Guidance please, ?/Claws tanker

[Neiska]

Hello Tankers,

 

I would like to get some imput on my next project, a claws tanker. But I have no idea what armor would pair well with it, as I don't really see any synergies to speak of. And I don't have enough game knowledge yet to know what armor set is good for which activity.

 

My only requirement, is I would very much prefer to have a damage aura. As far as what activities, I would say general purporse. I'll run radios with her, AE missions, ITF's, Trials, etc. Might even try my luck at a GM or two.

 

So with that in mind, I think that leaves - 

Bio-Armor, Dark Armor, Electric Armor, Fiery Aura, and (maybe) Radiation Armor.

 

Here are the Armors, as I understand them with their Pro's and Con's. (But please by all means correct me if I am wrong.)

 

1. Bio - All around strong set, but is a late bloomer. Relies a bit on recharge, but has +absorb, a lot of regen, stances to suit the situation. I think it has a psi hole, but not 100% sure on that. I have run Bio before, and was happy with it. I am not sure how well it would pair with Claws though.

 

2. Dark - Another strong contender, but I have never had a high level one and the set does seem very toggle heavy, which leaves me worrying about endurance issues with the speed of the Claws powerset. 

 

3. Electric Armor - I have never played Electric Armor, but it does seem to have some END perks which is nice. But you don't see many Electric Tankers, which makes me wonder if there is a reason for that. Is it a buggy set? Large resistance holes? Or is it something else?

 

4. Fiery Aura - I have a fire brute already, so this is really my last pick. Not particularly crazy about the set, and I doubt claws would add much to it.

 

5. Radiation Armor - A very solid set, with a cold instead of psi hole. No damage aura though, but does have a debuff aura, and meltdown would help fill the lack of buildup with claws. If the aura was a damage aura, this would be my pick, based on my limited knowledge. 

 

So do any of these pair particularly well with Claws than any of the other sets? Or is there another option I haven't listed here?

 

Thanks bunches in advance.

[StriderIV]

1 hour ago, Neiska said:

Hello Tankers,

 

I would like to get some imput on my next project, a claws tanker. But I have no idea what armor would pair well with it, as I don't really see any synergies to speak of. And I don't have enough game knowledge yet to know what armor set is good for which activity.

 

My only requirement, is I would very much prefer to have a damage aura. As far as what activities, I would say general purporse. I'll run radios with her, AE missions, ITF's, Trials, etc. Might even try my luck at a GM or two.

 

So with that in mind, I think that leaves - 

Bio-Armor, Dark Armor, Electric Armor, Fiery Aura, and (maybe) Radiation Armor.

 

Here are the Armors, as I understand them with their Pro's and Con's. (But please by all means correct me if I am wrong.)

 

1. Bio - All around strong set, but is a late bloomer. Relies a bit on recharge, but has +absorb, a lot of regen, stances to suit the situation. I think it has a psi hole, but not 100% sure on that. I have run Bio before, and was happy with it. I am not sure how well it would pair with Claws though.

 

2. Dark - Another strong contender, but I have never had a high level one and the set does seem very toggle heavy, which leaves me worrying about endurance issues with the speed of the Claws powerset. 

 

3. Electric Armor - I have never played Electric Armor, but it does seem to have some END perks which is nice. But you don't see many Electric Tankers, which makes me wonder if there is a reason for that. Is it a buggy set? Large resistance holes? Or is it something else?

 

4. Fiery Aura - I have a fire brute already, so this is really my last pick. Not particularly crazy about the set, and I doubt claws would add much to it.

 

5. Radiation Armor - A very solid set, with a cold instead of psi hole. No damage aura though, but does have a debuff aura, and meltdown would help fill the lack of buildup with claws. If the aura was a damage aura, this would be my pick, based on my limited knowledge. 

 

So do any of these pair particularly well with Claws than any of the other sets? Or is there another option I haven't listed here?

 

Thanks bunches in advance.

All of these can be AWESOME pairings on a Tanker, and I'm sure you'll have a blast on whatever you roll. That being said, we can look at it through a lends of where some of the pairings MAY be more optimal on another Archetype, and maybe funnel down the options a bit for a Tanker!

Claws/Bio is a combo I feel REALLY shines on a Scrapper, with the extra +dmg Bio gives. @Sovera has spoken about this combo in the past.

 

Claws/Elec (CEBR) is a historically strong combo on Brutes. Many people used to do S/L farms with them! @Infinitum and @Hyperstrike both have amazing builds for this combo floating around the forums.

 

That leaves Dark/Claws, Rad/Claws and Fire/Claws. @Sovera developed the original "Brunker" build with the Fire/Claws combo. It is still very strong, I'm sure.

 

While I don't have either combined with claws, I have a Dark/Staff and a Rad/DB Tanker. Both are amazing. My dark does require Cardiac Alpha in order to deal with endurance, just as a heads up. Rad basically suffers from no endurance issues.

[The_Warpact]

I had a claws/elec broot on live and he could fight forever, claws is an end light set and coupled with elec infinite end...well you get the pic.

[StriderIV]

3 minutes ago, The_Warpact said:

I had a claws/elec broot on live and he could fight forever, claws is an end light set and coupled with elec infinite end...well you get the pic.

Absolutely man, you feel like a blender with this combo 😂 Just feels right on a Brute as well, with the fury just ramping everything up.

[Neiska]

Thank you both! But do those things apply to Tanker as well, or are those at specific? Because I am making a Claws Tanker.

[The_Warpact]

I'd go rad or fire, both are aggressive sets that mesh well with claws.

Edited March 22, 2021 by The_Warpact

[StriderIV]

6 minutes ago, Neiska said:

Thank you both! But do those things apply to Tanker as well, or are those at specific? Because I am making a Claws Tanker.

Absolutely, any of those combos can work on a tanker. I think we were just pointing out some pairs that might be more OPTIMAL on another. I would agree that Dark/, Rad/ and Fire/ paired with claws would be most optimal on a tanker. Credit to Dark/Claws being super Edgelord.

[Hyperstrike]

Here's a preliminary Dark/Claws.

 

Spoiler

This Hero build was built using Mids Reborn 3.0.4.7
https://github.com/Reborn-Team/MidsReborn

Click this DataLink to open the build!

Shadow SNIKT: Level 50 Natural Tanker
Primary Power Set: Dark Armor
Secondary Power Set: Claws
Power Pool: Fighting
Power Pool: Leaping
Power Pool: Speed
Ancillary Pool: Energy Mastery

Hero Profile:
Level 1: Death Shroud -- SprMghoft-Acc/Dmg(A), SprMghoft-Dmg/Rchg(3), SprMghoft-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(3), SprMghoft-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(5), SprMghoft-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(5), SprMghoft-Rchg/Res%(7)
Level 1: Swipe -- SprBlsCol-Acc/Dmg(A), SprBlsCol-Dmg/EndRdx(7), SprBlsCol-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(9), SprBlsCol-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(9), SprBlsCol-Dmg/EndRdx/Acc/Rchg(11), SprBlsCol-Rchg/HoldProc(11)
Level 2: Dark Embrace -- UnbGrd-ResDam(A), UnbGrd-ResDam/EndRdx(13), UnbGrd-Rchg/ResDam(13), UnbGrd-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(15), GldArm-3defTpProc(15), StdPrt-ResKB(17)
Level 4: Slash -- SprGntFis-Acc/Dmg(A), SprGntFis-Dmg/Rchg(21), SprGntFis-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(23), SprGntFis-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(23), SprGntFis-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(25), SprGntFis-Rchg/+Absorb(25)
Level 6: Murky Cloud -- UnbGrd-ResDam(A), UnbGrd-ResDam/EndRdx(27), UnbGrd-Rchg/ResDam(27), UnbGrd-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(29)
Level 8: Obsidian Shield -- UnbGrd-ResDam(A), UnbGrd-ResDam/EndRdx(29), UnbGrd-Rchg/ResDam(31), UnbGrd-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(31)
Level 10: Taunt -- PrfZng-Dam%(A)
Level 12: Dark Regeneration -- Arm-Dmg/Rchg(A), Arm-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(31), Arm-Acc/Rchg(33), Arm-Dmg/EndRdx(33), Arm-Dam%(33)
Level 14: Cloak of Darkness -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A), LucoftheG-Def(34), ShlWal-ResDam/Re TP(34), Rct-ResDam%(34)
Level 16: Spin -- SprAvl-Acc/Dmg(A), SprAvl-Dmg/EndRdx(36), SprAvl-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(36), SprAvl-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(36), SprAvl-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(37), SprAvl-Rchg/KDProc(37)
Level 18: Cloak of Fear -- EndRdx-I(A)
Level 20: Follow Up -- OvrFrc-Acc/Dmg(A), OvrFrc-End/Rech(37), OvrFrc-Acc/Dmg/End(39), OvrFrc-Dmg/End/Rech(39), OvrFrc-Acc/Dmg/End/Rech(39)
Level 22: Kick -- FrcFdb-Rechg%(A)
Level 24: Tough -- UnbGrd-ResDam(A), UnbGrd-ResDam/EndRdx(40), UnbGrd-Rchg/ResDam(40), UnbGrd-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(40)
Level 26: Oppressive Gloom -- PrfZng-Dam%(A)
Level 28: Focus -- SprWntBit-Acc/Dmg(A), SprWntBit-Dmg/Rchg(42), SprWntBit-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(42), SprWntBit-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(42), SprWntBit-Dmg/EndRdx/Acc/Rchg(43), SprWntBit-Rchg/SlowProc(43)
Level 30: Weave -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A), LucoftheG-Def(43)
Level 32: Combat Jumping -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A), LucoftheG-Def(45)
Level 35: Eviscerate -- Erd-Acc/Rchg(A), Erd-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(45), Erd-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(45), ClvBlo-Acc/Dmg(46), ClvBlo-Dmg/EndRdx(46), ClvBlo-Dmg/Rchg(46)
Level 38: Shockwave -- SprFrzBls-Acc/Dmg(A), SprFrzBls-Dmg/EndRdx(48), SprFrzBls-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(48), SprFrzBls-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(48), SprFrzBls-Dmg/EndRdx/Acc/Rchg(50), SprFrzBls-Rchg/ImmobProc(50)
Level 41: Hasten -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(50)
Level 44: Conserve Power -- RechRdx-I(A)
Level 47: Physical Perfection -- PwrTrns-+Heal(A)
Level 49: [Empty]
Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Gauntlet
Level 1: Sprint -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Swift -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Health -- Pnc-Heal/+End(A), NmnCnv-Heal(17), Mrc-Rcvry+(19), Prv-Absorb%(19)
Level 2: Hurdle -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Stamina -- PrfShf-End%(A), PrfShf-EndMod(21)
Level 50: Cardiac Core Paragon
------------

 

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[Neiska]

Hello @Hyperstrike, Thank you!

 

Your build looks great, but one question - your final power slot is empty? Is that open pick, or am i missing something?

[Hyperstrike]

Was gonna put the self-rez in there.  This build is just a "throw together" to try and tick off "huge resist, defense, blah blah blah.

[Hjarki]

Claws is a fairly late-developing set, so it doesn't exemplar very well. However, it has an array of different attacks so it's easily slottable - target AE, melee AE, melee and ranged are all powers you're going to take. It also has an attack you use in both single target and multi-target attack cycles (Follow Up). Lastly, while it's forced to take a bad attack at level 1, this is less of a hindrance because neither of the first two attacks are all that great anyway (so you're not envious of those Brutes/Scrappers/Stalkers who don't have to waste a power pick).

 

My thoughts:

• Bio. This is a generally strong armor set from an offensive standpoint. The combination of hard-cappable S/L resist and relatively high regen makes it a good choice for Tankers. However, dealing with the S/L Defense issue and a lack of DDR can be problematic. It also has only one defense toggle and there are only 3 obvious defense toggles for Tankers (Combat Jumping, Maneuvers, Weave) so you often have a mule a 5th one.
• Dark. Dark is almost purely a resist set, but it has a massive Energy hole that's hard to address.
• Electric. The most pure resist-based approach, it has zero Defensive toggles and a Toxic hole. It's not a bad choice since it amplifies your damage via recharge, but there's no particularly strong synergy.
• Fiery Aura. Fiery is a lot stronger than many give it credit for. While it's tough to make work (outside a Fire farm) on non-Tankers, you can cap most relevant resists as a Tanker and be in a situation similar to Electric above. However, it again has no real synergy.
• Radiation. This is the probably the best pure Tanker set there is with it's broad, comprehensive resists and regen. If you want to build a Tanker's Tanker, this is probably the set to use. But Claws wouldn't be the set you pair with it.

For Claws, some others to consider:

• Invulnerability. This has the defense toggles you need and a nice set of overall defenses, albeit with a Psi hole that makes Rikti and Shadow Shard problematic.
• Super Reflexes. I don't actually like Super Reflexes much because of how narrow it is. But it's very, very good at what it does. Very few enemies can bypass the combination of massive positional defenses and scaling resists - but those enemies slice through you in a heartbeat.
• Willpower. This is a less offensive, more defensive version of Bio - and it shares the problem of defense debuffs due to the weak S/L defense.

That being said, Bio/Claws is arguably one of the best farming specs around. Between the F/C resist on purples and the easily capped F/C defenses, you can easily survive fire farms. Spin does so much damage that you can simply put it on auto-fire and slice apart spawns. If you're actively fighting, you can add Follow Up and the other AE. As long as you have enough targets to feed your high target caps, you can easily out-perform a conventional Brute fire farm build.

[Sovera]

I'm not shy to say we can do most of everything in the game with Fire Armor. On the caveat we accept that incarnates exist and Barrier is a panic button that saves a life. In a world without Barrier I would be much more hard pressed to sing the praises of FA but still inspirations would be there if need be.

 

My own point of view is that if we kill things they don't hurt us back. I have done more durable but that killed more slowly and I died as much on them as on the FA because things lived longer.

 

Dark Armor/Claws, for example, is pretty durable. Dark Regen can be brought down under 10 seconds. Combined with Claws KD in Shockwave you can get a breather for Dark Regen to come back up.

 

But if I had to pick I would say Radiation Armor/Claws. It has more bells, more whistles, more debuff protection.

 

That said I'm definitely on Fire Armor's side. You can cap most of your resistances and soft cap S/L defenses, and Burn does -things- to my libido. As low as Positron you can be melting packs with Burn and Spin.

[Bill Z Bubba]

46 minutes ago, Hjarki said:

Claws is a fairly late-developing set, so it doesn't exemplar very well.

 

Clarification needed on this. A build for claws to maximize it at 50 may not exemplar well to low levels due to shockwave not being available until level 38 (33 exemplared.)

 

Claws itself, however, exemplars wonderfully, and it is, quite frankly, one of the best all arounder sets in the game.

 

I recently took my sr/claws tank to exemplar down to my new warshade's level of 28 doing her missions and got her to 32 because I was able to cruise around at +3/x8 even at lvl 28 thanks to a heavy recharge build with just followup, focus, slash and spin.

Edited March 22, 2021 by Bill Z Bubba

[Bill Z Bubba]

43 minutes ago, Sovera said:

In a world without Barrier I would be much more hard pressed to sing the praises of FA but still inspirations would be there if need be.

 

You love burn above all and you know it! 🙂

[BZRKR]

Seconding Bill-Z-Bubba above, you really owe it to yourself to try Super Reflexes with Claws!

I use my Super Reflexes/ Claws/ Energy Tanker to pull on MSR, do any Task/Strike Force, and generally do anything in-game that I want to.

[Yomo Kimyata]

13 minutes ago, Bill Z Bubba said:

 

You love burn above all and you know it! 🙂

 

[Sovera]

24 minutes ago, Bill Z Bubba said:

 

You love burn above all and you know it! 🙂

 

Don't get me started. Duoed Yin with the same person I did it on the Scrapper and we shaved 20 minutes off it 😄

 

 

1 hour ago, Hjarki said:

Claws is a fairly late-developing set, so it doesn't exemplar very well. However, it has an array of different attacks so it's easily slottable - target AE, melee AE, melee and ranged are all powers you're going to take. It also has an attack you use in both single target and multi-target attack cycles (Follow Up). Lastly, while it's forced to take a bad attack at level 1, this is less of a hindrance because neither of the first two attacks are all that great anyway (so you're not envious of those Brutes/Scrappers/Stalkers who don't have to waste a power pick).

 

Okay, what? Focus comes up at 28, how is this a late bloomer. Just substitute it for Swipe if exemplaring lower than 23. It also only has Shockwave at 38 (33 if exemplared) but Spin is the meat and potatoes of the set where Shockwave does... okay damage, but is more of a nice turbo booster and CC spam. I can honestly say I never considered Claws as a late bloomer.

 

Lets look at Katana whose only skills worth using come at 35 and 38 for a Tanker. What is someone even meant to use lower than 30? DA and a T2? I'm currently leveling StJ and it shaky as well. Rib Cracker comes early at 20 and is all well and good (gorgeous animation too) but then we tickle mobs with the T1 and T2 until 35 and 38.

 

No, hard disagree on Claws.

[DreadShinobi]

Quick question about claws on tankers, is spin the only power that got a radius increase with the inherent changes? Do people use eviscerate at all? I like to backflip, but the dpa isnt all that hot if youre not getting multiple targets, and tanks dont get a crit bonus on eviscerate. Iirc, shockwave was excluded from a radius increase.

 

I've also been thinking about a claws tanker and would definitely go with fiery aura because I believe you can get spin's recharge low enough to come back up during burn animation gapless.

Edited March 22, 2021 by DreadShinobi

[Sovera]

14 minutes ago, DreadShinobi said:

Quick question about claws on tankers, is spin the only power that got a radius increase with the inherent changes? Do people use eviscerate at all? I like to backflip, but the dpa isnt all that hot if youre not getting multiple targets, and tanks dont get a crit bonus on eviscerate. Iirc, shockwave was excluded from a radius increase.

 

I've also been thinking about a claws tanker and would definitely go with fiery aura because I believe you can get spin's recharge low enough to come back up during burn animation gapless.

Some people can bear Eviscerate and use it. I don't remember seeing it did not get the boost but as I don't use nor intended to using I may have skimmed the patch notes. Spin does get the extra radius and Shockwave was excluded, yeah.

 

Not even close about Spin and Burn, sorry. But Spin does recharge a fair bit faster. IF you can squeeze in Shockwave you can make everything faster thanks to the FF proc.

 

Because of Burn and because Shockwave is kinda expensive in endurance I found I didn't mind filling the gaps with ST attacks instead. Minions and alieuts are going to melt from Burn and Spin anyway, and then we have the bosses needing to be killed. So I focus on them while spamming Spin and Burn. They will still die before the boss since both AoEs are pretty damn strong.

Edited March 22, 2021 by Sovera

[StriderIV]

1 hour ago, Sovera said:

I'm not shy to say we can do most of everything in the game with Fire Armor. On the caveat we accept that incarnates exist and Barrier is a panic button that saves a life. In a world without Barrier I would be much more hard pressed to sing the praises of FA but still inspirations would be there if need be.

 

My own point of view is that if we kill things they don't hurt us back. I have done more durable but that killed more slowly and I died as much on them as on the FA because things lived longer.

 

Dark Armor/Claws, for example, is pretty durable. Dark Regen can be brought down under 10 seconds. Combined with Claws KD in Shockwave you can get a breather for Dark Regen to come back up.

 

But if I had to pick I would say Radiation Armor/Claws. It has more bells, more whistles, more debuff protection.

 

That said I'm definitely on Fire Armor's side. You can cap most of your resistances and soft cap S/L defenses, and Burn does -things- to my libido. As low as Positron you can be melting packs with Burn and Spin.

Not to hijack, but I've been playing your Fire/Ice Tanker and it's still *CHEF'S KISS*. Can't wait for the Ice Patch buffs.

[Bill Z Bubba]

16 hours ago, Sovera said:

Some people can bear Eviscerate and use it. I don't remember seeing it did not get the boost but as I don't use nor intended to using I may have skimmed the patch notes. Spin does get the extra radius and Shockwave was excluded, yeah.

 

For MAX ST DPS, eviscerate should be in the single target chain due to its extra chance for crit. I still skip it cuz it's a ridiculously stupid animation.

BAH: I had been drinking. The above statement does NOT apply to Brute/Tank Claws.

Edited March 23, 2021 by Bill Z Bubba

[Neiska]

Thank you everyone for your imput, it is appreciated! Haven't decided yet, still doing theory crafting and such in mids. Am leaning toward Bio or Dark right now.

[StriderIV]

2 minutes ago, Neiska said:

Thank you everyone for your imput, it is appreciated! Haven't decided yet, still doing theory crafting and such in mids. Am leaning toward Bio or Dark right now.

Enjoy man! Don't get discouraged early on with either of those sets. Both blossom later on with proper IO investment, imo.

[SeraphimKensai]

Stone Armor has a damage aura, its getting a huge buff with the rooted changes, and its still unkillable.

[Hjarki]

4 hours ago, Bill Z Bubba said:

Clarification needed on this. A build for claws to maximize it at 50 may not exemplar well to low levels due to shockwave not being available until level 38 (33 exemplared.)

The hardest hitting part of the ST rotation isn't available until level 20. Admittedly, most Tanker secondaries are a bit dysfunctional since the first power for the bulk of the melee sets is trash, but you've still got a big gap to fill even if other sets have a similar gap.