Weekly Discussion 45: Favorite and Least Favorite Story Lines

[GM Miss]

Weekly discussion 45 - Week 4/05/20-4/11/20:

⚔️ YOU VOTED: Lets talk about our favorite and least favorite story lines. I'll make a list at the end of the week of arcs for people try! ⚔️

 

❓ Things to think about:

 

>Hero story arcs: https://paragonwiki.com/wiki/Hero_Story_Arcs
>Villain story arcs: https://paragonwiki.com/wiki/Villain_Story_Arcs
>Praetoria: https://paragonwiki.com/wiki/Praetoria
>What arcs made you want to do them again and again?
>Which ones blew your mind the first time you did them?
>What arcs features your favorite maps?
>Which did you do once - and then never ever ever go back to?
>What zone would you like to see more story arcs in?

 

Don't just use these prompts, talk about anything Story lines!

 

Let's Chat 😄

[ArchVileTerror]

Windmill slam Dr. Graves for worst!
https://forums.homecomingservers.com/topic/9949-the-twinshot-trap/

 

One of the best mission start blurbs, though, was for a Mr. Bocor mission:
"The sweet smell of cinnamon mingles disturbing with the stink of sulphur."

It's atmospheric, descriptive, and (most importantly) provides sensory information without stealing agency from the player to define their character!

[Lines]

I genuinely thought this thread was directed at me for a moment.

 

Johnny Sonata was one I walked away from thinking, 'dang, that was cool.' I loved a lot of the St Martial arcs.

 

A lot of the old hero arcs are a grind to me. Particularly around the 30s, none of the plots are very conclusive and they really drag out. I just did Phillipa Mareaux's arc. It had barely any substance, but could have been kinda cool with a theme of mind control.

 

I think a lot of these older blueside stories have a trend of you showing up after the cool thing has happened and you only hear about the cool thing through the contact.

 

For stories I'd love to see:

I'd love to see the hazard zones given story arcs of their own. Especially Crey's folly. That place is so cool!

 

I may be wrong, but there doesn't seem to be a story for the Zigursky prison. You'd think it would be teeming with narrative.

Edited April 5, 2020 by Lines

[Bolt of Purity]

1 hour ago, Lines said:

I'd love to see the hazard zones given story arcs of their own. Especially Crey's folly. That place is so cool!

 

I may be wrong, but there doesn't seem to be a story for the Zigursky prison. You'd think it would be teeming with narrative.

+1 to both 👍

[Heraclea]

I must admit that the 'exploit' of base teleporting has breathed new life into old content.  Material I might have avoided like Unity Plague and Scroll of Tielekku turns into enjoyable content once the issue of the missions being in random zones all over the city becomes mostly a solved problem.  South IP is still something of an issue though.  I remain a fan of Croatoa, and just levelled a character through the Hollows and found that quite enjoyable despite too many street hunts.  Old style contacts need to be much more forthcoming with their story arcs, and never refer you to Security Chiefs.   And any older mission that involves more than one door or train. or moves the goalposts after you finish one mission, ought to be treated as a story arc and have merits awarded.

 

I probably won't do Maxwell Christopher's Nosferatu arc again unless on a character specifically tuned for it. 

 

Oddly, the content I intensely dislike tends to be newer.  The lower level content in Night Ward involving Drudges and the like is simply unplayable.  Never expected to get permamezzed and die on a tanker because of extended forced AFKs.  Not fun at all.  Arbiter Marchand offers long missions of drudgery, dangerous bosses, and annoying 'helpers', for tiny rewards.  So does Field Agent Nance.  Protean was way overpowered, and that arc definitely ought to have given more than six merits.  Newer content is often marred by useless maps.  It is way too easy to get lost on, say, the Admiral Sutter TF, where you can't find the rest of your team and the map gives no clues how to find them.  Even if you can see them, you can't get there from here. 

 

I have nothing but compliments for New Dark Astoria though.  There are very few bad maps there,  I kind of liked the Major, rather sparing on the flavor text,  but the ending seemed anticlimactic.  Same with Mr. G; not sure how that fits into lore.   And I really enjoy the Tsoo storyline in Steel Canyon involving the museum director.  Try to get that one in on every character in those levels. 

 

I have started running more lowbie content on redside, and finally got a character through Praetoria last month.  Did not do the grand tour there.  Towards the end I just wanted to get out and escape into the wider world.  Something to do once for old time's sake, but 20 levels of solo only content is quite a stretch.  And you aren't going to make that stuff team friendly without toning down the mobs and revising the alignment system, which was unique but is inherently antisocial. 

Edited April 6, 2020 by Heraclea

[Doc_Scorpion]

re: Praetoria
 

2 hours ago, Heraclea said:

Something to do once for old time's sake, but 20 levels of solo only content is quite a stretch.

I have a character that, for concept reasons, needs to come through Praetoria...  But I'm really struggling to convince myself to do so.  I've done a lot of stuff here on HC for old time's sake...  But I went through the pain of Praetoria once on live, and that was a struggle to get myself motivated to complete.  (In the end, I blew through the last of it on a Double XP weekend just to be *DONE* and get the character blueside.)

[Turric]

12 hours ago, Lines said:

I'd love to see the hazard zones given story arcs of their own. Especially Crey's folly. That place is so cool!

 

I may be wrong, but there doesn't seem to be a story for the Zigursky prison. You'd think it would be teeming with narrative.

This is a great idea. For the Zig Prison idea, perhaps work in some Family oriented stuff. Is there even a big boss for the Family? I do not recall having ever fought one, at least not on blue side.

 

While we're at it, other hazard zones like Boomtown and Perez Park could have used a story arc too. Maybe. Boomtown is kind of a crap zone but some kind of Council thing there that has to do with the War Walkers would have been cool. Or a 5th Column story?

 

If it were me, I would redesign some of the existing arcs so that they were contained within a single zone (mostly) and told a story about the neighborhoods as well, giving the setting some more flavor. Maybe some of the higher level stuff is more city wide. But I feel like some of the enemy factions are missing storytelling potential. Especially the Tsoo and the Family. That's my two influence.

[Gulbasaur]

17 hours ago, GM Miss said:

>What zone would you like to see more story arcs in?

With the exception of the Hollow and Striga, the Hazard zones basically have nothing going on in them at all, other than the odd giant monster. Eden basically only has the Eden Trial, which doesn't even really take place in the zone - you spend most of your time in an instance.

 

Crey's Folly has one of the more varied Hero-side maps with things like the Lost shanty town but there is almost no reason to go there.

[Lines]

3 hours ago, Turric said:

If it were me, I would redesign some of the existing arcs so that they were contained within a single zone (mostly) and told a story about the neighborhoods as well, giving the setting some more flavor. Maybe some of the higher level stuff is more city wide. But I feel like some of the enemy factions are missing storytelling potential. Especially the Tsoo and the Family. That's my two influence.

Totally this. I don't think it would take much within each narrative to align each plot to a certain neighbourhood. Give a reason why the thing is happening there and nowhere else.

 

It wouldn't just make the arcs less of a drag to run around, but enrich them by making them respond to the world rather than give the missions some random door somewhere in the city.

[Greycat]

I enjoy the Kheld arcs enough to keep running them.

Veats, I run to 10 for the cosutme slot and never touch the arcs again.

 

Other than that?

I want to find the Praetoria story enjoyable. I don't like it mechanically, though. Lots of things that are just not fun on a lowbie (not to mention "Hey,  go pick some flowers..." feeling like a time waster.) I've gone through them, but getting everything done... I didn't get through it four times. (More, actually, if you want to do the "report to the other side" stuff.)

 

 

Dislikes *tend* to stick out as single missions, though (like "Hey, deliver this CD to the person on the other side of skyway!" *delivers* "Oh, thanks, my kid needed these newspaper clippings." Really? Or the villain morality mission where you've defeated Frostfire in the past... even most of my villains wouldn't do something flat out stupid like that in the presented situation.) Other than that... *thinks* the "we're both idiots!" Willy Wheeler.

[Dz131]

Best is probably the DA one that ends with a giant battle of all the factions againest MoT.

 

Worst are any legacy CoX contacts, like Khalida.

[Heraclea]

1 hour ago, Gulbasaur said:

With the exception of the Hollow and Striga, the Hazard zones basically have nothing going on in them at all, other than the odd giant monster.

Faultline was originally a hazard zone, and it too has a storyline. 

[Virtual Green]

As a content-craving player, I tend to enjoy playing most of the arcs that the game has to offer, based on both writing and replay value. While I'll agree that most of the old school SAs have a tendency to drag on in terms of rythm (hunts.. so many hunts..), the majority of them usually hold up pretty well. And given that I've come to have a few favorites over the years, I'll try my best to be concise and list a few of them.

But SAs (and lore) are my favorite things in the game (right after the character creation process) and I can't thank the HC team enough for having written two fresh ones, which are pretty darn great!

 

Blueside : Roy Cooling's "Bad People, Good Intentions" (Talos Island)

 

Definitely my favorite SA in the whole game, Cooling's arc features exceptional writing, a deeper focus on the game world's own system (the mediporter system and its availability to citizens) and the introduction to a new, challenging enemy group (although not so new for redside players, at the time). This arc feels like one of the most "cinematographic" in the game, IMHO (despite not having any cutscenes, funnily enough, it feels like watching a thriller or action movie, from the immersive and dynamic setpieces (the sunken boat) to the action sequences (the SWAT raid with the four PPD NPCs), to the big action finale on top of the Sky Raider base... This SA has it all (add in the fact that it's the first arc (level-wise) that links the Sky Raiders to the Malta Group).

 

Honorable mentions :

- the Steel Canyon arcs (Graham Easton/Laura Lockhart) : some of the most fun (and heartwrenching, in Laura's case) low-level arcs in the game, and some of the only arcs to focus on both the Tsoos and the 5th Column, these SAs have some great writing and badges to offer. Special mention goes to Laura's arc, however, for the sheer replay value it offers thanks to the Ouroboros system (that not many players know of, sadly), which grants another badge and adds another layer to the arc.

- Crimson's "World Wide Red" (Peregrine Island) : one of the longest and most enduring old-school arcs, Crimson's story against the Malta Group feels like CoX's version of a Tom Clancy's novel : with double-crosses, twists and a surprise spawn by one very large Kronos Titan, this SA remains one of the most lore-heavy arcs in the game, as well as a pretty challenging (and rewarding) arc, pitting you against some of the game's nastiest enemies.

- The Dark Watcher's "The Horror of War" (RWZ) : the epilogue of the Rikti War storyline and one of the most somber arcs in the game, the Watcher's SA gives a definitive answer to one of the game's longest running storylines (what caused the Rikti War?), featuring one of the game's most tragic deaths and a final mission with a great twist (and a particularly impressive AV sandwhich!). But as the title of that final mission implies, "The Horror of War" remains of the only arcs that makes you feel like you truly "save the world".

 

Redside : Dean McArthur's "Me, Myself and My Other Selves" (Sharkhead Isle) / Bane Spider Ruben's "Destiny Follows" (Cap au Diable)

 

One of the common criticisms regarding most of the redside arcs is that the player character tends to feel like a lackey or henchman to their contact. Dean's and Ruben's arcs both succeed in making the villain feel like the actual boss of the story, and the result is some of the funniest and endearing arcs in the Rogue Isles. While the former is a high-fiving scoundrel who only wants to make you rich, the latter is a pretty blasé Bane Spider just doing his job in assisting an up-and-coming Destined One. Both arcs feature some hilarious dialogs and clever writing, making them some of the most entertaining SAs this side of the Rogue Isles, IMHO.

 

Honorable mentions :

- Vincent Ross's "Old Friends, New Enemies and New Opportunities" (SH) : the villainous counterpart to Cooling's arc, Ross's SA also dives deep into redside's lore, specifically surrounding the mystery of the Leviathan and the Blood Coral. While the arc itself is especially well-written and challenging, its true strength lies in its ability to connect to the player's past contacts, as Ross's SA allows villains to "doublecross" their contact by bringing in one of the older Sharkhead ones (Maros, Ansaldo or Dubrowski) and adding several sub-objectives to most of the SA's missions.

- Seer Marino's "Oh, Wretched Man!" (Mercy Island) : one of redside's most revered arcs, Marino's tragic story is one of investigation, betrayals and heartbreak as the player character dives deep into the past of both Ghost Widow and more specifically, her henchman Wretch.

- Viridian's "The Conference of Evil" (Grandville) : one of the most straightforward yet enjoyable Grandville arcs, Viridian's arc allows the player to engage with some of the fiercest AVs in the game, resulting in a one-of-a-kind finale (with a twist).

 

Praetoria's content also deserves some love, of course : the 1-20 SAs have some of the best and darkest writings in the game (Imperial City's Crusader arc, for instance), and both of the Wards offer some challenging stories.

My apologies for the long post!

[ArchVileTerror]

Don't apologize, Green.  I think you really hit the nail on the head quite a few times there.  Kudos.

[Redlynne]

12 hours ago, Heraclea said:

South IP is still something of an issue though.

Brickstown Tram > Tunnel to IP > In South IP next to Magic Store

Enter Paragon Dance Party > Exit Paragon Dance Party at Power Island in South IP

 

Navigating to South IP is not that hard ...

Edited April 6, 2020 by Redlynne

[Heraclea]

25 minutes ago, Virtual Green said:

- the Steel Canyon arcs (Graham Easton/Laura Lockhart) : some of the most fun (and heartwrenching, in Laura's case) low-level arcs in the game, and some of the only arcs to focus on both the Tsoos and the 5th Column, these SAs have some great writing and badges to offer. Special mention goes to Laura's arc, however, for the sheer replay value it offers thanks to the Ouroboros system (that not many players know of, sadly), which grants another badge and adds another layer to the arc.

I am fairly sure you can also run Easton's arc twice and collect both badges.  It would surprise me greatly if you could get both temp powers, though. 

[ArchVileTerror]

Just checked.  I have both Boon of the Ancestor and Summon:  Tsoo Sorcerer at full charge on my main villain.

[Virtual Green]

36 minutes ago, Heraclea said:

I am fairly sure you can also run Easton's arc twice and collect both badges.  It would surprise me greatly if you could get both temp powers, though. 

I wasn't sure of that, that's awesome! I was mostly referring to the fact that if you do Laura's arc then do it again with Ouro, you get access to a new alternate path where you get to save her life thanks to some convenient time-travelling shenanigan, which earns you the badge "Guardian of Forever" (all of which isn't on the wiki, too).

[ArchVileTerror]

IT's not on the wiki since Leandro added it on SCoRE.

[Virtual Green]

That does make sense. Nevertheless, an awesome feature which adds a lot of replay value to that arc!

[rolandgrey]

Favorite storyline?  Mysterious General Z.  It opens with a fantastic rescue mission where the people you rescue are all heavily armed.  I miss the version from before the RWZ, where General Aarons still had an assault rifle.  If you rescued all of the hostages, you wound up as a proto mercenaries mastermind.  Fun times.  Now, Aarons just has his pistol.  Also, Ambassador Alwani's guard has been turned into a "Diplomat," a heavily armed "Diplomat."  I think this was the Paragon devs subtly hinting the guy was actually with the Malta Group, but the Sky Raider attack was so far out of their plans, they decided to let it slide and work with the rescuing hero(es).  It would explain why Alwani and the nameless diplomat vanish from the rest of the arc.  Sadly, the rest is built with old technology and features a bunch of fetch quests and Defeat Alls, but the writing is superb, introducing a world of political intrigue to the playerbase and showing the Sky Raiders are more than just lackeys to the Nemesis Army like the lore hints.


Least favorite?  Henri Dumont's Disturbing the Dead.  First, you need to unlock the contact, which takes beating up a bunch of the miners.  Then he sends you on a boring series of standard fetch quests and a hunt mission before sending you into a generic cave to deploy a magic bomb...  Which does nothing but finish the mission.  No special enemies, no unusual mechanics.  Just a bunch of enemies who otherwise act the way they would in any other mission.  The dialogue is perfunctory and uninspired, the assets are all generic for when City of Villains was released...  It's so bland compared to Doc Buzzsaw, another unlockable contact who pits you against weird and strange Freakshow enemies with hilarious dialogue (both from her and the Freakshow).

[Sakura Tenshi]

I think the original Vigilante Arc from The Major could be improved with a few things:

1. DO NOT make us drop off AND retrieve the orders from the Dead Drops, that is completely pointless and makes no sense what-so-ever. Either have us drop them off or pick them up (the latter making much more sense)
2. Make the first mission instead the last, possibly shuffle around other missions, but the one where you take on the shopkeeper using Freakshow feels very vigilante: you're murdering a guy who, while being an unlawful cutthroat, could just be tried and sentenced through conventional judicial systems but instead some unknown group called 'Void Sanction' decided they had no interest in waiting or going through proper channels. If the arc ended on that, especially after fighting Holoman and hearing his accusations it should make you think "oh, shoot, did I just go too far?"

[Galaxy Brain]

People really think starting goldside is hard? o.O 

 

I love goldside! The 20 levels of story arc per character is great, and the aesthetic is overall different enough to warrant going through as much as you can.

[ArchVileTerror]

Hard compared to Blueside and Redside:  Absolutely.  It's all about relativity.

[Gulbasaur]

15 hours ago, Heraclea said:

Faultline was originally a hazard zone, and it too has a storyline. 

And a fantastic one at that. It's not been a hazard zone for a while, which is why I didn't call it one. 

 

Still, it's one of the more interesting Hero zones with the Arachnos tunnels and stuff.