -> Moonbeam -> EP -> BS

If TF crits and gives a double stack, ET replaces the second BS, then the ET -> BS order is inverted to BS -> ET on the next rotation. This also works if ET misses (and keeps its stack).

Hybrid ON

1:21 = 601 DPS
1:00 = 766 DPS
1:14 = 646 DPS

1:07 = 700 DPS

 

Hybrid OFF

1:17 = 625 DPS

1;26 = 573 DPS

1:24 = 584 DPS

New EM is so much fun. Doesn't seem to reach old TW levels of ST damage (which is good, god that was broken), but it's definitely up there with War Mace. Also with a less resisted damage type, and less reliance on -RES procs as well. You really see the potential come together when on a team with someone who has a way to apply Achilles' and Fury consistently, and then your damage output skyrockets relative to other meleers.

 

I like the DPE efficiency, too - with ET costing 0 end. That 766 DPS run was a result of not having to use Ageless, because I was still under the last 30 seconds or so of the previous Ageless when I engaged the Pylon. Perhaps this messes up with the validity of that run, but on the other hand, my other meleers in the 600+ DPS range NEED a fully recharged Ageless at the beginning of a fight, and can run out of end in protacted fights without additional help such as Recovery Serum and so on; whereas EM is infinitely sustainable out of the box. So in a sense, this run reflects a meaningful reality for actual gameplay - and if you added ~3 seconds to the time to account for a hypothetical Ageless cast, we'd still be looking at 736 DPS anyhow.

 

Why not run TF -> ET -> BS -> Moonbeam -> slow ET?

- BS and EP have DPAs fairly similar to slow ET when procced out

- sticking to faster animations gives me more mobility and room to react in real fights

- the damage taken from ET is not insignificant on a scrapper build geared for damage. With my chain, I get a Critical Strikes proc from TF 90% of the time, and more often than not ET crits; instead of losing HP or even evening it out between fast ET crit and slow ET later, we end up HP positive with this setup

 

I was on the fence on introducing combos to EM, and still am nonplussed by it as a matter of principle. But on a personal level, I'm having a blast. The chains flow smoothly, and the minigame of managing your stacks with ET, and of handling double stacks or recovering from misses, gives an enjoyable layer to the character yet doesn't commandeer your playstyle either (which was my pet peeve with TW).

Will edit this post with build later, currently not on the right computer.

With enough tries/tweaks you will probably break the minute barrier but the figures you show are more average times. Well done 😊

Edited December 3, 2020 by Gobbledegook

[BrandX]

3 hours ago, nihilii said:

EM/Bio/Soul Scrapper

T4 Musc, T4 Degen Core, T4 Ageless Core, T4 Assault Radial

TF -> ET -> BS -> Moonbeam -> EP -> BS

If TF crits and gives a double stack, ET replaces the second BS, then the ET -> BS order is inverted to BS -> ET on the next rotation. This also works if ET misses (and keeps its stack).

Hybrid ON

1:21 = 601 DPS
1:00 = 766 DPS
1:14 = 646 DPS

1:07 = 700 DPS

 

Hybrid OFF

1:17 = 625 DPS

1;26 = 573 DPS

1:24 = 584 DPS
 

 

Since I haven't seen an update to mids yet, did you have to have perma hasten for that?

[nihilii]

35 minutes ago, BrandX said:

Since I haven't seen an update to mids yet, did you have to have perma hasten for that?

Pretty close, to the point it is more than perma with the buff from Ageless.

 

 

[jojogladco]

RAD/EM Tank.  Musculature Core, Degenerative Core, Ageless Core, Assault Radial all tier 4. 

 

Pylon times with Hybrid on run from a best of 1:46 to a worst of 2:10, with most clustering between 1:55 and 2:00.  Hybrid off best time was 2:13 with most at 2:25 to 2:30

 

I settled on a priority system after several attempts at a static attack chain centered around Slow ET, TF, Fast ET. I tended to get my best time by skipping a slow ET for either CP or Energy Torrent as long as the gap for TF to recharge was less than the animation time of CP/Energy Torrent. I'd guess this gave me marginally more up time on the -RES procs which then boosted the damage of the subsequent TF+Fast ET.

 

This build solo's +4/8 ITF with insp fine, but can't handle a Werner Rules ITF, I'm ok with that level of squishy on a Tank but not everyone will be. For teamed content you're plenty sturdy to stand up to most any challenge you'll run into if you're being buffed. I'd switch to a different build to deal with Recluse/pack the right candy loadout for him.

 

http://www.cohplanner.com/mids/download.php?uc=1611&c=764&a=1528&f=HEX&dc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

 

 

[Gobbledigook]

Nevermind i got it working.

Edited December 5, 2020 by Gobbledegook

[jojogladco]

14 minutes ago, Gobbledegook said:

Nevermind i got it working.

I'm using the BETA update on MIDS. I normally also have a custom Ageless that shows me just the last minute of buffs and I fix the Perfect Zinger procs to have the right proc rate but I try to revert that stuff to stock before posting to avoid any issues for people who download the build. really sorry if I forget to do that posting late last night.

[Bill Z Bubba]

Averaging 3:24 with my SD/Nrg/Soul Tank. Workin on the Nrg/Bio/Soul scrapper next.

[BrandX]

52 minutes ago, Bill Z Bubba said:

Averaging 3:24 with my SD/Nrg/Soul Tank. Workin on the Nrg/Bio/Soul scrapper next.

Better than my 3:30 on a EM/Regen/Soul Scrapper w/ Tier 4 Spiritual/Preemptive/Assault 😞

[Bill Z Bubba]

5 minutes ago, BrandX said:

Better than my 3:30 on a EM/Regen/Soul Scrapper w/ Tier 4 Spiritual/Preemptive/Assault 😞

So I should test out Soul's Fast Snipe on the test server before locking into it? I would prefer to go a different route but feel forced into it. How much better are your times with musc/degen/assault?

Edited December 5, 2020 by Bill Z Bubba

[BrandX]

2 minutes ago, Bill Z Bubba said:

So I should test out Soul's Fast Snipe on the test server before locking into it? I would prefer to go a different route but feel forced into it. How much better are your times with musc/degen/assault?

Haven't gotten those up to tier 4's yet.  I just got the Assault to Tier 4 today.  I worked on the concepty ones first 🙂  Though...Spiritual really seemed the way to go for Regen, for the RCH and HEAL.

[BrandX]

Oh, I should note, I was going ET > TF > ET > Moonbeam > BS > Repeat.  I do think I have a slight gap in Hasten, so a slight gap in my chain for a bit, when I lack Hasten, but it's not much of a gap.

[Bill Z Bubba]

4 minutes ago, BrandX said:

ET > TF > ET > Moonbeam > BS > Repeat.

That's my goal as well. Leave EP or Barrage single slotted with the passive +crit AT IO.

[Bill Z Bubba]

Copied the freshly lvl 50 em/bio scrap to beta and got her all tricked out. With Assault Core: 1:40. Without it, 2:20. Would be ridiculous if I never missed. To be honest, though, I'm not sure I'll ever really build her out on live. While the pylon time is nice, bio's survivability is lacking at the high end. Although, she's got 2047 HP and Ablative Carapace is adding another 1096 Absorption, so that ain't nothin to sneeze at.

 

...

 

Also, I'm a dumbass. Forgot to turn on Offensive Adaptation.

 

1:20 with assault, 1:35 without. Honestly, that's not much better than what my claws/bio scrapper gets.

 

Come to think on it, it makes sense due to ET and TF not properly critting.

Edited December 5, 2020 by Bill Z Bubba

[Tsuko]

18 hours ago, Bill Z Bubba said:

Copied the freshly lvl 50 em/bio scrap to beta and got her all tricked out. With Assault Core: 1:40. Without it, 2:20. Would be ridiculous if I never missed. To be honest, though, I'm not sure I'll ever really build her out on live. While the pylon time is nice, bio's survivability is lacking at the high end. Although, she's got 2047 HP and Ablative Carapace is adding another 1096 Absorption, so that ain't nothin to sneeze at.

 

...

 

Also, I'm a dumbass. Forgot to turn on Offensive Adaptation.

 

1:20 with assault, 1:35 without. Honestly, that's not much better than what my claws/bio scrapper gets.

 

Come to think on it, it makes sense due to ET and TF not properly critting.

Stop hit on Gogo dancers in Pocket D and stay Focus !

 

 

 

Edited December 6, 2020 by Tsuko

[rojahnique]

Thugs / Time mm , 2m 28 sec 

Hybrid: Support Core Embodiment

Interface: Diamagnetic Total Radial Conversion

Alpha: Agility Radial Paragon

recharge from hasten+global+ chrono shift  265

perma Farsight 

[Frosticus]

Not sure if I can get much further than this with my current approach. I only got 1 bomb planted.

no insp/temp/lore (I used my temp self rez due to carelessness)

[Frosticus]

Here's a fun little solo challenge  when your server is slow (no insp/temps/lore - I locked the first two with the task force options, which also gave me a nifty timer and I just don't enjoy lore pets.

 

Clear all 20 pylons.

I cleared them in 30 mins on my ill/cold/stone with 1 death which definitely threw off my timing and the rotation I was planning to defeat them in 😞 (dam drop ship!)

 

That works out to 90 seconds per pylon including travel between and back from the hospital.

[Bill Z Bubba]

16 hours ago, Frosticus said:

hat works out to 90 seconds per pylon including travel between and back from the hospital.

Holy fark sticks...

 

/I still love this thread.

[tristanLV]

19 hours ago, Frosticus said:

Here's a fun little solo challenge  when your server is slow (no insp/temps/lore - I locked the first two with the task force options, which also gave me a nifty timer and I just don't enjoy lore pets.

 

Clear all 20 pylons.

I cleared them in 30 mins on my ill/cold/stone with 1 death which definitely threw off my timing and the rotation I was planning to defeat them in 😞 (dam drop ship!)

By god... And I thought the "Solo +4/x8 No Inspirations, No Temps ITF" was an exclusive club.. This is wild.

[Bill Z Bubba]

I probably posted this already but my memory sucks.

2 mins with a mace/bio scrapper.

Assault Core Hybrid was toggled on.

Pyronic was used twice.

Chain is Clobber, Jawbreaker, Shatter, repeat.

 

Going through a big character purge. This one I'll keep. Cuz... cute redhead mechanic with a magic wrench. What's not to love?

 

[Bionic_Flea]

Why purge if you have almost unlimited character space?