Setting a max level on PUGs

[Greycat]

16 hours ago, Digirium said:

A few misconceptions - a level 50 fully enhanced with set bonuses up the wazoo joining a level 20 PUG those set bonuses mostly evaporate unless the build is set for level 20 (unlikely) and the enhancements scale down to level 20 as well.

 

 

Ehhh... yes, depending on what they're using as far as enhancements. However,  "native" level 20 is going to have few if any powers fully slotted, compared to a 50 - so while those (ignoring purple, PVP, etc.) IOs are scaled down, they still have more. They have 5 levels worth of abilities above that level 20, as well - which can make a huge difference (even before the power-availabliltiy-level changes HC introduced a while back.)  They also have, for instance, a full inspiration tray, versus the... ten? you have at 20. There are a *lot* of things that build up to make that character more effective.

[Snarky]

35 minutes ago, ZemX said:

 

Fair, but I just hopped in game and asked Synapse to help me win an internet argument.  He agreed and promptly exemp'd me to 20.  Here's a couple quick snaps:

Global 1.3x accuracy bonus.  45% acc in my big hitter here.  Is that ED-cap damage?  No, of course not.  Does this make any real difference at level 20?  Not that I've ever been able to tell.  Again, maybe this is a much bigger deal on a Blaster.  I don't know.  I don't play Blasters.  But this situation above looks pretty damned good and it's definitely not what I remember from being actually level 20 with this same tank.  I haven't posted every stat here but I'll just say Resistances on this mostly-resist-based tank look pretty damned good too.  From a purely enhancement scaling perspective, for example, I am losing all of 6% smashing lethal defense in the pic below compared to what it looks like at 50 with ED-capped RES enhancement in the toggles.  And this is more than made up for by the set bonuses.  No SO-slotted 20 rad tank is looking this good for resistances:

 

 

I'm not sure why your experience is so different but your statement about being more effective at real 20?  Not just no.  Hell no.  Not for this character anyway.  Maybe this looks markedly worse at 15.  But it's a clear win for the exemplar at 50 here going down to 20.  It's not even close.  Maybe per punch this is doing less damage, fractionally, but its getting in more punches, managing endurance better, and is WAY sturdier.  Again, it's not even close.

 

Could be you have a different build strategy at 50 and not nearly as many purple set bonuses as I am showing here.  That's definitely making a big difference.  But this matches what the OP is saying about having 50s roll in and own the place on low level teams.  And this is why.  The benefits can easily outweigh the "teeth filing" you are talking about.

 

i do run a lot of blasters the last couple years.  yes, it is everything to a blaster.  

[Doomguide2005]

6 hours ago, Snarky said:

You can hit damage cap at level 5 in a power.  1 acc SO, 3 Dam SO   Generally I use 1 Acc SO, 2 Dam SO, and a P2W dam/rech/proc in powers I use a lot.  This misses a little on natural damage but picks up a proc and rech.  you can do that on 5 powers.  you can always go 1 acc/3dam SO on any power.  How is it hard to sproing off ED cap at low levels?  You.... you arent still using training enhancement are you?

 

Read again or stop trying to due it without some light 😜.  As I suspected you are talking about ED cap damage not the 400% and up AT  damage cap.  And yes the change allowing the lower level character to use SOs is potentially huge equalizer as you drop low. (as in under 15th but all but vanishes as 22nd+ approaches.

[UltraAlt]

On 8/1/2024 at 7:32 PM, MrPengy said:

Some times though, a level 50 maxed out character will join our level 20 radio team. And it kinda sucks the fun out of it.

 

Agreed.

 

On 8/1/2024 at 7:32 PM, MrPengy said:

This is weird to say, but I actually like playing my characters.

 

I do to, and I like them to have a challenge.

 

On 8/1/2024 at 7:32 PM, MrPengy said:

Now I get that I'm running a team, and I can do it any way I damn well please. If I want to run a radio mission where I only invite heroes with a banana theme, that's my choice! But how would you react if some one was forming a team, and not allowing any one over a certain level?

 

I saw the /lfg for it, I would get one of my 150 characters that is around the level of the character running the team and send a tell for an invite.

 

I think I have done it once in the past where I got some heat for it from a level 50. Guess, what happened next?

 

[HINT: look below]

 

[UltraAlt]

17 hours ago, MrPengy said:

was wondering how much power they truly keep. But any time I notice one person really standing out on a mid 20s to low 30s team, it's a level 50. I can understand some degree of being extra skilled with that toon due to time spent with it, but I think there's more to it than that. Or I'm wrong and this is just confirmation bias.

 

No. You are correct.

 

I've run on leveling teams were a level 50,

1) ran through mobs only taking out bosses and whatever might fall to collateral damage to leave the rest behind for the actual team to clean up.

2) ran away from where the team was to destroy everything in their path - solo - until they had cleared out that branch of the mission and then returned to trample what the rest of the team was fighting and rampage to the end of the mission not caring about anyone else on the team.

3) Stay with the team, but destroy mobs completely before teammates can use two powers (or so it seems).

 

17 hours ago, MrPengy said:

Thanks for the replies, all. I think I just feel weird about excluding people. The community in this game is (typically) so friendly and welcoming. Telling people "Nah, you can't come have fun with us" just doesn't sit right.

 

You shouldn't feel weird about it.

Think of how many characters are excluded from content because the character isn't high enough level for the content.

 

But you aren't saying "Nah, you can't come have fun with us", you are basically saying it would ruin our fun to have someone much too high for the content.

 

Think of it like this. There is a pee-wee flag football group and the ask if anyone else wants to join. An NFL linebacker gets a s***eating grin and says he wants in. Then he commences to trample the other team into the ground ... literally ... with steel spikes on.

Is he trying to have "fun" with the other players on the team, or is he trying to prove "what a big man" he is?

 

For me, take that [insert whatever here] to the end-game and stay there with it, and let those that like to level characters have fun in the actual game, because they want to play the game.

 

When someone is recruiting for a lower level team, they are doing that so that they can run that content at their level and have a challenge doing it.

They didn't ask to doorsit or get power leveled; they can ask for that in /lfg and some end-gamer will be more than willing to show how much of an end-gamer they are and power-level them to 50 in farm. Nor did they join any of the many level 50 tip or radio mission teams that seem to do a lot recruiting "any level welcome".

They actually want the challenge of playing at their own level with other characters around their level.

 

End-gamers should respect that, but I know there are many end-gamers that don't.

 

It is aggravating to me that I have to announce that I'm running a leveling TF instead of a speed TF because every end-gamer decides that every TF is a speed TF because they only want the merits.

Even if I announce it while recruiting some end-gamers will try to speed it anyway.

I warn, but I will use the boot, especially if some end-gamer tries to give me grief for leading the team that I spend the time recruiting ... and, no,  you can't have the star because you are level 50.

 

If someone with a level 50 wants to join a leveling team, they have plenty of slots to make a new character.

 

[Scarlet Shocker]

I have a good deal of sympathy with this but I think in many ways, the issue is not with the levels but how easy the game has become over the years.

 

Even on a team of peers, where there is nobody theoretically "better" or higher level it seems a few on the team will just steamroller the mobs at the front leaving others to follow behind cleaning up detritus and otherwise mindlessly button mashing without the need to give thought to their actions.

 

Personally I think it's a massive issue in the game and the gradual erosion of challenge is a potentially fatal flaw in the modern game but I seem to be one of the few voices to even mention it, and even fewer in favour of something of a reset.

 

That said, I'm not a decision maker and I don't play that often these days so I have no doubt the direction of travel will continue

[Snarky]

2 hours ago, UltraAlt said:

 

No. You are correct.

 

I've run on leveling teams were a level 50,

1) ran through mobs only taking out bosses and whatever might fall to collateral damage to leave the rest behind for the actual team to clean up.

2) ran away from where the team was to destroy everything in their path - solo - until they had cleared out that branch of the mission and then returned to trample what the rest of the team was fighting and rampage to the end of the mission not caring about anyone else on the team.

3) Stay with the team, but destroy mobs completely before teammates can use two powers (or so it seems).

 

 

You shouldn't feel weird about it.

Think of how many characters are excluded from content because the character isn't high enough level for the content.

 

But you aren't saying "Nah, you can't come have fun with us", you are basically saying it would ruin our fun to have someone much too high for the content.

 

Think of it like this. There is a pee-wee flag football group and the ask if anyone else wants to join. An NFL linebacker gets a s***eating grin and says he wants in. Then he commences to trample the other team into the ground ... literally ... with steel spikes on.

Is he trying to have "fun" with the other players on the team, or is he trying to prove "what a big man" he is?

 

For me, take that [insert whatever here] to the end-game and stay there with it, and let those that like to level characters have fun in the actual game, because they want to play the game.

 

When someone is recruiting for a lower level team, they are doing that so that they can run that content at their level and have a challenge doing it.

They didn't ask to doorsit or get power leveled; they can ask for that in /lfg and some end-gamer will be more than willing to show how much of an end-gamer they are and power-level them to 50 in farm. Nor did they join any of the many level 50 tip or radio mission teams that seem to do a lot recruiting "any level welcome".

They actually want the challenge of playing at their own level with other characters around their level.

 

End-gamers should respect that, but I know there are many end-gamers that don't.

 

It is aggravating to me that I have to announce that I'm running a leveling TF instead of a speed TF because every end-gamer decides that every TF is a speed TF because they only want the merits.

Even if I announce it while recruiting some end-gamers will try to speed it anyway.

I warn, but I will use the boot, especially if some end-gamer tries to give me grief for leading the team that I spend the time recruiting ... and, no,  you can't have the star because you are level 50.

 

If someone with a level 50 wants to join a leveling team, they have plenty of slots to make a new character.

 

I have run a LOT of PUG task Forces.  multiply my horror stories I post by 20-100.  I would MUCH rather have a native 20 on a Synapse than a exemplared 50.  And I build an alt build specific for level ranges.  The 'natural" 20 hits ED.  The exemplared 50 gets 2 more powers, is not at ED, and has a bunch of global bonuses that generally dont mean much.  Full upholstery and a bitchin stereo system will not win a NASCAR race.  

[Triumphant]

3 hours ago, Snarky said:

I have run a LOT of PUG task Forces.  multiply my horror stories I post by 20-100.  I would MUCH rather have a native 20 on a Synapse than a exemplared 50.  And I build an alt build specific for level ranges.  The 'natural" 20 hits ED.  The exemplared 50 gets 2 more powers, is not at ED, and has a bunch of global bonuses that generally dont mean much.  Full upholstery and a bitchin stereo system will not win a NASCAR race.  

 

The thing is, I'm guessing that a lot of people playing at lvl 20 don't even have any enhancements slotted yet (or if they do, it's just a few random things that have dropped from mobs) and are still learning how to play their character and the game.  Then you get some dude with a fully-slotted incarnate come in there, maybe also rocking accolade powers.  Even with the reduction in bonuses from exemplaring, that incarnate will still be dominating play, killing most of the mobs, causing boredom for the other players if they aren't just there to scoop some xp/levels on the run.

 

The difference here may even be more player experience than mechanical advantage (though I do think there is more of an advantage in playing a well-slotted, exemplared 50 on low lvl teams than perhaps you feel that there is.  I've played both native 20's and exemplared 20's in TF's, so I know from personal experience there is a qualitative difference.  Of course, most of the time, like many players, at lvl 20 I'm still learning my powersets and only have some random enhancements that have dropped slotted into my powers, so maybe that's the thing that causes the actual difference in play? 🤔🤷‍♂️)

 

The above is anecdotal, in the sense that my opinion comes from personal experience in playing examplared 50's on low level teams and playing native low-level toons on teams that have (or are led by) exemplared 50's.  While I do have several 50's that I run successfully at +4/8, I'm no expert on slotting characters (at high or low level) and my successes are mostly the result of working from other players examples, trial and error, or even blind luck. 

[Seed22]

On 8/1/2024 at 6:32 PM, MrPengy said:

Normally when I run a PUG (usually radios or papers, with an occasional arc like the Hollows) I invite characters of all levels. As long as you get a few high enough level toons, most teams can handle content even with some level 1ish heroes who are functionally useless against +2s.

 

Some times though, a level 50 maxed out character will join our level 20 radio team. And it kinda sucks the fun out of it. These level 50s have tons of set bonuses, and tons of slots filled with much better enhancements than I can put in the measly 2-4 slots each power has. This is weird to say, but I actually like playing my characters. When a level 50 maxed out scrapper can solo an entire mob of the +1s I can barely hit, I'm not really playing, I'm just throwing powers into the ether while he murders every thing in sight. It prevents me from getting a feel for my powers, ya know? Like how is that new armor power I just picked up? Dunno, every thing dies before I can get hit. Is this debuff making the enemies powerless against us? Well, they were already powerless against the one guy. Is my control power even worth using? I can't tell, because there's no threat to try it against!

 

Also, some times, I like to struggle. I have fond memories of less than perfect teams biting the dust almost every encounter in Faultline and still pulling out a victory. I can faceroll mobs while barely watching the screen when I hit 50, until then I want to actually fight.

 

Now I get that I'm running a team, and I can do it any way I damn well please. If I want to run a radio mission where I only invite heroes with a banana theme, that's my choice! But how would you react if some one was forming a team, and not allowing any one over a certain level?

I wouldn’t give a shit. I usually form my own teams so I literally wouldn’t even notice them

[Seed22]

On 8/1/2024 at 8:02 PM, Snarky said:

Unless the 50 has a second build dedicated to 20 level…. Their set bonuses and enhancement values probably suck.  
 

do not take my word.  Look it up

They don’t. Its called attuned, fun thing, those.

[Snarky]

2 hours ago, Triumphant said:

 

The thing is, I'm guessing that a lot of people playing at lvl 20 don't even have any enhancements slotted yet (or if they do, it's just a few random things that have dropped from mobs) and are still learning how to play their character and the game.  Then you get some dude with a fully-slotted incarnate come in there, maybe also rocking accolade powers.  Even with the reduction in bonuses from exemplaring, that incarnate will still be dominating play, killing most of the mobs, causing boredom for the other players if they aren't just there to scoop some xp/levels on the run.

 

The difference here may even be more player experience than mechanical advantage (though I do think there is more of an advantage in playing a well-slotted, exemplared 50 on low lvl teams than perhaps you feel that there is.  I've played both native 20's and exemplared 20's in TF's, so I know from personal experience there is a qualitative difference.  Of course, most of the time, like many players, at lvl 20 I'm still learning my powersets and only have some random enhancements that have dropped slotted into my powers, so maybe that's the thing that causes the actual difference in play? 🤔🤷‍♂️)

 

The above is anecdotal, in the sense that my opinion comes from personal experience in playing examplared 50's on low level teams and playing native low-level toons on teams that have (or are led by) exemplared 50's.  While I do have several 50's that I run successfully at +4/8, I'm no expert on slotting characters (at high or low level) and my successes are mostly the result of working from other players examples, trial and error, or even blind luck. 

If “ a lot of people “ dont have enhancement at 20 then any Blaster i run 20/50….10… will seem like god mode.  Maybe the test here is not a level thing, but if you are running “raw dog”

 

also, incarnate powers do not work below 45

[Snarky]

14 minutes ago, Seed22 said:

They don’t. Its called attuned, fun thing, those.

Most builds that are not made specifically for 20 content will lose the majority of their set bonuses.  Attuned or not.  There is a floor to most sets 20+ 25+ and a lot of the best srts are 30+.   A custom built 20 will be rocking winters purples and pvps to get around this.  But these are not sets common (in bulk) on high end builds.  The set bonuses are good, but mostly run sideways to modern build goals.  Again, do. Ot take my word for it.  Open 3 high end builds on the boards at random.  Look at the sets.  Look at the “floor” of the attuned.  It will become clear fast

[PhotriusPyrelus]

10 hours ago, Scarlet Shocker said:

I have a good deal of sympathy with this but I think in many ways, the issue is not with the levels but how easy the game has become over the years.

This is the problem.  The Power Creep is real, and despite the efforts to fight it, the Power Creep has wildly outstripped the Exemplar system.

[Snarky]

1 hour ago, PhotriusPyrelus said:

This is the problem.  The Power Creep is real, and despite the efforts to fight it, the Power Creep has wildly outstripped the Exemplar system.

I can blow the doors off a posi team or stnapse team with a natural 15 for posi or natural 20 for synapse.   This is due to 1) knowledge 2) complete lack of self control.   On a Blaster I just DPS as fast as i can, leaving half the team wondering what just happened and the other half joining in the ROFLSTOMP 

[Seed22]

5 hours ago, Snarky said:

Most builds that are not made specifically for 20 content will lose the majority of their set bonuses.  Attuned or not.  There is a floor to most sets 20+ 25+ and a lot of the best srts are 30+.   A custom built 20 will be rocking winters purples and pvps to get around this.  But these are not sets common (in bulk) on high end builds.  The set bonuses are good, but mostly run sideways to modern build goals.  Again, do. Ot take my word for it.  Open 3 high end builds on the boards at random.  Look at the sets.  Look at the “floor” of the attuned.  It will become clear fast

Oh I don't trust the forums "high end" builds(no offense forumites, though I'm sure some will take it anyway) . Minus Icesphere and the people who I recognize as pretty good/regulars on the discord.

 

Nah I go to discord for the high end builds, or 9/10, build my own.  But yeah I'm sure the forums builds suffer a lot in the 20s, none of mine ever do. Well, none of my newer 50s have ever felt noticeably weaker in exempted content than 50 content barring incarnates ofc, greyed out powers,  and the lack of a travel powers. seriously, I swear I pick em all around the 20s, yet strangely enough, I never have a travel power available. Or rather it feels that way lol.

 

I base my evidence off my dominators, who lean on perma dom a lot. On an exempted 50+ dominator in a team leveled to about 20-25, I have perma dom, so they effectively function as they would at 50 minus of course the missing powers from exempting. Don't get me wrong they're not decimating whole spawns usually like they do at 50, but they didn't lose  a majority of their set bonuses. They have roughly 66% of them. Out of my 104 50s, 13 might lose their bonuses. And that's because they were built in 2019-2020 when I didn't know about attuned IOs.

 

I don't need your word for it, I have direct experience.

 

*Perfect example recently, I just got out of a Virgil Tarikoss on my Marine/Dark. He functioned like he had a majority of his set bonuses, and looking at it, he did. Was he oozing recharge like he does at 50? No. But he had a seemless attack chain, the recharge of brine was almost exactly the same as at 50(I think here it was 17s vs 12s. with ST, it was literally the exact same as 50. 4s.)

 

Also Whitecap was still the monster it was at 50. So didn't lose anything there(admittedly proc bombed, so not going to be affected by exempt anyway)

 

 

Alls to say, attuned doesn't mean you won't lose any sets, you'll probably lose anywhere from 33-60% depending on how low you go(with 60% being in the single digits of levels), but you should retain a majority of your set bonuses. Or, you'll feel relatively the same as you do in the higher levels exempted into the 20s, minus of course recharge and possibly attack chain wise depending on missing powers.

 

Edited August 3 by Seed22

[Ravenplume]

On 8/2/2024 at 10:01 AM, ZemX said:

 

Maybe it's different for other ATs, but my experience exemplaring down my 50 tanker to even as far as 20 is that it still feels stronger than any natural 20.   I can see it being a bigger deal on a Blaster that was enjoying soft-capped defense at 50 losing all that going down to 20 and having their attacks no longer even enhanced to ED cap on damage.   But I would still wonder if all the other benefits outweigh that vs. a natural 20 blaster who is just as fragile but is probably struggling more with endurance or slower recharge on powers than the exemplar.

 

I have to just chime in with a good example...

 

Posi-1 on a 50 exemped down vs on a brand spanking new L8 hero is a whole different experience...altogether...

[ZemX]

13 hours ago, Ravenplume said:

Posi-1 on a 50 exemped down vs on a brand spanking new L8 hero is a whole different experience...altogether...

 

You didn't actually run the task force at level 8 though, did you?  Should have been exemplared to 15.

 

edit: Nevermind... some reason I thought Rule of Three was a signature task force.

Edited August 4 by ZemX

[Erratic1]

On 8/2/2024 at 12:01 PM, ZemX said:

The 50 has all powers fully slotted at least, which means yes, those strengths all get dialed back to 55% but you have more aspects e.g. acc/dmg/end/recharge in each power than any natural 20 has. 

 

Quibble: 67 slots, 24 powers. Full slotting every power would require more than twice as many slots as one gets (and that ignoring inherents--so Stamina).

 

Another thing is that while they have made power acquisition faster, some powers are going to be missing to you at level 20 and an optimized level 50 build may rely on some of those missing powers and have skipped other powers all together.

 

But a person who has optimized for exemplar playing can pull off some incredible feats. 

[ZemX]

39 minutes ago, Erratic1 said:

Quibble: 67 slots, 24 powers. Full slotting every power would require more than twice as many slots as one gets (and that ignoring inherents--so Stamina).

 

Okay, not the best choice of words.  Obviously, having gotten characters to 50, I know you can't six-slot every power and inherent.  I meant the 50's build is complete.  All the slots that were the plan for that build are assigned and filled with with either boosted or attuned IOs.  That's miles apart from the natural 20 who has all of 20 slots to assign, probably no accolades yet, and usually not using IOs with set bonuses yet outside of a few one-slot-wonder procs.

[ivanhedgehog]

19 hours ago, Snarky said:

I can blow the doors off a posi team or stnapse team with a natural 15 for posi or natural 20 for synapse.   This is due to 1) knowledge 2) complete lack of self control.   On a Blaster I just DPS as fast as i can, leaving half the team wondering what just happened and the other half joining in the ROFLSTOMP 

I have to admit...20 years of practice does take the guess work out of the game.  I love playing blasters for the opportunity to let loose with a hail of death.

[UltraAlt]

On 8/3/2024 at 9:42 AM, Triumphant said:

The thing is, I'm guessing that a lot of people playing at lvl 20 don't even have any enhancements slotted yet (or if they do, it's just a few random things that have dropped from mobs) and are still learning how to play their character and the game.

 

I play a lot of leveling content. Let's put this way - I pretty much never play end-game stuff.

 

I'm not the only one that can fully load out my slots including some IO set parts and ATOs by level 20.

There are a good number of us long time denizens of the city that play lower level content because it is more enjoyable to us for each our own reasons.

 

There are new players. And, yes, some of them probably are running around not entirely slotted at level 20.

They are challenged additional because of that, but that doesn't mean that they don't want to fight the content and defeat things instead of watching some level 50 running around "Hulk, smash"-ing everything.

Yes, because they are trying to figure out how to use their powers, and they can't do that if a level 50 is "Hulk, smash"-ing everything.

 

This seems to be clearly what players playing higher level characters - mainly players running level 50 - don't understand about their "party crashing" lower level teams.

 

It is this simple. 

Let other players that want to enjoy playing the leveling content (the game) play the game at that level.

 

I go out of my way to avoid bringing in characters that are much higher than a team. I don't even like to bring in characters that are 10 levels above a team. No way would I bring a character to a team would be 15 or more levels higher than the team, but that's me.

I have plenty of characters to pick from.

 

If it is a matter of a level 50 being bored and just wanting to do something, they have plenty of slots to make low level alts for when they are bored enough with their end-gaming to want to mix in with those that like to run the lower level content at level. Heck, they could even lead a team with their level 50 and see who might want to join them instead of disrupting someone else's team.

[UltraAlt]

On 8/3/2024 at 5:19 AM, Scarlet Shocker said:

I have a good deal of sympathy with this but I think in many ways, the issue is not with the levels but how easy the game has become over the years.

 

So maybe this is the starting point where we need to evaluate what is going on.

 

Incarnate powers can't impact team play below level 45, so there is that.

 

My gut reaction is also that the higher a level you are, the greater the loss of additional levels of power above the level of the team.

So right now you get 5 levels above the content regardless of how many levels you lose for being examplared down.

What if you get exemplar-ed down over 10 levels, that you would only get 4 levels worth above the team activity level?

20 levels? only 3 levels worth above the team activity level?

30 levels? only 2 levels worth above the team activity level?

40 levels? only 1 level worth above the team activity level?

 

I'm assuming this would be very difficult to incorporate into the game.

 

The system is already setup to not allow lower level players into higher level task forces. That isn't there to be a punishment to lower level players.

I'm assuming that the reverse could be done based on the same mechanic.

So, in reverse, it shouldn't be a punishment to ban level 50's from lower level task forces.

I know level 50s would hate it if they couldn't get merits for speed running low level (easier) task forces  .... but maybe level 50's should be barred from being allowed on a task force teams say below level 30. 

And I understand that the reason for additional merits for the lower level task forces when they are WTF is to intentionally funnel level 50s into lower level content.

It isn't funneling if a bunch of level 50's (a supergroup full, for example) speedrun low-level WTF for the merits. It just speed grind for the merits and isn't about inclusion of lower level characters for content enjoyment ... or even for those outside of their supergroup.

 

Limiting the lower level content to those below level 50 does not stop a player from playing lower level content.

A player you can't make many characters, and they don't all have to be 50.

It is entirely a player's choice to only run 50's.

The change would mean if a player wants to run the mid-level content down, the would need to make a non-50 to play that content.

 

The power creep is there in the end-game, and it has trickled down into the game itself.

I might not be the one to figure out how to resolve the issue, but something really needs to be done to thwart what some level 50 players are doing to ruin the enjoyment of players running lower level content.

 

I know I already work to weed out the bad apples from teams.

When it comes down to it, on the lower population servers, there are a lot fewer of them percentage-wise and the higher population servers. And, yes, I am saying that those that behave "that way" tend to flock to the most populated servers ... because it seems to me that is the case. I felt it was like that before the Sunset as well.

[Triumphant]

Quote

 

The power creep is there in the end-game, and it has trickled down into the game itself.

I might not be the one to figure out how to resolve the issue, but something really needs to be done to thwart what some level 50 players are doing to ruin the enjoyment of players running lower level content.

 

I know I already work to weed out the bad apples from teams.

When it comes down to it, on the lower population servers, there are a lot fewer of them percentage-wise and the higher population servers. And, yes, I am saying that those that behave "that way" tend to flock to the most populated servers ... because it seems to me that is the case. I felt it was like that before the Sunset as well.

 

 

Well, I don't actually disagree with you that it creates an imbalance that usually squashes the fun and challenge for the lower level characters.  As I noted, that has really (for the most part) been my experience as well.  When I really think about it, I'd say it's even more noticeable when I've got an incarnate and we're running missions in the mid to upper lvl 40's.  In that scenario, I often actually restrain myself because I realize I'm nuking all the mobs before everyone else can get so much as a hit in and, yes, this is inherently uncool and annoying for the other players trying to enjoy the game at their native level.

 

Really though, (for the time being, at least) I think the solution is primarily to do as the OP suggests and ask for team members not to be above a specific level range, and then to boot anyone that doesn't comply or get the memo.  I don't know what can realistically be done about it, apart from that.  Maybe put in a setting the person running the mission can pick, kind of like hard-mode, except it goes the other way and excludes incarnate lvl characters, and/or characters with "X" number of enhancement sets when you tick the box?

[Ravenplume]

On 8/3/2024 at 9:45 AM, Snarky said:

Most builds that are not made specifically for 20 content will lose the majority of their set bonuses.  Attuned or not.  There is a floor to most sets 20+ 25+ and a lot of the best srts are 30+.   A custom built 20 will be rocking winters purples and pvps to get around this. 

 

Shouldn't that be Winters, ATOs, and PVPs?  Remember, you can't slot an actual purple (aka Ragnarok, Armageddon, etc) until 50.

[Snarky]

5 hours ago, Ravenplume said:

 

Shouldn't that be Winters, ATOs, and PVPs?  Remember, you can't slot an actual purple (aka Ragnarok, Armageddon, etc) until 50.

When you make an exemplar build, say for level 10 stuff you are a 50. You go through a full build out.  Every power (in this case) after 14 is just there for muling globals.  Or set bonuses.  You can put as many purple on as you can fit in active or muled powers.