Focused Feedback: Electrical Affinity - Powers (Release Candidates)

[Coyote]

1 hour ago, Bopper said:

Actually, it doesnt even do that. It does enhance defense debuffs though. And DDR (if the toon has it). Mostly it's a single target recharge buff that does provide a chance at KD (havent tested) and like you said, greatly enhances a players secondary effects. Probably nice to use on a fellow support character. A shame it isn't a chain power. 100% effect on target, 75% effect on 2nd jump, and 50% effect on the rest.

 

So... it doesn't boost Jack Frost's S/L defense? Or the Maneuvers/Tactics from Enforcers?

[Bopper]

Just now, Coyote said:

 

So... it doesn't boost Jack Frost's S/L defense? Or the Maneuvers/Tactics from Enforcers?

It doesnt boost defense. Never did. The tooltip was a typo and I think it's fixed now.

[Wavicle]

I haven't tested Amp Up yet.

I would suggest that to make it really worthwhile (sans chaining) the "causing all of their abilities to unleash chained bolts of electricity at nearby foes. These bolts drain a small amount of endurance and have a chance to knock up the target" part of the ability needs to be really effective.

[Jimmy]

4 hours ago, Sir Myshkin said:

I had some initial concerns with this as well because, visually, it felt pretty tiny, but the radius lists 25' and that is in line with all the other protection bubbles. I wanted to demonstrate that, and double check something else. Since I'm personally not sure who to point towards this specific request, I'll just page @Jimmy on this one because we need an adjustment to the graphic visual of Faraday Cage.

 

I dropped a thumbtack on the map and set myself exactly on the marker 0', popped Faraday Cage, then moved 25 from that center point. Pointing out that the area of effect exceeds the actual visual animation for the cage. This explains why I felt it was too small after having played all three sets of Force Fields, Sonic, and Traps. There's 2 feet between where the buff stops, and when I'm actually "inside" (half inside, half outside) the Cage electrical swirl. So we're talking a visual difference of 4 total feet in its diameter. We could probably loose a bit of the glow as well to help define "in" and "out" more clearly. I hadn't thought to more specifically verify this when I brought it up last week, so here we are.

 

validation with the attribute window, outside the visual cage:

 

and one to validate it does stop at 26':

 

 

Thanks for the thorough report! As we're very close to hitting live we'll likely resolve this in the first patch after page 5 🙂

[WindDemon21]

8 minutes ago, Jimmy said:

I dropped a thumbtack on the map and set myself exactly on the marker 0', popped Faraday Cage, then moved 25 from that center point. Pointing out that the area of effect exceeds the actual visual animation for the cage. This explains why I felt it was too small after having played all three sets of Force Fields, Sonic, and Traps. There's 2 feet between where the buff stops, and when I'm actually "inside" (half inside, half outside) the Cage electrical swirl. So we're talking a visual difference of 4 total feet in its diameter. We could probably loose a bit of the glow as well to help define "in" and "out" more clearly. I hadn't thought to more specifically verify this when I brought it up last week, so here we are.

This is how almost all aura toggles work though if you'll notice. Arctic air, hotfeet, steamy mist, even healing auras. They all affect slightly outside of their actual animation by a few feet.

 

By that picture is faraday placing a location power and isn't a pbaoe click buff?

[Bopper]

16 minutes ago, WindDemon21 said:

This is how almost all aura toggles work though if you'll notice. Arctic air, hotfeet, steamy mist, even healing auras. They all affect slightly outside of their actual animation by a few feet.

 

By that picture is faraday placing a location power and isn't a pbaoe click buff?

You should get on Beta and test it out. Lots of interesting aspects of it. It is a PBAoE location power, so where ever you are (even in the air), if you cast faraday cage, it sits there, as a 25 foot radius Sphere.  You can move out of it and you can move into it, if you're within its radius, you'll be buffed.

[WindDemon21]

Just now, Bopper said:

You should get on Beta and test it out. Lots of interesting aspects of it. It is a PBAoE location power, so where ever you are (even in the air), if you cast faraday cage, it sits there, as a 25 foot radius Sphere.  You can move out of it and you can move into it, if you're within its radius, you'll be buffed.

Dang was hoping it was a click buff like farsight. Well people are crazy then if they think it shouldn't be usable while mezzed and have an issue with the rech/duration.

[Bopper]

18 minutes ago, WindDemon21 said:

Dang was hoping it was a click buff like farsight. Well people are crazy then if they think it shouldn't be usable while mezzed and have an issue with the rech/duration.

Another thing of note, it's not stackable, when you cast a new Faraday's Cage, it makes the old one disappear and the new one to be positioned where you're located. The low recharge is meant to address the frequent movement a team will do, so allowing you to replace it whereever you go. It is very power (the duration, the quick recharge, the resistance buffs and breakout ability), but there is a tax to having to reapply it whereever you go. Some of that tax is alleviated to the effects lasting 5 seconds, so you can fly out of the cage for 5 seconds then place it again without loss of protection.

[JayboH]

I assume it is stackable from different casters though, which should give nice resists.

[oedipus_tex]

Amp Up isn't an amazing T9 but that's fine because of the rest of the set is very good. 

 

Mainly you'd want to use Amp Up on your team's Defender or Controller, depending on what sets they took. It's basically extended Power Boost and a Recharge buff. The best effects boosted by POwer Boost tend to be mezz, ToHit, and Endurance Mod. Heal/Absorb also benefits, but not quite as much. So, team mates you'd likely want to use it on:

• Any Control set (especially Dark Control or Electric Control)
• Buff/debuff
  • Empathy / Pain
  • Dark Miasma
  • Time Manip
  • Nature
  • Electric Affinity (tho you can't self cast)
• Blasts
  • Dark Blast
  • Electric Blast

 

Edited March 28, 2020 by oedipus_tex

[WindDemon21]

6 hours ago, Bopper said:

Another thing of note, it's not stackable, when you cast a new Faraday's Cage, it makes the old one disappear and the new one to be positioned where you're located. The low recharge is meant to address the frequent movement a team will do, so allowing you to replace it whereever you go. It is very power (the duration, the quick recharge, the resistance buffs and breakout ability), but there is a tax to having to reapply it whereever you go. Some of that tax is alleviated to the effects lasting 5 seconds, so you can fly out of the cage for 5 seconds then place it again without loss of protection.

Besides not being a toggle (which is one of it's biggest issues) this is just like lifegiving spores which honestly is SUCH a pain moving between mobs and repositioning. I would much rather they make it a click buff or pet like ffgen.

[Bopper]

5 minutes ago, WindDemon21 said:

Besides not being a toggle (which is one of it's biggest issues) this is just like lifegiving spores which honestly is SUCH a pain moving between mobs and repositioning. I would much rather they make it a click buff or pet like ffgen.

To do that would require lowering the stats on faraday's cage. With great power comes a cost. 

[WindDemon21]

24 minutes ago, Bopper said:

To do that would require lowering the stats on faraday's cage. With great power comes a cost. 

Is it not the same damage resistance as sonic dispersion with mez/kb protection? Which not to delve into how all resistance powers should have a higher value tbh since you effectively need double the amount to equal their defense counterparts, and since you're not avoiding the attacks altogether they should really have better status protections too also and end drain/slow resistances. So unless I'm missing something then no I don't think it would be out of line as a click power or pet.

[Wavicle]

Just now, WindDemon21 said:

Is it not the same damage resistance as sonic dispersion with mez/kb protection? Which not to delve into how all resistance powers should have a higher value tbh since you effectively need double the amount to equal their defense counterparts, and since you're not avoiding the attacks altogether they should really have better status protections too also and end drain/slow resistances. So unless I'm missing something then no I don't think it would be out of line as a click power or pet.

Except it would defeat the entire purpose of the power. The trade off is that you have to stay inside it. That’s why it’s called Faraday CAGE.

[Bopper]

12 minutes ago, WindDemon21 said:

Is it not the same damage resistance as sonic dispersion with mez/kb protection? Which not to delve into how all resistance powers should have a higher value tbh since you effectively need double the amount to equal their defense counterparts, and since you're not avoiding the attacks altogether they should really have better status protections too also and end drain/slow resistances. So unless I'm missing something then no I don't think it would be out of line as a click power or pet.

It has more status protection, and protection to more statuses.

 

• Dispersion Bubble provides 15% resistance to everything except psionic damage, Faraday's Cage provides 15% resistance to everything except toxic damage. Winner Faraday's Cage (in my opinion).
• Dispersion Bubble provides mag 8.65 protection to Held, Stunned, and Immobilized. Faraday's Cage provides mag 12.98 protection to Held, Stunned, and Immobilized (50% stronger). Winner Faraday's Cage.
• Dispersion Bubble provides no protection to Immobilize nor Sleep. Faraday's Cage provides mag 12.98 protection to Immobilize and Sleep. Winner Faraday's Cage.
• Dispersion Bubble provides no protection to Knockback/Knockup/Repel. Faraday's Cage provides mag 10 protection to Knockback/Knockup/Repel. Winner Faraday's Cage.
• Dispersion Bubble provides no protection to Teleport. Faraday's Cage provides 100% resistance to teleport. Winner Faraday's Cage.
• Dispersion Bubble provides no resistance to Endurance/Recovery/Recharge. Faraday's Cage provides 30.27% resistance to Endurance/Recovery/Recharge. Winner Faraday's Cage.
• Dispersion Bubble costs 31.2 endurance per minute (before enhancement). Faraday's Cage costs 13 endurance per cast (before enhancement), can last up to 4 minutes. Winner Faraday's Cage (unless you're moving a lot and spamming it).
• Dispersion Bubble is a toggle. Faraday's Cage is a location PBAoE that recharges in 10 seconds (before enhancement). Winner Dispersion Bubble.

Please, feel free to go on Beta to test it out. Look up the numbers. See how it plays. But as you suggested, if it were to become a long duration click power or a pet that follows you around granting the buff (which doesn't fit thematically), it would come at a cost to the above mentioned advantages. Ultimately, the power, along with the power-set, comes at a choice. It doesn't need to be a replica of Sonic Dispersion or a knockoff of Force Field Generator. The fun of having a new set is having new characteristics of similar powers, not carbon copies. This brings new play-styles and gaming mechanics worth exploring. As far as I know, there is no other long duration click power that provides an area of protection at a given location. On top of that, it is stronger than any area of protection power I know of although it comes with obvious limitations (as mentioned above). Like I said earlier, with great power comes a cost. The cost of this power's greatness is the fact you have to reapply it whereever you go. The benefit is having total mez protection where ever you go (ok, no confuse nor fear protection but most of everything else).

[Hjarki]

3 hours ago, oedipus_tex said:

Mainly you'd want to use Amp Up on your team's Defender or Controller, depending on what sets they took. It's basically extended Power Boost and a Recharge buff. The best effects boosted by POwer Boost tend to be mezz, ToHit, and Endurance Mod. Heal/Absorb also benefits, but not quite as much.

Except you're the team's "Defender or Controller".  So you need to have another Defender/Controller to receive the buff - and one whose abilities overlap substantially with your own.

 

Moreover, the buff tends to target the kinds of features that builds design around. At low levels, +recharge is a good ally buff - at higher levels, players tend to have enough recharge to run their rotation and additional recharge does little for them. Likewise, they have enough hit to cap, enough duration on their mezzes and End Mod is a hyper-specialized approach. So I'm having trouble seeing how Amp Up would be useful in anything except a static team where you have a teammate designed around the use of Amp Up.

 

[Xoza]

Out of random curiosity and since I won't be able to get on to test anytime soon. How does the Defibrillate animation and FX look? Does it need improvement? I haven't seen it, so I'm not criticizing, I only imagined while reading it looking like... a charged jump fist smash into the ground next to/on top of an ally and the ground lighting bolt FX from 'Electrical Melee - Lightning Rod' that would reach other allies.

Edited March 28, 2020 by Xoza

[Coyote]

7 hours ago, Hjarki said:

Except you're the team's "Defender or Controller".  So you need to have another Defender/Controller to receive the buff - and one whose abilities overlap substantially with your own.

 

I think the main benefit where it won't overlap with Electric Affinity would be a -ToHit Debuff set. There are some sets whose damage mitigation is based upon this effect, and it's powerful enough to matter where you don't have uber defenses on the team... but those defenses basically render defensive buff sets irrelevant anyhow. On teams where adding more defensive abilities is helpful, there is a reasonable chance that there will be someone with significant -ToHit effects and then AmpUp will be useful.

 

It really should have a more consistent effect with the lightning discharge effect, and that should do damage, so that on a "no need for defense" team this power still helps. But right now, on teams that can use more help defensively, it's likely to be useful. The fact that most end game teams don't need defensive help is a general game problem, and I think that it's reasonable to design buff/debuff sets for teams that still need defense, otherwise everything will just be "how much -Res, +Dam, and maybe -Regen do we get out of this set, and can you get it all out in 5 seconds or less".

[Hjarki]

4 minutes ago, Coyote said:

 

I think the main benefit where it won't overlap with Electric Affinity would be a -ToHit Debuff set. There are some sets whose damage mitigation is based upon this effect, and it's powerful enough to matter where you don't have uber defenses on the team... but those defenses basically render defensive buff sets irrelevant anyhow. On teams where adding more defensive abilities is helpful, there is a reasonable chance that there will be someone with significant -ToHit effects and then AmpUp will be useful.

 

It really should have a more consistent effect with the lightning discharge effect, and that should do damage, so that on a "no need for defense" team this power still helps. But right now, on teams that can use more help defensively, it's likely to be useful. The fact that most end game teams don't need defensive help is a general game problem, and I think that it's reasonable to design buff/debuff sets for teams that still need defense, otherwise everything will just be "how much -Res, +Dam, and maybe -Regen do we get out of this set, and can you get it all out in 5 seconds or less".

I think you're threading an awfully fine needle here. This is a power received at 32 or 38. It requires a party member with a fairly specific build and a situation where that would be useful. Consider your example of to-hit debuffs. These are effects no one increases in the first place because they tend to act in a binary fashion. Either your to-hit buffs tend to completely overwhelm the target's hit or they're resisted into irrelevance. If improving hit debuffs was important, then people playing Dark Control or Dark Blast would do that. The fact that they don't even bother strongly suggests that doing it for them is unlikely to yield much benefit.

 

As a thought experiment, imagine for a moment that we:

• Reduce the recharge to a few seconds
• Make it affect all allies (just not the user) like a standard bubble-type power
• Swap it from the 9th slot to something much lower

Now, ask yourself - would you take this power? For me, it would fall into the 'maybe' category alongside powers like Increase Density.

[Coyote]

20 minutes ago, Hjarki said:

If improving hit debuffs was important, then people playing Dark Control or Dark Blast would do that.

 

You mean, people DON'T slot up Fearsome Stare for ToHitDebuff rather than for Fear? Because I do.

I don't think that this is as niche as you're implying... I think that most characters with major ToHitDebuff powers will generally put 4 Dark Watchers in them, or maybe 4-6 Cloud Senses. Hurricane is a probably exception, but mostly because it's SO strong without slotting... but Radiation Infection, Darkest Night, etc, are strong enough to be useful but not so overwhelming that they can't use slotting up, especially against +4 opponents.

 

I would certainly take the power if it affected the character, even with a weaker chaining effect. Getting improvements on Heal, Absorb, and End Drain would be useful for Electric Affinity. Several other sets would benefit from getting improvement on -ToHit. Some sets wouldn't get much, and ... I think it's bad that a Tier 9 power is situational rather than almost always useful. But I don't think that the "situational" means 10% of the time, and I think that you think it's less. If I made a character oriented on teaming, I would consider this power "useful but not mandatory", and would see if I have room for it at 47 or 49. That's a problem, because you should look forward to your Tier 9 at either 32 or 38, but it's not a case where I'd almost never take the power... it has enough use to be competitive with the last couple of powers that you're picking up.

[Verathyn]

Just out of curiosity, have many people made actual builds with this set yet? I have made a few end game IO controller builds and played them on beta(in limited fashion due to no team members). I noticed in my builds that I usually ended up skipping Energizing Circuit and Amp Up. I also think Amp Up is rather situational as a T9. However we are at the release candidate phase, and I think the set plays well and more testing in team situations (8, 16, 24 players) is required in order to give better feedback so looking forward to this being released.

[Wavicle]

8 hours ago, Hjarki said:

Except you're the team's "Defender or Controller".  So you need to have another Defender/Controller to receive the buff - and one whose abilities overlap substantially with your own.

 

Moreover, the buff tends to target the kinds of features that builds design around. At low levels, +recharge is a good ally buff - at higher levels, players tend to have enough recharge to run their rotation and additional recharge does little for them. Likewise, they have enough hit to cap, enough duration on their mezzes and End Mod is a hyper-specialized approach. So I'm having trouble seeing how Amp Up would be useful in anything except a static team where you have a teammate designed around the use of Amp Up.

 

The vast majority of teams have more than one Support toon.

[Wavicle]

1 hour ago, Coyote said:

It really should have a more consistent effect with the lightning discharge effect, and that should do damage, 

I assumed it does damage. Yes, it definitely should do damage.

[Bopper]

15 minutes ago, Verathyn said:

Just out of curiosity, have many people made actual builds with this set yet? I have made a few end game IO controller builds and played them on beta(in limited fashion due to no team members). I noticed in my builds that I usually ended up skipping Energizing Circuit and Amp Up. I also think Amp Up is rather situational as a T9. However we are at the release candidate phase, and I think the set plays well and more testing in team situations (8, 16, 24 players) is required in order to give better feedback so looking forward to this being released.

I designed a build early on, but it got wiped. It was a elec/dark defender leveraging the accurate tohit debuff sets for a high recharge/range defense build. If there were two powers to skip, it might be Defib and Amp Up. I would definitely take energizing Circuit in every build. The recharge boost is nice.

[Hjarki]

1 hour ago, Bopper said:

I designed a build early on, but it got wiped. It was a elec/dark defender leveraging the accurate tohit debuff sets for a high recharge/range defense build. If there were two powers to skip, it might be Defib and Amp Up. I would definitely take energizing Circuit in every build. The recharge boost is nice.

I agree that Energizing Circuit is one of the core powers of the set.

 

About the only test character where I found Amp Up useful was Necromancy/Electric.