Open Lettur from Disgruntled Player regarding Plant Control

[Cheli]

On 6/12/2025 at 1:31 PM, Seed22 said:

Exactly this. In early CoV days it was 7 corrs and a brute. Honestly the meta didnt change almost at all despite these balance attempts

 

 

Devs of this game have known for a loooong tiiiime that this issue of CC sets being of limited use in an ultra-optimized group would be a thing. There's a reason Hami has the 'pls bring controller we beg you' mitos. 

[Ukase]

On 6/11/2025 at 2:48 PM, Nayeh said:

And all this while other powersets, like Fire Blast, which is still struggling to keep pace in today’s meta, remain untouched?

Fire blast is struggling to keep pace? Not sure I accept that as truth. 

[Bionic_Flea]

While I cannot deny that we have both negative Nancys and White Knights, I also cannot deny that some things get changed, reverted, and modified during every beta testing period.

[Excraft]

21 hours ago, Captain Fabulous said:

If you genuinely think unhinged rants about proposed power changes are useful in any way shape or form there really isn't much I can say that's going to change your mind.

 

You seem very confused.  This isn't what I said at all.  I made no such claims regarding "unhinged rants" and whether they are or are not useful.

[lemming]

On 6/13/2025 at 12:16 PM, Bionic_Flea said:

Have you ever tried a Caesar salad?  You should!

My wife made a Caeser salad for Jerry Lewis.   Extra garlic and anchovies.    She said, she wouldn't eat it like that, but his choice.

 

Unless it's an allergy or like cilantro, most food comes to the prep.   I can't stand strong anchovies, but a little goes a long way.

 

It's almost like taste is subjective or something.

[golstat2003]

I disagree with the OP. IMO changes are not that bad.

 

And yes it was obvious the nerf hammer was eventually gonna hit plant control lol

Edited Monday at 12:28 AM by golstat2003

[Wavicle]

Nobody likes their characters getting nerfed, but that Plant was overpowered has been plain as day for years. This was just a matter of time. The new version of the set works just fine.

[SSR]

On 6/12/2025 at 3:03 PM, skoryy said:

"Game doomed because you're not doing what I personally want"

 

Again, I've heard this since the dawn of game forums, when my hair was brown and there was a lot more of it.

Okay Grandma lol....   Dismissing feedback as “just what someone wants” doesn’t mean it’s not valid. Passionate communities keep games alive, after all.  But these power changes have been inconsistent... The devs have made changes that nerf powers and try to throw you a + that wasn't something people really asked for.     "Hey this whole power set is getting nerfed... Here is a nice costume piece to make you happy...." (Obviously over exaggeration)  BUT if you want a prime example.... giving you access to the powers at a lower level at a cost of nerfing Fire farms.... Needless changes that a lot of people did not request or want.       I don't agree with somethings posted by @Nayeh But for the most part I feel like their Opinion is valid and I 100% agree on the comment about chasing Nerfs instead of improving things that need improvement like defenders and kinetic melee or any other Super Under performing powerset. (Kinetic Melee)

[SSR]

On 6/13/2025 at 2:22 AM, General Idiot said:

Also? No set should ever be reduced to one or two good powers while the rest are just filler. Any set that is, is an objectively badly designed set and needs to be reworked. No matter how long it's been left in its broken state.

The point is a power set will have its amazing 1 or two powers..... There are plenty of powers that are like that and changing this is like taking what makes plant different and special.... As a matter of fact all powers should be their own special version.  Also it's not like creepers comes back SUPER fast...  It's mainly useful on slow teams with no dmg.... if you take it to speed team it will help some but not be game changing....

[SSR]

On 6/13/2025 at 3:10 AM, JayboH said:

I assume the OP is avoiding discussing the Spore Burst changes on purpose?

You mean the changes that are a net benefit for every control set???? lol why even bring it up 😵‍💫

[Wavicle]

Just now, SSR said:

You mean the changes that are a net benefit for every control set???? lol why even bring it up 😵‍💫

Just because other sets are being helped similarly doesn’t make it irrelevant to a discussion of how well plant works.

[SSR]

On 6/14/2025 at 4:49 AM, ForeverLaxx said:

From my personal experience, it doesn't matter if we tested anything if our opinion is negative regarding the direction of the changes, no matter the form that opinion takes. You and people like you will swoop in, declare we "must not have tested anything" because the assumption is that if testing had been done, we'd see the error in our thinking and come to the obvious conclusion that we're delusional and join the side of the Good And Just and go full steam ahead on all changes while you all pat yourselves on the back for another job well done.

It's why I stopped testing things forever ago and just (mostly) passively observe what's getting broken and where so I can adjust my concept characters accordingly.

 

Just throwing this out there; I'm going back to being a passive observer, but I felt it prudent to point out that far more often than not, "negative feedback" just gets shouted down regardless of context and information provided -- this goes doubly so if said individual refuses to engage with Discord groups.

Well put and you are 100% correct.... Most of these people accusing of the poster of not testing do not even know 100% if they tested or not.... 

[SSR]

8 minutes ago, Wavicle said:

Just because other sets are being helped similarly doesn’t make it irrelevant to a discussion of how well plant works.

It's making everything better across the board lol.  I love this logic of hiding nerfing with false buffs.

[Wavicle]

Just now, SSR said:

It's making everything better across the board lol.  I love this logic of hiding nerfing with false buffs.

I understand why that seems like a logical take, but it’s not.

[JayboH]

42 minutes ago, SSR said:

You mean the changes that are a net benefit for every control set???? lol why even bring it up 😵‍💫

...because someone thinks every control set has sleep????  🤪

[Nayeh]

Hello everyone,

 

Yes. I did already test the changes. Because I actually *play* the game and spend free time either in-game or in real-life doing other things. Not these cesspool forums where your average basement trolls live. I shared my critical opinion of the changes that will dramatically reduce the effectiveness of one of my favorite Control-type characters and provided additional commentary on the repulsive direction the developers have taken. Why? Because this is apparently the only place to actually voice my grievances as an active player that does not regularly browse this forum.

 

Setting aside most of the irrelevant banter many of you trolls have provided. Here is a glimpse of the new reality for Plant Control if these changes take place in regards to the flagship powers. My build was the same across test server and live as a Plant/Martial Dominator.

 

Test: NERFED Dominator

• Visual chaos: Dismal. Where are my plants? They initially spawn very slowly. Fewer targets, more likely to die. They don't hang around and thrash as much.
• Confusion: Power is moderate in impact. Now very unsafe exposure added to the confuse coverage for a power that requires you to be in close-range.
• Damage: Pathetic base damage, less Creepers delivering damage, slower response from Creepers, and Procs are virtually non-existent.

 

 

 

S

 

 

Live: pre-NERF Dominator

• Visual chaos: Aesthetic! Your visual feedback and crunching noises keep you motivated to keep playing City of Heroes. Plant vitality is excellent as they spawn reliably and consistently.
• Confusion: Actually does something useful and impactful. Remember: The developers changed the levels powers become available. Not their fault it's online faster now.
• Damage: Oh nice, something that isn't garbage but still does not outperform Fire Blast. Procs are still relevant.

 

 

Over all, my Tier 8 power Carrion Creepers are no longer iconic. They are consistently late to the party and fall flat. Dealing with this robot enemy type took about 3x more time and effort to defeat compared to my live pre-NERF Dominator under the same circumstances. Who ever played a Controller or Dominator and said "Gee, I wish I had *less* damage and *more* control. smh Nobody! No, a Deep Sleep buff does not make up for the enormous loss in performance. Lack of addressing the base damage of Carrion Creeper is also super lame. This is an unfair cascading nerf! There are tons of powers that can trigger Procs - stop singling out the few powers and address procs as a whole if you hate procs so much. What exactly was wrong with having an option for players to have a respectable damage-control set? Nothing. So stop forcing us to respec our characters every patch cycle!

 

Also, Spirit Tree having a taunt aura is still a very moronic display of game design when looking at the entire set as a whole.

Dear Devs, if these changes go live: Big L.

Thank you for your attention.

 

Edited Tuesday at 06:40 AM by Nayeh

[skoryy]

9 hours ago, SSR said:

Okay Grandma lol....   Dismissing feedback as “just what someone wants” doesn’t mean it’s not valid.

 

If you're gonna come in here dooming because of a nerf, I'm gonna dismiss you easily.  Just as I'm dismissing anything you say.  Bye now.

[arcane]

7 hours ago, Nayeh said:

Hello everyone,

 

Yes. I did already test the changes. Because I actually *play* the game and spend free time either in-game or in real-life doing other things. Not these cesspool forums where your average basement trolls live. I shared my critical opinion of the changes that will dramatically reduce the effectiveness of one of my favorite Control-type characters and provided additional commentary on the repulsive direction the developers have taken. Why? Because this is apparently the only place to actually voice my grievances as an active player that does not regularly browse this forum.

 

Setting aside most of the irrelevant banter many of you trolls have provided. Here is a glimpse of the new reality for Plant Control if these changes take place in regards to the flagship powers. My build was the same across test server and live as a Plant/Martial Dominator.

 

Test: NERFED Dominator

• Visual chaos: Dismal. Where are my plants? They initially spawn very slowly. Fewer targets, more likely to die. They don't hang around and thrash as much.
• Confusion: Power is moderate in impact. Now very unsafe exposure added to the confuse coverage for a power that requires you to be in close-range.
• Damage: Pathetic base damage, less Creepers delivering damage, slower response from Creepers, and Procs are virtually non-existent.

 

 

 

S

 

 

Live: pre-NERF Dominator

• Visual chaos: Aesthetic! Your visual feedback and crunching noises keep you motivated to keep playing City of Heroes. Plant vitality is excellent as they spawn reliably and consistently.
• Confusion: Actually does something useful and impactful. Remember: The developers changed the levels powers become available. Not their fault it's online faster now.
• Damage: Oh nice, something that isn't garbage but still does not outperform Fire Blast. Procs are still relevant.

 

 

Over all, my Tier 8 power Carrion Creepers are no longer iconic. They are consistently late to the party and fall flat. Dealing with this robot enemy type took about 3x more time and effort to defeat compared to my live pre-NERF Dominator under the same circumstances. Who ever played a Controller or Dominator and said "Gee, I wish I had *less* damage and *more* control. smh Nobody! No, a Deep Sleep buff does not make up for the enormous loss in performance. Lack of addressing the base damage of Carrion Creeper is also super lame. This is an unfair cascading nerf! There are tons of powers that can trigger Procs - stop singling out the few powers and address procs as a whole if you hate procs so much. What exactly was wrong with having an option for players to have a respectable damage-control set? Nothing. So stop forcing us to respec our characters every patch cycle!

 

Also, Spirit Tree having a taunt aura is still a very moronic display of game design when looking at the entire set as a whole.

Dear Devs, if these changes go live: Big L.

Thank you for your attention.

 

Your test results don’t mention the impact on gameplay of the Spore Burst buff, the Spirit Tree buff, or the Vines buff. They also imply that Seeds is somehow unsafe even though the target cap was returned to normal. I urge you to do more thorough testing 😁

 

We hear ya on respecs though. So many to do. What I did this time was I started preparing resources for the changes as soon as the patch went to open beta, and now I’m ready to roll! Give it a try next patch.

Edited Tuesday at 12:43 PM by arcane