P2W Option: Reject White Salvage Drops

[Nanolathe]

Yes the salvage is an infinitely seeded resource, but those seed prices aren't nearly as cheap as most salvage is routinely sold for.

For clarity last I checked the infinite supply seed prices are: 10,000 for common, 100,000 for uncommon and 1,000,000 for rare.

 

If we're all cool with the price for salvage heading upwards in price towards those maximums, which is going to the consequence of reducing supply, then by all means carry on. But don't pretend like the Devs have seeded everything at their current ~250, ~1,500 or ~500,000 selling prices and that there's nothing that would happen as a consequence of opt-out common drops.

[tidge]

3 hours ago, Snowdaze said:

I personally wouldn't use this option, as I sell ALL salvage on the AH, and then just buy it back for cheaper when I need it. Also the delete stack option is easy enough to use...

 

But I don't see harm in looking into this as a possibility since the market has been seeded.

/agree. I don't really see the harm in this. I am often frustrated when my personal salvage is full, but right now it just means I have to take a breather to delete some common stacks (or dump them in the AH)... if I can't free up some slots by crafting enhancements mid-mission. Now if the portable workbench allowed us to craft empowerment buffs....

[Yoru-hime]

This seems consistent with the other filters available via P2W.

 

The market argument is fallacious. The market is seeded because the devs want there to be a price cap on certain items. If player behavior changes to the point that said price cap is threatened, they'll simply reseed more often or in larger quantities to protect it. The sky is not going to fall on Wentworth's just because fewer farmers list white salvage.

 

 

[ZacKing]

11 minutes ago, Nanolathe said:

Yes the salvage is an infinitely seeded resource, but those seed prices aren't nearly as cheap as most salvage is routinely sold for.

For clarity last I checked the infinite supply seed prices are: 10,000 for common, 100,000 for uncommon and 1,000,000 for rare.

 

If we're all cool with the price for salvage heading upwards in price towards those maximums, which is going to the consequence of reducing supply, then by all means carry on. But don't pretend like the Devs have seeded everything at their current ~250, ~1,500 or ~500,000 selling prices and that there's nothing that would happen as a consequence of opt-out common drops.

Exactly.  And no, those prices aren't worth it to me.

[Coyotedancer]

I have a solution for you, OP...

 

Open Salvage window (takes about one second)

Right Click salvage you want to get rid of (another second, at most)

Select "Delete Salvage Stack" from the menu that appears (again, about a second)

 

So... three seconds there, per stack. You might have ten stacks to do at the end of a mission, but at about three seconds each, that's still not a huge time investment.

 

Of course, I suspect you'll still argue that that "takes too long" and is too much of a pain because... you know... it still requires some minimal amount of effort. <_<

[Zeraphia]

32 minutes ago, Coyotedancer said:

I have a solution for you, OP...

 

Open Salvage window (takes about one second)

Right Click salvage you want to get rid of (another second, at most)

Select "Delete Salvage Stack" from the menu that appears (again, about a second)

 

So... three seconds there, per stack. You might have ten stacks to do at the end of a mission, but at about three seconds each, that's still not a huge time investment.

 

Of course, I suspect you'll still argue that that "takes too long" and is too much of a pain because... you know... it still requires some minimal amount of effort. <_<

I already do this, again, the other options are available, this is a suggestion forum. I am suggesting for this to be added to the options that you can reject.

[EmmySky]

If someone wants to throw away inf, I have no problem with that.  I think if enough people opted out of it, it may have an effect on the prices in AH, but considering how many people simply vendor or delete it now, it would have to be a hell of a lot of people opting out to change the current status quo.  I am almost always in favor of more options, so long as they are options and not hidden mandates.

 

Happy hunting!

 

😁

[Coyotedancer]

Just now, Zeraphia said:

I already do this, again, the other options are available, this is a suggestion forum. I am suggesting for this to be added to the options that you can reject.

 

Having my salvage glutted with commons is something I run into all the time when I'm farming... Just deleting a few stacks to make some space really isn't all that much of a pain. 

 

Options are always nice to have, yes, but when dev time and resources are as limited as Homecoming's seem to be? You have to think about the practicality of adding those potential options. Especially when there's already a quick and easy solution to the supposed problem that's already available. 

[ZacKing]

48 minutes ago, Coyotedancer said:

I have a solution for you, OP...

 

Open Salvage window (takes about one second)

Right Click salvage you want to get rid of (another second, at most)

Select "Delete Salvage Stack" from the menu that appears (again, about a second)

 

So... three seconds there, per stack. You might have ten stacks to do at the end of a mission, but at about three seconds each, that's still not a huge time investment.

 

Of course, I suspect you'll still argue that that "takes too long" and is too much of a pain because... you know... it still requires some minimal amount of effort. <_<

But but but but.... multiply that by 10 times a day x 12 months a year and over a hundred years he will have wasted 15 minutes deleting salvage!! 

[Zeraphia]

1 minute ago, ZacKing said:

But but but but.... multiply that by 10 times a day x 12 months a year and over a hundred years he will have wasted 15 minutes deleting salvage!! 

she* and dear lord, I get it, you disagree but please... be more polite.

[ZacKing]

No offense intended, just poking a little fun at a very silly argument.

[Camel]

7 hours ago, Zeraphia said:

let's say 1 second to recognize it's there

another 2 to open the ah

another 3 to wait for the prompt and put in 1

that adds up to hours of time after how frequent they drop dedicated toward selling them or ignoring them and not getting any good drops.

this is all for chicken feed in terms of inf gain.

 

there is an abundant supply, that doesn't mean it's a good thing. this is a seeded economy with billions of them already, we dont need players to put in more or contribute to the supply because it's endless. the prices are hardly dependent on what players sell due to the seeding and the massive volume of them.

 

they clog up my inventory, they're awful, they're a waste of time, there are often hundreds of them after selling is done.

 

no thank you. reject!

Second. If I combined all the seconds I’ve spent dealing with all the white salvage I don’t frequently use... it would be HOURS. I know I’ve spent hours listing stacks of 10 common salvage for 1 inf each. So. Many. Hours.

[lemming]

I don't see the harm in the option, but there better be badges like recipes for it. 😉

[AerialAssault]

What would help would be a 'Sell All Common Salvage/Recipes' option at vendors, or maybe, if that's too much to code in, an NPC who will do that for you through a dialogue option.

[Greycat]

24 minutes ago, AerialAssault said:

What would help would be a 'Sell All Common Salvage/Recipes' option at vendors, or maybe, if that's too much to code in, an NPC who will do that for you through a dialogue option.

... heh. Borrow an idea from some other games. P2W vendor "pet" that sells your salvage on demand. "Sell: [x] All common salvage at [100] inf."

[Nerio72]

Code it so rejected white drops go straight to AH. The people that would use this option are happy and the market doesn't implode

The OP made a suggestion and it seems some people think it's a horrible idea. If they implement it don't use it. Easy.

[blayzemaster]

Given that most people are suggesting they don't even list their white salvage and instead delete it, I can't see that this would have a demonstrable impact on the market. Those who delete it now no longer have to waste time doing so (which CAN add up and is a frustrating element for no net gain), and those that want to sell it can sell it.

[Sovera]

21 hours ago, Neogumbercules said:

Is it like a forum game that I've never caught on to where people come up with arguments to resist the simplest and least affecting suggested changes just for the fun of it, or is the gatekeeping so strong in this community that people actually feel compelled to argue stupid shit? 

 

If you take a pretty decent peak player count from a busy weekend day, let's say 4,000 toons, and you take the 2 billion seeded white salvage and divided equally among each of those 4,000 players, each player would have a stack of 500,000 of each type of white salvage. 

 

In other words, letting the handful of people who want to disable white salvage drops do so would have practically zero impact on the supply, or anyone else's gameplay experience! What a ridiculous argument! 

It very much is. I only read part of the first page before deciding there was no point in continuing.

 

I made the same suggestion a few months back and got the same reaction: it takes no time at all to sell. It does not bother me. Man you must be really lazy.

 

Considering the OP (and I a few months back):

 

- Did not advocate for a forced change affecting everyone.

- Did not tell people not to sell or use their salvage.

- Suggested something that already exists (P2W option to reject white recipes who are worth 100k ish a pop instead of 100 inf).

 

then why are people bothering to come and say how it does not bother, and how fast it is to sell, how lazy the OP is?

 

 

In WoW and other games like it there are grey items with no point or use other than being sold to a vendor (and cluttering the inventory). A commonly mentioned addon for new players is one that auto sells these grey items so that they don't need to check their inventory slot by slot and sell one by one. Lets not even speak of the bug that prevents rapid clicking to sell stuff to a vendor here since the window loses focus and we need to re-click on the next item on the list which forces to right click and spam E to sell stacks instead.

 

 

Here it's a forum game to sniff haughtily at the same suggestion, never mind the fact the option is going to be hidden away and will require someone mentioning to a channel/friends/forums how the volume of near useless white salvage is annoying for one of them to point how they can use the P2W to remove that (just like we helpfully pipe in when someone mentions how they keep running into walls when they get Speed Boost). Never mind the fact that we already have one such recipe in the game and that, to my limited coding knowledge, would require copy pasting it and changing 'white recipes' to 'white salvage' (actually more like copying the entire list of white salvage and pasting over the entire list of white recipes that is to be rejected).

[ShardWarrior]

2 hours ago, Sovera said:

Here it's a forum game to sniff haughtily at the same suggestion, never mind the fact the option is going to be hidden away and will require someone mentioning to a channel/friends/forums how the volume of near useless white salvage is annoying for one of them to point how they can use the P2W to remove that (just like we helpfully pipe in when someone mentions how they keep running into walls when they get Speed Boost). Never mind the fact that we already have one such recipe in the game and that, to my limited coding knowledge, would require copy pasting it and changing 'white recipes' to 'white salvage' (actually more like copying the entire list of white salvage and pasting over the entire list of white recipes that is to be rejected).

Part of that game is also people berating and criticizing others who dare to disagree with their idea.  That door swings both ways.

Edited May 14, 2020 by ShardWarrior

[Sovera]

1 minute ago, ShardWarrior said:

Part of that game is also people berating and criticizing others who dare to disagree with their idea.  That door swings both ways.

Mmmmmmyeah, 'dare' to disagree. Is that what your ShardWarrior-vision shows? I must be wearing different glasses.

[ShardWarrior]

10 minutes ago, Sovera said:

Mmmmmmyeah, 'dare' to disagree. Is that what your ShardWarrior-vision shows? I must be wearing different glasses.

Apologies as my comment was not directed at you personally.  I should have clarified that.  It is more a general statement as there are quite a lot of people here lately who seem to forget that people have different opinions and only want to listen to people who agree with their ideas.

[Greycat]

As far as the "forum game," as it was put -

 

At least for me, no, it's not a "game," nor is it meant to show some sort of superiority or put someone down. The point of the forum is discussion - and that does mean also pointing out existing solutions to the problem being presented (assuming a "problem" is being addressed) or down sides with whatever the suggestion is, including if it's something unworkable.

 

Yes, the person posting it should be prepared to defend their post. (Or abandon it if it's one of those "Oh. Wow, I didn't know that, yeah, that wouldn't work" or "I didn't know a solution already existed in game!" items.)

 

This should not be used or seen as a personal attack on *either* side. It's hard to do sometimes, absolutely. We're not face to face, most of us don't personally know each other, so it's very easy to take something dashed off in a minute as being snarky or condescending or otherwise rude. (And yes, there *are* some posts that are just that. Let's be real.) You, the person making the suggestion, have put thought (I hope!) into the idea, it's something you think would be great, and suddenly you have a bunch of people telling you there are problems or it's not the greatest thing since sliced bread. It is, sometimes, hard not to feel attacked. The only advice I can give is back up, take a few breaths, and re-read what's getting you annoyed. And *do your best* to cut that off at the pass - whether that's asking (*politely!*) for clarification or even just saying "Look, the last three responses have been pretty much just snarky put downs, I'm not responding to you any longer." If you have to actually *put* the person on ignore for a day or two so you don't even see the posts, do that.

 

But do your best to gauge intent, too.

 

Back on live, I was known for "copypastas." I had responses for some fairly common suggestions (vehicle travel powers, for one.) Some people took them as attacks. The whole point of them, for me, was to say "OK, we've talked about this in the past. To summarize, here are what we know of as problems, here are some ways the idea hs been given in the past, here are what the devs have said if they've weighed in. So let's shortcut all that and see if there's something new we can do with it," primarily to avoid retreads and some things that would bring up arguments. Everyone had the same info, and occasionally they *would* be jumping off points for interesting discussions or new twists. Which was the point. But they were never meant to be "Your idea's stupid, and so are you," or "read the 10000 pages of the forum, noob!" Unfortunately, some people took them that way. *shrug* It's the danger of a text medium. All we can do is try our best to avoid misunderstandings.

[Zeraphia]

6 minutes ago, Greycat said:

As far as the "forum game," as it was put -

 

At least for me, no, it's not a "game," nor is it meant to show some sort of superiority or put someone down. The point of the forum is discussion - and that does mean also pointing out existing solutions to the problem being presented (assuming a "problem" is being addressed) or down sides with whatever the suggestion is, including if it's something unworkable.

 

Yes, the person posting it should be prepared to defend their post. (Or abandon it if it's one of those "Oh. Wow, I didn't know that, yeah, that wouldn't work" or "I didn't know a solution already existed in game!" items.)

 

This should not be used or seen as a personal attack on *either* side. It's hard to do sometimes, absolutely. We're not face to face, most of us don't personally know each other, so it's very easy to take something dashed off in a minute as being snarky or condescending or otherwise rude. (And yes, there *are* some posts that are just that. Let's be real.) You, the person making the suggestion, have put thought (I hope!) into the idea, it's something you think would be great, and suddenly you have a bunch of people telling you there are problems or it's not the greatest thing since sliced bread. It is, sometimes, hard not to feel attacked. The only advice I can give is back up, take a few breaths, and re-read what's getting you annoyed. And *do your best* to cut that off at the pass - whether that's asking (*politely!*) for clarification or even just saying "Look, the last three responses have been pretty much just snarky put downs, I'm not responding to you any longer." If you have to actually *put* the person on ignore for a day or two so you don't even see the posts, do that.

 

But do your best to gauge intent, too.

 

Back on live, I was known for "copypastas." I had responses for some fairly common suggestions (vehicle travel powers, for one.) Some people took them as attacks. The whole point of them, for me, was to say "OK, we've talked about this in the past. To summarize, here are what we know of as problems, here are some ways the idea hs been given in the past, here are what the devs have said if they've weighed in. So let's shortcut all that and see if there's something new we can do with it," primarily to avoid retreads and some things that would bring up arguments. Everyone had the same info, and occasionally they *would* be jumping off points for interesting discussions or new twists. Which was the point. But they were never meant to be "Your idea's stupid, and so are you," or "read the 10000 pages of the forum, noob!" Unfortunately, some people took them that way. *shrug* It's the danger of a text medium. All we can do is try our best to avoid misunderstandings.

There is "disagreement" and then there is name-calling and outright bashing. I've dealt with the latter quite a lot recently. I've also seen people support the latter several times. This has lead to a lot of general forum toxicity.

 

So much of the response to this has been exactly as Sovera has described "you're lazy!" "it doesn't bother me" "I wouldn't use it." Well, that's great, I'm glad for those people that they enjoy their white salvage, I do not. Many others do not. I know of many people who do not like EA, are never going to make Katana to enjoy the new animations (myself included), but I don't sit around, bash them and their character choices and go on about how stupid they are for picking those choices and how the devs shouldn't waste their time on their ideas (the parallel of "you're lazy for suggesting this and the devs should be spending their time on other things!" in this thread). Interestingly, from said poster, suggesting ideas that would take far longer to implement (on other threads) and be a benefit for far less people... but I'm not going to get into that argument, it has been nasty enough. 

[Greycat]

And as far as the subject at hand, if convenience is the issue:

- Sure, P2W option to reject common/uncommon/rare (are you sure?) salvage.

- Optionally, or additionally, some commands:

/deletesalvage common (or uncommon or rare)

/auctionsalvage (rarity) (cost) (so, /auctionalvage common 6 would auction all common salvage for 6 inf each.)

/movesalvagetovault moves everything (or add common/uncommon/rare) to your "vault reserve" vault.

[Greycat]

3 minutes ago, Zeraphia said:

the devs should be spending their time on other things!"

.... side note, I wish that argument would stop being used. It's fine to say "This would take a lot of dev time," because it's surprising what would, but until someone here hires them and has to assign people to projects...

 

I wouldn't take "I wouldn't use this" as an attack though. If nothing else you can use it as a gauge. Heck, *I* don't think I'd use it, but that's not saying I'm against it, either. At least you're not wondering if people are just ignoring it.

Edited May 14, 2020 by Greycat