effectiveness of Medicine Pool?

[Latex]

I love taking Medicine on high DEF characters. You can get in a free heal most the time.

[Llewellyn Blackwell]

I will admit as much as I want to play devils advocate and defend this pool, it is not the easiest hill to find some terrain on to put together a defensive position for.

 

For myself I have 2 characters that make use of this pool, and these are choices made as much for RP as anything so not mainly a meta gamer pov.

 

One is my PB. He uses heal other and glowing touch to heal an ally up in a pinch. He only uses the first 2 powers. I carry the rez ally temp with plenty of charges for that need, costs be damned, and self heal just fine with my built in powers.

 

The other is my regen using Dr. Demetrios Vasilikos. He has the full pool for thematic reasons. But being regen actually gets a fair bit of use out of it all. No few times a team has wiped, he has won last man standing style, then got his team back up on their feet.

 

I do kinda feel like I am seeing some real ???? thinking though. I mean we cant say the game is so easy there is no challenge, but then say a power that is abit of a challenge to use "in combat" is useless or bad, becuase what is really being said is anything that is a challenge to actually use or do is bad. If the content is hammering your toon hard enough it needs to heal, falling back to do so is perfectly viable. Odds are if your even pondering such, your not on a toon tuned for extreme dif solo play or the like. And yeah against the likes of frost fire solo, being able to fall back and recover can be a huge boon to the player/toon of average ability.

[Twisted Toon]

My Grav/Time Controller has Heal Other, Heal Self, and Resuscitate.

The only power that I've used was Rez.

That's usually after a team wipe (or almost total team wipe).

[roleki]

4 hours ago, Bentley Berkeley said:

I do kinda feel like I am seeing some real ???? thinking though. I mean we cant say the game is so easy there is no challenge, but then say a power that is abit of a challenge to use "in combat" is useless or bad, becuase what is really being said is anything that is a challenge to actually use or do is bad. If the content is hammering your toon hard enough it needs to heal, falling back to do so is perfectly viable. Odds are if your even pondering such, your not on a toon tuned for extreme dif solo play or the like. And yeah against the likes of frost fire solo, being able to fall back and recover can be a huge boon to the player/toon of average ability.

It's not necessarily that it is a 'challnge' to use, it's just that Heal Self is literally designed to not be useful when you would need it the most.  Who wastes a pool power on "Whew!  That was close!  Now I'm going to shave a couple seconds off my wait to go try it again!"  

 

Then again, if someone is looking at that proposition and going for it, I imagine the game must be a challenge to SOME people.

[Sovera]

5 hours ago, Bentley Berkeley said:

I do kinda feel like I am seeing some real ???? thinking though. I mean we cant say the game is so easy there is no challenge, but then say a power that is abit of a challenge to use "in combat" is useless or bad, becuase what is really being said is anything that is a challenge to actually use or do is bad. If the content is hammering your toon hard enough it needs to heal, falling back to do so is perfectly viable. Odds are if your even pondering such, your not on a toon tuned for extreme dif solo play or the like. And yeah against the likes of frost fire solo, being able to fall back and recover can be a huge boon to the player/toon of average ability.

Not sure what ??? confuses you. A 4.5 second animation for 30% takes so long we would lose the 30% before the animation is over. Half the animation sure, even with the interruptible element.

[Ironblade]

21 hours ago, cohRock said:

I am surprised at the unanimity -- "don't bother with the Medicine Pool."  Nothing to add, really -- I just thought someone might defend it.

I'll defend it.  I've taken 1-3 powers from it on various characters and never regretted it.

 

I built an invuln tank who had Aid Self slotted for interrupt reduction.  Even with multiple enemies around me, I could CONSISTENTLY use it without being interrupted.  And he obviously had to take Aid Other to get Aid Self.  One power has 5 slots and the other has 6, not for the power itself, but to mule set IO's for +regen.

 

I have Aid Other on Ironblade due to my long-term goal of completing all the missions.  Too many have stupid/squishy escorts that I have to keep alive.  Since he's /regen, he obviously doesn't need Aid Self.

 

I have a sonic/sonic defender with Aid Other, Aid Self and Field Medic.  He also has 3 powers (Assault, Tactics, Vengeance) from Leadership so there's no either/or dichotomy on those two pools.  As a defender, he supports the team.  Often, he's the only person with any healing whatsoever.  Since he doesn't have high damage output, he's usually not the main target of enemies so he can use the heals in combat without much concern about being interrupted.  And, of course, Field Medic makes Aid Other uninterruptible and that's the heal I use the most.

 

I also have a dual pistols/devices blaster with Aid Other and Aid Self.  Frankly, they seemed like a good choice since I solo him a lot and both his primary and secondary had powers that I felt sucked so I had extra power picks available.  He also has Recall Friend, Assault and Grant Invisibility.

 

So, do I have the Medicine Pool on most, or even a lot, of my characters?  No.  But it definitely serves a purpose.

 

P.S.  As an aside, is there any pool I have on most characters?  Yes.  All but two of my characters have the Leadership pool.  I think it's the best power pool available.

[roleki]

5 minutes ago, Ironblade said:

I'll defend it.  I've taken 1-3 powers from it on various characters and never regretted it.

 

I built an invuln tank who had Aid Self slotted for interrupt reduction.  Even with multiple enemies around me, I could CONSISTENTLY use it without being interrupted.  And he obviously had to take Aid Other to get Aid Self.  One power has 5 slots and the other has 6, not for the power itself, but to mule set IO's for +regen.

 

I have Aid Other on Ironblade due to my long-term goal of completing all the missions.  Too many have stupid/squishy escorts that I have to keep alive.  Since he's /regen, he obviously doesn't need Aid Self.

 

I have a sonic/sonic defender with Aid Other, Aid Self and Field Medic.  He also has 3 powers (Assault, Tactics, Vengeance) from Leadership so there's no either/or dichotomy on those two pools.  As a defender, he supports the team.  Often, he's the only person with any healing whatsoever.  Since he doesn't have high damage output, he's usually not the main target of enemies so he can use the heals in combat without much concern about being interrupted.  And, of course, Field Medic makes Aid Other uninterruptible and that's the heal I use the most.

 

I also have a dual pistols/devices blaster with Aid Other and Aid Self.  Frankly, they seemed like a good choice since I solo him a lot and both his primary and secondary had powers that I felt sucked so I had extra power picks available.  He also has Recall Friend, Assault and Grant Invisibility.

 

So, do I have the Medicine Pool on most, or even a lot, of my characters?  No.  But it definitely serves a purpose.

 

P.S.  As an aside, is there any pool I have on most characters?  Yes.  All but two of my characters have the Leadership pool.  I think it's the best power pool available.

I wouldn't say I 'regret' going deep into the Medicine Pool on the one character I did (Fire/Natural), but that was an experiment on my part to see what effect (if any) Field Medic had in regards to Bloom, +Regen, +Absorb and whatnot.  That said, if I had a character who was always in need of healing, I would look first towards +Def or +Res or ways to keep green insps flowing before I would resort to Medicine.

 

Is it the worst pool?  Maybe second-worst?  I still have not taken the Presence pool on anything, and I don't think I've ever run anyone into the wild who had.  I might try that out and see what it actually does; the Invoke Panic power seems like it could be kind of interesting.

 

But I do wholeheartedly agree on Leadership being the best pool.  With three picks and one additional slot, I can get 15% recharge and 15% +ToHit?   Yeah, I'm doing that on everyone.    

[cohRock]

10 hours ago, Ironblade said:

I'll defend it.  I've taken 1-3 powers from it on various characters and never regretted it.

...

So, do I have the Medicine Pool on most, or even a lot, of my characters?  No.  But it definitely serves a purpose.

 

P.S.  As an aside, is there any pool I have on most characters?  Yes.  All but two of my characters have the Leadership pool.  I think it's the best power pool available.

I'm glad at least someone has found uses for the Medicine Pool.  I don't remember if in the old days any of my guys used it or not.  I'm sure it was not common, though

 

I strongly agree with you about the Leadership being the best pool.  What's really nice is that at least two of its powers can fit into most builds without sacrifice.  A lot of folks here probably don't remember the "old old days", when Fitness (Stamina, Health, Hurdle, Swift) was a pool, not inherent.  So must builds would take at least Health and Stamina.  Now (since issue 15 or so) the whole pool is gifted at level 2 or 3,  builds have a lot more flexibility.

Edited July 24, 2020 by cohRock

[Chance Jackson]

Aid other can be useful for high def builds who need to be able to heal others or pets in battle but otherwise it's of questionable value

 

I only have it on my Bots/Traps/Mu MM

[Twisted Toon]

10 hours ago, cohRock said:

 A lot of folks here probably don't remember the "old old days", when Fitness (Stamina, Health, Hurdle, Swift) was a pool, not inherent.  So must builds would take at least Health and Stamina.  Now (since issue 15 or so) the whole pool is gifted at level 2 or 3,  builds have a lot more flexibility.

Back in those days, I had a whopping 3 characters, out of 40 or so, that had the Fitness pool.

I had more characters that used Leadership than Fitness.

But then, I didn't chase DPS either.

[Doomguide2005]

Part of the issue is the strength of the heal ... in the just under 5 seconds I could  fire off Aid Self my scrapper will have naturally regenerated about half of what I can expect to get off Aid Self iirc ... my regen on my SR is about 32/sec the likelyhood I'd get hit again before I've regenerated the damage before I'd recovery it is using Aid Self  is tiny

[Vanden]

2 hours ago, Doomguide2005 said:

Part of the issue is the strength of the heal ... in the just under 5 seconds I could  fire off Aid Self my scrapper will have naturally regenerated about half of what I can expect to get off Aid Self iirc ... my regen on my SR is about 32/sec the likelyhood I'd get hit again before I've regenerated the damage before I'd recovery it is using Aid Self  is tiny

If you have 32HP/sec Regeneration, that's 160 HP in 5 seconds. Aid Self at 50 gives a Scrapper 262.37 HP unslotted. Your regeneration wouldn't even come close if you slotted Aid Self up.

Edited July 24, 2020 by Vanden

[UltraAlt]

On 7/22/2020 at 11:50 PM, DoctorDitko said:

I think I have to concur, though, that the p2w Rez, End boost, and self-heal pretty much obviate the Med Pool. It could use some serious Dev love. As it stands, skip it!

 

Disclaimer: Not a medical doctor. Do not take medical advice from Doctor Ditko.

I have to take it all the time.

Some pesky team mate who's name rhymes with Doctor Ditko never seems to be able to keep me (and sometimes my pets) alive when his characters have team heals.

 

Med Pool is team powers. They rely on being in a team and working with a team.

Stimulant is great when you need to be able to get a teammate out of holds, immobilize, etc.

The delay in the powers isn't  huge issue if you are non-melee and you have melee on the team on the front line.

It helps keep my pets alive even if I use it a secondary heal.
The self heal is a fall back and it works to get some health back quick when I need it.

 

Unlike THE CITY that I grew up in (er started playing in? I'm older than the hills and younger than the mountains, so it's all ... oh well...), there is a lot less concern for the other members of the team that there was. Or at least that's what I have seen.

Not dis-ing on anyone so much as pointing it out.

(not to mention those that would rather run headlong into a fight and die rather than take a moment to figure out how to defeat the enemy safely so they don't fall in battle, but that's another thread or reason for a reply to this one)

 

Plus, can you really trust Doctor Ditko talking about the med pool? I mean look at his disclaimer! "Not a medical doctor. Do not take medical advice from Doctor Ditko." 

So why listen to him about the Med Pool?!

 

[Sorry, Doc. if you didn't see that one coming.. well... and, btw, I'll meet you on Beta tonight as planned.]

Edited November 3, 2020 by UltraAlt

[UltraAlt]

On 7/21/2020 at 2:04 PM, MTeague said:

If you do not have very high defense, you won't be able to use Aid Self / Aid Other when things are attacking you.

 

EDIT:  that said, I use it on my Claws/SR scrapper and it's nice.  But that is a tricked out /SR build.

You won't have things attacking as much if you're on a team with a tank with taunt.

Just saying.

That's one of the reasons why I said that they are "team powers" in my other post