Overview

This is a helpful page for editing tables https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Help:Tables

Sure those are good suggestions, I came up with Nautical and Aerial cause I figured they would sound more formal and fit the "Greek" aesthetic in the lore of City of Heroes, but I'm certainly not opposed to Sea and Air. ^.^ And yeah, I need to see if there's a way to distinguish the table a little more, I did the extra sorting for the second version and it took me a moment to interpret just how to read it correctly.

I like your changes! So... it's weird... even though they are correct... the terms "Nautical Transport" and "Aerial Transport" rub me the wrong way. Meanwhile, "Sea Transports" and "Air Transports" seem nice. Not sure why. It might just be me. 😉 Definitely make the columns for the ferries, ship, and submarine stand out as separate. Right now it all seems to blend in together and it's hard to tell where one begins and the other ends. You can do it a zillion different ways... make some of the cell border lines invisible, thicken some of the borders, change the background color for each column (could do something like light gray, white, light gray, white or just make each column a different background color, etc. Otherwise, FANTASTIC!

The guide is now up to date. Nearly all of the original guide was retained. I added a few things but refrained from adding too much to keep the guide simple and straightforward for beginners. https://homecoming.wiki/wiki/The_Incomplete_and_Unofficial_Guide_to_/bind That said, if there is anything any of you think should be added please let me know.

Then the Wiki Dark Mode isn't right, at least on charts, as it should have shifted the foreground objects to much lighter tones to maintain contrast.

I'll have to check mediawiki to see if there's code for that, though the colors it uses right now is cause I use the wiki in dark mode.

I suggest lightening the background grey tone, it's dark and there's not enough contrast between the foreground text and the background.

So I realized that while my table showed all of the overlapping travel points, it didn't show the alignment required which is important to know if you're trying to navigate between them, so I did a few coding adjustments.

Well that's the point of having grouped together pages for similar content, it keeps the wiki from having multiple stub sized pages that have currently been redirected anyway, and Ferry only applies to two of the subjects while my suggestion applies to all current and future ones.

I like the idea of an easy to read table. I do not like the idea of using names not found in game.

Overall I like it. I was a bit dubious about the table initially, then I visited the ferry page and saw that the stops are all listed out anyway. I definitely think that the table is the most useful way to present that info.

So if anyone has been paying attention to my messages in the Discord, you'd probably see that I've been working on the Zone Overview page a lot. I rearranged the Zones to match the changes made up to Issue 27, added every missing Zone and their original lore names, added the alignment icons to show who can go where, and most recently added as many of the game's unique travel shortcut methods as I've been able to find which at the moment is 18, though I found 2 more today that I have to make pages for (The Vanguard DPO portals and the Shadow Shard Portals) which is why I've been so focused on revamping those pages. Currently I've revamped the pages for TUNNEL System, Paragon City Monorail, and the Cole Transportation Authority, but I've got two changes in mind that I wanted to run by everyone first before I put them into action. 1. I want to change the "Ferry" page to "Nautical Transport" because only two of the four boats are actually ferries, as well as merge all the stops into one table, here's an example I've quickly coded up. 2. I want to merge the "Black Helicopter Transport" and "Free Fire Zone Transport" pages into an "Aerial Transport" page with a similar style table as above. I personally think that these are great ideas and I might go as far as making a similar grouped page for TUNNEL, Shadow Shard Portal, and Vanguard DPO portals but I wanted to see if others think these changes would make using the wiki as a reference guide as easy as I believe it would.

Well, thanks! At least SOMEONE gave their opinion... 🙂 OK. I'll put the guide on the list of things to eventually do. As usual, I'll try to retain as much of it as I can while at the same time adding improvements. I've updated the wiki with the Issue 27 Page 7 and Issue 28 Page 1 changes to slash commands and the keybinding system. It turned out that a surprising number of pages around the wiki needed updating because of the updates. I added some new pages too, the most important one being Keybind Profiles. It's in a final draft or first published kind of state, so if anyone has any suggestions or additions, just let me know. Otherwise, I can't think of anything else to do at the wiki related to binds, macros and commands. It seems fairly complete now. 🙂

I say edit away, and make it an official wiki document. I certainly appreciate the effort of past editors, but my personal opinion is that if the page is no longer accurate or could otherwise be edited to convey its information more efficiently, then it should be edited to correct those issues. Paragon wiki will stand for all time as a snapshot in time to preserve the work of editors past. This is Homecoming, and I have no problem with any change that needs to be made to make the HC wiki represent the game as it is now. Again, just one man's opinion.

Should we update The Incomplete and Unofficial Guide to /bind? As I said in its talk page, I'm a bit hesitant about changing anything in it. It's been THE guide players have gone to in order to learn keybinding since the beginning of the game. However, there are some important things that could be added from my own Advanced Bind Guide, new discoveries from the Homecoming forums, and from recent updates to the binding system in the game (Issue 27 Page 7). After reading its talk/discussion page, it's clear that @Curveball's guide was rewritten by a team of Paragon Wiki editors with @Curveball's permission. In fact, @curveball even joins in on the discussion and offers his approval of the changes. The guide is stamped with the standard wiki warning "This is a players guide, we disavow all responsibility for it". The guide was originally written by a player, yet because wiki editors played a major part in rewriting it, I kind of feel like the wiki version is not really a player's guide... but rather a wiki guide (if there is such a thing?). The information in it is accurate, authoritative, and proven. If you read it, not a lot of opinion is in the guide either. So... I feel like we should remove that tag and make it an official wiki document. Make it authoritative. What do you think? Re: updating... if we decide it's a good thing to update the guide, anyone interested could work together with me many different ways. I could take the lead, for example, and suggest changes for discussion, or we could do something else. We could discuss it here, or on its talk page... but first thing's first... should we edit it at all?

Thanks BlackSpectre! Knowing the good work that you do I am sure it will look great. I have slightly more free time for testing stuff now than I did a few weeks/months ago, so if you need any help testing anything just let me know.

OK. I've finished testing and the numbers check out. I'll write a note in the talk page. Updating the Experience page now... 🙂

Well, it's taking longer than I anticipated. I've had very little time to log in and test the numbers I have. So far I've tested and vetted everything except the team size bonuses for teams of 5, 7, and 8. So almost done. If you'd like to see what I've done so far, you can look at the revised Experience page work in progress here https://homecoming.wiki/wiki/User:BlackSpectre/Testthis Also if you have any suggestions I'm happy to hear them. 🙂

This is true, but just as sg and team and coalition channels are somewhat private, and rules are relaxed unless a complaint is made, so should bases be in the same category. In other words, you'd have to go into a base to be offended if it was inappropriate; once notified, we can take a base off of a list, just as inappropriate names are genericked once reported and confirmed, and people using channels inappropriately are sanctioned if reported and the investigation bears out the complaint. I do not see that all the information related to individual bases should be absent because a very small percentage might be inappropriate, if that is your reasoning; that's punishing the vast majority of COC abiding builders for the possibility a very small few are not in compliance. I still do not want to mess with the base list here, mind; but I disagree that that needs to be or should be a consideration. If a name is inappropriate, or the base is listed as catering to adults, we had already agreed not to list it.

I don't want to relitigate the whole thing either; I promise you I have nothing at all to do with the FBSA Wiki.

I could be mistaken but I think Dacy is not a "he". What I meant was it is very difficult to have a large list of player bases on the wiki and at the same time ensure that none of them is inappropriate.

I appreciate you, BlackSpectre. 🙂 What we tried to do was maintain the wikipages offsite. We have (still) several people who edit and update the pages and make sure they are accurate, it is not just EB and I. It's meant to survive any of us moving on. Our great docs expert, Matsiyan, had automated the update to the wiki so that it would overwrite the old wiki info with the updated directory download. However, the problem was that there was objection to the idea of an informational source being maintained outside of the wiki that the wiki editors could not affect, and there was objection to the plan of having the directory be the source, even to the point of asking people to add their bases to it, rather than to the wiki. So, I agreed to monitor for changes and accept wiki entries as entries to the directory, inputting them there so the two would align. But this was still unsatisfactory, it seemed, to some, and several haggles over minor wording preferences, and then the wiki...do I say, crashed? became uneditable for quite some time. Essentially, I felt there was one person who seemed to have a problem with the directory as sourced, and the issue and then tangential issues were raised again and again until I was thoroughly tired of the whole thing and just wished to be DONE. I appealed to Michiyo, as her name had been mentioned as the one person whose opinion would be respected and honored. This is from a few posts ago: So, Michiyo said that maybe FSBA would be a better place. Thunderforce has decided he agrees (*shock*) and so perhaps the directory should be removed. I said I would wait for Michiyo's ruling, which she clearly has not given (I thought the new rules might say something, but like you, I do not see anything there that pertains), but am so disheartened and tired of dealing with it that I'm happy to remove the directory. It will continue to be kept and updated by us and those that volunteer to do so; it's just that the wiki will not have access to that information. We are not going to put it on FSBA. Trying to do this was enough, we don't want to risk going through such again. Like you, I find the base information to be useful. Lots of people here RP; there is an entire server known as "the RP server"; this is why Everlasting has the most and the best bases. They tie directly to the RP game, a large section of this game's population. There are people who do nothing in this game OTHER than bases. There are people who never fight mobs, but only RP and use the bases created for RP. And it's helpful for RPers to see what is out there. It's helpful for builders to know where to find examples of certain types of bases. And many like you find base hopping to be enjoyable. So I, too, think a directory would be a worthwhile inclusion, else I would not have tried to include it, but now, I'm just ready to let it go. I have, in the past, updated some of the pages, which are woefully out of date. However, life at the moment is tumultuous and overly full, and I am barely managing a minor amount of base building and the current showcases; and soon, it will be Halloween, which is a huge time commitment every year. Perhaps, if I can get past the negative associations I have at present with editing in the wiki, and I have more time, I will update the pages in the future. That last thing you said, about the online tools, that is what I meant about automated. It's not that a computer goes, Oh, it's time! And makes the update; we have to do that, and all of the information has been checked beforehand, and all changes are looked at to make sure they were the correct changes. I just meant we don't have to go in and do it line by line and base by base. 🙂 Press a button, look at the changes, if it's right, you're done. That's pretty automated, to me! You could add a link to the topic where Easter Bunny consolidated all of the helpful guides for bases, including my video tutorial channel, for those who prefer to see it done, rather than reading the instructions (depending on the type of learner one is). You see, there are guides to things like what light sources actually give light, a link to a source giving more music sources than the wiki lists, and so forth. Even our Discord is listed, as it has become a resource all on its own. This one link includes the directory as well, although that has an additional topic all to itself, because people won't read. Here is the link:

I just wanted to let y'all know that I'm getting ready to completely rewrite the Experience page. https://homecoming.wiki/wiki/Experience I've been working on figuring out all the variables involved in calculating XP gain from critters, and I'm pretty sure I've figured out the formula which includes additional reference tables. It might not be right away as I want to sit down and verify the method for awarding mission completion XP rewards first. In the past when I've edited pre-existing pages, I've tried to make as few changes as possible, going so far as to keep even the formatting, organization, and wording in the page. That's my homage to the previous Paragon Wiki editors that came before me. However, there's enough new information about experience that it might be worth rewriting the entire page. I can say the information that's there now will be retained, more or less, but a lot more will be added and the organization of the page might need to be revamped. I won't be entirely sure until I actually do it and see what really needs to be done. My question is, would anyone like me to write up the new experience page and post it at the HC forums for you to look over before I edit the page? Or would you like me to do that on the page's talk page? or just edit the page with the option to revert it? This last option is easiest, but I'm open to alternatives.

I just went ahead and added a link to the Community Base Directory spreadsheet at the bottom of the Supergroup Base page https://homecoming.wiki/wiki/Supergroup_Base. So now we're covered. If that's all you want to do @Dacy, I completely understand. I'm actually tempted to add another link to the Base Builders Cheat Sheet post at the Homecoming forum It's been THE most important base editing information that I've encountered. Although... a-hem! ... I haven't read any base building guides. Maybe that would be a good idea! LOL

I think adding a link to the directory a the bottom of a wiki page in the "See Also" section is perfectly fine. It would merely be a helpful link to a good off-wiki resource. Ah, OK. That totally makes sense. So really the main question you've been asking wiki peeps is whether or not it would be a good idea to have the wiki reflect what is on the spreadsheet. So my answer to that is whatever would be easiest to maintain. Frankly, the easiest thing would just be to add a link and be done with it. Other players can edit the wiki and add the information from your directory if desired, or you could tackle that project. Either way, once the information is at the wiki, you aren't required to monitor it. The rest of us can do that, especially now that we know that it's an issue. Exactly what I meant. When I think about maintaining 2 different sources that both change, it seems like too much work. And you're right, the amount of people that edit the base pages is small. So if you WANTED to maintain both spreadsheet and wiki, I'd have no objections but it would mean your attention would have to be split, and I know that can be a pain. I'm just trying to be helpful and positive, @Dacy. 🙂 Not that I think this would ever happen with you and @Easter Bunny, but what if the unthinkable happens and you both become unable or unwilling to continue to maintain your base directory? If the information is also at the wiki (or any wiki), at least players could still update it themselves and all the information wouldn't be lost. The converse is true as well, what if this wiki goes away? So having the same or similar information at 2 different places is not a bad idea. Personally, I think information about community bases that are useful to the general player population (such as the many teleport bases), is the most important base location information to host at this wiki. Information about personal bases that are accessible to other players to look at is nice as well, but not as important because it isn't immediately useful to as many players. Once in a while I do like going around to other people's bases to see what others have done, so it's not useless information in the least. And if you're a player who is interested in base building, then the open house bases are extremely useful as examples of what can be done! So I do think the base location information has a place at this wiki. I know @thunderforce is advocating removing the base information from the wiki, but I don't think that's necessary or desirable. I can live with it, though, as long as the information is available to players elsewhere and is easily accessible. So what do I recommend? Well, at MINIMUM, add a link to your directory at the bottom of the wiki page. If we do that, I think we're covered. If you want to rewrite or edit any of the base pages I think that's perfectly fine. I might say I even want you to do that! I couldn't ask for better people than you and @Easter Bunny to update the wiki's SG base pages. I trust your judgement @Dacy, especially when it comes to SG bases. You two are like THE SG base experts! I also think there's no reason for you to maintain the wiki info and provide oversight if you don't want to afterwards. As for automatic updates of the wiki pages from your directory, I really don't think that's necessary and it also makes things more complicated. Maybe just periodic updates done manually? That way we'd have a human looking at everything. Heck, I can even do that! It's a relatively simple task to convert a spreadsheet into a wiki table with the online tools that are available. I hope what I've said here is helpful to everyone. Warmest wishes from me to everyone involved. I appreciate your dedication, intelligence, and support. Glad to be in the same company with people the likes of y'all. 🙂