Solarverse Posted July 3, 2019 Share Posted July 3, 2019 So I need help understanding. So my Fire Controller, the Immobilize prevents knock back, which means DPS and Khelds can fire away till their heart's content without any fear of retaliation from the team. However, my Gravity Controller (who is my favorite by-the-way) does not prevent knock back. Was this going to be changed at some point or is Gravity always going to be unable to prevent knock backs? P.S. Seems I recall in the early years of CoH that Gravity DID prevent knock backs. Did something change or am I just recalling incorrectly? SFX and Music Mods by Solarverse (Consolidated) WP/EM God Mode Tank Guide and Build Help Support the Return of Missing Code for Sound Files! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HelenCarnate Posted July 3, 2019 Share Posted July 3, 2019 It "should" prevent knockback by changing it into knockdown instead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rathulfr Posted July 3, 2019 Share Posted July 3, 2019 Gravity builds are the controller/dominator equivalent of Energy Blast builds: it's all about the knockback, baby. ;D @Rathstar Energy/Energy Blaster (50+3) on Everlasting Energy/Temporal Blaster (50+3) on Excelsior Energy/Willpower Sentinel (50+3) on Indomitable Energy/Energy Sentinel (50+1) on Torchbearer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solarverse Posted July 3, 2019 Author Share Posted July 3, 2019 It "should" prevent knockback by changing it into knockdown instead. I see the mobs get knocked back a lot with my immob applied. I do not think it changes it to knock down. If it does, I have never seen it happen. SFX and Music Mods by Solarverse (Consolidated) WP/EM God Mode Tank Guide and Build Help Support the Return of Missing Code for Sound Files! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coyote Posted July 3, 2019 Share Posted July 3, 2019 It "should" prevent knockback by changing it into knockdown instead. I see the mobs get knocked back a lot with my immob applied. I do not think it changes it to knock down. If it does, I have never seen it happen. Gravity's Immobilizes did not grant KB protection to mobs, unlike most other Controller Immobs. So probably when they went through the Immobs and changed the KB protection to conver KB to KD, they didn't bother changing Gravity (and maybe not Electric, as I recall, it had the same no-KB-protection benefit). Nowadays, what used to be a benefit has turned into a drawback. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solarverse Posted July 3, 2019 Author Share Posted July 3, 2019 It "should" prevent knockback by changing it into knockdown instead. I see the mobs get knocked back a lot with my immob applied. I do not think it changes it to knock down. If it does, I have never seen it happen. Gravity's Immobilizes did not grant KB protection to mobs, unlike most other Controller Immobs. So probably when they went through the Immobs and changed the KB protection to conver KB to KD, they didn't bother changing Gravity (and maybe not Electric, as I recall, it had the same no-KB-protection benefit). Nowadays, what used to be a benefit has turned into a drawback. Which leaves me wondering if this will ever change. SFX and Music Mods by Solarverse (Consolidated) WP/EM God Mode Tank Guide and Build Help Support the Return of Missing Code for Sound Files! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trickshooter Posted July 3, 2019 Share Posted July 3, 2019 Which leaves me wondering if this will ever change. It might. The new devs weren't intentionally excluding Grav and Elec, those sets were just already immune from the problem they were trying to fix. Buff Trick Arrows! | Buff Poison!Powerset Suggestions: Circus Performers | Telepathy | Symphonic InspirationOld Powerset Suggestions: Probability Distortion | Magnetism | Hyper-Intellect Some day, the prophecy will be fulfilled; Trick Arrows will be buffed and I will finally be allowed to die. https://twitter.com/trickshootah Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeneki Posted July 3, 2019 Share Posted July 3, 2019 The Gravity powers that stopped knockback were the holds, not the immobilizes (both the single-target and AoE holds). Yes, this is different from many control sets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Generator Posted July 3, 2019 Share Posted July 3, 2019 Hold on, does this mean that Fire Cages can make Bonfire (partially) usable? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solarverse Posted July 3, 2019 Author Share Posted July 3, 2019 Hold on, does this mean that Fire Cages can make Bonfire (partially) usable? Not too sure, I have a KB to KD in my Bonfire. So I can't actually answer that question. SFX and Music Mods by Solarverse (Consolidated) WP/EM God Mode Tank Guide and Build Help Support the Return of Missing Code for Sound Files! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Generator Posted July 3, 2019 Share Posted July 3, 2019 Hold on, does this mean that Fire Cages can make Bonfire (partially) usable? Not too sure, I have a KB to KD in my Bonfire. So I can't actually answer that question. And how does that work out? I know that changes the frequency of the Knockback/down pulse. Does it still happen often enough to be useful? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solarverse Posted July 3, 2019 Author Share Posted July 3, 2019 Hold on, does this mean that Fire Cages can make Bonfire (partially) usable? Not too sure, I have a KB to KD in my Bonfire. So I can't actually answer that question. And how does that work out? I know that changes the frequency of the Knockback/down pulse. Does it still happen often enough to be useful? Oh my God yes! It's as if they are on Ice Patch! Try using your Immob with it first though, you may get them to knock down more often that way. If so, I would like to see...may end up taking my KB to KD out if this is the case. But as of now, I am very happy with it SFX and Music Mods by Solarverse (Consolidated) WP/EM God Mode Tank Guide and Build Help Support the Return of Missing Code for Sound Files! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WindDemon21 Posted April 18, 2020 Share Posted April 18, 2020 On 7/3/2019 at 3:55 PM, Generator said: And how does that work out? I know that changes the frequency of the Knockback/down pulse. Does it still happen often enough to be useful? It does, more than ice slick in my experience still. And yes without the kb-kd they contant-no break-knockdown, but you have to SPAM your fire cages, and if one misses, they're getting flown. Grav and Elec definitley need their aoe immobilizes to get the kb-kd treatment that the others have. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MunkiLord Posted April 18, 2020 Share Posted April 18, 2020 On 7/3/2019 at 2:55 PM, Generator said: And how does that work out? I know that changes the frequency of the Knockback/down pulse. Does it still happen often enough to be useful? It works out as a game changer. Bonfire with the KB to KD IO is brokenly good. 2 The Trevor Project Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Generator Posted April 18, 2020 Share Posted April 18, 2020 It's so funny that the two of you both replied to this today, which is what, nine months later. I say that because I finally got around to leveling up my Fire/Fire Dominator, and just yesterday, I got him high enough to slot Bonfire and drop a Sudden Acceleration piece in it. Stupid amounts of fun. 😄 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MunkiLord Posted April 18, 2020 Share Posted April 18, 2020 Ha! I didn't even realize this was an old post. The Trevor Project Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twisted Toon Posted April 19, 2020 Share Posted April 19, 2020 6 hours ago, WindDemon21 said: It does, more than ice slick in my experience still. And yes without the kb-kd they contant-no break-knockdown, but you have to SPAM your fire cages, and if one misses, they're getting flown. Grav and Elec definitley need their aoe immobilizes to get the kb-kd treatment that the others have. I'm not sure that Grav's Immobs have -KB. I know the Holds do. I'll have to test this and make sure, but it seems to me that the Immobs didn't keep the enemy from flying back when hit by Propel. I could be misremembering though. It's frustrating that the /time holds for controllers doesn't have -KB. Also, doesn't have the impact mechanic that Grav gets either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WindDemon21 Posted April 19, 2020 Share Posted April 19, 2020 3 hours ago, Twisted Toon said: I'm not sure that Grav's Immobs have -KB. I know the Holds do. Grav immobilizes do not, they need the kb protection as well as the elec immobilizes. 9 hours ago, Generator said: It's so funny that the two of you both replied to this today, which is what, nine months later. I say that because I finally got around to leveling up my Fire/Fire Dominator, and just yesterday, I got him high enough to slot Bonfire and drop a Sudden Acceleration piece in it. Stupid amounts of fun. And yet the grav and elec immobilizes are still not fixed... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riverdusk Posted April 19, 2020 Share Posted April 19, 2020 18 hours ago, MunkiLord said: It works out as a game changer. Bonfire with the KB to KD IO is brokenly good. And sadly makes ice controllers brokenly underpowered in comparison now as a better version of one of their signature control powers is on a set that also does loads more damage than they can do. One of the things I wish would be looked at, ice control needs some love. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Without_Pause Posted April 20, 2020 Share Posted April 20, 2020 On 7/3/2019 at 2:37 PM, HelenCarnate said: It "should" prevent knockback by changing it into knockdown instead. To cover this response better, you can't change the immob powers themselves to be KD. It is the power which is doing the KB which needs the KD, see Khelds referenced by the OP. Top 10 Most Fun 50s. 1. Without Mercy: Claws/ea Scrapper. 2. Outsmart: Fort 3. Sneakers: Stj/ea Stalker. 4. Waterpark: Water/temp Blaster. 5. Project Next: Ice/stone Brute. 6. Mighty Matt: Rad/bio Brute. 7. Without Pause: Claws/wp Brute. 8. Emma Strange: Ill/dark. 9. Nothing But Flowers: Plant/storm Controller. 10. Obsidian Smoke: Fire/dark Corr. "Downtime is for mortals." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WindDemon21 Posted April 20, 2020 Share Posted April 20, 2020 2 hours ago, Without_Pause said: To cover this response better, you can't change the immob powers themselves to be KD. It is the power which is doing the KB which needs the KD, see Khelds referenced by the OP. The immobilize should be doing -kb, so yes turns them into knockdown. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Generator Posted April 20, 2020 Share Posted April 20, 2020 22 hours ago, Riverdusk said: And sadly makes ice controllers brokenly underpowered in comparison now as a better version of one of their signature control powers is on a set that also does loads more damage than they can do. One of the things I wish would be looked at, ice control needs some love. After playing this guy a bunch over the weekend, I'm not ready to say (Sudden Accel + Bonfire) > (Ice Slick) from a control standpoint, which is what I want from it. Don't get me wrong, it's very good, and vast improvement over how Bonfire works when it's Knockback, but the proc rate seems to be juuust low enough that some guys can keep their footing long enough to beat the crap out of me, much more so than with Ice Slick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Without_Pause Posted April 20, 2020 Share Posted April 20, 2020 2 hours ago, WindDemon21 said: The immobilize should be doing -kb, so yes turns them into knockdown. But you can't slot anything into the immob power to change it is what I was implying. Top 10 Most Fun 50s. 1. Without Mercy: Claws/ea Scrapper. 2. Outsmart: Fort 3. Sneakers: Stj/ea Stalker. 4. Waterpark: Water/temp Blaster. 5. Project Next: Ice/stone Brute. 6. Mighty Matt: Rad/bio Brute. 7. Without Pause: Claws/wp Brute. 8. Emma Strange: Ill/dark. 9. Nothing But Flowers: Plant/storm Controller. 10. Obsidian Smoke: Fire/dark Corr. "Downtime is for mortals." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WindDemon21 Posted April 20, 2020 Share Posted April 20, 2020 3 hours ago, Without_Pause said: But you can't slot anything into the immob power to change it is what I was implying. Oh yeah the powers themselves are broken. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peacemoon Posted April 20, 2020 Share Posted April 20, 2020 On 4/19/2020 at 8:44 AM, WindDemon21 said: Grav immobilizes do not, they need the kb protection as well as the elec immobilizes. And yet the grav and elec immobilizes are still not fixed... Grav immobilise has never stopped knockback. It has always been the holds that prevent knockback for Grav. This could get changed, but there is nothing to fix. Retired, October 2022. Fallout Engineer Rad/AR Defender || Peacemoon Empathy/Psi Defender || Svarteir Dark/Dark Controller Everlasting || UK Timezone Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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