Weaksauce

[Bionic_Flea]

5 minutes ago, Shadeknight said:

One theory being true does not mean all of them are true. Look up some other conspiracy theories unrelated to HC.

I'm just saying, this whole "inner circle/cabal" theory is hilarious and pointing out where it falls flat tends to piss off those who believe there's some secret inner group.

 

That's exactly what a member of this cabal would say!

[Ruin Mage]

I am the entire Inner Circle, Flea.

There is no Inner Circle in Ba Sing Se.

Edited July 31, 2022 by Shadeknight

[ShardWarrior]

55 minutes ago, ZacKing said:

Wasn't "there is no private server" over on the Titan forums a conspiracy theory for a few years? 

 

Zardoz does make a fair point here.  Trust is very important.  Given the history of lying to the community for years about the existence of the server, it does make anything they say suspect. 

[Ruin Mage]

There is no Inner Circle in Ba Sing Se.

I get that the devs not (rightfully) listening to the Suggestions and Feedback forum is cause for conspiracy theories, but not every theory is true. Just because The Other Server existed does not equal some sinister puppetmaster cabal that decides all the changes exists. They are two very different things, and it's getting wild to see the same few regurgitate it without critical thinking.

Does it not make more sense that the Devs want to deliver their vision of City of Heroes? Or must everything have some sinister or extra unseen motive behind it?

[The_Warpact]

8 minutes ago, Shadeknight said:

Does it not make more sense that the Devs want to deliver their vision of City of Heroes? Or must everything have some sinister or extra unseen motive behind it?

Well, historically if a certain division/person/party wanted to deliver their "vision" to the masses. They could do so in various fashions, deceit, lying, extortion, bribery, murder, etc, etc, etc.

Is it outside of the realm of possibility that the HC team could use "alts" to sway popular opinion to their side to achieve their "vision"?

Certainly not, it would be a way to "guide" the general populace to what they want to do, and still receive donations to fund their past time, namely this game. 

That's not necessarily a "conspiracy theory" but, just a possibility of a united front of individuals trying to maintain a goal for their "vision" and what they deem the greater good for the longevity of this game.

 

Typically it's better to lead a horse to water with a gentle pull to guide them instead of forcing them or outright ignoring their needs.

And once in a while you give the horse a carrot and it thinks it is getting what it wants.

 

 

[Ruin Mage]

You lost me.

Why would a bunch of volunteers spend their time trying to convince people that these changes are good through alt accounts? Like does that not sound insane at face value? Just because certain individuals lied about some super sekrit server does not correlate or relate to "oh, there's some inner cabal directing the changes of the server."

Changes can be done because the dev team wants to try and tackle x. Just as much as it can be springboarded off a suggestion and done their way.

The whole "they're using alt accounts." attributes a maliciousness to people that none of us really know outside of Homecoming and that is baffling to me.

[arcane]

I just want to know my login info for the sekrit cabal user portal so I can start nefariously orchestrating changes myself 😞 

[Excraft]

14 minutes ago, Shadeknight said:

The whole "they're using alt accounts." attributes a maliciousness to people that none of us really know outside of Homecoming and that is baffling to me.

 

Right because lying to the community for years about a private server wasn't malicious at all.  It's the most honest and trustworthy thing ever. 🙄

[Ruin Mage]

Lying about a private server does not naturally lead to "They're using alt accounts." - its two very different things.

There's no real proof of it. Like some devs post plenty as is - Booper, Faultline, Cobalt, Caretaker, and Powerhouse. They're pretty open about things when things hit beta and sometimes elsewhere. Why do that much and then suddenly use alt accounts? At least make it make sense rather than using "WELL BECAUSE THEY DID X THEY'LL DO Y."

Personally, I don't believe it to be malicious after all this time. Was it a good thing to do? No. But malicious? Heavens no. This entire "ALT ACCOUNTS!!!" theory proves that it wasn't a bad idea to be a little hidden about it. Because some people are nuts when things don't go their way. A lot of what's happened after Page 4 went to Brainstorm shows this.

Obviously, opinions differ on that matter.

Edited July 31, 2022 by Shadeknight

[Myrmidon]

2 minutes ago, Excraft said:

 

Right because lying to the community for years about a private server wasn't malicious at all.  It's the most honest and trustworthy thing ever. 🙄

While I was never part of any hidden server, let’s break this down into a concept that (hopefully, but unlikely for the contrarians among us) anyone can understand.

 

1. Someone gets the source code for the game through clandestine means before shutdown.

 

2.  someone decides to create a server with the game.

 

3. Knowing that the owner of said code disrupting this is highly likely, said someone invites people that they believe can keep a secret and reverse-engineers the game to figure out how it functions.

 

4. Once the game is functional and that same said someone decides to open it up to the public, they release the source-code into the Wild (not hoard it, not keep it to be the only source). This is the “Hail Hydra!” moment when the game can never truly die.😉

 

Everything that transpired over the last decade is the reason why we have both City of and the luxury of even having this discussion. At least try to fake a modicum of respect.

[Bill Z Bubba]

27 minutes ago, Shadeknight said:

Like does that not sound insane at face value?

 

Have you met any humans? Looked around at the state of the planet lately? I *expect* people to usually make insane choices and have insane beliefs.

[Myrmidon]

Three from the same person in a Regen post, nine from the AE “discussion” thread and likely one or two in here from Excraft and some of the other AE lemmings after the above post.😂

Edited July 31, 2022 by Myrmidon

[The_Warpact]

26 minutes ago, Shadeknight said:

You lost me.

Why would a bunch of volunteers spend their time trying to convince people that these changes are good through alt accounts? Like does that not sound insane at face value? Just because certain individuals lied about some super sekrit server does not correlate or relate to "oh, there's some inner cabal directing the changes of the server."

Changes can be done because the dev team wants to try and tackle x. Just as much as it can be springboarded off a suggestion and done their way.

The whole "they're using alt accounts." attributes a maliciousness to people that none of us really know outside of Homecoming and that is baffling to me.

Well I don't know motive, it could be something as simple as thousands of dollars of donations to keep the project moving forward.

Listen, it started off on shaky ground anyways by not not saying anything about the secret server for years regardless of the reason.

That act in itself has led to distrust from the start especially since it was a leak.

Coupled with the same cheerleaders always stepping forward blindly agreeing with every action the HC team has done or wants to do makes people question motive and who they are. 

I *get* that team can do whatever they want because it is their time. But, knowing the direction, why things are done in a certain way, and institute suggestions that have been rehashed for years would go in a more positive way.

Transparency and communication build trust because, every idea you put out or I put out on motives is just conjecture. 

 

[Troo]

1 hour ago, Shadeknight said:

does not equal some sinister puppetmaster cabal that decides all the changes exists.

 

there is always a decider.

[Ruin Mage]

The decider is the dev team. It's that easy.

 

5 minutes ago, The_Warpact said:

Coupled with the same cheerleaders always stepping forward blindly agreeing with every action the HC team has done or wants to do makes people question motive and who they are. 

You cannot stop this. It happens with any MMO. That doesn't mean Blizzard, Ubisoft, Riot, or other companies have an inner cabal of players deciding the direction of their games. Just because there are cheerleaders is no proof of some puppetmaster whisper-whisper group.

 

 

6 minutes ago, The_Warpact said:

institute suggestions that have been rehashed for years would go in a more positive way.

Not all suggestions are equal, and sometimes just sometimes the devs can disagree with them or want to go a different direction. God forbid, right?

 

 

7 minutes ago, The_Warpact said:

Transparency and communication build trust because, every idea you put out or I put out on motives is just conjecture. 

I hate the word transparency and that's my only addition to this.

[lemming]

19 minutes ago, Myrmidon said:

Three from the same person in a Regen post, nine from the AE “discussion” thread and likely one or two in here from Excraft and some of the other AE lemmings after the above post.😂

Hey now!

[arcane]

53 minutes ago, Excraft said:

 

Right because lying to the community for years about a private server wasn't malicious at all.  It's the most honest and trustworthy thing ever. 🙄

Someone did something bad once so everyone must be doing bad things all the time. 

[Troo]

Regarding inner circles, cabals ect.

 

"The fact that there is no secret insider conspiracy doesn't mean their aren't blocs of players who pressure the direction of development to suit their interests, in some cases more successfully than others." - @battlewraith

 

n o w  b a c k  t o  m e,  w h o  w o u l d  n o t  b e  a  g r e a t  d e c i d e r.

[Ruin Mage]

Again, that is attributing the idea that changes were done by pressure - that the devs can be pressured to implementing changes.

One can flip that and point at the AE change (no XP post-50) being walked back as a case of pressure going the opposite direction.

Sure, both can be true but they are not inherently related.

[arcane]

5 minutes ago, Troo said:

Regarding inner circles, cabals ect.

 

"The fact that there is no secret insider conspiracy doesn't mean their aren't blocs of players who pressure the direction of development to suit their interests, in some cases more successfully than others." - @battlewraith

 

n o w  b a c k  t o  m e,  w h o  w o u l d  n o t  b e  a  g r e a t  d e c i d e r.

I love how no one dares allege anything specific about someone specific because they know that’ll open them up to being directly told how wrong they are. Vague allegations of illuminati involvement accomplish much more.

[Troo]

Just now, arcane said:

I love how no one dares allege anything specific about someone specific because they know that’ll open them up to being directly told how wrong they are. Vague allegations of illuminati involvement accomplish much more.

 

yeah, but you agree that there are some who are more successful at getting changes?

 

to an individual I imagine it feels like a group of insiders.

[Marbing]

My ratio of total reactions received vs thumbs down is 🔥, I am so proud of myself. Most of these came during this round of focused feedback, so my future is looking very 👎 given my inclinations. 😄 

[The_Warpact]

2 minutes ago, Marbing said:

My ratio of total reactions received vs thumbs down is 🔥, I am so proud of myself. Most of these came during this round of focused feedback, so my future is looking very 👎 given my inclinations. 😄 

I just help ya! 🙂 

[Ruin Mage]

Page 4 has paid its dues in downvotes.

[arcane]

9 minutes ago, Troo said:

 

yeah, but you agree that there are some who are more successful at getting changes?

 

to an individual I imagine it feels like a group of insiders.

Only evidence I have seen of this is within a fraction of the PvP community. You know, the one that claims to be the whole PvP community.

 

Other than that, nope, don’t agree.