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Blackfeather

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    Light Control: A Luminous PBAoE Control Powerset

    in Suggestions & Feedback

    Posted

    19 hours ago, Dahle said:

    I will chime in, because this is interesting.  I enjoy playing things like Fire Control, Ice Control and Electric Control, all sets that benefit from being more in close or point blank range.  Though none are set in stone to the point of 'you MUST play melee.'

    A lot of this, in theory, will force a player to play in melee.  That isn't a bad thing, in some scenarios.  Though looking at it, I feel like you'll be forced into a defensive secondary as a controller and as a Dominator you'll be forced into Perma-Dom (but who doesn't do that).

     

    I do want to ask a few items though:

    1. Why is their no Single Target Hold? I understand the sleep and the mechanic there, but if a controller lacks that basic, it really isn't a control set anymore, it becomes a debuff set and might be better as a def primary or controller secondary.

    2. I think I read this earlier, but the Ray of Light Mechanic would probably be ignored, just like the /Time mechanic is ignored.  I liked the suggestion of making it a toggle, and maybe even an AoE toggle on an enemy.  This gives it more utility to be used and probably makes it a must take, though it would need to be weakened a bit.  It also would need to be moved out of the T1 spot probably. Maybe move the sleep to T1, put in a Hold at T2 and mix Ray of light and Twilight into an AoE toggle on an enemy power?

    3. I saw some slotting inconsistencies. And though I find the Sets that are To Hit Debuff to be more in line with what I look for, some of the powers probably should be changed to Accurate To Hit Debuff, like Ray of Light and Dazzling Glow.
    4. Your pet is intentionally made 'weak' so it explodes I am guessing?  But that makes me not want the Pet, it is almost completely skippable IMO.  Just like Fire Imps that die so easily.  I think an opposite of Dark Servant might fit as a pet better, something that throws a lot of Ranged Damage out instead of lots of debuffs (probably a lot of ST damage) to offset the lack of damage in the set, and a Ranged Damage dealing pet may not die so often because of the melee orientation of the set and how it pulls things in.

     

    So yeah, I'd try it. I mean I have 45 controllers in varying states of play, what is one more 🙂

     

    Hey there, and thanks for your thoughts on this! I was definitely inspired by Ice Control's reliance on Arctic Air to primarily control the battlefield, and thought it'd be a neat fit for something like Light Control - to my mind, I perceive the element as 'radiating' and 'straightforward', which translated to 'up-close-and-personal' for me. I'll definitely say that the -To Hit was supposed to help compensate for this to some degree, with the hope being that it wouldn't necessitate specific secondaries for it to work.

     

    That being said, there were certainly other ways I could have gone about fulfilling that sort of idea. For example as you've mentioned, the Illumination mechanic here could potentially be leaned on much more heavily in terms of control - here it's supposed to be more of a bonus thing, since I figured that an additional mandatory mechanic might get in the way of actually controlling the battlefield. One idea that I've tossed around a little is creating small AoE bursts of temporary Hold status effects when chaining some kinds of powers together, or something like that.

     

    As for the lack of a single target hold, it was for a similar reason to why Ice Control doesn't have any confuse powers outside of Arctic Air - I wanted 1975604704_BlindingHalo.png.324caf2c9fd1a29bf9599d753c78a038.png T4: Blinding Halo to be its main source of lockdown, but still prevent it from immediately stacking without putting in extra work to do that (e.g. like how one can stack Arctic Air with World of Confusion). I figured that it was a potent enough power to stand alone by itself, and provide Light Control with more wriggle room to have a variety of different effects. I actually toyed with the idea of providing a T2 Disorient instead of a Sleep, but I didn't want it to further potentially stack with 122333432_IncandescentEruption.png.bed1d861415a435328a8b4fe6b7b8443.png T6: Incandescent Eruption and 804575760_PrismaticField.png.37db79635018f16e4f24feb5430f294e.png T7: Prismatic Field.

     

    And thanks for the heads up on the slotting - I forgot about the Accurate To Hit Debuff sets, quickly edited to properly fit them; I'm pretty sure that -ToHit powers with an accuracy component actually allow for both To Hit Debuff and Accurate To Hit Debuff sets.

     

    I'm also not entirely sure how durable I'm imagining 278989210_ShiningMotes.png.cee815dd22c339ad160973a3f8e8a36f.png T9: Shining Motes to be. I've been toying with the idea of a -To Hit debuff aura around them; the idea behind them was to stack further PBAoE powers that synergise with Light Control's own ones, a bit of a death-by-a-thousand cuts kind of thing, if that makes sense. The best way to look at the knockdown is more as a bonus flavour thing than as an intentional mechanic to exploit - something that happens in the case of them prematurely expiring than something to rely upon.

     

    Hope this clears things up a bit!

    Light Control: A Luminous PBAoE Control Powerset

    in Suggestions & Feedback

    Posted

    12 hours ago, Leo_G said:

    Have you, by chance, played much of Ice Control?

     

    While it can be played with some range, it benefits from close ranged and synergies with other sets that either bolster it's ranged capabilities (I paired mine with Trick Arrow to stack it's control and damage but still wade into the thick of it) but I could imagine Poison, Dark and Empathy being a decent pairing due to wanting to be near the action or having PBAoE effects to capitalize on.

     

    Overall, I think there could be more control sets made for that type of synergy similar to Ice and Illusion, simply because there's just not many like it 

     

    Ice Control was definitely one of the main inspirations for this powerset! Though I did mention to @oedipus_tex that the powers involved here were meant to help keep the Controller/Dominator safe despite staying in melee range: -To Hit debuffs, knockdown, and other forms of softer control should hopefully help to synergise with it. I also mentioned some thematic/mechanical combinations over here:

     

     

    Though of course, a lot of it is mostly speculation.

    Light Control: A Luminous PBAoE Control Powerset

    in Suggestions & Feedback

    Posted

    11 hours ago, krj12 said:

    Looks interesting, my take:

    1.  I prefer controller sets with a pet, so don't lose the pets.

    2.  Not a fan of ground targeted AE powers in this game, so having more than one power of that type would be a big negative.

    3.  I prefer to stay at range when possible with my trollers, I'm not a tank or a blapper.  So, all the PBAE powers... not sure about that.

     

    As to whether I'd play the set ... with me, character concept always comes first before I decide to try a powerset.

    After that, it depends on how it plays - I've deleted characters due to either awkwardness of a power set or relative lack of performance.

    Hard for me to tell based on descriptions, I'd have to actually try it.

     

     

    Hey there, and thanks for your response! @MTeague did mention that most people'd probably prefer the pet T9, and I think this supports that, hahah. I am considering replacing Eclipse.png.ad1aa9468e64d19928d03d3c3c86dfb8.png T5: Twilight with 1960645279_GleamingSphere.png.bd89df70fbcb039e88008c4e90ba7c11.png Gleaming Sphere just because flavour wise it sounds a bit more fitting...but having a way of showing the absence of light is neat too. Plus, it provides a relatively safe way of letting the Light Controller/Dominator walk up to enemies beforehand.

     

    Location based powers...hmm. Reducing them might be possible, though I'm not sure how best I'd do that - I imagine you're not a fan of Earth Control as a result! I will say that Light Control does make said powers fairly skippable, since 1975604704_BlindingHalo.png.324caf2c9fd1a29bf9599d753c78a038.png T4: Blinding Halo is its main source of control; the patch powers are useful for influencing larger amounts of the battlefield, but aren't necessary.

     

    That being said, Light Control was definitely conceptualised as a PBAoE control powerset, kind of similar to Ice Control, except with a toolkit that actually synergised with that idea. That's part of the reason why -To Hit is part of it: providing some safety when sticking close to enemies and shining. There's definitely options for staying at range...but it'd definitely make the powerset much less potent. 😅

     

    And, well...I do hope that one day a Light Control actually becomes implemented! I'd look forward to testing out such a set myself if that happens. Once can dream! And in the meantime, draft up concepts of what it'd look like.

    • Like 1

    Light Control: A Luminous PBAoE Control Powerset

    in Suggestions & Feedback

    Posted

    On that note, going to ping @zenblack on this topic. Hey there! From your posts/Discord discussions, it looks like you're pretty versed in terms of Controllers/Dominators; would be interested in hearing your thoughts on this proposed writeup for Light Control - does it stand out from the others, is it overtuned/underpowered? Would it be something you'd be interested in playing? Hope to hear from you soon enough! 😊

    Patch Notes for April 20th, 2021 - Issue 27, Page 2

    in Patch Notes Discussion

    Posted

    I also use these binds for some of my characters, which lets a person switch to Fly, Hover, and walking with a single keypress:

     

    hover.txt

    F "powexec_toggleoff Fly$$powexec_name Hover$$bindloadfilesilent ./binds/flight/fly.txt"

     

    fly.txt

    F "powexec_toggleoff Hover$$powexec_name Fly$$bindloadfilesilent ./binds/flight/ground.txt"

     

    ground.txt

    F "powexec_toggleoff Fly$$powexec_toggleoff Hover$$bindloadfilesilent ./binds/flight/hover.txt"

     

    Easy enough to set up, and allows for rotating between multiple powers - a neat setup for sure. 😊

    Light Control: A Luminous PBAoE Control Powerset

    in Suggestions & Feedback

    Posted

    11 hours ago, Hew said:

    Something to consider. Instead of making things BRIGHT, you also have the option of making things DARK. Dark as in literally dark, not dark as in darkitydarkdark blast et al. 

     

    Consider the set less like a philips light bulb on 24x7, and more like a wall switch with light and dark both being part of the same switch.

     

    Definitely something I'll think about further on, thanks for the heads up! I've touched on using the absence of light flavour wise with Eclipse.png.ad1aa9468e64d19928d03d3c3c86dfb8.png T5: Twilight but there's definitely room for more powers in that sort of vein.

     

    Hmm...hey there @ArchVileTerror - thought it might be a good idea to phone a person that's part of the RP community - got any ideas on flavouring some of these other Light Control powers as involving manipulating light away from opponents vs. directly dazzling/overwhelming them? 😄

    Light Control: A Luminous PBAoE Control Powerset

    in Suggestions & Feedback

    Posted

    12 hours ago, Hew said:

    So, a few things.

    #1, I really like the idea of reusing the new attraction mechanism that singy has. That is cool as hell, and it would be nice to get more mileage on the mechanism.

    #2, I could see the potential of increased crit chance against blinded foes (since I guess it is beyond flash arrow?) making it unique for the set.

    #3, stripping stealth off things would make arachnos easier I think, and that would be a good thing.

     

    For sure! I imagine a dedicated powerset could probably make use of the Attract mechanic more liberally (I think Magnetism was brought up for instance), but having one power in another control set use it would be nice too...not to mention a boon for something like Mind Control's Telekinesis. With Light Control's PBAoE nature, I figured having a way to keep enemies close to them would be a neat synergistic power.

     

    Admittedly, the Illumination mechanic was heavily inspired by Time Manipulation's Time Crawl, with its Delayed mechanic empowering the effects of other powers in the set. Ray of Light helps to deal damage and add a bit of extra control in combination with the other powers in the set, but it can still be forgone if desired. Glad you like it!

     

    And agreed - I thought Blinding Halo having a -Stealth component was quite fitting given the whole revealing/obscuring nature of manipulating light. It was kind of influenced by how Ice Control's Arctic Air did the same thing...in fact, that's the most comparable power to it. Agreed on providing the powerset with a niche that sets it apart a little! Plus, due to its PBAoE nature, Light Control's especially effective against invisible enemies, since they don't require targeting.

    Light Control: A Luminous PBAoE Control Powerset

    in Suggestions & Feedback

    Posted

    Think I'm going to ping @Galaxy Brain as well on this - heya! Was kind of curious if you had any thoughts on this proposed Control powerset; I wanted to make something that played relatively uniquely compared to the available primaries, with its focus on PBAoE powers. Additionally, would be interested in your thoughts on its relative strength between Controllers/Dominators, with its toggle Hold aura, akin to Ice Control's Arctic Air and so on.

    • Like 1

    Light Control: A Luminous PBAoE Control Powerset

    in Suggestions & Feedback

    Posted

    3 hours ago, 5099y_74c05 said:

    Thanks for the heads up. I'll try and walk through this on the weekend to get a feel for how the powers interact with each other and how this will play out.

     

    What would you consider natural pairings with this primary?

     

    Thanks in advance for your time! I tried to make Blinding Halo the main source of Light Control's lockdown, similar to how Ice Control's Arctic Air does most of the heavy lifting. As such, it's meant to be an up-close-and-personal powerset that compensates for the danger it puts the user in by way of -To Hit.

     

    The later powers in the set are meant to supplement this in various ways, such as inhibiting enemy aggro via reduced perception, or keeping them grouped together so the Light Controller/Dominator can easily wade in and engage more easily (with the occasional random status effect kicking in). For instance, by slowing enemies down, Prismatic Field helps to bunch up mobs, and Luminous Distortion does this explicitly, with the tech used in the new Singularity that draws mobs towards it.

     

    Pairings (Controller)

    As for natural pairings (Controller-wise), I imagine any powerset that has a way of stacking Holds would be desirable, since Light Control has no other way of doing so outside of their Halo. As such, Time Manipulation (Time Stop/Distortion Field), Poison (Paralytic Poison), Trick Arrow (Ice Arrow), Nature Affinity (Entangling Aura) and Radiation Emission (Choking Cloud) all have some synergy.

     

    Additionally, powersets that encourage Controllers to stay up close would also be ideal, such as Pain Domination (Anguishing Cry), Poison (Venomous Gas), and Time Manipulation (Time's Juncture), given how much of Light Control's kit is useful when near enemies.

     

    In terms of themed pairings, I imagine Radiation Emission (manipulating wavelengths), Darkness Affinity (elemental duality), Force Field (hard-light), Nature Affinity (photosynthesis), Sonic Resonance (anyone say Dazzler?), Time Manipulation (embody the 'swift/speed' aspect of light & its temporal shenanigans), Electrical Affinity (artificial lighting) and Thermal Radiation (manipulate aspects of the sun, heat & light) would be quite appealing.

     

    Pairings (Dominator)

    Similarly to Controllers, powersets that can stack status effects might be appealing for Dominators. I can see Energy Assault being strong and thematic due to its large amount of Stun potential, which might synergize with Light Control's own stuns - I believe Radioactive Assault has a way of stunning enemies as well. In this vein, Earth Assault, with its Hold-inflicting Seismic Smash and Stun-inflicting Fissure might stack two different status effects at once.

     

    Additionally, Assault powersets that encourage keeping in close range, such as a variety of PBAoE/melee powers will likely do well - I think that mostly encompasses all of them for the most part, though Psionic Assault stands out due to Drain Psyche, especially since Light Control is quite good at gathering enemies close and keeping them there.

     

    As for themed pairings...well, there's more that go together well than those that don't, I think:

    • Dark Assault = elemental duality
    • Earth Assault = crystalline luminescence
    • Electricity Assault = artificial lighting
    • Energy Assault = use of light offensively
    • Fiery Assault = manipulate aspects of the sun, heat & light
    • Icy Assault = reflection of light via ice crystals
    • Martial Assault = special elemental ki that uses light
    • Radioactive Assault = manipulating wavelengths
    • Thorny Assault = photosynthesis
    • Like 1

    Light Control: A Luminous PBAoE Control Powerset

    in Suggestions & Feedback

    Posted

    8 hours ago, oedipus_tex said:

    I think this is an interesting foundation for a powerset.

     

    The obvious balance point vs this set is Dark Control, which also does -ToHit. In general -ToHit tends to be a very useful effect on Control sets, especially on Dominators (because Doms have few other sources of debuff) so the basis for this set is good. 

     

    I'm not sure if I missed it, but most Control sets have some form of reliable hard control on either 60 or 90 second recharge. Ice, Mind, and Illusion Control are exceptions so it's not a hard rule. I see a couple of power with small chances to mezz with what looks like Shadow Field-style chances. I'd need to see how all these powers layered together functioned before making a call. All of the -ToHit in addition to those effects may be enough to make the set effective. On the other hand, Dark Control has a ton of -ToHit and still has good hard controls.

     

    Ray of Light may be more interesting as a toggle. I'll admit I've almost never used Time Manipulation's special mechanic because I don't find it very useful in context.

     

    I didn't see a single target Hold. I don't think all Control sets are technically required to have one, but not having one does mean they can't contribute in normal Control-character ways to the one fight control characters are really needed, Hamidon.

     

    BTW beware that Dominators tend to get short changed when a set features a lot of pseudo pets (e.g. Electric Control). There are ways around this but the powers have to be explicitly coded to keep this limitation of the system in mind. 

    Interesting ideas. Thanks for posting.

     

    Thanks for your thoughts on this! The core power in this set is meant to be Blinding Halo, a PBAoE Hold aura, kind of like a souped up Choking Cloud - since Light Control has an always-on form of providing Holds, I figured that it was an opportunity to deviate a little from the standard single-target Hold power, in favour of providing a larger variety of status effects.

     

    In a way, the closest comparison I've got here is with Ice Control, oddly enough, with its Arctic Air Confusion aura being its main form of control. The main difference here is that Light Control has a way of 1) initially stopping enemies from seeing them before they engage via Eclipse, 2) provides some initial mitigation beforehand via its -To Hit, and 3) has more sources of damage to whittle down enemies resistant to its controls.

     

    Basically, I wanted to avoid too much stacking of status effects, to prevent it from one-shot disabling bosses from the start (hence why the two powers that Disorient enemies are on a chance basis). I'm still thinking about mixing and matching said effects to make it work - if you've got suggestions of your own in that regard, I'd love to hear them!

     

    On the other hand, it's also why I thought the -To Hit provided by Light Control would also be helpful for it; it takes some time for Blinding Halo to stack up, so in the meantime, they get some additional mitigation to help stop the attacks that do go through initially.

     

    I like to think of Ray of Light's Illuminate effect more as a bonus than something necessary to use to make the powerset function; its main goal is to deal extra damage, kind of like Illusion Control's Spectral Wounds. Basically, if it's used in an attack chain, that's fine too. Though I'd like to think that its interaction with Dazzling Glow is neat, providing a way to stack sleeps by suppressing its damage on Illuminated enemies.

     

    Back to Dominators specifically - the main power I was wondering about in terms of benefit was Blinding Halo; with Domination on, I imagine it'd allow for a continuous aura of hard lockdown that keeps everything locked down save for the strongest of enemies.

     

    Outside of said power, a lot of Light Control's abilities are meant to be much softer forms of locking enemies down: knockdowns, slows, attracts, with the occasional chance of a hard status effect weaved in (i.e. Incandescent Eruption, Prismatic Field, Luminous Distortion respectively).

     

    Having a single target Sleep should also allow a Dominator to one-shot disable AVs as well, whereas a Controller would have to use Ray of Light first to suppress Dazzling Glow's damage first to make it stack.

    Light Control: A Luminous PBAoE Control Powerset

    in Suggestions & Feedback

    Posted

    Heya @oedipus_tex! Gonna give you a ping on this, curious if this proposal for a Light Control powerset would be something you'd be interested in seeing in-game, along with your thoughts on its balancing, both compared to how potent it is compared to other Control powersets, along with whether it'd be an appealing pick for Dominators specifically. Several powers are patch based/soft control...but are the ones that aren't enough to make up for it, in terms of benefits for Domination? Interested in hearing your views on it. 😁

    Light Control: A Luminous PBAoE Control Powerset

    in Suggestions & Feedback

    Posted

    11 hours ago, MTeague said:

    Well. 

    a) I'm sure the playerbase writ large would probably prefer the pet lol. 

    b) it's an interesting option. I'd need to think about how to leverages that most effectively, both for teams, and for soloing.

     

    I presume any attack that was initiated before the you entered/exited would likely still hit you, to prevent you from hoping in and out of the sphere and doing quick freebie attacks, or negating a big enemy wind up.  The game engine isn't kind to that kind of interruption anyway. if it was legal when it was triggered, it's legal when it connects, seems to be the general rule. Still.  For a T9, I presume it would likely have a LARGE to-hit debuff.  THAT could be worth it right there, as a kind of back-door Armor power. 

     

    Also now I'd kind of want to make a Light/Dark controller, in homage to an old old olllllld game.

     

    Archon: The Light and the Dark - Wikipedia

     

    (circa 1983)

     

    I just learnt about a new game from this! And agreed, pets would definitely be much simpler...but it's fun to speculate a bit.

     

    As for applications of Gleaming Sphere, I have a few ideas in mind:

    • Treat it like a damage patch - cast it near enemies and immobilise them around you, extra -To Hit provides more survivability
    • Area of effect powers still work, so stand to one side of it, and damage enemies with your PBAoE powers while they're outside/inside
      • Kind of similar to how stealthed enemies work: can't be targeted, but AoE powers close to them can still affect them indirectly
    • Potent fear can keep enemies out - places that need defending can make use of this
    • Prevent long ranged attacks from targeting you, meaning only things affected by Blinding Halo can see you
    • Split up multiple strong opponents: keep some on one side and immobilise them to keep them out, picking them off
    • Like 1
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