Ever build for +DMG?

[Jawbreaker]

Typically I know the vast majority of us build with +rech, +def being the main goals of set bonuses. I'm wondering if anyone has ever tried to build for max +DMG bonuses and if so, what AT/powerset and how well did it work for you? I assume defenders would be the first choice for doing something like this, but I dunno.

[MistressOhm]

I have the full Bombardment set on a Thunderous Blast on my Stormfender.  While it'd probably push higher orange numbers (and possibly more targets?) on my namesake blaster, it works well as a "cull all the adds" AoE.  The added Fire Damage proc is also useful, in case there's anything left standing after it goes off.  

 

Why'd I go with Ranged AoE Damage? Well, it's a nuke, a T9 attack that costs a lot of End and has a pretty long recharge.  It stands to reason, then, that I should supercharge it for as heavy a pounding as I can manage as it's a situational thing.  Besides, the End Drain aspect is already covered by other powers, I don't need to keep slotting for that effect everywhere.  

 

Since my stormfender is already slotted for -ToHit in Hurricane and -End in Short Circuit, and a decent amount of +Def in Hover and Evasive Maneuvers (I know, the latter goes away when in combat), I'm not that concerned about getting whomped upon for unloading ~2.1 gigawatts into a bunch of nasties.  Ranged enemies have a shot, but anything that gets into melee at the very least has grit in their eyes, can't maintain balance, and is shoved up against a nearby wall to the point of not being able to move.  

Edited October 22, 2022 by MistressOhm

[Snarky]

I tend to noy go this route.  But I believe (I may be wrong) that PROC damage builds tend to be favored in increasing max damage more than chasing straight +dam.  Rech, as well. brings up the hard hitting attacks faster.  

[Spaghetti Betty]

The main problem with trying to build for +DMG set bonuses is that the bonuses themselves are so miniscule that it wouldn't amount to much, even if you specifically sought them out in your build.

 

Loading up procs is by far the better way to go if you're looking to add onto your damage.

[kelika2]

Yes and it is just "ok"

My SR/MA tank did it first.  with storm kick, early toggles and some global UIs and +dmg sets generally having s/l resist anyways

Claw widow with the same story with built in defenses to extreme levels + assault

Got a couple more Blaster and Bio armor stories but its still just "ok"

 

[Major_Decoy]

I have. Radiation/Fire scrapper. It started with "Hey, if I two slot Achille's Heel in each of my attacks, I'll get a +1.5% damage bonus."

Thus was born Ember Lovin' Shrub. She skipped the fighting pool because it didn't provide damage bonuses, only two slots invested in resistance powers.

 

It's +42.5% damage from set bonuses, +10.5% from Assault, and eventually I'll get Assault Hybrid too.

 

Edit: It is not by any means an optimized build. There are a number of changes I could make to improve it. It has one of the two superior scrapper sets four slotted but it skips the +chance for crit enhancement. It doesn't use any luck of the gamblers, it doesn't doesn't use any procs except for Achille's Heel: Chance for resistance debuff. I have Fury of the Gladiator slotted into Burning Aura and don't have the chance for -rez slotted.

Edited October 22, 2022 by Major_Decoy

[Lazarillo]

I have a Bane Spider who I did this with.  It's exceptionally good at crunching things.  Lotsa fun.

For reference, +42% damage from set bonuses, +30% from stacked Assault powers, +10% from Assault Hybrid passive, and an average around +120% from enhancements/Alpha, so everything does triple base damage, and hitting Build Up basically puts it at the damage cap.  Is it minmaxed to the (min)max?  Eh, probably not.  Prochounds could probably do something that's better on paper.  But I'll take a reliable crunch every time.

Edited October 22, 2022 by Lazarillo

[Ironblade]

1 hour ago, Jawbreaker said:

I'm wondering if anyone has ever tried to build for max +DMG bonuses and if so, what AT/powerset and how well did it work for you? I assume defenders would be the first choice for doing something like this, but I dunno.

I don't think Defender would be a good choice unless perhaps you're talking about TEAM damage, but then set bonuses would not be applicable.

 

My character most focused on damage is a beam rifle / kinetics corrupter specifically created for the Magisterium iTrial.  He only has 13% damage from set bonuses (plus Assault) because his priority was recharge in order to be able to spam Fulcrum Shift - that's where his real damage comes from.

[Sanguinesun]

1 hour ago, Jawbreaker said:

Typically I know the vast majority of us build with +rech, +def being the main goals of set bonuses. I'm wondering if anyone has ever tried to build for max +DMG bonuses and if so, what AT/powerset and how well did it work for you? I assume defenders would be the first choice for doing something like this, but I dunno.

 

I think it may be better to consider this is a different way.   If you're building for +damage bonuses in the way I'm assuming you are, it seems your goal is to overall be having a better damage output within a certain frame of time(which is undefined at this point).

 

So to that end, +DMG bonus building exclusively is not necessarily going to give you that end result.

 

Think more on things as a recipe if your goal is more damage output.  Also understand that different AT's and even different power set combinations(be it primary, secondary, pool, or even epic/patron and of course the incarnate) are going to have different recipes for that result.

 

Using the +recharge as an example, for some sets, using +recharge(be it from bonuses or from procs like ff's one) are meant to be used in recipe with other IO set bonuses and procs for damage etc because if your powers are recharging faster, you can get more damage in during a set amount of time.     

 

For example if a power normally has a 45s recharge but you're able to +recharge it to attain a cap of 400% recharge(under the most optimal conditions) then that power's recharge drops to just 9s.  That means that in a 1 minute span of time, its gone from being used only once to being useable 6 times instead.  That potentially then can mean it is able to do more damage in that 6 times than it could get from 1 use, even if it were to have all the maximum amounts of going for +dmg bonuses with a low recharge of using just 1 time.

 

But.....

 

Using for example the +recharge example above, if you have crap for endurance recovery(be it recovery through bonuses and or recovery powers) you could fire off those 6 hits on that power in a minute but be left limping for the next min or 2 due to using all your endurance and having to recover slowly.

 

So again, it depends, due the large variety of variables mathematically that these different combinations can have, what is the best recipe for effectivity.  This is why people post builds, test builds with certain test variables, show video evidence etc for different combinations.   

 

And this is also without adding another factor: more overarching goals in game.    If you're playing the hardest difficulty, you're going to have to sacrifice some damage in various builds to shore up resistances or defenses(again depending on AT/power choices too) in order to be more effective with team dynamics in mind.   A soloer may build differently.  Someone who exclusively AE Farms would of course build differently and the list just goes on and on.  Just too many permutations.

 

So building for +damage bonuses is not something clear cut to consider as it may be leading you down an erroneous path of consideration.  

Edited October 22, 2022 by Sanguinesun

[Zappalina]

1 hour ago, Jawbreaker said:

Typically I know the vast majority of us build with +rech, +def being the main goals of set bonuses. I'm wondering if anyone has ever tried to build for max +DMG bonuses and if so, what AT/powerset and how well did it work for you? I assume defenders would be the first choice for doing something like this, but I dunno.

I do it on most of everything that isn't a tank and even tanks I put a little +dmg in if it's able to fit it in the build (like leftover). I prefer PVE and running with a team there is always someone doing +def or buffs of some kind, I don't need to max out a character on defense or recharge (An exception would be on a farmer though/PvP and a few others dependent on play style & what is being played raid/pve/hard trials etc.) as long as I have a chain of damage that goes decently and the +dps helps with accomplishing goals. 

I like PVE teams so that isn't something needing to max out defense, but again I do understand why some people love defense and +recharge and I on characters that don't need a lot of extra defense I go the +dmg route if possible. 

 

If you have the influence to invest you could also go with multiple builds, on one character, I noticed the other day it went up to 3 but haven't been keeping track of when that happened.  but that's cool, players could have a PvE build, Farming Build and a PVP or PvE hard trial/tf build. 

[Sneakers]

1 hour ago, Jawbreaker said:

Typically I know the vast majority of us build with +rech, +def being the main goals of set bonuses. I'm wondering if anyone has ever tried to build for max +DMG bonuses and if so, what AT/powerset and how well did it work for you? I assume defenders would be the first choice for doing something like this, but I dunno.

 

If you can build towards that without sacrificing what you need it's a welcome perk. 

 

Hybrid archetypes seam to benefit alot from it. (sent/corruptor) At least that's how it feels to me.

[MangoKulfi]

My stalker has base 63.5% +dmg because the idea is for them to not be my defender who doesn't get to stab things with a sword.  I have enough recharge and no endurance issue and wasn't planning to tank for anyone's team so I think it's working fine.

[Sneakers]

5 minutes ago, MangoKulfi said:

My stalker has base 63.5% +dmg because the idea is for them to not be my defender who doesn't get to stab things with a sword.  I have enough recharge and no endurance issue and wasn't planning to tank for anyone's team so I think it's working fine.

 

63% just from enhancements? or does a stalker have innate bonuses?

[Major_Decoy]

10 minutes ago, Sneakers said:

 

63% just from enhancements? or does a stalker have innate bonuses?

63% sounds high for just set bonuses. I'd guess shield (against all odds) or Bio (offensive adaptation)

[Sneakers]

30 minutes ago, Major_Decoy said:

63% sounds high for just set bonuses. I'd guess shield (against all odds) or Bio (offensive adaptation)

 

Yea that would definitely be a max +dmg build if it were all from enhancements.

[MangoKulfi]

Oh sorry, that's with assault and the damage boosting Alpha slot on a /energy stalker so like 43% from set bonus I think.

[StrikerFox]

I've built for +damage on a StJ/SR Stalker. I think it's the fastest Stalker StJ pylon time with 84s/584 dps. But I haven't looked at the pylon thread in a year, it may have been beaten already. It had a passive damage bonus of +58%. That total includes Leadership Assault's +10.5% and Assault Radial Hydrid's passive +10% damage.

[Sneakers]

5 minutes ago, StrikerFox said:

I've built for +damage on a StJ/SR Stalker. I think it's the fastest Stalker StJ pylon time with 84s/584 dps. But I haven't looked at the pylon thread in a year, it may have been beaten already. It had a passive damage bonus of +58%. That total includes Leadership Assault's +10.5% and Assault Radial Hydrid's passive +10% damage.

I have a SR scrapper he's nearly untouchable.

How does that play out for a stalker when taking hits from 10 or more +4 enemies?

[StrikerFox]

17 minutes ago, Sneakers said:

I have a SR scrapper he's nearly untouchable.

How does that play out for a stalker when taking hits from 10 or more +4 enemies?

 

Seems fine but I took Rebirth Radial for a heal and I don't solo since the game came back. Stalkers and Scrappers, with the same primary/secondary, built similarly... In most cases, the survival difference is pretty small. Higher HP/regen is usually the biggest difference between the two ATs. Also the missing power for AS can make a difference like MA's Dragon's Tail for example. Losing the KD mitigation is pretty big.

 

Back during live, I solo'd three Paladins with a much weaker StJ/SR Stalker build.

 

 

 

[Luminara]

7 hours ago, Jawbreaker said:

I'm wondering if anyone has ever tried to build for max +DMG bonuses and if so, what AT/powerset and how well did it work for you?

 

Dark/Martial dominator.  23% from set bonuses, 11.25% from Assault, 10% (passive) from Assault Core Embodiment, and (when I use it... i have 31.5%+ Defense to almost all types and positions with this build, so i tend to just run straight in and go banana balls instead) 14.2% from the Ascendency of the Dominator proc slotted in Fearsome Stare.

 

The problem was that Spinning Kick/Dragon's Tail/Trick Shot wasn't sufficient to defeat +0 minions, they always had a tiny amount of HP remaining.  I could use Thunder Kick or Masterful Throw to finish them, and for a while, I did, but the longer I played the character, the more it bothered me.  I don't like using an attack that deals 200 or 350 damage on something with 20 HP.  With every other character I have, I've simply taken a more powerful attack, or Aim/Build Up, or something else relatively simple.  But Dark/Martial doesn't have a stronger AoE that I could substitute, nor did I want to replace Spinning Kick, Dragon's Tail or Trick Shot.  Envenomed Blades proved to be awful with AoE and chain attacks, so that wasn't a viable option.  Caltrops and pets didn't fit the "GOGOGOKILLMOARFASTARNAOGOGOGO" feel of the character.  Adding Explosive Shuriken and praying that the "splash" damage would do the trick would've entailed having six attacks on my tray, and I'm just too damn lazy to juggle that many attacks.

 

So I re-engineered the character from the ground up, adding in every +Damage source I could to buff up Spinning/Dragon's/Trick.  It worked.  I could finally, after more than a dozen respecs, defeat +0 minions without resorting to one of my harder-hitting attacks, or waiting for things to recharge.

[Snarky]

8 hours ago, Major_Decoy said:

It has one of the two superior scrapper sets four slotted but it skips the +chance for crit enhancement.

It is well known this one proc will take a Scrapper to much higher levels of damage.  Building to slot this proc and get it timo fire often should be your too priority on a Scrapoer

[Major_Decoy]

1 hour ago, Snarky said:

It is well known this one proc will take a Scrapper to much higher levels of damage.  Building to slot this proc and get it timo fire often should be your too priority on a Scrapoer

It wouldn't be hard at all, I'd just have to unslot Superior Scrapper's Strike: Acc/Dam, Acc/Dam/Rech, Dam/End/Rech, Acc/Dam/End/Rech and slot in Acc/Dam, Acc/Dam/Rech, Add/Dam/End/Rech, Rech/Critical Hit Bonus.

 

But the moment I start doing that, I'll ask myself stuff like "You don't ever seem to use Char or Fire Blast, you have all the set bonuses you wanted from four slots, you don't need to have them five slotted, why don't you move those slots?"

[Snarky]

13 minutes ago, Major_Decoy said:

It wouldn't be hard at all, I'd just have to unslot Superior Scrapper's Strike: Acc/Dam, Acc/Dam/Rech, Dam/End/Rech, Acc/Dam/End/Rech and slot in Acc/Dam, Acc/Dam/Rech, Add/Dam/End/Rech, Rech/Critical Hit Bonus.

 

But the moment I start doing that, I'll ask myself stuff like "You don't ever seem to use Char or Fire Blast, you have all the set bonuses you wanted from four slots, you don't need to have them five slotted, why don't you move those slots?"

If I were you (and granted this requires time and a ton of influence) is look for a high damage Scrapper build with your power sets.  A real Pylon eater.  Then use your alt build to slap it on your toon.  Take it out for a spin.  Then after a week or so of running both strip the build you do not like as much for recycling.

[battlewraith]

I have a SS/bio brute that has a default 168% damage bonus from rage, the bio armor, and then all of the set bonuses. That's without activating adrenal booster which brings it to 200%.

Footstomp is procced out, but crosspunch, ball lightning, and electrifying fences are not. It's hard to say whether it's worth the investment in dmg or not but it gets the job done. It has decent surviveability and a lot of recharge despite the janky ragecrash mechanic.

[Hedgefund2]

I was part of a time + temporal team.  When there were at least 4 time manip users on, I would use a seismic/temporal blaster.  Knowing that both defense and recharge were covered by the Times, I went HAM seeking +DMG bonuses + procs (and resists).  I ended up with 39% +DMG just from set bonuses.  

 

Not a build strategy I'd pursue otherwise but 'twas fun to play.  I'd go ker-splat if I teamed outside of my Time buddies, but a real wrecking ball with them.

Edited October 23, 2022 by Hedgefund2