Sentinels

I heard Sentinels were getting their Inherent reworked, but I found the class to be incredibly boring and I don't an Inherent is going to change that too much.

What would Sentinels play like if their secondary choices remained the same, but their Primaries were Dominator Assault choices?

I don't an Inherent is going to change that too much.

 

 

You never know.

Take away Fury and see if Brutes are still as beloved.

On the flip side, lets say we give Sentinels their own tweaked version of Fury, or even Domination.

Inherent can go a long way.

I feel like the general idea of the Sentinel's inherent is good, but it could use a tweak. Honestly, I feel like while the Offensive/Defensive Opportunity is an interesting choice in theory, you either only ever use one, or you're not able to choose without awkwardly waiting on a recharge much of the time.

Personally, I feel Opportunity's Offensive and Defensive should be rolled into one, and given an inherent clicky to activate like Domination.

I think changing an entire power selection might be more work than it's worth, but...

I would be interested in playing Sentinels with an Assault primary rather than a Ranged primary. Most fights end up in melee before they're over anyway, so having a few melee attacks (not just from pool powers) would be really nice.

I would suggest a testing implementation first, using an Assault set that doesn't mimic existing Sentinel primary themes, like Thorny Assault or Martial Assault. If that were well received, then start looking into the viability of altering existing theme sets to match Assault parameters. (and if that works out, we could proliferate Munitions Assault to Dominators so they have a "guns" option!)

I feel like the general idea of the Sentinel's inherent is good, but it could use a tweak. Honestly, I feel like while the Offensive/Defensive Opportunity is an interesting choice in theory, you either only ever use one, or you're not able to choose without awkwardly waiting on a recharge much of the time.

 

Personally, I feel Opportunity's Offensive and Defensive should be rolled into one, and given an inherent clicky to activate like Domination.

I can't really disagree with most of what you said here.  I don't know if Domination's the right way, but most often I'm getting an Offensive Opportunity on the Minion that just died from the attack I made without realizing it was Opportunity time, or having to change targets to go Defensive so it ticks while I change targets.

I think changing an entire power selection might be more work than it's worth, but...

I would be interested in playing Sentinels with an Assault primary rather than a Ranged primary. Most fights end up in melee before they're over anyway, so having a few melee attacks (not just from pool powers) would be really nice.

 

I would suggest a testing implementation first, using an Assault set that doesn't mimic existing Sentinel primary themes, like Thorny Assault or Martial Assault. If that were well received, then start looking into the viability of altering existing theme sets to match Assault parameters. (and if that works out, we could proliferate Munitions Assault to Dominators so they have a "guns" option!)

Maybe not all, but some?  Sonic (the first Sentinel I played and current highest Sentinel) doesn't have an Assault version, so would be left out of this.

Or, this may sound a little weird, but just give them both options.  The Sentinel could go Fire Blast or Fire Assault as they choose.  This would actually get a better idea of desirability over all, as they can review the statistics.  Let's face it, comparing Martial Assault vs Fire Blast isn't going to go over very well in terms of comparison.

I think changing an entire power selection might be more work than it's worth, but...

I would be interested in playing Sentinels with an Assault primary rather than a Ranged primary. Most fights end up in melee before they're over anyway, so having a few melee attacks (not just from pool powers) would be really nice.

 

I would suggest a testing implementation first, using an Assault set that doesn't mimic existing Sentinel primary themes, like Thorny Assault or Martial Assault. If that were well received, then start looking into the viability of altering existing theme sets to match Assault parameters. (and if that works out, we could proliferate Munitions Assault to Dominators so they have a "guns" option!)

 

Maybe not all, but some?  Sonic (the first Sentinel I played and current highest Sentinel) doesn't have an Assault version, so would be left out of this.

 

Or, this may sound a little weird, but just give them both options.  The Sentinel could go Fire Blast or Fire Assault as they choose.  This would actually get a better idea of desirability over all, as they can review the statistics.  Let's face it, comparing Martial Assault vs Fire Blast isn't going to go over very well in terms of comparison.

Personally, I'm in favor of as many options as I can get, but I fear some would find it confusing to have to choose between Fire Blast and Fire Assault, and they would probably err on the side of lowest common denominator of understanding. And yeah, I'm not saying to get rid of powersets that don't have an Assault version, but to modify them into an Assault version to keep them comparable to the other changes. Also, like the Munitions Assault version of Assault Rifle I suggested (I guess I just suggested it without specifying it would be a modification to AR), that would mean we'd have a Sonic Assault to copy over for Doms as well.

It's better to introduce additional Assault primaries than to force anyone who like current Blast primaries to "lose" their character.

I just want to point out that the inherent is being looked at - nnot their primary or secondary powers. There has been absolutely no discussion (or need for a discussion) on changing the attack type.

Yeah I did forget about the part of people's current Sentinel's basically being borked if they swapped out primaries, maybe an entirely different AT with Assault Primaries would be interesting, but giving them Defensive type secondaries would make them...a little too similar to Sentinels maybe?  They'd need to have a different gimmick/inherent. 

One idea would be taking something like Defiance but:

Inherent: Everytime you use a Melee Power, you get a x% damage increase to your next Ranged attack.  This damage bonus is reset when you use a Ranged attack.

Everytime you use a Ranged Power, you get a y& damage increase to your next Melee attack.  This damage bonus is reset when you use a Melee attack.

It's better to introduce additional Assault primaries than to force anyone who like current Blast primaries to "lose" their character.

I disagree.  I would rather have the assault set on my fire/fire sentinel, but if they introduced both blast & assault sets, then I would have to start over from scratch because one cannot respec into a new powerset.

Kinda hard on all the Fire Sentinels who dont want their powers to change?  I mean, sure, you would be happy...

When I saw the Sentinel as an option for the first time, I honestly thought the Primary would be Assault. It made sense to me to pair that with a defensive set, because as you move in and out of melee range, you'd want some way to survive better. When I saw it was actually Blast as the Primary, I thought maybe the powers would be a little different. Nope. Same power set that you can find on Blasters, Corruptors, and Defenders.

And while I would love with all my heart for an Assault / Defense AT set up just like the Sentinel, I know the answer is NOT changing the current power sets from Blast to Assault. The idea of the Cottage Rule is a good one, and should really only be broken in extreme situations. Whether this situation is extreme enough to justify it is up the Developers who designed it, not me, but I would say it isn't. The current AT functions with the power sets it has (ignoring the Inherent), and forcing players to adapt to a change in what powers they have would be a terrible idea for the most part. I also don't know if adding Assault power sets as primary options is a good idea either because, for better or worse, they play and would have to be balanced a little differently.

Really, this just feels like a quagmire with no real good answer, and should be taken as a opportunity for learning for developing future ATs.

I disagree.  I would rather have the assault set on my fire/fire sentinel, but if they introduced both blast & assault sets, then I would have to start over from scratch because one cannot respec into a new powerset.

So basically "Screw everyone else.  This would let me play a toon that I would rather play without forcing me to put in the time to level them up"?

Glad you aren't calling the shots.

I like the Sentinel inherent in theory. The problem is that it's so awkward to use. I always get it full right as a pack is going down and then it decays. I have to avoid using my first two attacks or waste it on a mob that's almost already dead.

All I personally would want is for the decay to be removed or massively slowed down. Plus, don't tie opportunity to the basic attacks, just give me two seperate buttons so I can hit it and open with whatever I want.

I think the issue with Sentinels is that they were mid-range (Lower Range Blasts than Blaster, Corruptor and Defender) and supposed to be tanky. But in actuality their damage isn't high enough and their tankiness isn't good enough. They need some alterations to the stats and caps also to help push the tanky mid-range blaster.

Their passive should be similar to Fury. Their single target attacks and being damaged increases their AoE damage as the gauge fills. This would make being mid-range purposeful since you are close enough to take damage and make use of the Cones and AoE. I also think the damage auras should be added back but with a Taunt mechanic added only to it. This would give them off-tank capability without having Taunt or a Pokevoke mechanic all the time.

I heard Sentinels were getting their Inherent reworked,

Citation needed.

It occurs to me that such a change would be redundant.

A mixed ranged-melee primary and defensive secondary already exists as Arachnos Soldier.

A mixed ranged-melee primary and defensive secondary already exists as Arachnos Soldier.

I'm not a fan of those.  Would prefer something that offered the same style of play with more diversity in how you attack than shoot gun & smash w/mace.

A mixed ranged-melee primary and defensive secondary already exists as Arachnos Soldier.

I'm not a fan of those.  Would prefer something that offered the same style of play with more diversity in how you attack than shoot gun & smash w/mace.

That's not fair. They also have "smash with gun" and "shoot with mace."  ;)

I don't an Inherent is going to change that too much.

 

 

 

You never know.

 

Take away Fury and see if Brutes are still as beloved.

 

On the flip side, lets say we give Sentinels their own tweaked version of Fury, or even Domination.

 

Inherent can go a long way.

How dare you make sense!

I heard Sentinels were getting their Inherent reworked,

Citation needed.

What I feel comfortable saying is that there are some specific melee power sets that are being looked at, the Sentinel inherent is going to go through a huge overhaul, and there is some big unfinished work relating tankers.

It's better to introduce additional Assault primaries than to force anyone who like current Blast primaries to "lose" their character.

I disagree.  I would rather have the assault set on my fire/fire sentinel, but if they introduced both blast & assault sets, then I would have to start over from scratch because one cannot respec into a new powerset.

I would hate to be forced to abandon my Sentinels with the current set because someone had the bright idea of yanking the rug out from under a character I currently like quite a bit. If you are unsatisfied, then you get to do a new option from the ground up.

To be specific to the OP, I abhor this notion. I do not want an assault set, and if sentinels were changed into this I'd probably stop playing mine, which would be pretty damned annoying since I've got my main as a vet level 37 sentinel.

What I feel comfortable saying is that there are some specific melee power sets that are being looked at, the Sentinel inherent is going to go through a huge overhaul, and there is some big unfinished work relating tankers.

Thanks, Sunsette!

Personally, I don’t mind the inherent being improved.  I would have a problem with a radical redesign of Sentinel powersets after a large group of people have been playing them for several weeks now.  That’s ground that has to be tread carefully.

I'll say it again... as it was quoted already by Captain Powerhouse: The INHERENT is being looked at ... not the Primary powersets (Blasts). No need to get all paranoid - the only thing being looked at is the Sentinel Inherent.

I agree that the inherent needs some work. I find that defensive opportunity is so negligible in effect that I don't even take the tier two power on my sentinels to avoid wasting the chance at offensive opportunity (which may not be anything spectacular, but still beats defensive).

Oh, and one other suggestion vis a vis the inherent, could they pick a different color (assuming defensive opportunity remains) than green? Before I read up on the sentinel I kept assuming that my tier two blast was on auto click for some reason.