Which ATs or specific power sets are most in need of a review?

[archgemini24]

On 2/27/2022 at 7:32 PM, Cancrusher said:

1 Sentinels

2 Regeneration

3 Kinetic Melee

 

In that order.

 

Certainly, it would really be great if those could at least be addressed before the implementation of any more new material.  JMO.

 

Add HEATs and VEATs to that list either above or below Sentinels, and that list reflects mine. When people have been consistently talking about entire ATs needing love, a look seems warranted. Similar but smaller scale for powersets (Regen and Kinetic Melee). Smaller may not be right, though: Regen seemingly gets a post with considerations for adjustments every other week.

 

That said, I admit to a personal desire for HEATs and Regen to get a review: I am not a big badger, but two of the characters I actually try to run story arcs with are my /Regen Brute and my Peacebringer.

[SaintD]

Oh god I want to build a Crab that doesn't suck. 😭 All it needs in the short term is an animation fix for the ranged arm attacks. They have weird pauses and are inexplicably longer than the rifle. Smooth it out!

Edited March 14, 2022 by SaintD

[Agorazium]

Some of the outdated support sets like Force Field and Sonic Resonance could use new mechanics. I enjoy them, but don’t really see a point in playing an FF toon when I can access Power Boosted Farsight for the same effect plus several other kinds of support/utility. Sonic at the very least needs a change to Liquefy’s recharge which has no business being as long as it is.

[SaintD]

On 3/8/2022 at 9:17 PM, Snarky said:

Sentinel AT.  If you cannot figure out the reason I cannot help you.

 

Super Strength powerset.  As it stands with Rage power SS represents a tiny % of comic book supers with super strength and manic depressive cycles.  Withoit endless examples let is look at Superman.  Class Inv/SS Tank.  When exactly was he raging or having time outs do to depressive cycles?  This set had a nice fix built for it that was killed die to an extremely vocal minority who want to double stack rage and power game.  

What was the nice fix?

 

Since I don't know.

[Snarky]

I never went to Beta.  From what i read Rage would only crash if stacked.  An upfront end cost of 25 was charged.   
 

But those who do stack it crapped their diapers and threw pacifiers around the room because they would still have crash (because they insist in stacking). 
 

Maybe the Beta version was different.   It was thousands of pages of people arguing over a couple small points

 

The Devs ended up abandoning the entire thing 

[Gobbledigook]

4 hours ago, Snarky said:

I never went to Beta.  From what i read Rage would only crash if stacked.  An upfront end cost of 25 was charged.   
 

But those who do stack it crapped their diapers and threw pacifiers around the room because they would still have crash (because they insist in stacking). 
 

Maybe the Beta version was different.   It was thousands of pages of people arguing over a couple small points

 

The Devs ended up abandoning the entire thing 

I wonder how many of those still play the game?

[Funkenstein]

Sonic Blast, easy fix for ST damage :

Port to others AT the Sentinel' Screech damage scale

[TheZag]

Masterminds

 

*numbers*  *numbers*  *numbers*

 

*reasons*  *reasons*

 

[SaintD]

9 hours ago, TheZag said:

Masterminds

 

*numbers*  *numbers*  *numbers*

 

*reasons*  *reasons*

 

Your numbers are wrong and I don't like your reasons! I fight you now! 😠

[Bill Z Bubba]

3 hours ago, SaintD said:

I fight you now! 😠

 

/jumps into the fray and attacks both SaintD and TheZag with Spin.

 

BATTLE!

[Black Zot]

8 hours ago, Bill Z Bubba said:

 

/jumps into the fray and attacks both SaintD and TheZag with Spin.

 

BATTLE!

[aethereal]

2 hours ago, Krimson said:

Sentinels - I don't know. They aren't blasters and I don't think they should be treated as such but, I kind of look at Sentinels as similar to Peacebringers (I have yet to get into Warshade) in that they can be made pretty tough, but then hit like Defenders without the solo bonus. One thought I had was why not lampshade it and give Sentinels the same RES cap as HEATs and VEATs? 

 

Another suggestion I saw was opportunity. Maybe Offensive could let them hit more like Corruptors

 

Sentinels have a ranged damage scalar of 0.95.  Defenders have 0.65.  Corruptors have 0.75.

 

Obviously, Defender and Corruptors have access to buff/debuff sets, and certain of those can result in massive increases in personal damage.  And they have higher AoE caps.  But some people have the impression that Sentinels' base damage is much lower than it actually is.

[DougGraves]

On 3/17/2022 at 9:50 AM, Funkenstein said:

Sonic Blast, easy fix for ST damage :

Port to others AT the Sentinel' Screech damage scale

 

Is sonic blast bad for someone?  For defenders the -Res makes them do great damage with a few hits.

[Bill Z Bubba]

2 hours ago, Krimson said:

I stand corrected but it sure doesn't feel like their damage output is anywhere near my Corrs.

 

Because your Corr is doing 1.5 scale 30% of the time.

[Black Zot]

6 hours ago, aethereal said:

 

Sentinels have a ranged damage scalar of 0.95.  Defenders have 0.65.  Corruptors have 0.75.

 

Obviously, Defender and Corruptors have access to buff/debuff sets, and certain of those can result in massive increases in personal damage.  And they have higher AoE caps.  But some people have the impression that Sentinels' base damage is much lower than it actually is.

 

It's effective damage that matters, not base damage.  Lower target caps and no easy ways to get damage boosts leaves the Sentinel struggling to keep up with Defenders for overall throughput, even if you take the gimped range out of the equation.

[DarknessEternal]

Sentinels are a garbage fire.

[SaintD]

Sentinels have the problem of having not-quite-good-enough damage which perfectly synergises with not-quite-good-enough defensive abilities.

They don't hit hard enough to straight up kill enemies as fast as Scrappers, Brutes, Stalkers, or God forbid, Blasters do. As a result, they inherently have more incoming damage to deal with......and they have to deal with that higher level of incoming damage with the weakest defensive values available in the game.

Blasters have no defensive values because they obliterate everything instantly. Scrappers, Stalkers, and Brutes have average defensive values because they obliterate everything almost instantly. Tankers have utterly absurd defensive values because they will grind every enemy into a finely obliterated paste. Sentinels have the worst defensive values and reduced range because.....they can do less damage than the Scrappers, Brutes and Stalkers at a range that functionally does almost nothing to reduce the incoming damage they have to deal with....?

Wait, what?

Sentinel damage would be a very solid 'OK 😐'....if they had defenses to last the longer fight. Sentinel defenses would be a very solid 'OK 😐' if they were killing off enemies like a Scrapper or Stalker. Instead, 'OK 😐' on both sides synergises into 'Kinda crap 😑'.

[Major_Decoy]

I thought Sentinel power numbers were the same as scrapper numbers, except for maximum health and regeneration cap.

[aethereal]

1 hour ago, Major_Decoy said:

I thought Sentinel power numbers were the same as scrapper numbers, except for maximum health and regeneration cap.

Nope, they're slightly lower.

 

So for example, focused fighting (the first toggle in super reflexes) gives 13.875% melee defense to scrappers and 12.950% to sentinels.

 

(Though I don't think that sentinels have any real durability problems.)

Edited March 19, 2022 by aethereal

[Bill Z Bubba]

6 hours ago, aethereal said:

Nope, they're slightly lower.

 

So for example, focused fighting (the first toggle in super reflexes) gives 13.875% melee defense to scrappers and 12.950% to sentinels.

 

(Though I don't think that sentinels have any real durability problems.)

 

But Sent SR's passive scaling resists go to 80% instead of 60% for the meleers. ... while capping at 75% which makes total sense...

[aethereal]

1 hour ago, Bill Z Bubba said:

 

But Sent SR's passive scaling resists go to 80% instead of 60% for the meleers. ... while capping at 75% which makes total sense...

My guess is that's an oversight.  It's not just SR toggles, sentinel armor values are generally lower than scrappers/stalkers/brutes.

[Alaric2019]

I keep hoping one day COH2 will be a reality and they go away from ATs altogether.

Imagine you pick an Offense :  Melee, Range or Assault. Then you choose your defense :  Armor, Support or Control.

Then go from there.

Being a Tank would just mean you sank more of your enhancements into defense than offense.

Being a DPS cannon would be the opposite. Balance the game so you can build to whatever extreme you want and anywhere in between.

Inherents??  Special IOs or enhancement bonuses.  Don't need ATs if you have robust build options.

 

Sorry... wrong thread. What I really came to say.

 

I really wanted to like Kheldians but just can't. They are fine in a group, but someone like myself that loves to solo a lot, I just cannot handle the weaknesses.

Plus I spend a lot of time making a costume, why in the world should I be forced into a flying squid form or giant crabkin.

My thought.  Nix the Quantums and add options to not display the alien forms. 

 

[Marbing]

On 3/18/2022 at 3:51 PM, Bill Z Bubba said:

 

Because your Corr is doing 1.5 scale 30% of the time.

This is fairly misleading but we have talked on this before. 

Most of a Corruptors theoretical damage is complete overkill / waste. For example: On average a Corruptor and a Defender kill a Leut (for example) in the same number of attacks. Even if that last attack the Corruptor landed was at 1.5 damage scale, it was entirely wasted and in no way helped them kill that target faster than the Defender. The only time that 1.5 damage comes in handy is against hard targets like AV's and GM's and only towards the very end of that fight. (That is if you don't factor in the effect the Defenders better -regen has on time to kill). Now the above example is for solo play, for team play it is slightly different. But, even then Defenders have far better build flexibility to make up for the 15ish% less damage mod and keep things close enough AND their superior buffs/debuffs can often help the team more than the Corruptors slight personal damage boost (but this is subjective and is often debated).

But, alas, I don't want this to turn into a huge thread hijack about Corruptors vs Defenders. Just know that there are a lot of assumptions about Scourge and on paper they look good but in actual play they are only good in SOME situations. 
 

EDIT: This is also assuming you aren't playing a kin or chewing reds to keep you at damage cap. 

Edited March 20, 2022 by Marbing

[Naraka]

20 hours ago, Marbing said:

This is fairly misleading but we have talked on this before. 

Most of a Corruptors theoretical damage is complete overkill / waste. For example: On average a Corruptor and a Defender kill a Leut (for example) in the same number of attacks. Even if that last attack the Corruptor landed was at 1.5 damage scale, it was entirely wasted and in no way helped them kill that target faster than the Defender. The only time that 1.5 damage comes in handy is against hard targets like AV's and GM's and only towards the very end of that fight. (That is if you don't factor in the effect the Defenders better -regen has on time to kill). Now the above example is for solo play, for team play it is slightly different. But, even then Defenders have far better build flexibility to make up for the 15ish% less damage mod and keep things close enough AND their superior buffs/debuffs can often help the team more than the Corruptors slight personal damage boost (but this is subjective and is often debated).

But, alas, I don't want this to turn into a huge thread hijack about Corruptors vs Defenders. Just know that there are a lot of assumptions about Scourge and on paper they look good but in actual play they are only good in SOME situations. 
 

EDIT: This is also assuming you aren't playing a kin or chewing reds to keep you at damage cap. 

If it's a DoT attack, there is less waste.

[Marbing]

48 minutes ago, Naraka said:

If it's a DoT attack, there is less waste.

For a few specific DoT yes but not all