[Wishful Thinking] Replace fixed RNG for effects with an accuracy check modifier

[Redlynne]

Relatively simple notion this one.

 

I honestly dislike that there are so many power effects that have a fixed RNG percentage of happening and there is absolutely NOTHING that you can do as a Player to enhance your way to improving those RNG chances.  70% chance is a 70% chance because it is hardcoded to be a 70% chance and there are no ways to modify that 70% chance no matter what because it's a 70% chance for that effect to happen.

 

To put it mildly (or politely, if you prefer) ... I can see that approach making sense in a 2002-2004 coding era, but it certainly seems to be rather deplorably LACKING in a coding era in which it's possible to make auto-hit powers (like Taunts) do an accuracy check against certain types of $Targets (AVs and GMs being the obvious go to here, but also PvP).  We can already see the kind of programming logic needed to broaden the applicability of this idea in a number of powers at the City of Data wayback machine repository ... and which I presume @Captain Powerhouse would already have at least a passing familiarity with.  Here are a couple of examples stolen from a Tanker Taunt power and the Kinetics Repel power.

Quote

If (@ToHitRoll < @ToHit) or @ForceHit

If @ToHitRoll + 0.1 < @ToHit

 

So here's the basic idea, and for the sake of simplicity I'm thinking of it being potentially applicable to only Knock Effects (up/down/back) and for testing purposes applied only to Peacebringers, giving a relatively "stable" baseline of performance for comparative testing purposes and checking for edge cases.  A number of Peacebringer powers feature Knockback of various MAGnitudes (an enumeration of which can be found HERE) which I shall cross-post here now for ease of reference.

Quote

 

Peacebringer Human Form KB Powers

• Gleaming Blast (Ranged): 1.869 KnockBACK (10% chance)
• Radiant Strike (Melee): 2 KnockBACK (60% chance)
• Luminous Detonation (Target AoE): 3.739 KnockBACK (50% chance)
• Incandescent Strike (Melee): 0.67 KnockBACK (80% chance)
• Solar Flare (PBAoE): 4.154 KnockBACK (80% chance)
• Photon Seekers (Pet): 2.077 KnockBACK (50% chance)
• Dawn Strike (PBAoE): 18.694 KnockBACK (100% chance)

 

Peacebringer Nova Form KB Powers

• Bright Nova Blast (Ranged): 1.869 KnockBACK (10% chance)
• Bright Nova Detonation (Target AoE): 3.739 KnockBACK (50% chance)

 

Peacebringer Dwarf Form KB Powers

• White Dwarf Strike (Melee): 0.67 KnockBACK (30% chance)
• White Dwarf Smite (Melee): 0.67 KnockBACK (30% chance)
• White Dwarf Flare (PBAoE): 0.67 KnockBACK (80% chance)

 

Note that out of 12 powers ... ONLY ONE ... has a 100% chance of dealing Knock* to the affected $Targets.  Everything else is just pure RNGesus prayers that aren't affected by ANYTHING that the Player can do.

 

 

 

So here's the basic idea, which I'm keeping simple for the moment but which could potentially have broader application that just this one test case ... but you'd want to test and proof it first to make sure that it works before making any kind of investment in rolling out similar updates to other archetypes and powersets.  Start small, make sure it WORKS, and then build out from there as needed/reasonable ... amounts to basically this:

 

 

 

See all those % chance modifiers on those powers?

 

Rewrite them ALL as being checks against the @ToHitRoll vs @ToHit stuff that's already happening all the time anyway every time powers get used on $Targets.

• For a 100% chance, write the IF-THEN logic such that if the power HITS ... the effect happens ... every time.
• For an 80% chance, write the IF-THEN logic such that if the power HITS ... the effect only happens if the margin of success on the hit check was by 0.2 or greater (basically an extra +20% more on the d100 dice roll than you need to simply hit your $Target).

... and so on.

 

In other words ... allow ACCURACY slotted into a power to INFLUENCE how likely a "random chance" for an effect (such as Kockup/down/back) will happen.  Bias the math such that if a power has a(n equivalent to) 100% chance to hit a $Target then the % chance for effects in powers stay EXACTLY WHERE THEY HAVE BEEN this whole time ... but if the accuracy slotting in the power "exceeds what is needed" for a 100% chance to hit a $Target then the % chance for effects in powers INCREASE above the baseline chances we see enumerated in places like City of Data.

 

Or to put it more obviously ... Excess Accuracy (beyond what is "needed" for a 100% chance to hit) will "overflow" into increased chances for RNG limited effects (such as Knockup/down/back shown above) to happen to $Target(s).

 

 

 

Want your Knock effects to happen more reliably?  Slot "more" accuracy than you "need" in order to hit 100% of the time (prior to softcap bounding).

 

 

 

And if you can do THAT ... it then becomes possible to work out a variety of "gearing ratios" so as to figure how much "excess accuracy" results in an increased chance for a RNG driven power effect to actually take effect.  That way you can do things like saying that a 50% chance power gets +1% chance for every 2% of accuracy beyond 100% to hit against a $Target ... or an 80% chance power gets +1% chance for every 5% of accuracy beyond 100% chance to hit against a $Target ... that sort of thing.  That way you aren't dealing with a One Size Fits All (whether they like it or not!) style of outcome, and the legacy structure of various powers then acts as a "guide" for how efficient/effective this kind of accuracy overflow into the RNG for effects in powers is on a case by case, power by power basis.

 

Rig things such that the MINIMUM chance for effects to happen is the legacy chances and then simply allow the "maximum" chance for effects to happen be variable with excess accuracy.  Right now, we've got a system in which both the minimum AND maximum chance for these effects is "locked" at a single value for both minimum and maximum with no opportunity for variance.  I'm advocating for keeping the minimums set exactly where they already are, but allowing the maximum to vary depending on how a power is slotted for accuracy.

 

 

 

And THAT is how you take something that's already there, pick it up, re-jigger it slightly ... and wind up with a whole new potential game meta without rewriting the ENTIRE game(!) ... which can then potentially lead to a proliferation (if not explosion!) of possible build strategies, all competing for supremacy and loyalty among your Players.

 

 

 

Keep in mind that this case of Wishful Thinking™ is just an exercise in broad brushstrokes theorycrafting.  Ideally speaking you'd want to have a controlled test case (hence why I suggest Peacebringers) to not only check the math but also test the coding (to make sure something else doesn't BREAK!) which could be written in a relatively short span of time (because Dev Time is a valuable finite resource!) for iterative testing cycles to check solutions and gather Player feedback.  If the experiment works out and proves to be sound, the methodology then becomes something that could be rolled out more broadly to other archetypes/powersets in a controlled way following the same development process so as to incrementally update this part of the game over time rather than trying to do it "all at once" for every power simultaneously.

 

Prove that it works the way you want it to before doing a copy/pasta job elsewhere for everyone.

 

 

 

Thoughts?

Edited February 16, 2020 by Redlynne

[Wavicle]

CoH2

There's really no realistic possibility of our volunteer dev team rewriting and rebalancing the game from the ground up like that.

It's a neat idea.

[RubyRed]

It's an interesting proposition, but it basically changes the entire characteristic of the powers you're referring to. Those added effects have a flat-rng chance to proc specifically because they are a secondary effect of the power, a bonus if you will, and not the main thing that is being checked for accuracy. This isn't that uncommon a thing to do, even in modern games.

It's certainly possible to change them to be more accuracy-like rather than a completely random-chance, but as @Wavicle points out, that would probably require a balance pass on every effected power... I don't know that the benefits (if it is a benefit, I think it's just different) are enough to justify such a sweeping change.

Outside of the secondary effects, are there any powers that use a flat % chance to hit? I can't think of any off the top of my head. If they exist, then maybe powers where the primary effect is completely random could be looked at.

[Wavicle]

I think a much more likely proposition is a new power set that utilizes this mechanic. That could be fun and interesting and doable.

[Saiyajinzoningen]

Wow this is great finally someone who understands. Its totally unfair that KB and the end drain on elec are RNG based. None of the other secondary effects of powers are rng. Fire burn dot reliably, rad reduces defense reliably, darkness does its -tohitdebuff reliably, sonic does negative to resist reliably, cold slows reliably, psychic slows recharge reliably, Beam rifle secondary was recently made MORE reliable so it is possible to increase the chances of KB and End drain effects to being more reliable. I have no idea how this could be accomplished perhaps a new accolade or incarnate? heres an Example:

 

1 get knocked does 1000 times =  badge

                                                                > Accolade "Smackdown" = All smashing attacks now have an additional 30% chance to do 0.67 Knockback to target.

1 knock down foes 1000 times  =  badge

 

This will boost up those attacks that already have a KB modifier and most of those attacks are smashing attacks. Non smashing attacks are not affected and smashing attacks without a knockback modifier will rarely knockback AND when they do it will be knockdown not knockback.

 

the same formula can be used for electric and electric drain powers.

[Redlynne]

8 hours ago, RubyRed said:

It's certainly possible to change them to be more accuracy-like rather than a completely random-chance, but as @Wavicle points out, that would probably require a balance pass on every effected power... I don't know that the benefits (if it is a benefit, I think it's just different) are enough to justify such a sweeping change.

Hence why I suggested using a Start Small And Build Out methodology of testing the proposition in a controlled way on a single archetype for the necessary Proof Of Concept and to nail down exactly who the parsing ought to work (and so on and so forth).  Rather than trying to radically change EVERYTHING AT ONCE ... instead ... simply change TWELVE powers (only 12...) and see how it goes.  If it Works As Intended™ then the dev team will have another tool in the toolkit for applying the same principles more broadly to other powers in other powersets that suffer from "locked" RNG chance effects like this.  The nice thing about this approach in methodology is that you can build a test case (Peacebringers) that is both controlled in terms of edits to the powers database (a mere 12 powers that can be reverted relatively easily if stuff Goes Wrong™) and which can be tested against a WIDE variety of circumstances through gameplay on the Test Server to search for edge cases.

 

10 hours ago, Redlynne said:

Peacebringer Human Form KB Powers

• Gleaming Blast (Ranged): 1.869 KnockBACK (10% chance)
• Radiant Strike (Melee): 2 KnockBACK (60% chance)
• Luminous Detonation (Target AoE): 3.739 KnockBACK (50% chance)
• Incandescent Strike (Melee): 0.67 KnockBACK (80% chance)
• Solar Flare (PBAoE): 4.154 KnockBACK (80% chance)
• Photon Seekers (Pet): 2.077 KnockBACK (50% chance)
• Dawn Strike (PBAoE): 18.694 KnockBACK (100% chance)

 

Peacebringer Nova Form KB Powers

• Bright Nova Blast (Ranged): 1.869 KnockBACK (10% chance)
• Bright Nova Detonation (Target AoE): 3.739 KnockBACK (50% chance)

 

Peacebringer Dwarf Form KB Powers

• White Dwarf Strike (Melee): 0.67 KnockBACK (30% chance)
• White Dwarf Smite (Melee): 0.67 KnockBACK (30% chance)
• White Dwarf Flare (PBAoE): 0.67 KnockBACK (80% chance)

 

Take the Radiant Strike power ... for example.

 

As matters stand, the legacy form of the power does this:

Minimum chance for Knockback: 60%

Maximum chance for Knockback: 60%

 

I'm simply proposing a way to get to doing this for Radiant Strike:

Minimum chance for Knockback: 60%

Maximum chance for Knockback: anywhere from 60-100% depending on accuracy/tohit enhancement to the power

 

That's it.

No other parameters or values of the power change.

Damage doesn't change.

Endurance cost doesn't change.

Recharge time doesn't change.

Animation doesn't change.

Only the proc chance for the secondary effect changes, depending on the entirety of the build, and using data that is automatically generated anyway every time the power is used in order for the power to hit its intended $Target(s) AT ALL in the first place.  All of the parts and pieces are there ... waiting to be used.  All that is needed is the will to make use of them in a creative way to enhance the variability of the game in ways that Players can control/direct through use of their build choices (and accuracy inspiration consumption).  After that, it's just a matter of coming up with a mathematical formula that does the job and implementing it ... for a mere 12 powers to start with ... and test to see if it works out.

 

It's simply taking lemons and making lemonade.

 

8 hours ago, RubyRed said:

It's certainly possible to change them to be more accuracy-like rather than a completely random-chance, but as @Wavicle points out, that would probably require a balance pass on every effected power... I don't know that the benefits (if it is a benefit, I think it's just different) are enough to justify such a sweeping change.

So ... the reason NOT to try this is ... it's TOO GOOD of a change(!) ... and therefore it will HAVE TO BE done to more powers ... so therefore ... slippery slope/don't you DARE even try?

 

The benefits of the change are simply too great ... so don't do it.

The benefits of the change deemed too marginal to be justified ... so don't do it.

 

I'm having a hard time reconciling having both of those conditions being true at the same time, in the same context, since they're mutually contradictory (also known as "having it both ways").  That's not an argument for creative thinking ... it's an argument for paralysis no matter what (see: All Change Is Bad).

 

Then again, this proposal IS a paradigm shift (albeit a marginal one) that would increase the diversity/complexity of power performances in this regard ... hence why I recommend starting with a test case that can be easily managed/controlled and thoroughly tested for soundness of concept before contemplating the value/validity of rolling out the paradigm shift to other archetypes/powersets more broadly on an ongoing/rolling basis over time as resources for such changes (including the will to make them) become available.  Ideally speaking, you'd want to eventually end up in a place where this paradigm shift winds up affecting all powers subject to fixed RNG chances for secondary effects ... but you don't need to change everything all at once all in one go.  Instead, it would be better to roll out such changes over time over multiple patch cycles so as to tackle the problem in manageable chunks that don't upset the apple cart (or worse, break stuff!) while edits are being made and rolled out.  Keep things simple and small enough that you can do each piece of the paradigm update (with high confidence there are no bugs!) on a rolling basis through multiple patch cycles until you get from HERE to THERE.  Every journey begins with a single step (and all that).

 

Establish the pattern.

Test the pattern.

Prove the pattern.

Follow the pattern that has proven itself in the additional cases once it has been tested and proven.

 

It's not THAT hard ...

[Galaxy Brain]

This clearly breaks the SO only meta Redlynne, think of the casuals! 😧

 

+1 for the idea tho, it makes sense and gets rid of tech debt slightly where you already have an RNG roll with degrees of success 

[RubyRed]

2 hours ago, Redlynne said:

It's not THAT hard ...

Sure, you can reduce anything down to "it can be done." It probably isn't hard, in fact. It's definitely time-consuming and tedious though. And for what benefit? Like I said, what you've proposed is different, but I don't see how it makes things better. Dev time is scarce. Personal preference, but I would prefer they prioritize things that actually make ATs and power sets fun to play and close the gap between great powers and "okay" powers. This just doesn't seem like it. Being able to move the needle on a secondary effect from 60% to 100% or whatever just seems incredibly nitpicky.

[Wavicle]

 I think this is actually just a bad idea.

 

Here’s why.

 

In the vast majority of cases abilities that do either KB, CC, or End Drain  do not do good damage or have only a percentage chance to have their affect. There are only a very very few exceptional abilities, like clobber, that have these secondary effects at 100% chance. This is entirely by design. These are some of the most powerful effect in the game. Far more powerful than -to hit or minus defense. If you hit somebody with knock back they’re essentially held for the next couple seconds.

 

I will say again, while this is an interesting idea that could be fun it Requires a wholesale rebalancing of the entire game.

Edited February 16, 2020 by Wavicle

[golstat2003]

2 hours ago, Wavicle said:

 I think this is actually just a bad idea.

 

Here’s why.

 

In the vast majority of cases abilities that do either KB, CC, or End Drain  do not do good damage or have only a percentage chance to have their affect. There are only a very very few exceptional abilities, like clobber, that have these secondary effects at 100% chance. This is entirely by design. These are some of the most powerful effect in the game. Far more powerful than -to hit or minus defense. If you hit somebody with knock back they’re essentially held for the next couple seconds.

 

I will say again, while this is an interesting idea that could be fun it Requires a wholesale rebalancing of the entire game.

QFT. I'd rather have our VOLUNTEER UNPAID (in caps for the people in the back and the rafters) dev team work on . . . just about ANYTHING ELSE. lol

[oedipus_tex]

This is a good theoretical concept and you explained it well. Thanks for taking the time to write it up. I'm unsure on how some of the math particulars work out but I think that's the case with any suggestion. I can definitely see how it would be interesting.

 

One very interesting side effect; -Defense, which is currently not widely lauded, would be considered very valuable.

 

[Redlynne]

4 minutes ago, oedipus_tex said:

One very interesting side effect; -Defense, which is currently not widely lauded, would be considered very valuable.

It would certainly synergize well with a ToHit margin of success check factoring into the RNG system for whether or not a secondary effect will proc ... which Peacebringers tend to do natively with their powers ...

 

On 2/16/2020 at 11:36 AM, RubyRed said:

It's definitely time-consuming and tedious though.

12 POWERS

If that's your threshold for time consuming and tedious enough to deny support then it's pretty obvious you'll reject ANY developments of any kind for any reason, no matter how meritorious.

Also known as NIMBY-ism in other contexts ... and is related to BANANA-ism and CAVE.

 

On 2/16/2020 at 11:36 AM, RubyRed said:

And for what benefit?

Well ... I've explained the benefit ... more than once.

You just refuse to lend any credence to the possibility that there might be any benefit at all ... for anyone.

Kind of hard to convince someone who is unwilling to be convinced, so let's just leave it there ... since other people don't seem to have the same problem you're having with grasping the concept(s) involved.

 

On 2/16/2020 at 3:08 PM, Wavicle said:

I will say again, while this is an interesting idea that could be fun it Requires a wholesale rebalancing of the entire game.

REQUIRES is vastly overstating the case to a rather wild degree.

MAKES POSSIBLE a rebalancing of a number powers ... sure ... but the number of those powers is decidedly in the superminority of available powers.

Furthermore, just because the concept can potentially be applied to other groups/types of powers doesn't mean it SHOULD (or even MUST) be proliferated to those other powers (blindly?).  Any additional proliferation of the concept to other powers would (and I'd argue, should!) be done on a case by case basis after careful consideration and testing.

 

I mean, the absolute Worst Case Scenario™ (and I'm using that term facetiously here) would be if it gets implemented for Peacebringers ... turns out to be WILDLY SUCCESSUL (gasp! shock! horrors!) ... and then everyone and their little brother starts clamoring for the same concept to be proliferated to THEIR preferred powerset(s)!  In other words, the acceptance rate is too high and the community feedback COMPELS the devs to proliferate the idea to other powersets!

 

Yeah ... that would be horrible ...

 

On 2/16/2020 at 5:46 PM, golstat2003 said:

QFT. I'd rather have our VOLUNTEER UNPAID (in caps for the people in the back and the rafters) dev team work on . . . just about ANYTHING ELSE. lol

And this is why we can't have Nice Things™ ... 😞

[MunkiLord]

On 2/16/2020 at 5:46 PM, golstat2003 said:

QFT. I'd rather have our VOLUNTEER UNPAID (in caps for the people in the back and the rafters) dev team work on . . . just about ANYTHING ELSE. lol

Seeing as how you would rather the developers work on something else, you mentioning them being volunteer and unpaid comes across as an attempt at emotional manipulation. You want something else, so be it. The fact they are volunteer is simply a convenient fact for you to throw in there thinking it will garner sympathy. And it might. But it's an extremely manipulative tactic.

[MunkiLord]

I like this idea, sounds interesting. Would give me a reason to finally try really give some time to my Energy Blaster(assuming something like this was made game wide). This is a compelling suggestion to me.

 

I haven't looked much at the numbers, but I would like to throw out that if a change would require multiple respecs on multiple characters to retain current effectiveness, I'd prefer the respec system be rebuilt completely before such a change.

[Redlynne]

16 minutes ago, MunkiLord said:

I haven't looked much at the numbers, but I would like to throw out that if a change would require multiple respecs on multiple characters to retain current effectiveness, I'd prefer the respec system be rebuilt completely before such a change.

Simple answer ...

Current proc chances remain the minimum ... while maximum proc chances are allowed to drift upwards towards 100% depending on slotting (for accuracy, using this proposal's format).

 

Results:

Either no change or an improvement on proc chances for secondary effects that are RNG dependent.

[golstat2003]

40 minutes ago, MunkiLord said:

Seeing as how you would rather the developers work on something else, you mentioning them being volunteer and unpaid comes across as an attempt at emotional manipulation. You want something else, so be it. The fact they are volunteer is simply a convenient fact for you to throw in there thinking it will garner sympathy. And it might. But it's an extremely manipulative tactic.

Was not meant as emotional. It was meant as a fact. They have limited time to work on this as volunteers. It is not their primary profession. So every choice they make to work on something for Homecoming is an opportunity cost to not be able to work on something else. So when I say I would rather they work on something else, I literally mean that in terms that this suggestion we're discussing should never be a priority, IMO.

 

The amount of time this would take for very limited return on investment, would knock the time out for other more important requests and suggestions. Just like every other suggestion, others are allowed to point that out.

Edited February 18, 2020 by golstat2003

[Redlynne]

3 minutes ago, golstat2003 said:

They have limited time to work on this as volunteers. It is not their primary profession. So every choice they make to work on something for Homecoming is an opportunity cost to not be able to work on something else.

 

On 2/15/2020 at 10:41 PM, Redlynne said:

Ideally speaking you'd want to have a controlled test case (hence why I suggest Peacebringers) to not only check the math but also test the coding (to make sure something else doesn't BREAK!) which could be written in a relatively short span of time (because Dev Time is a valuable finite resource!) for iterative testing cycles to check solutions and gather Player feedback.  If the experiment works out and proves to be sound, the methodology then becomes something that could be rolled out more broadly to other archetypes/powersets in a controlled way following the same development process so as to incrementally update this part of the game over time rather than trying to do it "all at once" for every power simultaneously.

12 POWERS ... is "too much of an opportunity cost" for your comfort level.

 

TWELVE ...

 

How about 11?

7?

5?

2?

1?

 

Let me guess ... your answer is going to be ZERO.

And I can infer that because you've basically said so ... TWICE.

[golstat2003]

4 minutes ago, Redlynne said:

 

12 POWERS ... is "too much of an opportunity cost" for your comfort level.

 

TWELVE ...

 

How about 11?

7?

5?

2?

1?

 

Let me guess ... your answer is going to be ZERO.

And I can infer that because you've basically said so ... TWICE.

I just don't see the value in the suggestion versus all the other things that have been suggested that would take powers, testing and implementation time. Doesn't mean it's a bad one. If this were still a live paid mmo, sure. To be fair you did put "wishful thinking" in the title.

 

To be clear, suggestions that basically re-write parts of the game, I never found to be all that compelling.

 

Suggests for further powersets, ATs, storylines, incarnate powers . . . sure.

Edited February 18, 2020 by golstat2003

[MunkiLord]

56 minutes ago, golstat2003 said:

Was not meant as emotional. It was meant as a fact. They have limited time to work on this as volunteers. It is not their primary profession. So every choice they make to work on something for Homecoming is an opportunity cost to not be able to work on something else. So when I say I would rather they work on something else, I literally mean that in terms that this suggestion we're discussing should never be a priority, IMO.

 

The amount of time this would take for very limited return on investment, would knock the time out for other more important requests and suggestions. Just like every other suggestion, others are allowed to point that out.

Fair enough, looks like I read too much into your comment. My apolgies.

[Saiyajinzoningen]

7 hours ago, golstat2003 said:

Was not meant as emotional. It was meant as a fact. They have limited time to work on this as volunteers. It is not their primary profession. So every choice they make to work on something for Homecoming is an opportunity cost to not be able to work on something else. So when I say I would rather they work on something else, I literally mean that in terms that this suggestion we're discussing should never be a priority, IMO.

 

The amount of time this would take for very limited return on investment, would knock the time out for other more important requests and suggestions. Just like every other suggestion, others are allowed to point that out.

give it up man i suggested the same thing in a thread where the op wanted to remove all translucency from stealth and i got swarmed. Personally i feel your response is warranted @golstat2003

[Chrome]

For the record i love the idea as proposed.

the problem i have with arguments against this change ,and any other that is not "universally" wanted, is that while its is fact that our dev team is all volunteer,this does not mean that a change like this going to take time away from new ATs or new powersets.  It just  means that this will take time to do.  I have always hated the guys that say, "im a programmer i know this is too difficult to do", because i said so.  

 

maybe this is a rationalization defense mechanism to the idea that dev x didnt input my amazing idea. it must be too hard. therefore anything that is not my amazing idea is, either super easy to implement and fine, or way harder than my awesome idea and should in no way be done because my super amazing awesome idea did not get done.  assumed difficulty of the different idea is based on a sliding scale with regards to how much i like or dislike the idea.

 

i am not arguing that they dont have limited time and, i am not arguing that nobody should disagree with ideas however, let's remove the argument "they should do something else because i dont like it and something else is better(maybe my super awesome idea)because they have limited time".  

 

I don't claim to know what our homecoming devs are alloting for time for our beloved CoH inbetween real life and managing this wonderful place, however i am 100%% sure that ONLY they can say if they have time for certain ideas, if they like the ideas, or if they think the ideas are super amazing awesome. 

 

I will say this, since the snipe changes that originally were accuracy based to now insta snipe in combat, a change like this is certainly possible if not MORE likely than say adding ENTIRE powersets, only because homecoming devs have historically{since april 2019) done small changes such as tanker changes.   while it was a strong improvement to the tanker, it did not OMGCHANGETHEWHOLEGAME.

 

sorry for my rant, just had to get it out ignore if you want.

 

 

[Wild Claw]

My personal opinion: I like the concept of tying previously 'just random' effects to the initial tohit (or whatever) roll.  It's a function I like to use when playing tabletop games, to make the initial roll mean something more than just the binary hit/no hit. You hit really well? You get better or more interesting effects. 

 

Whether that's something easy to implement given the state of the game? Dunno, I haven't looked at the code yet. I'm avoiding doing so.... but in any case, I like the base concept.

[Wavicle]

2 hours ago, Chrome said:

this does not mean that a change like this going to take time away from new ATs or new powersets.

 

Yes, absolutely it does. I’m not gonna take time to argue this to explain it to you because it’s plainly obvious.

 

“ it did not OMGCHANGETHEWHOLEGAME”

 

I don’t think you really understand the relative significance of the changes being discussed.

[Chrome]

that is the point it does not take any time away from anything, you HAVE no idea what time they have or want to put towards new power sets or anything else for that matter you can only verifiably say that any suggestion will take time. 

 

in your world you believe that the developers are right now using every available amount of time to do your amazing new powerset idea, or one you agree with at any rate, and you also believe that you personally know exactly what it will take to do both ideas.  Unless you ARE a homecoming dev, you have no CLUE what takes any time away from anything else.  

 

put simply we can guess that these guys are super busy working on supernew powerset that will change everything RIGHT NOW and any other idea is taking time away from this powerset.  this is just a guess that has ZERO basis in fact.  the FACT is we have no idea what they want, where they are headed or there plan for the game in the future. so the idea that this idea will take time away from anything but their personal lives is actually wrong.

 

and the Tanker changes did literally nothing except slightly buff tankers to a more equal footing with brutes and give them a slight advantage with some AOE powers, this didn't change the game to where everyone is now saying brutes are useless now, it just gave people a reason to bring tankers.  nothing amazing or world shattering at least not to me, more of a "well it's about time".

 

i do value the changes and i was happy to see how the discussion and changes of the tankers evolved, but it wasnt enough for me to say woo this is AMAZING!  of course that part is subjective.

 

either way if they come out and say they are actively working on a new AT or powerset instead of the pet customization changes that we last heard about then, i stand by what i said.

[Wavicle]

3 minutes ago, Chrome said:

Unless you ARE a homecoming dev, you have no CLUE what takes any time away from anything else.  

 

This statement applies to you. You have no clue what takes any time away from anything else and none of your statements about it need be taken with any seriousness at all because of that fact.

Edited February 18, 2020 by Wavicle