When to slot IO sets

[GamerRick]

So I think I am starting to understand how to use converters to get different IO set pieces I want. 
 

My question is, when should I start adding them to my build?  I see many low level recipes for an IO set but why would I waste money/converters to slot an IO set at like level 15. I know the set has a bonuses but as you level the individual enhancement percentage increase is going to fall behind quickly and you will need to upgrade. 
 

Right now I usually wait till level 47 so I can slot level 50s. The personal issue I have is that the end game for me is pretty much creating and playing alts. I play the level 50 for a while and get bored then move on. 
 

I know this is probably subjective and may have been asked before (try using search) but I was wondering am I missing something about using those low level IO sets. 

[VileTerror]

You might get some good mileage out of Attuned versions of IOs then.  They level up with you, up to their maximum level, or if you Exemplar a lot, you don't lose the Enhancement Bonuses.  Note:  You don't need to Attune Purple IOs, since they get the benefits of Exemplaring regardless.

 

https://paragonwiki.com/wiki/Exemplar_Effects_on_Enhancements

[Sif]

In addition to the above mentioned attuning, there's also value in frankenslotting (can be helpful when you're very slot starved earlier on) as well as any of the procs (e.g. the Stalker ATO procs are incredibly powerful).

[GamerRick]

Thank you for the quick replies. This makes sense. I can see how attuned versions would be great and/or having powerful procs at low level. 
 

The link was very informative. 
 

So it raises another question. When converting an IO can it convert to an attuned version?

[Shred Monkey]

2 minutes ago, VileTerror said:

You might get some good mileage out of Attuned versions of IOs then.  They level up with you, up to their maximum level, or if you Exemplar a lot, you don't lose the Enhancement Bonuses.  Note:  You don't need to Attune Purple IOs, since they get the benefits of Exemplaring regardless.

 

https://paragonwiki.com/wiki/Exemplar_Effects_on_Enhancements

I agree with this recommendation.   I slot attuned IOs in my build as soon as I have enough slots for them.  Generally I try to stay with ones that are also in my level 50 build, too.  Usually the slotting begins around level 22 with some of the standards.... The +recovery uniques IOs in health and Stamina.  Possibly the +3 defense IOs in tough.  Then comes the 6-slotted thunderstrikes in a ranged toon, or the 4-slotted kinetic combats in a melee toons to set up my defenses.  Also if there's something uniquely great in the ATOs, I stick that in as early as possible.   

 

I would say it's usually around level 35 that I really get a true IO build set up.

 

 

[Frostbiter]

 

1 minute ago, GamerRick said:

Thank you for the quick replies. This makes sense. I can see how attuned versions would be great and/or having powerful procs at low level. 
 

The link was very informative. 
 

So it raises another question. When converting an IO can it convert to an attuned version?

When you can slot the IO that you want to Convert. You can only convert slotted IOs.

[VileTerror]

uh . . . I Convert IOs in my inventory all the time.  In fact, I've -never- Converted a Slotted IO.  

Did you mean Attune, Frostbiter?  But you can also get the Attuned versions of Enhancements straight from the market, since the IOs are bucketed across level/Attunement anyway.

[SwitchFade]

I build all my toons for smooth level progression. Several powers are always at 5 or 6 slots by 31-33 and ready for attuned sets. I slot iO sets as early as I can, health and end by 10, and sets starting usually around 29-31, adding in more as  i progress.

 

Attuned is the way to go, except for purples, which are attuned inherent and should be +5'd at 50. So, slot em as early as you can, and build for fun and effect.

[ScrewlooseCohh]

6 hours ago, GamerRick said:

So it raises another question. When converting an IO can it convert to an attuned version?

 

No non-attuned IOs never convert to attuned IOs.

 

You can use a Converter on an Attuned IO and it changes it to a different Attuned IO, but it is a bit more random than converting non-Attuned IOs because there is something screwy with the way it works out what level they are so there are a wider range of sets that it can Convert into.  I have seen posts about this but the basic info I took was don't use Converters on Attuned IOs .

 

regards, Screwloose

"I am not young enough to know everything."

[Haijinx]

just buy them already Attuned, Slot them as soon as they fit. 

[Frostbiter]

Yes I meant Attune.
😕

Edited February 21, 2020 by Frostbiter

[tidge]

11 hours ago, GamerRick said:

So I think I am starting to understand how to use converters to get different IO set pieces I want. 
 

My question is, when should I start adding them to my build?  I see many low level recipes for an IO set but why would I waste money/converters to slot an IO set at like level 15. I know the set has a bonuses but as you level the individual enhancement percentage increase is going to fall behind quickly and you will need to upgrade.

The P2W offers 'free' IOs that can be slotted at level 1; I usually grab those to drop into attack powers in the early levels.

 

At level 10, I will drop an attuned Panacea proc into health. The little extra oomph always helps, so I try to add it ASAP. Similarly: the Performance Shifter proc +End is ready for Stamina at level 17/20. I never skip on a travel power, and whatever power (usually Fly or Mystic Flight) is usually chosen at or before level 10. On most toons, that power gets a Universal Travel Blessing of the Zephyr: Knockback Protection (+4) ASAP. The enemies with KB/KD as controls (hard or soft) start showing up at this level and they never really go away.

 

Now about sets: My SG base has a significant number of Overwhelming Force and PVP IOs (a mix of Attuned and 50+) in storage so the attuned ones start filling out attack powers at level 10 (I honestly can't recall if you can slot these before 10, but they work down to lvl 7), even if they aren't part of the end-game build. There are some assorted attuned leftovers from other sets as well. Respecs are easy to come by, so that's how these are recycled. At level 22, attuned Luck of the Gambler Global Recharge will be slotted in the powers that take it (most toons want Global Recharge). Again, the SG base has these at the ready from converter roulette but they are also on the market.

 

I will pay attention to certain set bonuses that I want and try to plan out the slot placement when leveling up. For example, there are a couple of defense and healing sets which give desirable (to me) bonuses at 6-slots. While leveling up, attack powers may stay at 4-slots so that I can get the full set bonuses from the healing/defense/fear powers as IMO many of the 'optimal' (for me) attack set bonuses are for higher level IOs and can wait for slots & respecs at 40+.

[Erydanus]

There's a few things to consider with this question.

 

1. First, overall enhancement set IOs with their multiple pieces are more powerful than baseline generic IOs of the same level. When you have a 2 parter, those 2 pieces add up to 125% of the enhancement you'd get in a single IO. For example at level 25 a damage IO is 32% but an Accuracy/Damage enhancement is 20%/20% or 40% total. At level 50 it's 26.5%/26.5% for a total of 52% enhancement, beating a generic with 42.4%. Three part pieces are actually 50% more enhancement than a plain enhancement. So there is bang for your buck with these pieces.  

 

2. Except sometimes it's not useful. Sometimes set enhancements apply to parameters that are not really that relevant. Probably not a complete waste, but if you were limited to generic IOs/SOs, they maybe enhance something you wouldn't worry about, like ever. You see this waste a lot when people cram endmod sets into stamina for the bonuses they confer, basically the recharge and end reduction mixed in with the end mod is going to waste. But sometimes all these enhancement parameters just go to waste. Have you ever slotted a set that had so much accuracy you were over cap? 

 

3. Planning sets for powers is all well and good but the numbers people mostly go by are level 50. I've actually run into the situation where I slotted a power with a full set at a mid-level, and it was even attuned, and I got something like 75% damage out of it, because the set only had 90% damage enhancement AT level 50. If I had just put 1 acc and 3 damage generic IOs in, I'd have actually had better numbers. Sure, the set gave me some bonuses and some recharge and end reduction, but it wasn't a power I used a lot, and I really just wanted that power to do damage. I ended up unslotting a piece and sticking a damage IO in there for leveling.

 

4. Some set bonuses are nothing but a white rabbit luring you down a hole. They're not useful. Sure, if you're gonna use that set for its values, accept that 2% run speed buff but if you're not actually on a mission to boost your run speed for a play style reason, it's no different than buying something you don't need just because it's on sale. Even with bonuses that seem like they'd be valuable in combat, ask yourself if it will really make a difference before chasing it. Now I'm not saying you can't with a plan stack a whole bunch of tiny bonuses to cap yourself on smash/lethal resistance, not at all. I am saying if you're not actually doing that is a 2% smash/lethal resist bonus going to be as valuable as say putting another damage enhancement in the power you use the most.

 

So, keeping these points in mind here is my take on this:

 

1. While leveling, using pieces of sets mixed and matched to get great values (Frankenslotting) is the most effective thing you can do. 2-part IOs at level 24 and 3 part enhancements at level 21 are 38-39% enhancement, blowing right past +3 SOs.  Often I find that using the same 2 or 3 parts from 2 different sets nicely doubles down on the core enhancement values you really want. For instance with a power like Shadowfall using the Defense, Defense/Endurance, and Defense/Endurance/Recharge pieces from 2 different sets at level 25 values pretty much exactly caps the power on those 3 parameters.  

 

2. If there are sets whose enhancement numbers look good to you while leveling, then go ahead and use them at any level above 22! If you get attuned sets they can grow with you as well. ATOs for instance, just use them as soon as you get them (and of course they're special so their #s are even higher.) However if the set numbers are not good I would not use them while leveling just to have set bonuses unless, again, the bonus is explicitly something you need.

 

 

[Ironblade]

Firstly, I've only been recreating characters I had on live so I already know what kind of +recovery or type of defense they might need.  I had 37 50's so it's probably going to be a while before I create any 'new' characters.  For a powerset I'm not familiar with, there will be some experimentation and respec'ing as they level up.

 

If a character is going to need +recovery, stealth, -KNB, +3% defense unique or something like those, I'll slot it as early as possible.  After that, I start slotting sets around level 32 (level 35 IO's).  For the overwhelming majority of my characters, these will never get replaced.  I think I only ever had 2 characters that I respec'ed at 50 to fully optimize their builds  - my main, Ironblade, and a dominator.

 

By the time I get to around level 40, I have *ALL* the IO's I will need for the final build sitting in my trays waiting to be slotted as I level up.  In my experience, this gives me pretty good builds and really doesn't involve much effort or investment.  I only worry about absolutely mix/maxing my main (who is currently vet level 29 - he gets played a lot).

As for what IO's to slot, don't overlook frankenslotting.  Sometimes it's super effective and super cheap.  For example, +regen is generally the first bonus in a set that offers it.  I had an invuln tank with +360% regen.  That amount of regen on tank hit points with Dull Pain is just brutal.  And it was dirt cheap.  I'm pretty sure that build only cost me 80-100 million back on live - it would be much less now.  My average build back then was 200-300 million.  Ironblade's build cost me around a billion but was worth more like 4 billion at the high point of the market.

 

My opinion is that you can get about 3/4 of optimum character performance for a pittance and that's really all you need unless it's going to be one of your main characters.

[Yomo Kimyata]

As soon as you can afford them.

[MunkiLord]

I slot them after I get to level 50, but I farm my way there.

[The_Warpact]

And here my dumbass has been farting around with SO's all the way to 47, damn when did all this happen it wasn't back on live.

[merrypessimist]

1 hour ago, The_Warpact said:

And here my dumbass has been farting around with SO's all the way to 47, damn when did all this happen it wasn't back on live.

All what? IOs? Those came about not too long after CoV released.  They've been part of the game for more than ten years.  Homecoming simply made them cheaper to acquire and utilize, generally speaking.  

 

Though I will say the Homecoming devs are responsible for... I want to say five brand new, never existed on Live IO sets.  Might be four, but it's somewhere in there.

[The_Warpact]

16 minutes ago, merrypessimist said:

All what? IOs? Those came about not too long after CoV released.  They've been part of the game for more than ten years.  Homecoming simply made them cheaper to acquire and utilize, generally speaking.  

 

Though I will say the Homecoming devs are responsible for... I want to say five brand new, never existed on Live IO sets.  Might be four, but it's somewhere in there.

No the attuned sets, how you can slot them and they lvl with you.

[Heraclea]

I tend to have a fair number of basic and useful crafted IOs like the Panacea, Numina, Miracle procs lying around on base.  I get them by crafting the random yellow recipes that drop, converting those enhancements into rares, and then gambling with them until they land on something useful.  Problem is that they are in ample supply in level 50 versions, but they're wanted at level 7.  I catalyze an existing high level character's set IO, unslot that, and replace it with one that character can slot but the lowbie can't.  This way the lowbie gets an attuned version that can be slotted at 7, 17, or 27 and so forth. 

 

My other chief use for catalysts, apart from ATOs and the like, is when you get a recipe for a set with good bonuses, but it's a set that drops from 25 to 50 and you got one on the low end of the scale.  Craft it and spend a catalyst. 

 

For a melee I like to have as many Kinetic Combats as they can support as early as possible.  Some I buy through AH bids; that can take a while for them to fill, though.  I also buy four of the Accuracy/Damage recipes with at 20 merits apiece.  I then use 'odd' numbers of merits to buy converters which I use to convert three of the Accuracy/Damages into something else in the set.  That way those enhancements cost one or two rather than fifty merits. 

[merrypessimist]

On 2/21/2020 at 8:05 PM, The_Warpact said:

No the attuned sets, how you can slot them and they lvl with you.

Also a Live dev innovation.