Best archetype/set for Kinetics

[rheckenkamp]

Good day,

 

I want to try the Kinetics powerset, which I've never done before. At the same time provide maximum offensive buffs for team mates at end game. 

 

Fire/kinetics controller? 

Kinetics/fire corruptor?

Kinetics/sonic defender? 

[Tryna_Dugid]

really just depends on how you enjoy playing. the troller is less fun in groups and more fun solo in my opinion. there isn’t enough time to get everyone buffed and make meaningful control options, because stuff will be dead that fast. drop a bonfire with KB->KD and jump in to fulcrum while your pets and team do the rest.

 

i prefer it on corrupters as i can lead the group a little more. the difference on defenders is very small iirc, outside of getting fulcrum at 32. those that want the buffs are gonna need to jump in when i do cause after my alpha strike there isn’t much left for them to do.

 

overall, you need pretty solid defenses and resists to survive in melee range, so keep that in mind, especially if you’re the first to jump in.

[siolfir]

I enjoy Kinetics Corruptors and, like @Tryna_Dugid, tend to be at or near the front of the group running in. Defenders are a touch safer because of their higher AT modifiers and provide more of a buff to the team, but have a lower damage cap so top out on their personal damage much faster. Controllers are a (generally) safer option since their controls can lockdown spawns to set up the Fulcrum Shift and they get pets that also get a boost. So "best" is going to be subjective because it depends on what you're looking for: I just prefer doing the damage myself and play my Kinetics characters as if they were Brutes.

 

Note that Masterminds also get Kinetics now if you wanted to try one, although pets don't benefit from recharge. The advantages here are that you can focus on Kinetics and six pets backed by Fulcrum Shift will do quite a bit of damage. The disadvantage here is that your modifiers are worse than every other AT that gets Kinetics and you'll also be trying to rein in pet AI that is going to try to aggro the entire map at once while rushing around on Speed Boost.

[Darkir]

Kinetics works best on fire corruptors in an IO/ATO world. The reason for this is the damage scale of .75 combined with the higher 500% damage cap. Essentially this equates to doing 40%+ more damage than a defender/controller with the same powers, even the fire dots are increased. As a corruptor you can also still get softcapped POS def or S/L/E def, high resists, high global recharge, and Mez protection (if you go the s/l/e rune of protection route). Plus you get to boost your whole teams damage while being capable of healing.

[Force Redux]

I'm going to recommend Beasts/Kinetics Mastermind.  Why?

 

Kinetics offers little in the way of protection for the caster. Beasts grabs aggro for you and does your tanking. You are safer.

 

Kinetics is very good for melee positioning. Beasts are all-melee pets.

 

Kinetics has very little way of protecting MM pets. But Beasts can self-cap pet Defense with Fortify the Pack and IOs. 

 

While Beasts do not gain from -recharge, they do gain from +damage. Kinetics can turn Beasts into a chainsaw of doom.

 

Beast/Kin offers solid Kin buffs to a group (and their pets). They have heals. Their pets offer solid damage and tanking when solo. They will be very sturdy all on their own.  Its a very complimentary pairing. 

[Dr Causality]

On 1/14/2020 at 4:55 PM, Force Redux said:

I'm going to recommend Beasts/Kinetics Mastermind.  Why?

Interesting,  I had a similar starting point but chose Bots because the extra +10% Def Shield one of the Protector Bots puts on your Character makes it much easier to softcap, letting you got for more Rech Bonuses while still staying safe. 

 

It worked surprisingly well because the Bots would run into melee range to punch things, so were always in heal range.    I haven't tested that toon with the improved ranged pet AI that's now out, so although it was an amazing improvement for the game, it might not turn out all well for my Bots/Kin    😏

Edited January 30, 2020 by Dr Causality

[Redlynne]

Gravity/Kinetics Controller

 

Wormhole with KB>KD slotted for "safe" Fulcrum Shifting ...

[Tugzug]

It's a very busy set compared to most other Support sets, so just keep that in mind when planning a build.

[Dr Causality]

3 hours ago, Tugzug said:

It's a very busy set compared to most other Support sets, so just keep that in mind when planning a build.

My feelings too and that's why I'm on the same page with @Force Redux in suggesting a MM as making one of the best team oriented KINs.     It might just be because I've extensively played MM's, but I feel like you can largely let the henchen's AI do the attacking so you contribute DPS, freeing you up to focus more on using your KIN powers...

[Coyote]

MMs is a good choice. So is a Plant/Kinetics, because you get higher than usual Controller damage in Roots, and also because it's the most "fire and forget" primary.... throw Seeds, then start Kineticizing 😉  ... with occasional uses of Roots for damage. Roots, Creepers, and the Fly Trap will kill spawns that are fighting each other due to Seeds, and then you can finish the bosses with Fulcrum Shifted Seismic Smashes, while still having time to Transfusionette allies.

[Dr Causality]

49 minutes ago, Coyote said:

.....So is a Plant/Kinetics, because you get higher than usual Controller damage in Roots, and also because it's the most "fire and forget" primary.... throw Seeds, then start Kineticizing 😉  ... with occasional uses of Roots for damage. Roots, Creepers, and the Fly Trap will kill spawns that are fighting each other due to Seeds, and then you can finish the bosses with Fulcrum Shifted Seismic Smashes, while still having time to Transfusionette allies.

 

Yeah.  I can see that being great too.   Proc-ed out Carrion Creepers are such good DPS and mitigation they might as well be henchmen attacking with AI. 

[JayboH]

On 3/13/2020 at 4:05 PM, Dr Causality said:

My feelings too and that's why I'm on the same page with @Force Redux in suggesting a MM as making one of the best team oriented KINs.     It might just be because I've extensively played MM's, but I feel like you can largely let the henchen's AI do the attacking so you contribute DPS, freeing you up to focus more on using your KIN powers...

What pets do you like best (with any pairing)

[Dr Causality]

14 hours ago, JayboH said:

What pets do you like best (with any pairing)

I think a lot will depend on whether you plan to primarily team or solo.   KIN's heal Transfusion is an enemy target based heal, making it difficult to keep ranged pets healed.   You often have to manually have them run up next to your target, so they can get into the heal radius...

 

I used to prefer Bots/Kin, because one of Protector Bot shields your MM for up to around 10% Def (if you slot it for Def enhancement).   That makes it much easier to get Def numbers up, even on /Kin.     But now with the pet ai upgrades Bots are properly all ranged.  This can be nice on teams since you can have them sit out of the way, while still attacking targets.    BUT especially for Solo play, now that Bots ai is fixed to prevent them from running into melee, as described above it's challenging to use your heal.   

 

 

Due to Transfusion's enemy target based heal, especially for Solo play, you'll likely be happiest with melee based Pets/Henchmen.    

 

Given that best sets would probably be one of these three, especially for solo play:

• Demons with all their -Res debuffs, and their Ember Demon's +Res Shield are great.  They have melee claw attacks, so will eventually run into melee.    All  that  -Res they can stack would be the biggest force multiplier for KIN Fulcrum shifts, and especially noticeable on teams and against AVs/GMs.
• Thugs are great due to Enforcer's stacking Leadership powers. Which means it should be possible to softcap them with all the +Def pets IOs, MM taking Maneuvers and Hybrid Support. But they're  mixed ranged and melee, with only the (3) Bruiser (T3) being melee. 
• Beasts are all melee and recommended by @Force Redux    But I have very limited experience with them, so can't personally comment on what it takes to soft cap them etc.   From my understanding getting the most of out Beasts requires using the MM attacks to build stacks of 'Pack Mentality'.   To me that sounds like it would be busy and maybe distracting on top of all the /Kin powers.  But the difference between busy and boring, seems to  be very much a personal playstyle preference....

Zombies are all melee and should also be workable. 

 

Not Recommended (unless you need them for theme)

Ninjas while melee are quite fragile, so not recommended, especially paired with a 2ndary like /KIN that doesn't have +Def or significant +Res buffs to help keep them alive...

Mercs are not recommended for pairing with KIN because they're all ranged, but lack the Bots Def buffs and -Regen etc. 

 

 

For Team play,  especially on /Kin I really like the Fire Master Epic pool, so you can get Bonfire.  You give up the Resistance Shield, but Bonfire is a ton of mitigation with Overwhelming KB to KD proc.  And you still get the single target Hold you proc into a Dmg power and Fire Ball.  So gives you some nice offensive powers.    I think the highest DPS KIN MM build will likely be Demons/Kin/Fire.

[JayboH]

1 hour ago, Dr Causality said:

I think a lot will depend on whether you plan to primarily team or solo.   KIN's heal Transfusion is an enemy target based heal, making it difficult to keep ranged pets healed.   You often have to manually have them run up next to your target, so they can get into the heal radius...

 

I used to prefer Bots/Kin, because one of Protector Bot shields your MM for up to around 10% Def (if you slot it for Def enhancement).   That makes it much easier to get Def numbers up, even on /Kin.     But now with the pet ai upgrades Bots are properly all ranged.  This can be nice on teams since you can have them sit out of the way, while still attacking targets.    BUT especially for Solo play, now that Bots ai is fixed to prevent them from running into melee, as described above it's challenging to use your heal.   

 

 

Due to Transfusion's enemy target based heal, especially for Solo play, you'll likely be happiest with melee based Pets/Henchmen.    

 

Given that best sets would probably be one of these three, especially for solo play:

• Demons with all their -Res debuffs, and their Ember Demon's +Res Shield are great.  They have melee claw attacks, so will eventually run into melee.    All  that  -Res they can stack would be the biggest force multiplier for KIN Fulcrum shifts, and especially noticeable on teams and against AVs/GMs.
• Thugs are great due to Enforcer's stacking Leadership powers. Which means it should be possible to softcap them with all the +Def pets IOs, MM taking Maneuvers and Hybrid Support. But they're  mixed ranged and melee, with only the (3) Bruiser (T3) being melee. 
• Beasts are all melee and recommended by @Force Redux    But I have very limited experience with them, so can't personally comment on what it takes to soft cap them etc.   From my understanding getting the most of out Beasts requires using the MM attacks to build stacks of 'Pack Mentality'.   To me that sounds like it would be busy and maybe distracting on top of all the /Kin powers.  But the difference between busy and boring, seems to  be very much a personal playstyle preference....

Zombies are all melee and should also be workable. 

 

Not Recommended (unless you need them for theme)

Ninjas while melee are quite fragile, so not recommended, especially paired with a 2ndary like /KIN that doesn't have +Def or significant +Res buffs to help keep them alive...

Mercs are not recommended for pairing with KIN because they're all ranged, but lack the Bots Def buffs and -Regen etc. 

 

 

For Team play,  especially on /Kin I really like the Fire Master Epic pool, so you can get Bonfire.  You give up the Resistance Shield, but Bonfire is a ton of mitigation with Overwhelming KB to KD proc.  And you still get the single target Hold you proc into a Dmg power and Fire Ball.  So gives you some nice offensive powers.    I think the highest DPS KIN MM build will likely be Demons/Kin/Fire.

Thank you - however what I meant by (any pairing) is what MM sets do you like best with any secondary at all?

[00Troy00]

On 1/13/2020 at 10:46 PM, Darkir said:

As a corruptor you can also still get softcapped POS def or S/L/E def, high resists, high global recharge

Do you have a build that can accomplish this?

[JJDrakken]

Fire/Kin Controllers were/are/will always be the Staple for go to for Kin farmers.  Do to containment you deal double dmg. You Flashfire or Cinders.  F-S, Then AoE Immob with your Hotfeet melts stuff fast cuz your getting containment.

 

They were first "Farmers" for a reason.

Edited July 4, 2022 by JJDrakken

[Darkir]

On 6/26/2022 at 8:49 AM, 00Troy00 said:

Do you have a build that can accomplish this?

Lots, just look at my posts in the corruptor forum.