How to make a build - maths and Mids?

[Coyote]

50 minutes ago, arcaneholocaust said:

I see many people doing exactly what I predicted and promoting soft capped defense across the board. Let me clarify: I have soft capped characters, and I have more offensively powerful characters with ~20% defense. I have zero problems surviving on the latter type in endgame content if I play my character mindfully and appropriately. So please please please take this soft capping trend with a grain of salt and build in a way that works for you.

 

Softcapping Defense is always helpful, but you do have to make build constraints to get it. I would generally try to make a build for softcapping and see how it plays, as it's easier to re-jig the build for more damage by changing some sets to Recharge and some attack powers to use damage-proc IOs, and then see how that version plays. But that doesn't mean that I would be sold on playing the softcapped version until I tried both.

[Grouchybeast]

2 hours ago, Mashugana said:

Did I miss any of your favorites like Blessing of Zepher or Karma?🙂

The Kismet +6% To-Hit is usually the first IO I slot.  Pretty much every character will benefit from a boost to Acc at low levels.  It can be slotted from level 7.  Pop it in Combat Jumping or Hover (it needs to go in a power you use, as it's a proc) and enjoy all the many benefits of missing less.

 

Also, if you like to badge, or you fancy speedrunning, then some kind of Stealth is really useful, especially on squishies.  If you want to be able to see your costume most of the time, you can easily slot a Celerity Stealth into one of the Prestige sprints.  (If I have a spare power pick, I'll often pick up the Concealment pool Stealth as well, anyway.  It doesn't need slots to be useful, and it can take a LotG +rech.)

[arcane]

8 minutes ago, Coyote said:

 

Softcapping Defense is always helpful, but you do have to make build constraints to get it. I would generally try to make a build for softcapping and see how it plays, as it's easier to re-jig the build for more damage by changing some sets to Recharge and some attack powers to use damage-proc IOs, and then see how that version plays. But that doesn't mean that I would be sold on playing the softcapped version until I tried both.

Yeah, I guess my starting point is a vague conception of what I want the character to do as well as whether or not I want to commit to any specific pools. Once I’ve decided, for instance, that I want the character to be a total damage proc monster, that’s when other incompatible options get thrown out the window.

I don’t always go one way or the other - I try as many playstyles as possible. Some characters soft capped and loaded up on set bonuses, some procced to the teeth, some built around something else entirely (like using aid self or fold space for a change as opposed to the most popular pools). This also extends to incarnates - I know already that I could make any combo work great with musculature/intuition, degenerative, ageless, assault, etc., but I prefer to explore the other options than to tie myself down to the meta. 

[Doomguide2005]

4 hours ago, Coyote said:

 

Looks good other than this, for the following reasons:

 

1) Most Melee attacks have some Smash or Lethal component to them, so if you soft-cap S/L then you don't really need to worry about Melee.

2) If you're a ranged character and softcap Ranged D, then AoE D is next in importance, because regardless of whether an attack is Smashing, Psionic, or whatever, it will have to go through one of those defenses. Don't worry about S/L unless you're like a Blaster or Dominator and have a mix of melee and ranged attacks.

3) If you do get Ranged D high for a ranged character, it's better to back it up with a Resistance-based armor from the Epic pools, not one of the S/L Defense shields. This is because adding S/L defense against a Ranged attack is superfluous if you already have good Ranged D, but adding some resistance for those attacks that DO hit will be more helpful.

This and usually when I build for defense I'm also thinking about (probably in part because my main was /SR) but I'm also going to consider DDR aka defense debuff resistance.  By going above the soft cap of 45% I can help avoid getting into cascade defense failure.  At 45% your chance to be hit is bottomed out ~ 1 in 20 until the first defense debuff.  I'll shoot for more defense as a cushion against that first debuff to keep the next hit still at ~ 1 in 20 and therefore roughly the chance to initiate cascade failure is ~ 1 in 400.  This not only makes it less likely for 2 blows to start things going south but makes it even less likely for the 3rd hit to occur before the first debuff has worn off slowing the process further, in turn giving you time to pop an inspire or just plain withdraw around the corner etc..   How much of a defense buffer you need will depend on how much DDR you have and how readily you can spare the slots and/or power choices to get to that buffer.  My /SR will be only barely over 45, whereas a character with no or minimal DDR I might try for 50 or 52 to buffer against debuffs and be more likely to preemptively use inspires to ensure the overcap is sufficient.

[Saikochoro]

I have my own style for building my toons. They fulfill the way I like to play so they aren’t universal truths. I have no problem sharing builds and explaining why I build things the way I do. 
 

That said, I will give some general guidelines that have worked well for me:

 

-Endurance management. I take care of this first and foremost. I take care of it before defense, resist, rech, extra damage, you name it. If I don’t have any endurance, then I can’t play the character. So I usually slot miracle + rec and performance shifter + end as soon as possible. More if my consumption rate calls for it. I know ageless takes care of endurance, but I don’t want to wait until I’m an incarnated 50, before I can stop chugging blue inspirations. 
 

-Fill out main attacks: I then make sure my go-to attacks (not necessarily all) are slotted up so they are as effective as possible as I level. 
 

-acceptable mitigation. Whether this be through defense, resists, absorbs, healing, or cc I build up my mitigation to an acceptable level and then move on. I fill in my remaining mitigation after I work out other priorities. The reason I say “acceptable level” is because the threshold is different for every character and it is fulfilled by different means. I get myself to the point where I am not face planting every mission and then call it good for the time being. 
 

-recharge. Once I have decent recovery and I’m not face planting I start looking for ways to increase my recharge. Set bonuses, LOTG + rech, and hasten all help. The reason I do this is because global recharge tightens up my attack chain and makes my clickies come back faster. It is one of my priorities, but doesn’t have to be everyone’s. I’m usually in my late 20s to 30s by the time this becomes a focus. 
 

After that I fill in as needed as I level up. I don’t usually build with incarnates in mind, but sometimes I do. If my character is lacking in a particular aspect I shift focus to it. Once I’m level 50, I then do a respec to put in my final build. If I don’t like it, then I rebuild and respec. 
 

If you have specific builds you like guidance on your best bet is to go to the archetype subforum, post your attempted build, and then ask for feedback. Take everything you get as feedback with a grain of salt. 

Edited February 2, 2021 by Saikochoro

[Nemu]

You can play this game without mids, without sets and there are people with a certain mindset that can still find the game fun even without understanding the deeper mechanics with builds/gameplay etc, which isn't really that deep when you compare it to some of the other games out there.

 

The fact that you are asking about mids and numbers means you want more than that. I find that anyone that asks about how to uses mids has a desire to min/max. It's just a matter of degree. So it helps to understand your mindset. Do you want to use it to come up with servicable budget builds or ultra high end builds.

 

Build philosophy is the same no matter what your priorities are. The biggest mistake I see people commit is lack of focus. They spread their set bonuses too thin and slot in ways that don't contribute to their overall goal, if they made one in the first place. The typical priorities are broken into two categories:

 

Offense:

     - Recharge

     - Procs

Defense:

     - Softcap different types of defenses (what type(s) of defense to focus on depends on your powerset and your intended playstyle)

     - Recharge (for certain power sets such as fire armor or regeneration, survival really depends on high recharge )

     - Resists (much more niche, you have to have decent resists from your powersets to build on top of, otherwise not worth heavy investment)

 

A simple example of what not to do when planning a build is something like this:

 

You set up a goal to focus on global recharge:

You then proceed to 6 slot Armageddon into your pbaoe. Armageddon provides a 10% global recharge at 5 slots so what's that 6th slot doing for your primary goal of focusing on recharge? Absolutely nothing.

 

That's one slot you wasted and it might not be a big thing, but then you also proceed to 6 slot Ragnorak, Apocalypse, Hecatomb and Unbreakable Constraint in other powers. All of these purple sets offer the same recharge bonus as Armageddon with the 10% global recharge at 5 slots. So now you wasted 5 slots which could be put into another power for even more recharge bonuses.

 

This is not the kind of game where having a full set provides the maximum benefit. But I see this mind set very often in a lot of the builds posted in the AT forums.

[Grindingsucks]

Quote

This is not the kind of game where having a full set provides the maximum benefit. But I see this mind set very often in a lot of the builds posted in the AT forums.

This is something that I find myself doing regularly, although it's not about expecting to get the best performance out of my character.  Rather, I just have OCD issues with having every enhancement except one in a set.  My character performance does suffer as a result, of course.  

 

It's hard, being neurotic, sometimes.  😁🤷‍♂️

[LiquidBandage]

On 2/1/2021 at 2:35 PM, Mashugana said:

Is there a guide to the numbers I am shooting for when I make a build in Mids?

 

People keep saying to plan my builds in Mids but I have no guidelines.  Are there certain goals you want for all characters (e.g. always get S/L Res to a certain number, always get global recharge to a certain number)?  Are there specific numbers for roles (e.g. melee damage characters want X, Domintors always want Y for Permadom).

First, ask yourself what you want the character to be able to do. Then ask yourself what you want the character to be able to do well. Then ask yourself in what situations your character will play (everything everywhere, solo, just missions, TFs, whatever) and with whom (do you have a regular play group that covers most bases for buffs). Evaluate what dangers you expose yourself to when playing (close in support, pulling, solo, getting hit by AoEs, etc). Then evaluate where you have vulnerabilities and judge where you want to reinforce and skimp. A lot of the answers to those questions will inform what you will want to target for your build.

 

Another thing you should be aware of is your build order (i.e. when you select which powers) for the purposes of exemplaring. 

 

If you build to someone else's defined standards, you will inherit their biases and vulnerabilities (knowingly or unknowingly). 

[Snarky]

1 hour ago, Nemu said:

You can play this game without mids, without sets and there are people with a certain mindset that can still find the game fun even without understanding the deeper mechanics with builds/gameplay etc, which isn't really that deep when you compare it to some of the other games out there.

 

The fact that you are asking about mids and numbers means you want more than that. I find that anyone that asks about how to uses mids has a desire to min/max. It's just a matter of degree. So it helps to understand your mindset. Do you want to use it to come up with servicable budget builds or ultra high end builds.

 

Build philosophy is the same no matter what your priorities are. The biggest mistake I see people commit is lack of focus. They spread their set bonuses too thin and slot in ways that don't contribute to their overall goal, if they made one in the first place. The typical priorities are broken into two categories:

 

Offense:

     - Recharge

     - Procs

Defense:

     - Softcap different types of defenses (what type(s) of defense to focus on depends on your powerset and your intended playstyle)

     - Recharge (for certain power sets such as fire armor or regeneration, survival really depends on high recharge )

     - Resists (much more niche, you have to have decent resists from your powersets to build on top of, otherwise not worth heavy investment)

 

A simple example of what not to do when planning a build is something like this:

 

You set up a goal to focus on global recharge:

You then proceed to 6 slot Armageddon into your pbaoe. Armageddon provides a 10% global recharge at 5 slots so what's that 6th slot doing for your primary goal of focusing on recharge? Absolutely nothing.

 

That's one slot you wasted and it might not be a big thing, but then you also proceed to 6 slot Ragnorak, Apocalypse, Hecatomb and Unbreakable Constraint in other powers. All of these purple sets offer the same recharge bonus as Armageddon with the 10% global recharge at 5 slots. So now you wasted 5 slots which could be put into another power for even more recharge bonuses.

 

This is not the kind of game where having a full set provides the maximum benefit. But I see this mind set very often in a lot of the builds posted in the AT forums.

And this is why I get "pigeon holed" into only wanting to build certain builds / sets.  Because for certain AT/Build/Sets ALL the things just line up.  Once you have experienced it you seek it out again, but...oooooh.  It is rare.  But when you find a build where every set just adds at every bonus you start to slaver and drool, and gibber on the floor.... um.  I mean, it is good.  You like that.

[BelleSorciere]

On 2/1/2021 at 2:35 PM, Mashugana said:

Is there a guide to the numbers I am shooting for when I make a build in Mids?

 

People keep saying to plan my builds in Mids but I have no guidelines.  Are there certain goals you want for all characters (e.g. always get S/L Res to a certain number, always get global recharge to a certain number)?  Are there specific numbers for roles (e.g. melee damage characters want X, Domintors always want Y for Permadom).

 

Thanks for any advice 🙂

I think the only rule you need to keep in mind is that you can only have any given bonus five times before it stops counting.

[Yomo Kimyata]

Also, it will behoove you to know at least a little about how procs work, because they can really change the damage profile on a lot of builds.  Long story short, the longer the recharge, the higher the chance of proccing, but it is significantly more than that and I will let someone else run through that for you.  @macskull  @Bopper I believe have links in their signatures to spreadsheets that can be very useful if you *really* want to know more.

[Mashugana]

Thanks again everyone - I think I have a good starting point now and I can go where i need from here