Lets talk - The negative part of the Double XP Buff.

[Zewks]

It would seem that its come time to really ask, "Does this negative need to exist?"

 

Many will state that the amount of inf you miss out on is negligible. Nothing something to even care about. If that is the case, why is the negative even there still?

 

Best case scenario, people dont care because they already have more than enough inf from playing the game so long.

 

Worst case, however, a new player on their first character is going to find the game unreasonably harder by leaving them mostly broke. 

 

Asking a new player not to use the double xp when 1. Nearly every player is encouraging them to, and 2. This games xp grind to max level is ultimately more than most new mmorpg players are used to (if they havent played old school mmorpg before). Just in the last week alone, Ive seen at least 3 new players come and go from the game because CoH inherently isnt very hand holding or easy to grasp for many. I know the vets easily overlook this, the game being as familiar as the back of their hand now.

 

So again, perhaps its time to simply remove the negative part of the double xp buff? Just make it a double xp buff, with no downside.

 

Or perhaps, just make it the default rate of xp. There is already an option in the setting to disable xp for those who dont want to outlevel content. (as well as Ouro for when you do)

 

Just something to think about.

[Nyghtmaire]

2 minutes ago, Zewks said:

Or perhaps, just make it the default rate of xp. There is already an option in the setting to disable xp for those who dont want to outlevel content. (as well as Ouro for when you do)

There’s a kernel of a good idea here. Maybe an on-the-go slider in options to self-select XP gain?

 

 

[roleki]

As someone who would have generated literally billions of inf if double XP didn't carry with it the penalty of 0 inf, I don't see what's wrong with the current system wherein you can choose your XP buff (if any) from P2W and opt to get a little more XP for a little less inf, up to 2X and 0.  

 

 Not that I would mind making inf along with 2XP, but come on, you have to draw the line SOMEWHERE.

[Astralock]

IMO, double XP shouldn’t exist at all, and the 50% XP boost should cost ten million INF per hour at a minimum.  So I see no reason to buff something that shouldn’t even exist.

 

At the very least, a new player shouldn’t be using any XP buff beyond 25%.  That just creates AE/radio babies, something we have far too much of already.

 

As for making double XP standard, /jranger.

[Snarky]

It is actually not a negative.  It is quite beneficial.
 

Listening to you whine about this truly minimal penalty brings absolute joy and amazement to me

 

Thank you.  Keep the dream alive man.  

[Zewks]

10 minutes ago, Snarky said:

It is actually not a negative.  It is quite beneficial.
 

Listening to you whine about this truly minimal penalty brings absolute joy and amazement to me

 

Thank you.  Keep the dream alive man.  

 

Spoken like someone who has become completely out of touch what a brand new player would experience in the game. Im sure leaving it as is, or changing it, wouldnt affect you or your play experience one bit. 

 

[Zewks]

29 minutes ago, Astralock said:

IMO, double XP shouldn’t exist at all, and the 50% XP boost should cost ten million INF per hour at a minimum.  So I see no reason to buff something that shouldn’t even exist.

 

At the very least, a new player shouldn’t be using any XP buff beyond 25%.  That just creates AE/radio babies, something we have far too much of already.

 

As for making double XP standard, /jranger.

 

So basically, xp boosts should only be for vets who have earned enough inf over the course of their play time?

 

Thats one way to look at it for sure...

[ZemX]

Are you serious?  Inf is the least of the rewards you earn in this game.  Turning that off has about zero effect on your ability to fund a character while leveling up.

 

Now, if you're door sitting your way to 50 in a farm and then complaining you don't have money when you get there?  I have little sympathy.  That's not playing the game.  Farming is for people who have done it all before a million times and don't care to again.  Play the game and you'll have all you need.  Don't know how?  Ask in /help or here on the forums.  Answers are at your fingertips.

[Zewks]

8 minutes ago, ZemX said:

Are you serious?  Inf is the least of the rewards you earn in this game.  Turning that off has about zero effect on your ability to fund a character while leveling up.

 

Now, if you're door sitting your way to 50 in a farm and then complaining you don't have money when you get there?  I have little sympathy.  That's not playing the game.  Farming is for people who have done it all before a million times and don't care to again.  Play the game and you'll have all you need.  Don't know how?  Ask in /help or here on the forums.  Answers are at your fingertips.

 

 

Every new player who does small groups, actual missions and story, who doesnt have an alt level 50 farming character, will 100% make good use of that inf they would get while leveling from 1-50.

 

The only players who dont find it valuable are those who have been playing long enough, or who have expert knowledge of the game systems that a new player wouldnt. Its easy for experienced players to forget what starting new is like. (something CoH suffers a great deal from with many players)

 

And again, if its really that trivial, that unimportant, then it shouldnt be an issue to simply allow players to earn it with the double xp. Why be upset or bothered that people are getting something that "has about zero effect"

Edited January 20, 2023 by Zewks

[tidge]

And while we are at it, can I upload a list of item drops that I am just going vendor anyway? My inventory keeps filling up and I feel like I am missing out on some inf by getting too many recipes and salvage.

[BZRKR]

Check this out:

 

[Ironblade]

1 hour ago, Zewks said:

Asking a new player not to use the double xp when 1. Nearly every player is encouraging them to, and 2. This games xp grind to max level is ultimately more than most new mmorpg players are used to (if they havent played old school mmorpg before).

"Nearly every player is encouraging them to"?  That seems like a gross exaggeration to me.  I buy the double XP booster, do 2-3 runs of Death From Below and then delete it and never buy another.  I actively discourage people from using double XP because we already level so fast.

 

As for characterizing this game as having a an "xp grind to max level", that seems laughable when there are constantly new threads complaining about how it's too easy to level in this game and it's all 'easy mode'.

 

I think the different tiers of XP boost were a good idea and, if there should be any change, the top booster (double xp) should just be removed.

[Rudra]

This has got to be the least "grind-y" game ever. Characters get to 50 so fast they miss content and then wonder what other players are talking about. Even without any xp booters. SCORE or whomever's revamp to the xp system after shutdown made it possible to crank out max level characters in mind boggling time. The only way for this to be less of a grind is if the game awarded you xp for just having an account. Oh wait, the game does. It's called Patrol XP.

 

If players want to farm their way to 50? Go for it. Lots of options there. If they want double xp to get there faster? Go for it. It's there ready for use. If a new player expects to be able to trick out their brand new level 50 character after using double xp and door sitting? Tough. Even just door sitting, those characters are getting drops. They can take those drops and sell them for starting cash. And if they are door-sitting on a level 54 farm? They're going to be getting level 50 +/- 3 drops. (Just not the purples.) Those sell for decent inf' depending on the drop. They can also ask others for inf'. (There are players that readily just give their inf' away.)

Edited January 20, 2023 by Rudra
Edited for spelling errors. And again for poor word choice "possibly".

[biostem]

There are vanishingly few tradeoffs one must make in this game, with regard to the decisions you make about your character - I am against further diluting the weight of such decisions...

[Luminara]

No-one recommended 2x XP to me when I started playing here.

 

I feel excluded.  Someone explain things to me like I'm a n00b so I can experience a sense of belonging.

[Rudra]

2 hours ago, roleki said:

As someone who would have generated literally billions of inf if double XP didn't carry with it the penalty of 0 inf, I don't see what's wrong with the current system wherein you can choose your XP buff (if any) from P2W and opt to get a little more XP for a little less inf, up to 2X and 0.  

 

 Not that I would mind making inf along with 2XP, but come on, you have to draw the line SOMEWHERE.

While yes, the increased xp carries a penalty of commensurate reduced inf' gains, the 0 xp setting no longer awards a commensurate gain of inf'. I agree with you, but I'm still flabbergasted by the lack of inf' gain rate if xp gain is set to 0 (turned off).

[Snarky]

2 hours ago, Zewks said:

 

Spoken like someone who has become completely out of touch what a brand new player would experience in the game. Im sure leaving it as is, or changing it, wouldnt affect you or your play experience one bit. 

 

There are players that will give you 20 million.   There are players who will give you incredibly simple and easy steps to make millions in minutes.   The cash you lose by not earning to 50 is NOTHING.   Especially since the drops are most of the earning.  Unless you just vendor the recipes and give away rare salvage.   *facepalm.  Tell me you dont do dat.   I am not kidding.  You want to make cash?   Run a 50.  They make cash.  Or, if you dont want Yomo’s free 20 mil, and you dont want to learn how to make millions in minutes, turn on the double exp booster and run TFs.   Earn merits.  Turn these into converters.  Sell those

 

Or did you mean you want double exp, and earn cash, while you sit in someone elses farm to fifty and do not play the game?    
 

Spoken like someone who played on live when a new player was at the hard end of the fulcrum shift of we have stuff and you cant get it.   Homecoming….just raise your freaking arm and it is handed to you.   Of course on Homecoming people complain about having to raise their arm

Edited January 20, 2023 by Snarky

[ZemX]

1 hour ago, Rudra said:

This has got to be the least "grind-y" game ever.

 

Yeah, there is honestly a strong odor of "troll" to this thread now.  When ridiculous stuff like "This game is more grindy than any other mmo" gets thrown out there... you kind of have to take the hint that your chain is being yanked.

[Snarky]

13 minutes ago, ZemX said:

 

Yeah, there is honestly a strong odor of "troll" to this thread now.  When ridiculous stuff like "This game is more grindy than any other mmo" gets thrown out there... you kind of have to take the hint that your chain is being yanked.

The beautiful thing is I do not memorize the trolls names. New or old.  I take pretty much everything at face value.  You say blue.  I acknowledge you see blue.  Your ass may be crazy but you say it is blue.  The best part is most folks have almost no impact on my headspace.  I rent out no room.  Shit still dont look blue to me though

[Captain Fabulous]

Dunno man, it's easier and faster than ever to get to level 50 even without the double-XP buff. And if you're a new player you should have to spend more time actually playing and learning how the game and your powersets work. Pretty much all MMOs have a steep learning curve, especially the older they get. Hell, jumping back into an MMO you haven't played in years is HARD, as so much has changed (I'm looking at you, GW2). You're almost better starting from scratch rather than trying to play one of your max-level characters.

[kelika2]

I leveled one alt on firefarming a few years ago without double exp

I think raw inf (no drops) was like 40m inf 1-50.  most of that was in the late 40s.

 

tons of variables like half exp in ae, some debt from afk and the drops that i didnt want to count.  like if you are leveling normally youd get level 25 recipes meanwhile ae drops nothing but level 50s

[Nyghtmaire]

The player with no influence after leveling is purely hypothetical. But the AE-leveled-new-player is a ridiculous straw man (gender neutral). 
 

That said, if the influence gains to 50 are minimal, what’s the harm again?

[ZemX]

2 minutes ago, Nyghtmaire said:

That said, if the influence gains to 50 are minimal, what’s the harm again?

 

Where's the harm in leaving it as is?  The OP asserts without proof that this is detrimental to new players.  But let's be serious.  Nobody is struggling in this game.  It is easy street compared to any other game out there.  

 

The way it's set up now makes perfect sense.  1XP gets normal Inf.  2XP gets none.  Cost/Benefit.  Up to the player.  The idea that this is too difficult for new players to understand is laughable.  It's also dead easy to earn what you need, even with 2XP on, even started brand new on Homecoming with nothing to your name.  Took me less than a week to figure that out when I joined.   

 

Almost two years later, I would guess I have a little less than a billion inf total sitting on alts and probably a couple more billion in IOs slotted in those alts.   Not a fortune compared to many here, but also not something I would say I lifted too many fingers to obtain.  I rarely spend time crafting and selling IOs.  Done it a bit.  Sold some converters.  More earlier on.  Not so many now.   Have a ton of merits on some toons.  I basically always run 2XP when leveling and I have never set one toe in any farm.

 

There's nothing to see here.  Which is why I suspect this is either a troll or is really about AE babies earning some scratch for sitting at a door.  Because there's no problem at all if you're actually playing the game.

[Rudra]

What is the benefit? Who is steering new players into double xp? And given that the drops are going to be the biggest money makers if you're farming to 50, how is the OP going to change anything? Those playing through the content using double xp boosters are still getting drops (of a lower level) that they can sell. And merits they can convert. And those merits are going to be much more useful to them. Those farming their way to 50 are already getting high level drops. So if the inf' is already there, as has been explained in this thread and as you acknowledge with the "The player with no influence after leveling is purely hypothetical" response, then what benefit does the OP provide? Other than making inf' even easier to get.

 

If you can get double xp and still get normal inf'? Then why not ask to get double xp and double inf'. So you can say that you are gaining as if normal play. That is a bogus argument and I am grateful no one has made such a request, but wouldn't that logic also apply here?

 

If you want to gain faster at one thing, you should give up something else to compensate. Otherwise just make the server like the test server and have everyone start at level 50 with everything they want. (Which I am not requesting happen.)

[Glacier Peak]

Too much xp granted in the early levels so it's easy to fly by content. Too many ways to generate inf throughout the leveling journey, let alone through the various in game economies. 

 

I don't understand why this is even being suggested.