If you could radically overhaul 1 thing....

[Troo]

32 minutes ago, Twisted Toon said:

They do try to instill some sense into the game.

 

The character models don't have three arms.

That's why you don't see shield defense available with Staff, Dual Blades, or Titan Weapons. (and similar power-sets)

 

So you want to add a 3rd arm body type?.. that's a super cool idea. 😀

[Luminara]

3 hours ago, Shadeknight said:

Shitpost answer aside: I'd overhaul Staff so I could make Staff Fighting / Shield Defense.

 

Use some of the staff animations, pull some animations from the Cimerorans, BAM!  Spear Fighting.

 

I'd do unwholesome things for a spear.

[Frostbiter]

8 minutes ago, Luminara said:

 

Use some of the staff animations, pull some animations from the Cimerorans, BAM!  Spear Fighting.

 

I'd do unwholesome things for a spear.

[Coyotedancer]

7 hours ago, Twisted Toon said:

They do try to instill some sense into the game.

 

The character models don't have three arms.

That's why you don't see shield defense available with Staff, Dual Blades, or Titan Weapons. (and similar power-sets)

 

If you can alter animations to make KinMelee work with a shield (Which you can. Mr. CD runs a Kin/Shield Brute that's mildly scary), it shouldn;t be TOO much of a stretch to get Staff or Titan to work. DB would be silly, though. You're right about that one.

[Hexquisite]

Just now, Coyotedancer said:

If you can alter animations to make KinMelee work with a shield (Which you can. Mr. CD runs a Kin/Shield Brute that's mildly scary), it shouldn;t be TOO much of a stretch to get Staff or Titan to work. DB would be silly, though. You're right about that one.

What if the shield WAS one of the blades?

 

What if both blades could be shields?

 

I demand a Dual Shields set!

[Coyotedancer]

Just now, Hexquisite said:

What if the shield WAS one of the blades?

 

What if both blades could be shields?

 

I demand a Dual Shields set!

 

Somewhere Captain America is raising an eyebrow. You know he is. XD

[Luminara]

15 minutes ago, Coyotedancer said:

 

Somewhere Captain America is raising an eyebrow. You know he is. XD

 

He used dual shields in Infinity War.

[Coyotedancer]

5 minutes ago, Luminara said:

 

He used dual shields in Infinity War.

Yes. Yes he did. XD

[gourdhead]

7 hours ago, Hexquisite said:

What if the shield WAS one of the blades?

 

What if both blades could be shields?

 

I demand a Dual Shields set!

Now I want a swashbuckling set where you can change fencing styles.  Rapier and dagger, but the dagger Is a defense buff?  TAKE MY MONEY!

[Turric]

15 hours ago, Luminara said:

 

Use some of the staff animations, pull some animations from the Cimerorans, BAM!  Spear Fighting.

 

I'd do unwholesome things for a spear.

 

Same. I have a character that is begging for a spear!

[Twisted Toon]

16 hours ago, Coyotedancer said:

If you can alter animations to make KinMelee work with a shield (Which you can. Mr. CD runs a Kin/Shield Brute that's mildly scary), it shouldn;t be TOO much of a stretch to get Staff or Titan to work. DB would be silly, though. You're right about that one.

Have you actually tried to use a ginormous two-handed weapon and a rather large shield (not talking about a buckler) at the same time?

Strength doesn't really have anything to do with the difficulty in with using both, if that's what you were going to go for.

It wouldn't be long before you, either, knock yourself out with the shield, or rip the thing off your arm.

The same goes for the staff.

Although, if you severely limited your motions with the staff (mainly restricted to just poking with it) you might manage something.

 

I do have some familiarity with melee weapon combat with (and without) shields.

Trust me, using two-handed weapons and a medium to large shield together are unwieldly as all get out.

[Coyotedancer]

12 minutes ago, Twisted Toon said:

Have you actually tried to use a ginormous two-handed weapon and a rather large shield (not talking about a buckler) at the same time?

Strength doesn't really have anything to do with the difficulty in with using both, if that's what you were going to go for.

It wouldn't be long before you, either, knock yourself out with the shield, or rip the thing off your arm.

The same goes for the staff.

Although, if you severely limited your motions with the staff (mainly restricted to just poking with it) you might manage something.

 

I do have some familiarity with melee weapon combat with (and without) shields.

Trust me, using two-handed weapons and a medium to large shield together are unwieldly as all get out.

 

You do realize this is an utterly unrealistic comic book game, right? And that a fair few of the things our characters do are impractical if not outright impossible for actual humans?

 

I really don't think the practical limitations of actual weapons use was given much consideration when City's attack sets were designed. XD

[Twisted Toon]

2 minutes ago, Coyotedancer said:

 

You do realize this is an utterly unrealistic comic book game, right? And that a fair few of the things our characters do are impractical if not outright impossible for actual humans?

 

I really don't think the practical limitations of actual weapons use was given much consideration when City's attack sets were designed. XD

I understand that half of the attacks for Dual Pistols are impractical, if not impossible.

Most of the attacks for Dual Blades are impractical as well.

The animations for Titan Weapons don't really work with momentum, IRL. (to be honest, momentum, as it is done here, isn't a thing IRL with large two-handed weapons)

 

That was why I mentioned in a previous post that they did try to instill some sense into the game. (emphasis on some)

[Coyotedancer]

1 minute ago, Twisted Toon said:

I understand that half of the attacks for Dual Pistols are impractical, if not impossible.

Most of the attacks for Dual Blades are impractical as well.

The animations for Titan Weapons don't really work with momentum, IRL. (to be honest, momentum, as it is done here, isn't a thing IRL with large two-handed weapons)

 

That was why I mentioned in a previous post that they did try to instill some sense into the game. (emphasis on some)

 

I spent the morning on a character who both spends her life ON FIRE *and* doing ridiculous slow-motion backflips when she claws things... The "unrealistic" thing is sort of front an center in the City. Realism doesn't just get ignored, it gets pulled into a dark alley, stuffed in a sack and shipped to Siberia.

[Luminara]

1 hour ago, Twisted Toon said:

The same goes for the staff.

 

People throughout the entirety of human history have used spears with shields.  Using a spear with a shield allowed Rome to build one of the most successful empires, ever.  Using a spear in conjunction with a shield allowed a handful of Spartans to hold off an entire army of Persians.  The Egyptians, the Mayans, military units all over the world used spears and shields, from the dawn of civilization, to conquer and defend, and were remarkably effective.

 

If it worked for several tens of thousands of years in real life, it can work in a video game focused on superheroes.  If we have a twirly attack or two, no-one's going to complain about realism because we might give ourselves a rap on the noggin if we tried to replicate the attacks in reality.

 

1 hour ago, Twisted Toon said:

Although, if you severely limited your motions with the staff (mainly restricted to just poking with it) you might manage something.

 

You can thrust, lunge, sweep, vault and spin, and throw the spear.  There's six of nine powers in the set, without limiting motion.  In a superhero video game, I think we can dispense with the argument that there have to be realistic limitations on the remainder, or even on the six already possible.

[Twisted Toon]

1 hour ago, Luminara said:

 

People throughout the entirety of human history have used spears with shields.  Using a spear with a shield allowed Rome to build one of the most successful empires, ever.  Using a spear in conjunction with a shield allowed a handful of Spartans to hold off an entire army of Persians.  The Egyptians, the Mayans, military units all over the world used spears and shields, from the dawn of civilization, to conquer and defend, and were remarkably effective.

 

If it worked for several tens of thousands of years in real life, it can work in a video game focused on superheroes.  If we have a twirly attack or two, no-one's going to complain about realism because we might give ourselves a rap on the noggin if we tried to replicate the attacks in reality.

 

 

You can thrust, lunge, sweep, vault and spin, and throw the spear.  There's six of nine powers in the set, without limiting motion.  In a superhero video game, I think we can dispense with the argument that there have to be realistic limitations on the remainder, or even on the six already possible.

If you're break dancing with the staff and shield, I think you've gone a little too far.

 

I would point out that the spears that the Romans, Spartans, Egyptians, Mayans (etc...) used with their shields, were not two-handed spears.

They were short spears that could be (and were) used one handed.

They never used their spears two-handed while using a shield at the same time.

Not even the Romans could ignore physics.

 

Here's a thought.

Grab yourself a makeshift shield, like a trashcan lid, and a makeshift spear, like a broom handle, then attempt to use the "spear" two-handed with the "shield" and still make effective use of the "shield".

(I can guarantee you, it can't be done.)

Then explain to me how a super hero could use them both in a way that makes even a modicum of sense.

If anyone can do it, I'm sure it would be you.

You have some of the most well thought out posts on the forums that I've seen.

 

2 hours ago, Coyotedancer said:

 

I spent the morning on a character who both spends her life ON FIRE *and* doing ridiculous slow-motion backflips when she claws things... The "unrealistic" thing is sort of front an center in the City. Realism doesn't just get ignored, it gets pulled into a dark alley, stuffed in a sack and shipped to Siberia.

I never said that the game was realistic. I just said that they instilled some sense into the game.

 

Sense =/= realistic

[Patti]

Do you mean "internal consistency" when you say "sense?"

 

[Luminara]

6 minutes ago, Twisted Toon said:

If you're break dancing with the staff and shield, I think you've gone a little too far.

 

That was neither what I said, nor what I implied.  I said include some animations from Staff Fighting, pull other animations from the Cimerorans.  The animations from Guarded Spin and Innocuous Strikes could be comparatively easily modified to use one hand, and would fit the concept well.  Other animations, such as holding and throwing the spear, as well as the basic combat stance, already exist and can be imported from within the game (the Cimerorans).

 

I'm not suggesting Staff Fighting with a reskin.  I never was.

[Frostbiter]

I can see a Spear or other piercing weapons set working. Maybe with something like a bleed mechanic that works like a minor DoT.

[FoulVileTerror]

I'd have to call "nuh-uh" on a claim that this game has internal consistency on things like animations.  Hell, some Sets aren't even internally consistent with their animations (hello Energy Melee).

 

To the best of my knowledge the reason, back in the day as it is now, that Powers like Titan Weapon and Shield were not compatible is because of the amount of work it takes to get animations to exist in this engine.

When's the last time any of you saw a -new- animation here?  I don't mean one which you hadn't personally seen before, but one that was created from scratch.

I've said it before, but I'll say it again:  I would -really- like to be proven wrong on this, but I think 3D assets in this game are still a nut that hasn't been cracked yet.   Piecemeal's recent work kind of reinforces this.  They're some INCREDIBLE reskins . . . but they're all just* reskins and mish-mashes of existing 3D assets.

*"just" in so much as that they're all assets which already exist; not "just" meaning to diminish the incredible work Piecemeal has clearly done.

 

I absolutely agree that it would fantastic to have Shield Defense not be mutually exclusive with so many other Sets, though.  There are a lot of awesome concepts which are unceremoniously blocked due to those limitations.

[Frostbiter]

2 minutes ago, FoulVileTerror said:

I'd have to call "nuh-uh" on a claim that this game has internal consistency on things like animations.  Hell, some Sets aren't even internally consistent with their animations (hello Energy Melee).

 

To the best of my knowledge the reason, back in the day as it is now, that Powers like Titan Weapon and Shield were not compatible is because of the amount of work it takes to get animations to exist in this engine.

When's the last time any of you saw a -new- animation here?  I don't mean one which you hadn't personally seen before, but one that was created from scratch.

I've said it before, but I'll say it again:  I would -really- like to be proven wrong on this, but I think 3D assets in this game are still a nut that hasn't been cracked yet.   Piecemeal's recent work kind of reinforces this.  They're some INCREDIBLE reskins . . . but they're all just* reskins and mish-mashes of existing 3D assets.

*"just" in so much as that they're all assets which already exist; not "just" meaning to diminish the incredible work Piecemeal has clearly done.

 

I absolutely agree that it would fantastic to have Shield Defense not be mutually exclusive with so many other Sets, though.  There are a lot of awesome concepts which are unceremoniously blocked due to those limitations.

I'm hoping that now that it appears the Devs here have cracked the asymmetry issue with costume pieces that this may be closer to possible in the future.

[Puma]

9 hours ago, Twisted Toon said:

Have you actually tried to use a ginormous two-handed weapon and a rather large shield (not talking about a buckler) at the same time?

Strength doesn't really have anything to do with the difficulty in with using both, if that's what you were going to go for.

It wouldn't be long before you, either, knock yourself out with the shield, or rip the thing off your arm.

 

No, but I've never ripped into the ground with my bare hands, pulled a boulder out, and thrown it into the distance.  I supposed that if I did I'd rip off my arm.  

 

 

But Im not super. Our characters are. By the way, some shield options are elemental or energy.  Who says that things cant pass through them that I want to pass through them?

Edited September 24, 2020 by Puma

[Troo]

10 hours ago, Twisted Toon said:

Have you actually tried to use a ginormous two-handed weapon and a rather large shield (not talking about a buckler) at the same time?

yes, yes I have.. but then

[Twisted Toon]

9 hours ago, Luminara said:

 

That was neither what I said, nor what I implied.  I said include some animations from Staff Fighting, pull other animations from the Cimerorans.  The animations from Guarded Spin and Innocuous Strikes could be comparatively easily modified to use one hand, and would fit the concept well.  Other animations, such as holding and throwing the spear, as well as the basic combat stance, already exist and can be imported from within the game (the Cimerorans).

 

I'm not suggesting Staff Fighting with a reskin.  I never was.

Also, what you are suggesting is a one-handed spear set. That would make sense.

 

10 hours ago, Patti said:

Do you mean "internal consistency" when you say "sense?"

 

No, I do not. I mean a tiny smidgen of non-nonsensical.

4 hours ago, Puma said:

No, but I've never ripped into the ground with my bare hands, pulled a boulder out, and thrown it into the distance.  I supposed that if I did I'd rip off my arm.  

 

 

But Im not super. Our characters are. By the way, some shield options are elemental or energy.  Who says that things cant pass through them that I want to pass through them?

Some of the shield options are also wooden, metal manhole covers, and police riot shields.

Are you suggesting that only some shield options be allowed with two-handed weapons?

 

3 hours ago, Troo said:

yes, yes I have.. but then

Doesn't look two-handed to me.

And even if Herc tried to use a two-handed sword two-handed with a shield, the shield wouldn't be attached to his arm for long.

When they make Titan Weapons usable with one hand, then we can come back and discuss this one.

[EmmySky]

Sorry folks.... @Troo wins with the glistening man chest.  One hand, two hand, doesnt matter...pects!

 

😝